TomKittel

+1 There is another parallel to the auto business, more specifically to the used car business: would anyone accept if a car manufacturer prohibits selling along the extra features of a used car? So please remove the leather steering wheel and the sports seats when you sell your car. This is exactly what Roland is doing with it's license policy for model expansions. You are not allowed to transfer the expansions to the buyer if you sell the instrument. I am really surprised that hardly anyone complains about it. But maybe that's because people only notice down the road when they want to sell their Roland toy in favor of the next hot sequel.

re softsynths: TAL U-NO LX mimics the Juno 60 incredibly well. It sounds at least as good if not better than the Zenology model for a fraction of the cost. The ipad version cost about 10 or 15 bucks.

If it’s the same heavy Roland interpretation of aftertouch as in the Fantom or in the A800 controller, it’s quite useless.

Juno X: superior appearance, lesser VA System 8: superior VA, lesser appearance The System 8 engine repackaged in Juno 106 or Juno 60 design would have caught my interest.

I just doublechecked with Midi-Ox and my YC61. Percussion and C/V do send Sysex.

The Juno Stage 76 (not to be confused with Juno G or Juno DS) has the very same action as the Jupiter 50. A very nice action indeed. I recently compared it with the flagship Fantom 7 action. While the shape of the keys is a little different, the weights underneath the keys are very similar. The quality and the playing feel of the Jupiter 50/Juno Stage 76 action is equal to that of the flagship Fantom 7.

Here is another Fantom 0 deal killer: the synth expansions are NOT free of charge as they are with the original Fantom. JP8, JX8P, Juno106 and SH101 would set you back 600 bucks plus taxes. This plus the lower-grade keybed puts the lower price for the Fantom 0 in a different light. In addition, you can not sell the expansions, should you want to sell the Fantom 0 some day. You are stuck with these licenses forever, no matter if you still own the instrument or not. The Roland Cloud licensing policy is ridiculous. I wish a journalist like Stephen Fortner would address this issue which definitely is a case for consumer protection.

This is so ridiculous. I am done with Roland Cloud. Never had such issues with Arturia or Native Instruments. Statement of Roland Cloud support: „You can transfer the JD-800 model expansion software that's installed on the hardware by not resetting the hardware prior to sale, and the new owner could continue to use that install until they did a factory reset or wanted to install further software, but the license itself is non-transferable. After the sale you would also have to uninstall the software on your computer and refrain from reinstalling it.“

I just sold my Jupiter XM including JD800 and Voice Designer expansion. The two expansions cost me over 300 bucks. When I wanted to transfer the expansions licenses to the buyer I was told by Roland support that it's not allowed even though it's clearly stated in the Roland Cloud EULA: "Transferability. You may transfer the Software on a permanent basis as part of the sale or transfer of the hardware system on which the Software is loaded, provided that You retain no copies of any version of the Software." This is nothing but fraud. These expansions can only be used with the corresponding hardware! So when I sell the hardware I am stuck with the software which will be unusable for me then. I really begin to hate this company and it's cloud bullshit for it's non-existing customer service. With Arturia or Native Instruments and others it was never any problem to transfer licenses to buyers when the related hardware was sold. So be aware if you ever want to buy one of these expensive expansions in the Roland cloud. You will be stuck with what you bought forever, no matter if you still own the related hardware synth in the future or not.

I would love to have a Jupiter XM as rack module for the purpose the OP described.

I wouldn’t even have noticed any key trigger issue if I hadn’t read this here. I really like the YC61 keybed. For my needs it’s one of the better allrounder keybeds I owned. I am admittedly not the most advanced organ player. But smears and other organ techniques I am using work pretty well, for example. In comparison my NS3C keybed feels stiffer and I have no idea if it has a high or low trigger point. Everyone has a different taste though. So try before you buy.

This example sounds no different to me than the PC3 or Forte. I had spent endless time with the PC3 or Forte trying to program better sounding B3/Leslie patches. Pure waste of time. Any mediocre clonewheel will sound a thousand times more accurate.

Thanks for confirming.

Where is your trigger point? Up or down?

New Kurzweil PC3 experiments from Theo?

