I think I can safely say . . .

[whitefang]

OK, see, right there. Not being a drinker per se, I don't fully understand the whole "single malt" thing.

 

What does that mean exactly? Never heard anyone speak of "double" malt.

 

Also, not drinking any distilled liquors on any regular basis leaves me without a distinguishing pallett. I could never taste the difference between scotch, bourbon or Canadian blended.( I didn't say I NEVER drank!)

Whitefang

[Scott Fraser]

Ya I`m not really a whisky guy either but you may have noticed the spelling-there`s a seminar I go to every year with some pretty legendary after hours parties. For that event I have taken to choosing a good single malt. Mix that with anything and they send people to make you disappear.

 

Beer & wine's all fine, but single malt Scottish whisky is my main thing.

 

It is truly awesome stuff but not really a party drink, to my mind. It kinda demands a certain amount of focus, otherwise it`s a waste. Good for quiet chats with jazz in the background.

 

Yeah, like any of the finer things it demands a certain kind of situation. I'm not a party guy, although I have had single malt at parties, but they're not raucous affairs. It's a quiet, reflective, sipping kind of experience, almost entirely about taste, & hardly at all about alcohol delivery.

[Larryz]

Whitefang, Just remember if it says single malt on the label, you better damn sure like the taste as it's going to cost quite a few bucks. So if you can't taste the difference between scotch, bourbon or Canadian blended, then you can save yourself a lot of money! Double malt would be just like your word blended or one that didn't follow all the rules for the use of the single malt whisky label. American Whiskey actually has more stringent rules even on cheap whiskeys. If it says straight whiskey or bourbon there are no additives allowed. So the basic rules for single malts made in Scotland are: made at one distillery, using only one grain (barley), using a pot still, aged in oak casks or barrels for at least 3 years, no additives other than water and caramel for coloring. Many are aged for as long as 20 years. It's the best they can make and you better not mix it!

 

The Irish won't drink scotch and claim it tastes like peat moss as they use peat for the fire and allow a little smoke into the whisky. The Irish have been known to fib a bit when it comes to refusing a drink of good single malt. Many countries make single malt and use a different grain like rye. The Scottish get the nod though and they get down to single malt from a single cask or barrel. Hope this helps as I have enjoyed a bottle of single malt as a birthday present and it is very good sipping whisky (I kept it hid like me pot of gold and never shared a drop till it all evaporated). For the most part, I'll stick with the one with a lot of E's on the label from the Tennessee Whiskey maker also known as Jackie D...

[Scott Fraser]

OK, see, right there. Not being a drinker per se, I don't fully understand the whole "single malt" thing.

What does that mean exactly? Never heard anyone speak of "double" malt.

 

Non-single malts are "blended". Blended Scotches are Chivas Regal, Cutty Sark, Johnny Walker, Hanky Bannister, etc. These companies buy whiskies from a number of distillers & blend them according to their own belief of what makes a good whisky.

Fairly recently, say since the 1970s, distillers have started selling their spirits under the distillers' names, unblended. These whiskies, from a single maker, are called single malt because they haven't been blended with any other brands, though there may be blending within the distiller from different batches or vintages. Single malts embody the distinctiveness of a single distillers craft, & the differences between different makers is profound.

 

Also, not drinking any distilled liquors on any regular basis leaves me without a distinguishing pallett. I could never taste the difference between scotch, bourbon or Canadian blended.( I didn't say I NEVER drank!)

Whitefang

 

Much of the joy of single malt exploration lies in discovering & appreciating the myriad distinctions & particularities which differentiate the various makers. It's like the difference between boutique hand made guitars (single malts) & factory made models (blended whiskies).

[whitefang]

Thanks for the info, although it will make no difference to me. I just never took to drinking that much. I preferred other mood and mind altering substances, which I also gave up.

 

The people I know who DO drink aren't that discretionary. The hard liquors they prefer fall into two categories:

 

1. Free

2. Lots of it

 

These are members of my second wife's family. I used to drink a bit of beer when I first met them. My preferrences in beer were dark brews, like Lowenbrau or Amstell. THEIR beer preferrences are Bud Lite. But they drink so MUCH of it that, well, let me put it this way...did you ever go to an "all you can eat" restaurant and see somebody eat SO much that you actually lost YOUR appetite?

