Roland V-Combo VR-09

[Craig MacDonald]

You should get something you enjoy playing and if it's cheap and light.... all the better.. !

[Plassgard]

My Bad Craig and not the VR-09. It was 24-bit files, just needed to convert them to 16-bit and all worked fine.

[Adan]

 

You should get something you like playing, not something that is cheap and light.

 

+1

 

You two should start a band together. "The A-Gamer's"??

[Ekewaka]

 

You should get something you like playing, not something that is cheap and light.

 

+1

 

You two should start a band together. "The A-Gamer's"??

 

Wish I was an A-gamer but I'm striving towards it, Kaitzen...

 

Anyway, if people ask me what guitar to purchase I tell them to try out each and every one in the store, when you find one you like playing, that's the one. Same with keyboards. And no need to become a cheapskate, you could use the instrument for years and years like my college day electric guitar.

[stevie b]

I have been watching this thread for a while now and appreciate the info provided.

 

My top board is currently a VR760. The keybed appears to be the limiting factor, but as others have said it may be good enough. I only use the board for organ and snyth, so I could care less about playing subtle piano on this board.

 

It appears I would gain a better Leslie sim and the ability to play mp3 or wav.

The weight/ size could also be a plus.

 

Has anyone done a side by side comparison with a VR760 or 700?

 

Thanks for all the posts so far.

[Dglavko]

I think I will like it, Dglavko, because I've now taken to playing my SK1 using the Roland RT-20 rotary pedal (not using the SK1's internal rotory sim). With that pedal, I can slow that fast rotary down to 0 if I wanted to. The VR-09 manual shows the adjustable range/scale of the fast rotary running from 0 to 127. On the SK1, the fast rotary bottoms out at 375 on its scale and I find that too fast.

Ok I think I get that. You are looking for sounds unlike a traditional Hammond at times? That reminds me, now that we can all almost sound like a real Hammond with our various clones, it is almost passé. For example, if one of my original music projects, the non keyboard guys get way more excited when I dabble in obscure combo organ patches with cheesy vibratos then they do over my efforts to re-create "that Hammond SOUND". Who knew? Getting back on topic, I guess the VR 09 with ring mod and other nontraditional hammond effects has a bright future? Yet I'm about to pull the trigger on an sk1?!

[jcazzy]

I probably should go back through the previous 31 pages and look to see if it has already been posted but are the VR-09 keys velocity sensitive on everything but the organ setting and if they are, can that feature be turned off with a global setting?

 

Sorry 'bout the laziness!

[RetroVintageOld]

For piano I liked the action in my Juno GI more than my Electro. I would have kept the GI if the sound selection was more up my alley. The VR09 may be just be the ticket for me.

[simchaleh]

One other tip.. the tone control is interesting in that it doesn't work like an EQ.. as you move it from one side to the other, it emphasizes different frequencies, at the same time that it de-emphasizes others.. It's like an entirely different organ. When you play with the low/high gain try it in conjunction with the Tone control.. Turn the tone control to the extreme left and right, and then play with the gain settings.. You'll find the results pretty interesting.. I use leslie type 2, with my gains flat and the tone control all the way to the left.. One last thing.. using compression will help to boost some of the weaker frequencies.. as I was playing with my VR-09 I was getting a sound I liked but it wasn't quite cutting/screaming the way I wanted, and I bumped up the compression and the thing came alive. As you're playing with tone/gain and leslie types also boost the compression to see how the sound/bite changes.. it's remarkable.

hey craig. i know we spoke about this already, but since i see youve had more time experimenting with the vr09 i figured to ask again for more input, regarding the descision im having between the kronos or vr09. is it also this easy to control change and manipulate tones.

it seems like the vr09 has combined and programmed each control knob, to change a few factors at once which brings to intresting results. whereas in the kronos, would i need to start getting down into each gritty detail in order to get similiar results? or perhaps the tones are much better built and organized there, so that i wont need to manipulate the tones as much. how do the organs on the kronos compare to the vr09? thnks

sb

[Craig MacDonald]

already, but since i see youve had more time experimenting with the vr09 i figured to ask again for more input, regarding the descision im having between the kronos or vr09. is it also this easy to control change and manipulate tones.

it seems like the vr09 has combined and programmed each control knob, to change a few factors at once which brings to intresting results. whereas in the kronos, would i need to start getting down into each gritty detail in order to get similiar results? or perhaps the tones are much better built and organized there, so that i wont need to manipulate the tones as much. how do the organs on the kronos compare to the vr09? thnks

sb

 

SB, you can definately do a lot more with the Kronos, but the thing is that on the VR-09 the engineers have already done this for you (albiet organizing things the way they think you'll like it). With the VR-09 you've also got dedicated controls for your convenience, and as such the VR-09 is a great live board for someone who either doesn't want to dig into a synth or doesn't have the skills/experience to do so. That said, the Kronos has a huge library of sounds and combinations, and I'm sure you'll find some have great effects and preassigned controls as well. So the answer is yes it's relatively easy to control changes and manipulate tones on the Kronos.