With regards to variety: 1) The three Hammond models in the YC61 really differ from each other. Many clonewheels are featuring different models. However, most of them differ only very subtly. 2) The different FM organ models can be tailored to produce 'hammondish' tones as well as convincing Vox and Farfisa tones or whatever crazy tones are desired. 3) Add to that the three rotary sims and four amp sims (BTW the old 'classic' and 'overdrive' rotary sims can still make sense for some sounds) plus a variety of adjustable and programmable EQ and drive settings. The new EQs pack a punch and they can really make a difference. Alltogether the sound shaping options can lead to surprising results. I would not agree that the YC61 only offers very few variations to choose from. The opposite is true if you dig deeper into it's programmability. YC owners should check out Soundmondo. For example Katsumi Ujiie is demoing some of his Artist Sound Sets here. The following examples were based on the old OS with sub-optimal rotary sim. Organs start at minute 7:00.

Is your assessment based on demos or have you compared these three instruments yourself? At the end of the day, I doubt anyone could tell any of the current clonewheels apart in a blind test if played by a capable organ player. There is no such thing as the one and only Hammond sound anyway. All I can say is that I'm having endless fun with the YC61. It has exceeded my expectations. This applies not only to the organ but to the entire versatility of this instrument. And for what it's worth in my arsenal of the last few years it's the first clonewheel that makes me completely forget about the Vent. JMTC

As far as I can tell the YC61 sounds at least as good as the B3X. I like the YC61 sound better. The diverse EQ and drive settings make it way more versatile. The same is particularly true compared to the VB3 II which the Mojo seems to be based upon. But I never played a Mojo. So I can't answer this part of the question. It's all a matter of taste for sure. But since the 1.2 update the YC61 is a strong contender in the clonewheel market. When I bought the YC my plan was to use it with B3X/iPad among other things. But this is completely superfluous. And my Vent II is now finally out of work too. JMTC

I played around a bit with the Soundmondo app today. There are many good presets to be found and it's a great uncomplicated way of preset management by iPhone. Pure fun!

My YC61 arrived this weekend. I am impressed. The B3 sounds are 'hammondish' in every way. At first glance I like them better than those of my NS Compact. In comparison the NS3 organ/leslie sounds are washed out and less detailed somehow. The YC61 percussion 'klonk' and keyclick sound better to my ears. The same goes for C3 Chorus on the YC61. Not to mention the new Leslie sim, which does not leave me a desire for a Vent or such. Also, and this is important to me, the YC61 Waterfall keybed allows you to play the AP and EP sounds expressively. I can't say that about my Nord Stage Compact keybed. I hate playing AP on the NS Compact. The pianos always sound like crap on the NSC, no matter which of the Nord Piano samples I use. The keys to sound connection never seems right with the NS compact's AP sounds. I don't know how to put this any better. I remember an FOH guy asking me what's wrong with my piano sounds at a gig last summer. Anyway, Yamaha APs somehow seem to have a special quality in comparison. Some people seem to appreciate that and some don't. Anyway, they are really fun to play on the YC61. It's certainly not the same experience as on a good weighted hammer keyboard, but still very usable if you can get by with 61 keys. Same goes for EP sounds. The new touch settings are very useful in this regard. I briefly tried out the iPad integration through Midi and Audio I/0 with a single USB cable. That was really fun! Simply plug in a USB cable plus camera connection kit and everything works 1a without any cables hassle. Any iPad/iPhone instrument can be used like an internal YC61 sound source. Brilliant! Long story cut short, the YC61 is a keeper. Hope my assessment doesn't sound like a fanboy report. But it could even be that I will sell my NS compact for it. We'll see.

Maybe this demo will change your mind?

Hope the YC61 will allow me to get rid of any keyboard submixer hassle. It seems to be one of very few organ centric keyboards (if not the only one) which features regular sized audio in jacks plus an additional class compliant USB audio interface to easily hook up an iphone/ipad as additional sound source. B3-X and Korg Module are awaiting their new host instrument!

Sounds like a good compromise to me. I will report as soon as I have played the YC61.

Good to know. I still remember the terrible pushback of the Kurzweil PC3-76 and the Artis 7 which made these boards unplayable for me.

This update sold me. Just ordered a YC61. Wondering if it features the same keybed as the Vox Continental 61? Yamaha used to be a shareholder of Korg. They still seem to maintain a cooperation.