 

Same here for me with that.

Whitefang

[desertbluesman]

I preferred other mood and mind altering substances.

 

yep

[Scott Fraser]

The people I know who DO drink aren't that discretionary. The hard liquors they prefer fall into two categories:

1. Free

2. Lots of it

These are members of my second wife's family. I used to drink a bit of beer when I first met them. My preferrences in beer were dark brews, like Lowenbrau or Amstell. THEIR beer preferrences are Bud Lite. But they drink so MUCH of it that, well, let me put it this way...did you ever go to an "all you can eat" restaurant and see somebody eat SO much that you actually lost YOUR appetite?

 

Ugh!

I'm not a snob, but I also feel there's no need to drink crappy alcoholic beverages. Once, on tour, the parents of one of the musicians joined us at the hotel after the concert for a party to celebrate his birthday. His mom, very sweet lady, asked if I'd care for a beer. I said yes, & then she pulled a Bud Lite out of the picnic basket they brought in. It was too late to politely turn down at that point, but later, after miming drinking it, I excused myself to the bathroom & dumped it down the sink. I am not going to drink crap beer, free or otherwise. Life is too short to waste on avoidable bad experiences.

BTW, the worst single malt I've had has always been better than the best blended Scottish whisky. I've never turned down a single malt, but I almost always turn down a blend.

[skipclone 1]

Ya I mean, given availability and absence of biometric inquisitions, alcohol is not my #1 choice either-but my policy on any substance has been, better quality means you need less of it which is always easier on your body. Therefore you don`t end up swearing to give it up every time you imbibe-at least until you actualy are ready to give it up. I do recall coolers of Pabst, Grain Belt and Bud at family gatherings-there`s not much of a way to drink it except by the cooler full.

[Steevo]

I've never seen a better example of a 'snob' than that post. A nice lady, mother of musician on his birthday simply offers a beer to Scott (out of her picnic basket) and he pours it down the drain as 'crap'. Ugh.

[Scott Fraser]

I've never seen a better example of a 'snob' than that post. A nice lady, mother of musician on his birthday simply offers a beer to Scott (out of her picnic basket) and he pours it down the drain as 'crap'. Ugh.

 

Perhaps you didn't get that this occurred out of sight, later, in the privacy of a bathroom.

[A String]

I suppose I am a bit of a snob when it comes to matters of the pallet.

 

I can't drink domestic wines. They taste like they've separated. Water and alcohol. No depth. No character.

 

I can't drink most domestic beers. To me, they taste terrible. Nothing like what a beer should taste like. No complexity. Very flat and one dimensional. Unappealing.

 

I dislike blended boozes and most of the "big name" alcohols (you know who you are). If taking a shot makes you cinch up and make a face, then you are drinking the wrong brand. Alcohol should have a slight bite and then revel you in complex flavours. Fruity over tones. Carmel notes. Oak and earthy notes. It should not taste like rubbing alcohol.

 

Same goes with food. I took a semester of culinary arts. Learned to enjoy the complexities and delights that good food offer. Without a doubt, as my pallet became more refined, I became a food snob.

 

The perfect way to compare it is by looking at chocolate. Some people enjoy the taste of milk chocolate. Others prefer the complexities of a dark chocolate. For me, the milk chocolate is waxy and bland and lacks the depth of a good, dark chocolate. I can eat it, but I find the waxy, bland taste slightly off putting. For others, those very same complexities in the dark chocolate are what they find off putting.

 

Some people are "super tasters" and some aren't. It's not a bad thing. It's just the way it is. In no way does it make anyone better than anyone else. I have a very refined pallet. Others may have incredible hearing that allows them to pick out the differences in notes far better then I could. Different strengths and weaknesses. That's all.

[whitefang]

That would be the best way to do that, if the opportunity is there. Sometimes(or more often than not) it isn't.

