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#2480643 - 03/26/13 01:46 PM TC Electronic Sucks
H-A Forgiven Offline
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Registered: 03/12/13
Posts: 198
Anybody seen this yet? Looks awesome. At that price, plus you could fit it in your pocket! Me want one!
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pages/tc-electronics-ditto-looper?icid=202636

***Title subject was not written by H-A Forgiven.****


Edited by A String (08/07/13 07:35 AM)
Edit Reason: Added note about title.
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#2480654 - 03/26/13 02:14 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: H-A Forgiven]
A String Administrator Offline
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Posts: 11910
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After having a bad experience with TC Electronics, I will never buy another product from them again.

Just a few months back, I bought an M350 Reverb Unit. It said, in the information, that it came with a VST controller that would allow you to add the reverb to your DAW's recording program. So, I bought one instead of another one I was looking at.

Needless to say, when I hooked it up, there was not VST controller. There was a link to a website where you could get the VST file from. So, I headed over there to download it. First problem I had was a post that said they were "working on it". The post was dated over two years ago. In that post, they said they would be charging $20 for it, when it was done (two years later and it's still not done mad ).

So, I contacted TC Electronics and inquired. They said the file was not included. I told them that it said it was in the ad. They said sorry, they don't handle software stuff. I asked if there was any other solution. The guy got rude and told me that if I didn't like it, I could return the product. I explained that it had been more than the 15 days and he said "well I guess you are out of luck, aren't you".

Bottom line, they used false advertising on a product that doesn't do what they claim it did and then hit me with extra bad customer service. My advice is, avoid them like the plague. Don't give the bastards a single penny of your money. I know I sure won't be.
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#2480677 - 03/26/13 03:50 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: A String]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 5454
Loc: Hwy 49, California
Loopers are a very cool tool. I like the extended recording time and all the whistles and bells on my DigiTech JamMan. A great practice and writing tool... cool

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#2480723 - 03/26/13 07:47 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Larryz]
russclan Offline
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Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 285
Looks cool. I have an EHX 2880 and love it, lots of fun. And +1 to what Larry said, they're indispensable scratch pads, imho.
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#2480772 - 03/27/13 06:04 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: russclan]
Winston Psmith Offline
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Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 1927
Loc: Inside the Beltway
H-A, you should look into some of the small multi-effects units, like the Boss ME-25, which has a built-in Looper, along with all the Guitar effects you're likely to need anytime soon. $129 for a small stand-along Looper isn't a bad price, but I see the Digitech Solo JamMan units showing up at GC for $80-100 used, and RC-2's for around the same price. A used ME-25 will run you around $100, about the price of a new Tube Screamer. Some of the Digitech multis also have built-in Loopers, but I'm not as familiar with their products.

BTW, A String, that is one lousy tale of customer service! IIRC, some of the Lexicon MPX series will do something like what you were expecting, in terms of interfacing with your PC.
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#2480793 - 03/27/13 07:13 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Winston Psmith]
H-A Forgiven Offline
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Registered: 03/12/13
Posts: 198
Yeah, well I don't have the funds to buy something like this right now, because (as I said in a different thread) I'm currently looking for a new amp, probably a tube. And I'm also looking at getting a delay pedal soon after. I like what I've seen of the Boss DD-20 Giga Delay, which has sound on sound recording (basically a looper) with 23 seconds of record time, which would be enough for me I think most of the time. I just thought that this TC Electronic pedal was a good idea, if all you needed was a looper, and didn't want to pay for a bunch of bells and whistles that you don't need.
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#2480911 - 03/27/13 12:48 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: H-A Forgiven]
davidcooperorton Offline
Member

Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 2
I've had one for almost 3 weeks, and have to say AVOID. Started OK, but become increasingly erractic and unreliable. Not sure if there's an inherrent flaw in the switching mechanism or whether I'm unlucky enough to have been supplied with a faulty one. I have owned and used foot pedals for 40 plus years and this is my first bad experience, so maybe I shouldn't be quite so annoyed, but I'd advise waiting to see whether there's a design element that needs correcting or a component that needs re-sourcing

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#2480918 - 03/27/13 01:07 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: davidcooperorton]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 5454
Loc: Hwy 49, California
Welcome aboard David! Your comments may be posted just in time, and help with H-A's choice in pedals...

