3-octave controller

[marino]

I need a bit of advice.

For a side project, I am seeking for a MIDI keyboard to control an expander or two. Here's what I need:

 

- 37 keys (3 octaves), give or take a few.

- FULL SIZE keys.

- MIDI out (not just USB)

- Pitch wheel.

Mod wheel and aftertouch a plus, but not necessary.

Sliders, knobs, and any other physical controls NOT needed.

 

I did some researches, and to my amazement, I found a *deluge* of those 25-key things, and a whole lot of 49-key controllers (too big for this particular application). The 37-key range appears to be almost non-existent. There are a couple with mini-keys, which I wouldn't consider.

The closest I came to matching my needs is this one from German manufacturer MidiTech:

 

MidiTech i2-Control 37 black edition

 

Except that it has all those pots and sliders that I wouldn't use.

 

Any other ideas?

 

I would even consider some older and/or crappy keyboard, as long as it's around 3 octaves, has MIDI out, and a pitch wheel. But none has come to my memory to date.

 

Also: If I buy one of those USB/MIDI cables, could I use it to drive an expander with old-style MIDI in, from a controller with only USB connections? I mean, *if* I power the controller from an AC adapter, of course.

 

Any help appreciated... and pardon my ignorance on the subject.

 

Carlo

 

 

[Leh173]

http://www.rolandus.com/products/details/1094/460

 

Maybe this is close to the mark, but not quite 37 keys...

[Ekewaka]

Yes it seems the market has standardized on 25/49/61/88 while many of us would like 71/73 and/or 37. The IK Multimedia iRig Keys lightweight keyboard is 37 and with the Magnum Group Buy you get a lot of SW but I don't know if you want such a light-weight keyboard as the main studio keyboard. Not that it works fine if you exclude the amount of controllers and smaller keys.

[AnotherScott]

Studiologic CMK137 if you can find one is probably exactly what you want.

 

Korg R3, Alesis Vortex, Alesis Micron, Akai MiniAk,, M-Audio MidAir 37 all have the key layout but do more than you want. Or 32 keys, Arturia Analog Experience - The Factory.

[marino]

Thanks for your replies.

 

Leh - The Roland is rather comparable with the MidiTech, but since it has less key range *and* the dreaded Roland paddle (I much prefer wheels), the MidiTech still wins. Also, like the MidiTech, lots of physical controls which I would never use.

 

Kenekahuna - I had checked the iRig, and while it's interesting, I get terribly frustrated when forced to play mini-keys. That's why I listed full-size keys as a must.

And no, it's not going to be my main controller - I have three hammer-action controllers at home... plus a grand piano, a digital piano, and several keyboard synthesizers. It's for a small mobile rig for a temporary situation.

 

Any other ideas before I get the MidiTech?

 

Also...

 

If I buy one of those USB/MIDI cables, could I use it to drive an expander with old-style MIDI in, from a controller with only USB connections? I mean, *if* I power the controller from an AC adapter, of course.

Thanks in advance!

 

 

[marino]

Scott - thanks a lot for your suggestions. I'll check those out!

 

Edit: Yeah, the Studiologic seems to be the closest thing to what I'm looking for. I'll start hunting for one. Thanks!

 

Now something weird: I wasn't familiar with the M-Audio MidAir 37, so I checked and... it's the *same* thing than the MidiTech! I mean, they are identical. I guess some kind of sale under licence is going on here.

 

 

[AnotherScott]

If I buy one of those USB/MIDI cables, could I use it to drive an expander with old-style MIDI in, from a controller with only USB connections? I mean, *if* I power the controller from an AC adapter, of course.

 

you'd need

 

http://www.kentonuk.com/products/items/utilities/usb-host.shtml

 

or

 

http://www.iconnectivity.com/iConnectMIDI

[marino]

Again, thanks, Scott. Um, another box to add - not really worthy given the temporary nature of the thing. It looks like I'll stick with good old MIDI.

 

Also, I've checked throughout the net, and it seems that CMK-137s are extremely difficult to find. I'll try again for a few days, maybe calling Fatar itself (here in Italy), then if I can't locate one, I'm afraid I'll be back to M-Audio/MidiTech.... grunt...

 

 

[kanker.]

No idea what your budget is, but a Little Phatty of some sort would be a very versatile 37 note controller....

[hurricane hugo]

well, there's this: http://line6.com/podstudiokb37/

 

...but it has a lot of features that you probably don't need.

[marino]

Well, I just need something simple... just for triggering notes, with velocity and the occasional pitchbend. Nothing more.

A Little Phatty would be definitely overkill... I already have a MEK btw, which is also kind of more, um, Slim...

 

 

[non ce futuro]

Bongiorno Marino,

 

Why don't you take a look at 49 controllers? There's much more keyboards in the market with 49 (some of them really nice), and an extra octave never hurt any pianist

Don't know if price is a main concern though...But even an MX49 have wheels, little weight and a decent keyboard action, with some motif sounds inside *just in case*. If that's too much money, the you can find the Alesis Q49 (not too many knobs and stuff), maudio oxygen 49, etc. Do not expect the greatest on keybed quality though

 

ciao!

[Dana.]

This is a no-brainer: Novation Ultranova. 37 full-size Fatar keys, MIDI, pitch wheel, bonus synth sounds. Buy used.

[AnotherScott]

This is a no-brainer: Novation Ultranova. 37 full-size Fatar keys, MIDI, pitch wheel, bonus synth sounds. Buy used.