 

I've learned to be gracious about such stuff to the point of putting myself through the torture. It's a large part of my upbringing. When I was about nine years old, my new oldest step-sister got married. At the wedding reception, I started griping about the food being served( you wouldn't know it to look at me now, but I WAS a picky eater). After whining a few minutes about everything from the vegetables to the gravy, my step-father leaned over and quietly asked, "Do you want a REFUND?" Point taken. Especially since the LOOK on his face told me the question required no answer. I shut up and ate it.

Whitefang

[A String]

I hear you, Whitefang. I suppose the big difference here is that some folks have refined pallets and let everyone know about it and some, like Scott or myself, sneak into the back room and dump the beer down the toilet so no one knows (something I have actually done myself. I thought I was the only one LOL!).

[Dannyalcatraz]

I can't drink domestic wines...

 

FWIW, I'm pretty picky, but my mother pretty much only drank German whites.

 

...until we discovered the Washington state whites from brands like Columbia and 14 Hands. They're not quite as good as the Germans, but they're close- good enough for her.

 

And a buddy of mine married a girl in the wine biz. He was more of a beer & liquor kind of guy, but decided to learn his wines so he could keep up with her. Turns out, when it comes to wine, she ain't picky.

 

However, he's developed a decent wine-tasting palate, and has recently turned me on to Conundrum's reds.

[whitefang]

Make no mistake. My case WASN'T one of having a "refined" pallet. Just one of those annoying kids who was a picky eater. To this day, there's STILL some things I won't eat. Never liked it, never will. Like spinach, asparagus, Brussels sprouts. But I HAVE turned the corner on things like broccolli, cauliflower, green beans, green peppers, onions, liver, poached eggs and clams.

 

But the whole "food thing" baffles me. In the sense of what some "foodies" think the way things should be. For instance, my wife likes to watch this show called "Chopped". One of the thing the judges dislike is what they call "cafeteria presentation". That's where each food item on the plate is given it's own space, you know, the way NINETY-NINE PERCENT of Americans serve their food! And this "distinctive pallet" idea doesn't work for me either. A few years ago, we went to a dinner at a relatives house where each of us were asked to bring some sort of appetizer type thing. We brought a vegetable tray with a garlic-cream cheese dip. A cousin brought a tray of small bread slices with a little bowl of oil in the middle. I asked him what this was supposed to be, and he said, "You take the bread and dip it into the "extra virgin olive oil" and eat it." I asked him, "You want us to eat oily bread?" He said, "Try it." So I dipped a piece of bread into the oil and said, "It tastes like oily bread!" He then asked, "But, don't you taste the PUNGENT EARTHINESS of the olive oil?"

 

I told him I tasted OILY BREAD!

 

This kind of stuff is wasted on me.

Whitefang

[Dannyalcatraz]

Not impugning your cousin, but he may not have served that properly.

 

Olive oils can be as different in flavor as soft drinks or liquors. When using olive oil as a sub for butter like that, you need to find one that has a good flavor. Most of the stuff on grocery-store shelves isn't of that caliber. You need to do a little shopping around for a higher end EVO, or, barring that, add some seasoning like roasted garlic and fresh cracked pepper to the regular stuff.

 

Now, it STILL may not be to your liking- my dad can't stand it- but it does make a difference.

[A String]

Yup. There is a BIG difference between basic supermarket EVO and the "good stuff". Almost as drastic a difference as the one between balsamic vinegars.

 

Regarding the "presentation issue", it's because food, for a chef, is an art. It's because 99% of people serve "cafeteria style" that chefs are under such high expectations. There is a difference between getting food from a cook and getting food from a Chef.

 

When I took the course, I was shocked at the amount of respect the Chef demanded. It was like boot camp. A Chef is a title that you earn after years of training. Not the name of some guy who cooks your food. After seeing how they work and what they do, I understood how little I knew about the whole thing.

 

Shows like "chopped" give you a peak into what that world is like. Into how much of artisan quality is contained in everything they do.

[Dannyalcatraz]

Personally, I dig shows like Good Eats- which tells you the WHY and HOW, the science of cooking- and the Iron Chef shows which is all about artistry and innovation.