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#2480959 - 03/27/13 02:51 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: davidcooperorton]
A String Administrator Offline
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Originally Posted By: davidcooperorton
I've had one for almost 3 weeks, and have to say AVOID. Started OK, but become increasingly erractic and unreliable. Not sure if there's an inherrent flaw in the switching mechanism or whether I'm unlucky enough to have been supplied with a faulty one. I have owned and used foot pedals for 40 plus years and this is my first bad experience, so maybe I shouldn't be quite so annoyed, but I'd advise waiting to see whether there's a design element that needs correcting or a component that needs re-sourcing


Glad I'm not the only one. It's a shame as TC used to be such a good name. Now they are just useless trash. Better off throwing your money in the garbage.
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#2480988 - 03/27/13 04:08 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: A String]
russclan Offline
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Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 285
Man, back in the day, I lusted after their Chorus/PM/Flanger, as well as the compressor/limiter. Seemed like I could never afford them. I can now, but I'm easily distracted and end up spending the money on something else (stuff for the wife, too - gotta keep her happy).

I think maybe some of the problem with the looper is that they squeezed everything into that teeny little box (room for more pedals on your board! Gotta have more pedals! Right.) and are touting it as only having one knob and one switch. "Everything you need, and nothing you don't". Or something like that. Well, the knob has an easy job, but man, that switch has to take some abuse after a while.

And yes, it is a shame if the majority of their stuff now is crap. They were kinda like...boutique, before there was such a thing.
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#2481076 - 03/28/13 01:45 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: russclan]
davidcooperorton Offline
Member

Registered: 03/27/13
Posts: 2
I should add that prior to the Ditto, I bought the X4 Delay/Looper back in October, and have - to date - experienced no issues whatsoever. I don't know if they use the same switches on all their products - anecdotal evidence from Loopers' Delight and similar forums suggests that other companies including Line6 use them, too, and that the failure rate is appreciable. I belive there's at least one place specialising in replacement with more robust switches. However, as I'm in the UK, the postage costs outweigh the benefits. I do hope TC isn't expanding beyond it's ability to maintain quality control...

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#2481669 - 03/30/13 09:34 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: davidcooperorton]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 3915
Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: davidcooperorton
I've had one for almost 3 weeks, and have to say AVOID. Started OK, but become increasingly erractic and unreliable. Not sure if there's an inherrent flaw in the switching mechanism or whether I'm unlucky enough to have been supplied with a faulty one. I have owned and used foot pedals for 40 plus years and this is my first bad experience, so maybe I shouldn't be quite so annoyed, but I'd advise waiting to see whether there's a design element that needs correcting or a component that needs re-sourcing


While browsing through Harmony Central today on another quest I ran across this from somebody there:

"WARNING: TC Electronics Pedals Are NOT REPAIRABLE. Instead of fixing my switch they wanted to charge me $72 plus shipping on a $99 pedal to replace all electronics, when only the switch was defective. This is their blanket repair policy on ALL repairs. They have no replacement switches. The switch is on the board so substituting a different switch can't work. Do not buy pedals from companies that cannot repair their own switches."
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#2481677 - 03/30/13 10:11 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Scott Fraser]
Dannyalcatraz Offline
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Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3154
Loc: Dallas/FW Metroplex, Texas
That's...pretty ugly as far as engineering & business planning go.
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#2481688 - 03/30/13 10:37 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Dannyalcatraz]
Winston Psmith Offline
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Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 1927
Loc: Inside the Beltway
This has been a problem with many of the Line 6 modelers - the original large pedals - the board gives from the pressure on the switches, so instead of dealing with a bad switch, you're also dealing with a broken circuit-board. I have heard of techs re-mounting the Line 6 switches, but it's not a cheap fix.

