Keyboard Studio Mixer Sound-Off

[Stephen Fortner]

Craig's audio interface roll call got me thinking about this. I"d like to know what folks who still use a mixer for their mainly keyboard-based studios are using, based on certain premises that describe me and perhaps a lot of us here. These premises are:

 

- You have enough hardware synths that you want a slab-o-faders to mange and monitor them all.

- You don"t necessarily need to mix 'tape returns' from your DAW because you"re happy mixing down in-the-box; again, you just want something physical and analog for routing, monitoring, and perhaps gain-staging while jamming or tracking.

- You already have one or more audio interfaces or converters you like and you"re invested in their ecosystems. Therefore, a digital mixer that's also a multi-channel audio interface (e.g. PreSonus StudioLive) both (A) has redundant functionality, and (B) subjects your signal to an extra stage of A/D/A conversion you'd rather not have.

- You want at least eight direct channel outs or group busses to connect to the line inputs of your audio interface. Ideally, direct outs for every channel.

- If you need mic preamps in your mixer, you don"t need a lot of them. Four, maybe eight. This could be because you already have outboard pres or you don"t mic up much other than your voice and a Leslie.

 

This is my situation. (Not to knock the StudioLive boards, by the way, which are very deep and powerful on their own and certainly a way to go if you"re starting from some other place than the above.) Here's where I"ve observed that there doesn"t seem to be a lot out there in a range that"s upmarket of what we might call 'Mackie and its competitors' yet not getting into five-figure territory. There"s not the middle there used to be.

 

When the ADAT and DA-88 dominated, so did the midmarket 8-bus mixer. The Mackie 8-Bus was the most popular on a budget, but those who wanted something nicer could go for, say, a Soundcraft Ghost or similar. In fact, what I see people doing with this application is going for stuff like a well-cared-for used Ghost or Midas Venice F-series. Older used consoles are their own can of worms, though.

 

So, what are folks with wants similar to mine using? Or should one just get with the times and be happy to be mixerless?

[J. Dan]

Well, I'm a studiolive user but you already know all about them. When I bought it, Behringer wasn't up to snuff yet like they are now and it just so happened that my bass player worked for the local rep and got me a good deal, so.....

[Tom Williams]

I have a couple of Behringers: XR18 for the house (doubles as an 18 stream interface for the computer) and an XR12 for gigging (fewer keyboards, mixing down to 2 channels of keyboards and an optional 3rd channel for my voice). Having had several analog mixers over the years, I am still blown away by the processing options.

[Markyboard]

Years ago I switched from a Mackie 32x8 to a Speck Xtramix cxi - 8 bus fed into an Aurora 16. The quality and build is unsurpassed. Wish he still made them.

[The Real MC]

I acquired the bulk of my pro audio outboard when everybody was dumping that stuff to go ITB. Digital reverbs, compressors, delay processing, mixers, etc. I appreciate the conveniences of ITB but to my ears OTB sounds better. Not in any hurry to switch.

 

I'm not mixing in the box so I'm not using a multi-channel audio interface. The computer is for MMC and MIDI control only. I use the computer for arranging and sound design, then I commit the tracks to my Alesis HD24. I use non-MIDI stuff like Rhodes and guitar. Mixdown and post processing are done through the channel strips on my Allen & Heath GL-2200. MMC is great because I can still sync to the computer if I need any changes to MIDI instruments during mixdown.

 

The GL-2200 isn't a "studio" mixer but it can be adapted to use with tape returns and it has six sends for effects. The routing on that board is pretty flexible and I don't need eight subgroups.

 

One big advantage of OTB is I don't have to worry about plugins going obsolete with advances in computer OS.

[Doerfler]

Older used consoles are their own can of worms, though.

 

I still use a 25 year old Yamaha 02R with a meter bridge. It's what I have and I'm not going to buy something new until it doesn't work anymore. It's bulky and heavy, but what I have gotten out of it considering how long ago it was paid for is all that matters to me currently.

I actually had two of these, but no longer had the room for both. I donated one to the radio station brother zukskywalker manages here in DC and that one is still going strong also.

[kenheeter]

Just like Tom, I've moved to the Behringer Xair stuff. I have an XR18 in my studio and I use the tiny XR12 for live work. It replaced my Key Largo. Way more flexible and powerful. Now I have all of my charts and control for both the XR12 and the Mackie console to adjust monitor mix onstage, all loaded onto an Asus Zenbook. Great solution for live performance. I've always been skeptical of Behringer products but the Xair mixers seem to be much higher quality than previous things I've tried from them.