 

With a couple hours work, I could create a "combination" in the Kronos that has all of the same effects as the VR-09 and I could assign specific effect parameters to a standard set of controls (and the Kronos has lot's of assignable controls), and effectively do everything that the VR-09 can do.. but it takes work and you won't have dedicated buttons, and you'll have to understand the different effects so that you can decide what parameters you want to change and how to assign them etc.. On the VR-09 this is all done for you, which is very convenient, but somewhat limiting at the same time. With the Kronos you can create a dozen different combinations of different effects in different order and different control parameters etc.. but on the VR-09 you just sit down and start turning knobs! So you have to decide which you value more.. ease of use and simple/effective live interface, or depth of programmability.. Don't forget that the Kronos is a workstation with 16 part mulitimbrality, 9 different synth engines and a huge library of samples and sounds. The Kronos is a monster synth.. but it's 2.5 times the price.

 

One of the limitations of the VR-09 effects is in the area of splits and layers.. if you're using a split keyboard, you can't have one effects chain on the upper section and a different effects chain on the lower section, and if I'm not mistaken the live effects only affect the sound assigned to the upper section (althought this really doesn't bother me). There is no such limitation on the Kronos.. on the Kronos I can split the keyboard into 16 different parts and each part can have an entirely different set of effects.

 

With respect to the organ.. I prefer the VR-09 organ as it stands. The one weakness of the Kronos is that the CX3 engine has a very poor leslie sim, when compared to todays standard, the Ventilator pedal. On the other hand the VR-09 leslie sim is excellent, and with a bit of tweaking of the tone and high/low gain the VR-09 organ sounds great.

 

 

[simchaleh]

great. thnks for the description. very well said. i do have a head for programming but not so much experience as far as which effects control what. thats why i thought it would be best to have both the synths to easily learn what potential different effects have on the tone.

on the other hand, my gigs mostly are where in any case i need to prepare pre programmed lists before hand so actualy on the spot live tweaking doesnt really matter since that can be assigned on the kronos.

also i dont really see too much of a problem with the lack of being able to split effects to the lwr split, since in any case, thats usually a sound that will want to be in the background, whereas the right upper split is usually taking more of a sound which should be cutting through or different.

the one big minus you just pointed out is the weak leslie sim on the kronos. thats a big dissapointment as about 85% of the tone i will be using is organs, and need good ones.

thnks for the help. so any ideas how to get together the funds to buy both boards

Sb

[Craig MacDonald]

thnks for the help. so any ideas how to get together the funds to buy both boards

Sb

SB, go get a regular job..!! AS they say.. if you want to make a million bucks in the music business...start with 2 million.

[rhodey]

New at thisIve been keeping up with this post for a while so I know there are some issues around using the expression pedal on the VR-09. Got my RD-64 2 weeks ago, VR-09 last week. Nice compact rig. After 2 gigs I am frustrated with the controller issues. The RD-64 has no capability to change FC1 and FC2 from their default of soft and sostenuto in piano mode. The capability exists in controller mode, however, piano voices are disabled. The VR-09 has no capability to assign the expression pedal to individual parts. Happy with both keyboards sound and playability, but I am back to using the FP4 with Mainstage.

[Craig MacDonald]

I have the VR-09, and the expression pedal is a problem for me too.. it seems crazy that the VR-09 can't separate expression control between two parts. There is a work around $149 (you'll see it mentioned earlier)..

 

Can't help you with the piano pedal mode problem. Just make sure you report it to Roland.

[AnotherScott]

Just make sure you report it to Roland.

Or ask Santa Claus. ;-)

[Craig MacDonald]

Just make sure you report it to Roland.

Or ask Santa Claus. ;-)

ho ho ho!!

[grapite]

Has anyone tried to playback a general midi song yet? just wondering about the quality of their gm sounds.

Regards

[simchaleh]

thnks for the help. so any ideas how to get together the funds to buy both boards

Sb

SB, go get a regular job..!! AS they say.. if you want to make a million bucks in the music business...start with 2 million.

 

do i need to get a haircut too?

 

so it looks like in the long run ill probably be getting both, or by the time i get to the second board, whatever else better is available on the market by the time i get the funds for the second board.

any reccomendations which would be the good one to go for first in the meantime?

in the meantime i do also have a lightweight roland bk-5 which i can use a second board for dedicated piano/rhodes or something like that to afford more flexibility. however its a backing keyboard and not at all made for this type of music and sound setup as the sounds are barely editeable and very difficult menu diving to do pretty much anything.

Sb

[Josh Paxton]

I should have mine tomorrow, and hopefully will have it sufficiently tweaked and ready to take out on a couple gigs this weekend. I look forward to trying the tips mentioned here so far!

[Leh173]

I have the VR-09, and the expression pedal is a problem for me too.. it seems crazy that the VR-09 can't separate expression control between two parts. There is a work around $149 (you'll see it mentioned earlier)..

 

Can't help you with the piano pedal mode problem. Just make sure you report it to Roland.