 

I also enjoy occasional shows with Jamie Oliver, Emeril, Mario Batalli and even Gordon Ramsey.

 

I also enjoyed watching Bobby Flay's "challenge" show, which was primarily about his ego. He got beat. A lot.

[Larryz]

I love dark chocolate and plain old glazed donuts, Coors Regular beer and Jack Daniels for alcohol beverages. Since I'm diabetic I have limits on all of it...as for Domestic wines, California takes many of the gold medals handed out over the old foreign wines these days. My lack of pallet does not prevent my appreciation of the finer foods and spirits and I really appreciate the chef style presentations and tastes. I love a 2" fillet and a glass of Cabernet for dinner along with a good port or sherry for desert. I do use my manners if I can't handle the taste of something served to me as a guest. If it's edible I'll eat or drink it. If it's flushable, I'll use the bathroom method. For just about anything non-liquid, I can't hide it in a napkin and toss it in the garbage when the opportunity comes up.

 

For me, the big thing at weddings and parties, is not to have more than a couple of drinks (spirits) before and/or while playing the guitar and singing. Booze can easily get in the way of playing ability. If people want to play with me, I ask them to do the same until after we play if it's a performance situation. Then we can party hardy and drink as much as we want as long as we are not driving...

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Never liked the taste of dark chocolate.

 

******

 

Here's an interesting tidbit: you know how there is a delicate art to partnering favors of foods & drinks- especially those that are alcoholic in nature?

 

Well, I found an odd one last year: if you partner a good Stilton cheese with a lighter beer like a Blue Moon or a Shiner blonde, the beer will taste mildly sweet.

[whitefang]

I've always liked dark chocolate, Danny. Since way back when Hershey's was calling the bars "semi sweet" instead of "special dark". Just as I preferred dark beers. Or a hint of "char" on my toast or English muffins. And dark roast coffees. Don't know why that is. Some say things like this indicate certain personality traits, but not sure what trait THIS reveals.

 

As for the olive oil my cousin used, I really couldn't say which kind he used. I know there are flavored ones on the market now. But I've seen oils at even Meijer's that sell for upwards of $12-$15 a bottle, so I don't use much of it.

 

And I personally don't care how my food is presented to me. If I had my druthers, the "cafeteria" style presentation is preferred, chiefly because I usually don't mix my different foods on my fork. It all depends on what it is, though. As long as it looks appetizing, it's all that matters. I'm not impressed with an ice cream scoop sized portion of food planked down in the middle of a 14" diameter plate covered with a mock Jackson Pollack painting done over it with some kind of basalmic drizzle( which Craig Ferguson said sounded like an STD). Give me a normal sized plate with enough on it to look like a MEAL, and I'm fine! I also think paying $60 a plate for $15 worth of food is kind of stupid, but hey! This IS America. Anyone else could do as they like.

Whitefang

[Scott Fraser]

Never liked the taste of dark chocolate.

 

It's another acquired taste. Dark is in the area of 70% pure cacao, & that doesn't leave a lot of room left for sugar. Milk chocolate is mostly sugar, but pure dark chocolate is edging toward bitter.

 

Here's an interesting tidbit: you know how there is a delicate art to partnering favors of foods & drinks- especially those that are alcoholic in nature?

Well, I found an odd one last year: if you partner a good Stilton cheese with a lighter beer like a Blue Moon or a Shiner blonde, the beer will taste mildly sweet.

 

Yup, fats open up the taste buds, allowing a lot more flavor through. That's why cheese & caviar are often served at wine functions.

[Dannyalcatraz]

Yup, fats open up the taste buds, allowing a lot more flavor through. That's why cheese & caviar are often served at wine functions.

 

Not just that.

 

Like your closely-related sense of smell, tasting is all about chemical reactions. You can only smell or taste something if the proper chemicals in your receptors are present. If they are used up- usually by tasting/smelling something for a long time- the taste or smell is not perceived so strongly...if at all.

 

When you data the Stilton, it uses up some of the same chemicals that react to the bitterness in a beer, unveiling some of the other favors present.

