Dave Bryce Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 It is the official policy of this forum that off-topic ad hominem attacks have no place here. If you wanna get into it with someone in one of the sports threads, fine. If you wanna bust someone over their taste in music and/or gear, fine. However, I do not want to see anyone picking on anyone else on a personal level. I don't know how to make this any clearer. I'm sorry, guys - my name is the one on this forum, and I strongly feel that for me to let this stuff go on is a direct reflection on me...and I have no wish to be seen as someone who enjoys this sort of thing. Frankly, I don't think it's terribly sporting, especially when the person in question is no longer permitted here and is therefore unable to defend themselves. As most of you know, I just hate having to be the police...so I'd be most grateful if you would respect my wishes. Thanks, dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steadyb Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Bravo. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steadyb Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 What's "ad hominem" mean? And isn't it spelled homonym??? (or was it "add cinnamon?") Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 16, 2004 Author Share Posted July 16, 2004 Originally posted by steadyb: What's "ad hominem" mean?"Ad Hominem" means "against the man" or "against the person." dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steadyb Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 As in "The beautiful woman pressed her spectacular body ad hominem." "And he enjoyed it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Klopmeyer Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 That's just sad hominem, steady. - Jeff Marketing Communications for MI/Pro Audio My solo music and stuff They Stole My Crayon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Grace Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Thank you Dave! Even though I haven't been involved in any of this, I've found it very distressing. It's not surprising to see an individual with problems attack other people; it's even understandable for a normal person, on a bad day, to behave poorly. But the lynching going on at "Harmony" Central and the mob mentality that has prevailed there and spilled over here is a disturbing example of the ugly side of human nature! It's worth noting that few forums over there are moderated, and it makes me doubly appreciate what we have here. More often than not, Keyboard Corner members exhibit the good side of people: fun, friendly, intelligent, and helpful. I value this more than I can say. Dave, thank you for taking a stand for integrity. I'm in your corner! Best, Geoff My Blue Someday appears on Apple Music | Spotify | YouTube | Amazon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steadyb Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Originally posted by Geoff Grace: Dave, thank you for taking a stand for integrity. I'm in your corner! Best, GeoffSo, does that mean you're standing in the corner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsu Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 "........! Try to make It..REAL! compared to what? ! ! ! " - BOPBEEPER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Grace Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Originally posted by steadyb: So, does that mean you're standing in the corner?Always! Best, Geoff My Blue Someday appears on Apple Music | Spotify | YouTube | Amazon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Grace Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Although sometimes I guess I'm standing on the corner... My Blue Someday appears on Apple Music | Spotify | YouTube | Amazon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Pierce Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 I love this place. dB rules. --Dave Make my funk the P-funk. I wants to get funked up. My Funk/Jam originals project: http://www.thefunkery.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phait Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Hey Bryce, the Raiders suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 16, 2004 Author Share Posted July 16, 2004 Originally posted by Phait: Hey Bryce, the Raiders suck. Dude, that was certainly the case last year... Maybe this year they'll be better. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeronyne Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Although I certainly was not the main culprit, I definitely participated in the attacks. I apologize...my frustration go the better of me. I sometimes forget that the easiest way to resolve these things is to contact the moderator. "For instance" is not proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Klopmeyer Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Originally posted by Dave Bryce: Originally posted by Phait: Hey Bryce, the Raiders suck. Dude, that was certainly the case last year... Maybe this year they'll be better. dBJust so you know, that's Bryce code for "My uncle Vito's coming to break your kneecaps. Never speak badly of the Silver-and-Black or face the consequences, sucka!" - Jeff Marketing Communications for MI/Pro Audio My solo music and stuff They Stole My Crayon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Fortner Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Prof. Fortner's field guide to Ad Hominem fallacies: Technically, to be an Ad Hominem fallacy, the speaker argues for some factual conclusion based on irrelevant (even if possibly true) information about a person's character. Example: Premise: Martha Stewart is known for being a nasty, demanding person who routinely reduces employess to tears. Conclusion: Of course she's guilty of conspiracy to commit insider trading. Even if the premise is true, it does nothing to support the conclusion. My favorite example of Ad Hominem (this variety is called abusive, because it argues based on a personal attack) is when Hitler, having been informed new work of Einstein's had been found that could improve the range of the V2 rockets, said he "wanted no part of Jewish physics." Ad Hominem circumstantial is when you argue that someone's claim is false, solely or chiefly based on the grounds that they have something to gain if their claim is true. Indeed, this may cause us to question their motives, and look deeper into the facts; we commit the fallacy when we don't bother and reject their claim out of hand. Example: P1. Dick Cheney says the war in Iraq is just.P2. Cheney is connected to Halliburton.P3. Halliburton stands to profit from no-bid contracts to rebuild after the war is over.C. The war in Iraq is unjust. Presumably, there's a lot more to debate over