 

I find these limitations amazing... the Fantom G can do all this stuff... can the reception of controllers be edited at patch level (if there is such a thing on these) ie disable a piano patches reception to expression controllers... I think on the fantom G I can disable controllers at live set/studio level or at patch level...

 

Reporting this to Roland for a change is worth doing. who know's if they'll listen, but they seemed to for the Jupiter-80...

[LX88]

Man, Craig sure has a lot of good things to say about the VR09! Roland should be giving him a commission....

 

Anyway,two of these just showed up in my area about 35 miles away.I will probably hear it on Friday.

 

As I am saying, I was quite familiar with the VK8m module. Very , very few people have actually heard what it is really capable of, because you have to do the sim bypass and then you can really compare it with a real Hammond if you have one.

 

So if the VR 09 is in that class, I will find out soon. And if it is, Guitar Center is running a 12 percent off sale this weekend.

 

I would say if the VK engine is up to par with past Rolands, if it has good EP's and even reasonably good AP's and anywhere near decent action it could be considered a bargain.

 

I will find out more Friday and report Saturday.

[Craig MacDonald]

Just remember, I bought this thing despite not being a fan of the vk engine! But I really like it. Is it the most authentic sounding clone? not by any means, but it sounds good, and it makes me want to play it.

 

LX88 I think you're going to like the sound of it! Remember to pick the Bay Area B3 registration and play with the tone control.. I just turned it all the way to the left and then increase/decrease the upper/lower gain to suit your taste, depending on what you're listening to it through.... Bump up the expression a bit and you should have a pretty good hammond tone..

[LX88]

How is the chorus vibrato Craig?

[Craig MacDonald]

Well I think it's very good but from reading your posts I think you have a very specific C/V sound that you're looking for so I can't be entirely sure that you'll love it, but I think it's very good. I'm anxious to get your thoughts on it.. As a fan of the vk engine, I'm interested in your opinion....

[LX88]

I the thing I liked about the VK8m was that they didn't try to program "character" into it.In other words it wasn't unnaturally "fat" or "warm" until you put those qualities in with whatever amplification you used. I used a leslie 860 a lot with the VK8m ( with a subwoofer).

 

It was a very neutral Hammond sound, but the good chorus vibrato and overdrive made it work.

 

I always thought the drawbar tones were accurate enough, but I often liked to soften the EQing a bit.

 

With the sim bypassed, the chorus was on par with the Key B engines and VB3. I have not heard the Mojo, but the VK8m chorus was on par with the others I have tried.

[AnotherScott]

I find these limitations amazing... the Fantom G can do all this stuff...

Not for $999 it can't. ;-)

[simchaleh]

With respect to the organ.. I prefer the VR-09 organ as it stands. The one weakness of the Kronos is that the CX3 engine has a very poor leslie sim, when compared to todays standard, the Ventilator pedal. On the other hand the VR-09 leslie sim is excellent, and with a bit of tweaking of the tone and high/low gain the VR-09 organ sounds great.

other than the lacking a good leslie sim factor, other than that, how does the organ sounds on the kronos compare to the vr09?

thnks

Sb

[Leh173]

I find these limitations amazing... the Fantom G can do all this stuff...

Not for $999 it can't. ;-)

 

Haha well you 'd think if the fantom can do up to 16 parts worth of individual pedal assignments, a $999 instrument could manage just 2....

[Craig MacDonald]

With respect to the organ.. I prefer the VR-09 organ as it stands. The one weakness of the Kronos is that the CX3 engine has a very poor leslie sim, when compared to todays standard, the Ventilator pedal. On the other hand the VR-09 leslie sim is excellent, and with a bit of tweaking of the tone and high/low gain the VR-09 organ sounds great.

other than the lacking a good leslie sim factor, other than that, how does the organ sounds on the kronos compare to the vr09?

thnks

Sb

SB, you're asking me to compare the two instruments in ways that I don't use them... So I really can't answer this.. however, the CX3 engine in the Kronos is much more tweakable and because it has seperate audio inputs and outputs, IF you were to utilize a Ventilator with the Kronos you can send the raw organ out to on a separate output to the Ventilator and route it back into the Kronos and then to the main outs.. So there is no need for a separate mixer to mix the regular Kronos sounds with the output of the Ventialtor. With respect to organ, some might think that the Kronos CX3 tweakability and audio ins/outs give it a bit of an advantage.

[simchaleh]

SB, you're asking me to compare the two instruments in ways that I don't use them... So I really can't answer this.. however, the CX3 engine in the Kronos is much more tweakable and because it has seperate audio inputs and outputs, IF you were to utilize a Ventilator with the Kronos you can send the raw organ out to on a separate output to the Ventilator and route it back into the Kronos and then to the main outs.. So there is no need for a separate mixer to mix the regular Kronos sounds with the output of the Ventialtor. With respect to organ, some might think that the Kronos CX3 tweakability and audio ins/outs give it a bit of an advantage.

 

hey have you tried the organimation from k-sounds. how does their rotary compare to the vr09. they claim its very upgraded from the default kronos rotary. heres a link you can hear them. intrested to hear what you think