 

Now, I have heard people tell me the same kind of thing happens with partnering dark chocolate with red wines. In my experience, they're either delusional or they're serving the wrong red wines, because that is NOT a party in my mouth. If anything, the dark chocolate tastes worse to me.

[Dannyalcatraz]

I've always liked dark chocolate, Danny. Since way back when Hershey's was calling the bars "semi sweet" instead of "special dark". Just as I preferred dark beers. Or a hint of "char" on my toast or English muffins. And dark roast coffees. Don't know why that is. Some say things like this indicate certain personality traits, but not sure what trait THIS reveals.

 

You're a bitter old man?

 

I actually like dark beers, but prefer my toast to be golden.

 

A bit of char on a steak or sautéed veggies is good.

 

As for coffee...well, since my ratio is 1/3 coffee, 1/3 milk, 1/3 sugar*, the darkness of the roast matters less than the strength of the brew. Weak coffee is not welcome!

 

And tea? Iced or hot, all I add is lemon. Or occasionally lime.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

* I kid, but I do like my coffee sweet & milky, so its mostly a pure dessert drink for me, and rarely ordered.

[skipclone 1]

Ya my favorite coffees are Sumatran which has a peaty, smoky character and when I can find it, Laotian which is thick and rich but without the smoky part. I wouldn`t call myself a foodie at all but the last couple years I have been on a tear with cooking-I have been posting a lot of pics on facebook, if you guys want to see a few let me know.

It was mostly out of health concerns for me, China has a long history of food as medicine. For example dang guei is is an herb that is often thrown in with a piece of chicken or duck, broth is added and you can buy it at night markets. That herb has similar benefits to ginseng, especially for women, but is much cheaper. Chicken or duck enhances the effects.

Until now I haven`t had much interest in what drink goes with what food, I don`t deal with fish often and still prefer reds with other seafood. My friend John Gauntner is a sake expert, his website www.esake.com has good info about sake and food.

Anyway next week is Japan`s Golden Week holidays, I`m going to Hong kong for a few days with a buddy who knows the city well and is a food fan. I`m also going to meet a former Tokyo beer club member and journalist who is very knowledgeable about food,looking forward to it.

 

Dark chocolate for me-after 70% cocoa it gets too bitter but that`s about right-it lasts longer too.

 

I have a kind of guardian angel-it`s a bit of a long story but, after I mentioned some concern about food safety after the earthquake and nuclear accident, she started sending me things from the U.K.-grains, sauces etc. ostensibly we are testing them for possibly importing them but the Japanese market is notoriously fickle and insular, in the meantime-let`s eat haha.

[Dannyalcatraz]

It was mostly out of health concerns for me...

 

That's a big part for me, too.

 

I started cooking at age 7, because Mom had a long recuperation after a surgery and Dad made cereal for breakfast and PB&Js for lunch & dinner.

 

After learning the basics, I realized I needed to learn the family recipes, because at some point, Iwouldnt be around those cooks and/or those cooks wouldn't be around.

 

But then, Mom got diagnosed with diabetes and I got diagnosed with sodium-dependent hypertension.* So now, I'm reworking the family recipes as much as feasible to retain flavor while making them healthier. Some recipes you can't do much with, but some I have revolutionized.

 

My turkey, for one, is now so much in demand, I have to cook at least 1/month on average, shared with my extended family. It's easy, its juicy, and it's made nearly sodium free.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

* the worst my doctor had seen in 40+ years of practice.

[skipclone 1]

I have mild hypertension but it wasn`t for anything specific-and I want to keep it that way. You know, an ounce of prevention and all-especially cooked slowly in white wine and lemon juice, with sauteed mushrooms and onions...

[skipclone 1]

Hi

Just for the heck of it and despite popular request I though I`d post this, from this very evening-this is a traditional English dish from the Devonshire area called Upcott Pork. Thin sliced pork, sliced apples, cheese, onions, cider, double cream and seasoning. My first time to make it, turned out nice:

 

I moved this photo to a food album so I`ll repost it:

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a236/skipclone1/Skipfood/NEC_0316.jpg

 

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I'd eat it!

[Scott Fraser]

Aren't there rules prohibiting depictions of pork on this forum?