BTW, Scott, thanks for that heads-up, I'd been looking at some of those TonePrint pedals. Near miss, that.
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#2481689 - 03/30/13 10:44 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Dannyalcatraz]
Scott Fraser Offline
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Registered: 03/20/05
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Loc: Los Angeles
Originally Posted By: Dannyalcatraz
That's...pretty ugly as far as engineering & business planning go.


Engineering-wise, I believe it makes it easier to build the pedals by robotic assembly. Business-wise, it maximizes profit by eliminating the cost of actual repairs. As long as nobody knows this is how they roll, it's good for TC. Once people learn this is their way of dealing with their customer base, it's very bad for TC. I hate this kind of corporate hubris. It's what gives capitalism a bad name. F*** TC, I hope this comes back to bite them very deeply on the ass.
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#2481987 - 04/01/13 05:46 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: H-A Forgiven]
LeftyBlues Offline
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Registered: 05/22/03
Posts: 1536
Loc: Cincinnati, Ohio
I was very interested in this looper but having read through this thread "fugheddaboudit". Thanks all for the info! The switch on PC board failure-waiting-to-happen is just crappy design period. They should (but probably won't) come out with a revised version with the switch as a separate entity, I'd buy one and be willing to pay more. The concept itself is great, I had the single Boss looper but got rid of it as it was not easy to use (for me anyway).
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#2482051 - 04/01/13 09:17 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: LeftyBlues]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 5454
Loc: Hwy 49, California
It's rare when this many people chime in with a negative report on a piece of equipment. Hope H-A gives it consideration before buying as I think Lefty has made the right "fugheddaboudit" decision. I know I would too...

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#2493828 - 05/16/13 11:02 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Larryz]
02R96 Offline
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Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 971
I have their Hall of Fame Reverb and the foot switch does have a strange feel to it. Unlike the normal large switch found on most pedals, the TC has a very weak tactile response; like you need to really mash down on it to engage it. I even Emailed TC support about it and in their response they assured me all was well. If this switch is indeed PCB mounted, I can foresee many cracked or broken circuit boards due to the stress placed on it.

An easy workaround would be to leave it on and use a more robust AB switch to Route-To or Bypass it.
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#2499423 - 06/06/13 02:44 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: 02R96]
ToreTC Offline
Member

Registered: 06/06/13
Posts: 4
Hi guys,

I just stumbled upon this thread and figured I'd chime in. As you can see from my signature, I work at TC Electronic, so I'm obviously extremely biased and shouldn't be trusted under any circumstances. :-)

So just to set the record straight on whether the Ditto Looper footswitch is PCB mounted or not... it's not.

Some of our products do have PCB mounted boards though, but the switch is attached to the chassis on both the front and back so no stress is applied to the PCB board when stomping on the switch.

Regarding the quality and quality control at TC, all I can say is that we take it VERY seriously constantly following failure rates of all products coming for service and support. All products that fail within the first 6 months after its released get sent back to development for inspection by the engineering team.

We try our best to make products that never break and our failure rate is well below the threshold we've set. But I realize that all this doesn't matter much to those of you who have had a bad experience with one of our products and for that I would like to apologise sincerely on behalf of TC!

If any of you have a specific problem with a pedal don't hesitate to mail me directly at tlm@tcelectronic.com and I'll be happy to help out getting the issue solved as fast and easy as possible.

Cheers,
Tore
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#2499434 - 06/06/13 05:08 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: ToreTC]
A String Administrator Offline
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Hey, Tore. I'm not sure there is much you could do for me. I've already contacted TC a few times to try and get my issue sorted out. The customer service guys were rude and unhelpful. My issue was never resolved and I got stuck with a $200 product that doesn't do what you guys claimed it did. In this day and age, bad customer service is often what drives people away from a company.
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#2499441 - 06/06/13 05:49 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: A String]
picker Offline
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Tore, we appreciate you stepping up on this. And, I would like to put a word to the wise here; a little assistance here almost certainly will bring larger returns in good word-of-mouth down the road. A lot of players referrence this forum for info. Here's hoping you benefit greatly from your effort.
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#2499443 - 06/06/13 05:53 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: A String]
ToreTC Offline
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Registered: 06/06/13
Posts: 4
Hi Craig,

I'm sorry to hear that! Do you know who you talked to? Also what product was it and what was the problem?