[KuruPrionz]

Speaking to the form factor - you mean somthing like this?

 

https://reverb.com/item/808043-korg-kmx-122-line-mixer

 

I don't know anything about the unit, Korg has made some nice gear in the past. The price makes one suspicious but maybe it's a sleeper?

[KuruPrionz]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Yamaha-MV802-Rack-Mount-Keyboard-Mixer/324138205482?epid=1204041919&hash=item4b7824812a:g:jScAAOSwyp5emTDh

 

Yamaha, older. Similar to the Korg.

[Dave Bryce]

I use two separate keyboard submixers in my studio: an Allen and Heath Mix Wizard 14:4:2, and a different model of the fabulous Speck stuff than Marky - the x.sum 32 x 4 channel line mixer. $$$, but worth it.

 

Both are connected to my main mixer (TASCAM DM3200). The Speck also feeds back into an input on the A&H, and I use a stereo buss from the A&H to route the output of both mixers to a Yamaha sound system (amp, floor monitors) in the back of the room so I don't have to turn the TASCAM and the studio monitors on when I just wanna play keys.

 

I also have a Mackie LM3204, but it needs to go to the doctor.

 

dB

[KuruPrionz]

And a newer Radial rackmount keyboard mixer. Radial is modern high quality stuff, the price reflects it but buy nice or buy twice.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Radial-KL-8-Rackmount-Keyboard-Mixer-NEW/323812415888?epid=28030082225&hash=item4b64b95990:g:xRYAAOSwYCdc4vbq

[NewImprov]

I have a rather over-complicated keyboard mixing setup in my studio that I am trying to streamline.

 

First, there"s my live rig, which combines hardware keys and Mainstage instruments. For this, I use a Keith McMillan K-Mix as a mixer and interface. I"m reasonably happy with the K-Mix, properly gain-staged it sounds really good, and has some pretty flexible routing capabilities.

 

Then I have a bunch of synths and modular stuff that all goes into an ancient Roland M160 line mixer. I"m sure this mixer doesn"t sound that great, but I"ve had it forever and it mostly works.

 

Outs of both of those go to an Allan & Heath SQ6 mixer, which acts as an interface to the studio computer, and routes signals to the various monitors around the studio, 2 sets of speakers in the control room, 6 headphone mixes, and 6 mixes to floor wedges around the live room. The SQ is amazing, sounds great, and records 32 channels at 96K simultaneously into our DAW, in our case, Logic.

 

I"ve been considering replacing both the K-Mix and M160 with A&H QU series mixers, because these will interface digitally with the SQ over Ethernet and not use analog channels or need an extra round of A to D conversion to record. But, since my income from live sound, studio gigs and playing has gone down to nothing since the corona lockdown, I"m probably sticking with what I have for at least the rest of this year.

[bfields]

The thing that annoys me about using my X18 at home is the way I have to go start up an app, connect, and wait for it to sync, all just to adjust one level.

 

If I'm going to be playing for an hour it's no big deal. If I was just going to take a break from work to play five minutes it bugs me.

[Steve Nathan]

I've still got a few old Rolands laying around if anyone ever needs one.

M-480

M-160

maybe a 120 somewhere

[Tom Williams]

The thing that annoys me about using my X18 at home is the way I have to go start up an app, connect, and wait for it to sync, all just to adjust one level.

If you're adjusting only one level, why not just turn the instrument in question up or down? That's what that knob on the left side of the keyboard usually does.

[mate stubb]

AFAIK the X18 comes up in a default preset without having a network connection. You could make the default preset have that channel active.

[Analogaddict]

I have a Rane line mixer connected to a patchbay that"s also connected to my audio interface so that I can connect my external synths from the front. I have an SSL X-patch and I"ve been thinking about getting a 2nd just for keys since it"s already hooked up to my SSL preamps and audio interface... The Speck mixer seems great too, and very future safe.

[bfields]

Usually what I actually want is a mute button, for the mic I'm not using or the bass guitar that's not plugged in.

 

Which I deal with by plugging and unplugging cables from the mixer.

 

I dunno, it's just a mild annoyance. But if I was buying another I might give a little more weight to physical controls.

[Canoehead]

I really like the Radial KL 8 but it does not have direct outs, one of the requirements mentioned by Stephen in the original post. However, used to mix a up to 4 keyboards in stereo and some soft synths it is excellent, in my opinion.

 

Cheers,

Canoe