The one thing I'd say it has in its favor is something you didn't mention: aftertouch. Other than that, I think every other 37-keyer mentioned (except the Moog) would be cheaper and smaller, and mostly closer to what he's looking for in terms of fewer extraneous controls and functions. But AT is nice...

 

edit: Marino, that 32-key Arturia has AT too

[marino]

Thanks again to all. Maybe I should have specified that I'm going to use this just a few times, during the long waiting hours involved in a commitment that I'm going to take. I don't need a whole new synthesizer, just something simple and small and cheap. The CMK looks like it, but nobody seems to sell it, new or used... so I guess my next best bet is on the M-Audio/MidiTech. I'm not going to use all those knobs and sliders, but it will work.

[Dana.]

Since Carlo didn't mention size or cost, I'm standing by my suggestion. With regard to extraneous controls, just don't use them. Build quality and resale value are also better than most of the other options mentioned.

 

Scott, going forward, as a courtesy to me, please do not comment on or respond to any of my posts. If it would help you to refrain from doing so, set my posts to ignore. Thanks.

[AnotherScott]

Scott, going forward, as a courtesy to me, please do not comment on or respond to any of my posts. If it would help you to refrain from doing so, set my posts to ignore. Thanks.

Okay. Where do I find the ignore setting?

[hurricane hugo]

^ I went looking through the My Stuff listings and didn't find one.

[AnotherScott]

^ I went looking through the My Stuff listings and didn't find one.

And it's not under the little pop-down under someone's name either, which is where I first expected it to be. Turns out you have to view the person's profile. There's a setting there to ignore them.

[Marzzz]

Marino, that 32-key Arturia has AT too

 

It's a nice little controller, if you can live with the 32 keys (F-C). Decent enough keybed, the AT works, the knobs are useful, metal construction with wood sides, and compact- the pitch/mod wheels are above the keyboard. Arturia just came out with an new Keylab series, so I imagine it will be even cheaper on the used market now.

[Marzzz]

Okay. Where do I find the ignore setting?

Click on the person's name to the left, then click on "View Profile"

 

It will be one of the choices "Ignore This User" in the middle of the screen.

[marino]

Marino, that 32-key Arturia has AT too

It's a nice little controller, if you can live with the 32 keys (F-C). Decent enough keybed, the AT works, the knobs are useful, metal construction with wood sides, and compact- the pitch/mod wheels are above the keyboard. Arturia just came out with an new Keylab series, so I imagine it will be even cheaper on the used market now.

Thanks Marshall. However, for my needs, the M-Audio/MidiTech is cheaper and has a full 3-octave range, so it's still on the top of the list - unless I'm able to locate a CMK-137. I "did" find a similar keboard, a CMK-37, in France - but that seems to lack even a pitch wheel.

 

 

[dazzjazz]

The Arturia one called "The Factory" looks pretty good. Has anyone played one? Is the action ok?

[mate stubb]

The Arturia one called "The Factory" looks pretty good. Has anyone played one? Is the action ok?

 

Yes, it's decent. More like a Novation and less like the weird mushy M-Audio ones.

[marino]

Update: I just discovered that the little wheel on the CMK keyboards is a mod wheel, not a pitch wheel.

[AnotherScott]

Update: I just discovered that the little wheel on the CMK keyboards is a mod wheel, not a pitch wheel.

Ah, I forgot that! If your software lets you remap, you could turn the mod wheel into a pitch wheel. Of course, it still won't spring back, which is the norm these days. You'd have to work it old school, a la minimoog. (Plus zero is all the way down instead of center, so that can be problematic if you bend both directions from true.)

 

To me, the biggest shortcoming of the CMK was that it had no octave switch buttons. So if you wanted to use it for LH bass, for example, you'd have to do the octave shifting on the receiving device.

[Tusker]

Of course, it still won't spring back, which is the norm these days. You'd have to work it old school, a la minimoog. (Plus zero is all the way down instead of center, so that can be problematic if you bend both directions from true.)

 

Well put. Also, pitch bend is a 14 bit specification. Mod wheel is typically 7 bit, and some hardware will support the higher resolution but not all of them. So you could get more stepping than you are used to, when re-purposing a CC controller to pitch. Of course Carlo knows that. He has forgotten more MIDI than I will ever learn.

 

I miss my Nord Modular. You can put lag generators and transform functions into any controller stream and solve these problems. It seemed like a good idea to get rid of old hardware.

[DaveMcM]

Hi Carlo,

 

Since no one has mentioned this yet, how about the Samson Carbon 49? I bought one of these (actually the 61 key version) to use with my iPad for additional sounds for my church gig and it works great. The unit has both a USB port and MIDI Out port. The playability is acceptable, there are other brands that feel better, but also more expensive brands that feel far worse. I have been quite happy with this controller. Samson Carbon 49

 

Dave

http://www.samsontech.com/site_media/cms/images/product/samson/usb-midi/keyboard-controllers/carbon49/Carbon49_top_1-display.jpg

[marino]

 

By chance, I stubled upon this old thread of mine, and realized I forgot to update it.

In the end, I have bought this:

 

http://www.alltime.ru/obj/catalog/music/archive/roland/img/big/PC-160A.jpg

 

It's called a Roland ED PC160A ( ) and I never suspected of its existence, until I found one a few kms from me, for 50 Euros. Works like a charm - except for the Roland paddle which I hate, but for the little I'm using it, it's okay.

 

I would like to thank once again every one who posted to give advice.