Cheers,
Tore
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#2499483 - 06/06/13 08:22 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: ToreTC]
Larryz Offline
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Registered: 06/23/08
Posts: 5454
Loc: Hwy 49, California
Welcome aboard Tore! +1 on Picker's comments. We very much appreciate you stepping up to the plate. If you check out this guitar forum on more than one thread, you'll find that we have members from all over the USA and many other countries. We are world-wide. For every member comment, there are hundreds of others viewing who purchase pedals and all sorts of other music related equipment. You're making points with all of us by taking an interest in what is being said about your company products. We hope your company will take an interest in the information from this forum that you will no doubt be sharing with those that can help. It makes a big difference when someone at least cares IMHO. thu

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#2499544 - 06/06/13 12:15 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Larryz]
A String Administrator Offline
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Registered: 12/18/03
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Loc: Ontario, Canada
Tore,
I have a recently bought M350. Your website, the store's website and the packaging all said that it came with VST plugin that would allow me to control it from within my DAW (Full DAW Integration Through VST Compatible Editor). That alone was the deciding factor in my purchasing of this unit.

When I went to download the plugin, it was unavailable and I was told to go to another site to get it. When I went to that site, they claimed they were working on the plugin and, when it was ready, it would be $20.

Now, not only is $20 not a "Free plugin", but according to the guys that make the plugin, it isn't even ready and may not be ready for a long time.

In short, this was false advertising. I bought the unit based on a claim your company made on what it could do. I was strung along for over a month, talking with people from TC, until it was too late for me to return the unit.

In the end, false advertising and extremely bad customer service stuck me with a unit that I paid $250 for, but is useless for my needs.
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#2499547 - 06/06/13 12:19 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: A String]
A String Administrator Offline
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#2501118 - 06/11/13 11:29 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: A String]
Winston Psmith Offline
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Registered: 02/15/10
Posts: 1927
Loc: Inside the Beltway
(bump)

Just wondering - was there ever any response to A String's issue, or did Tore from TC just disappear? It seemed like he (Tore) hadn't really read through the thread, since A String had already described the issue with TC.
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#2501123 - 06/11/13 11:38 AM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Winston Psmith]
Dannyalcatraz Offline
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Registered: 07/28/04
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Loc: Dallas/FW Metroplex, Texas
Hopefully, Tore has taken this issue up the line...
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#2501148 - 06/11/13 12:07 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Dannyalcatraz]
A String Administrator Offline
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Not a peep since I described the issue. This is how they strung me along for over a month, last time. In the end, they got rude and told me to return the unit to the store. Of course, by that time it was much to late. When I explained that it was too late, I never heard back from them.

Good news is, being a mod/admin here and at thestringnetwork.com, I can help spread the word and save others from the same mistreatment I had to go through.
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#2501150 - 06/11/13 12:15 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: A String]
Dannyalcatraz Offline
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Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3154
Loc: Dallas/FW Metroplex, Texas
I am all a-sad.

Too many companies fail to understand how important customer service is...and in the Information Age, its even more vital than ever before. Whereas before, word-of-mouth spread a la the game of "Telephone", a post on a board like this, Facebook, Twitter or other social media can be worldwide in seconds.
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Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap”.

My FLMS- Murphy's Music in Irving, Tx

http://murphysmusictx.com/

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#2501330 - 06/11/13 09:23 PM Re: TC Electronic "Ditto" looper pedal. [Re: Dannyalcatraz]
Caevan O'Shite Offline
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Hey, ToreTC, clearly it's go big or go home and suck it time.

What time is it on YOUR watch?
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