whether the war is just. The above argument on its own is akin to saying we should reject some math professor's claim about algebra because she has a textbook to sell. Then there's the tu quoque variety (Latin for "you too"), in which it's argued that because someone said or did or believed something in the past, and changed their mind, we should reject their current position. We have an admirable tendency to point out hypocrisy, but sometimes it's misguided, as in: P: In the Black Sabbath days, Ozzy did enough drugs to kill a herd of elephants.C. So, he has no business telling his kids not to do drugs now. Clearly this is wrong. Less formally, we use Ad Hominem to refer to any act of name-calling that happens at the same time of, or instead of, factual disagreement with someone else's claim, and I certainly agree with dB that such behavior has no place around here. For that matter, fallacies have no place among rational, self-respecting people! Wanna see more? Check out www.fallacyfiles.org (which I didn't come up with but wish I had.) Stephen Fortner Principal, Fortner Media Former Editor in Chief, Keyboard Magazine Digital Piano Consultant, Piano Buyer Magazine Industry affiliations: Antares, Arturia, Giles Communications, MS Media, Polyverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan South Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Was it ME? Did I start one o' them thar mad vomitin' arguments? The Black Knight always triumphs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzyprof Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Professor Fortner, thank you for that excellent treatise on ad hominem attacks. Is all that stuff going to be on the test? "Playing the piano is my greatest joy, next to my wife; it is my most absorbing interest, next to my work." ...Charles Cooke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byrdman Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Originally posted by Stephen Fortner: Check out www.fallacyfiles.org (which I didn't come up with but wish I had.)A nice sight although it did not always have the Latin or Greek names for some of the devices. One of my favorites fallacies is: All cats have three tails. Proof: 1 cat has 1 more tail than no cat. No cat has two tails. Hence: All cats have 3 tails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drawback Posted July 16, 2004 Share Posted July 16, 2004 Frankly, I despise harmoniums and believe they should be attacked and have their bells cut off. ____________________________________ Rod Here for the gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoozer Posted July 17, 2004 Share Posted July 17, 2004 Originally posted by Geoff Grace: It's not surprising to see an individual with problems attack other people; it's even understandable for a normal person, on a bad day, to behave poorly. But the lynching going on at "Harmony" Central and the mob mentality that has prevailed there and spilled over here is a disturbing example of the ugly side of human nature!You obviously have never been to the Open Jam part of the forums on HC. It's worth noting that few forums over there are moderated, and it makes me doubly appreciate what we have here.Actually, I tried to get a mod position on HC-KSS, but for some reason they never installed a moderator there. The forum doesn't need it - stuff like the string resonance fad wears off after a while. As for calling it mob mentality; hm, I'm not sure. There's a number of people there that are pretty much the heart of the forum (and I consider myself to be one of 'm). I don't know if you've taken the pain to read all the threads, but even the one that was started in honor of youknowwho derailed seriously after a few pages and turned into a really nice chat about Doritos and beer; something impossible to do on Open Jam, and friendly and fun, rather than mobbing. More often than not, Keyboard Corner members exhibit the good side of people: fun, friendly, intelligent, and helpful. I value this more than I can say.Good to hear that it's nice over here, too . Too bad there's lower traffic, though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Grace Posted July 17, 2004 Share Posted July 17, 2004 Yoozer, you took my comments in a broader way than I meant them. You're right about my lack of experience with the Harmony Central forums overall, and I'll take you at your word that the environment there is generally good. I know enough of about the attitude that was prevalent in this instance to comment on that, and my reaction remains the same. Now that we've clarified the limited scope of my words, perhaps we can agree to disagree and leave it at that. Best, Geoff My Blue Someday appears on Apple Music | Spotify | YouTube | Amazon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george costanza Posted July 17, 2004 Share Posted July 17, 2004 As I did recently when a similar(?) situation developed, I applaud DB's determination to not let things degenerate into the quasi-chaos that reigns on some of the MPlayer forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reverend Rhythm Posted July 17, 2004 Share Posted July 17, 2004 Thank you, Dave. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george costanza Posted July 17, 2004 Share Posted July 17, 2004 Originally posted by Yoozer: ... I don't know if you've taken the pain to read all the threads,...Gee, that doesn't sound too daunting or time consuming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 17, 2004 Author Share Posted July 17, 2004 I browse HC-KSS pretty regularly, and I occasionally post over there as well. In general, I find it to be pretty entertaining and a very good source of information. There's definitely a different vibe over there, but I don't think it's a "better or worse" thing - just different. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoozer Posted July 18, 2004 Share Posted July 18, 2004 Originally posted by Geoff Grace: Yoozer, you took my comments in a broader way than I meant them. You're right about my lack of experience with the Harmony Central forums overall, and I'll take you at your word that the environment there is generally good.Well, the first part of the reply should've had an smiley after it or similar shocked emoticon (OJ is, for a lack of proper words, a eh...verbal cesspool) it wasn't meant as "you know nothing about this, so don't even try". Sorry if it looked like that. I agree with you that it hasn't been exactly "Harmony" with mr. p120 and all that, and that it's better here in the sense that it's actively moderated, but I wanted to clarify that it's not like that all of the time, and that there's certainly a helpful and friendly club of people there - more often than not . Originally posted by Dave Bryce: There's definitely a different vibe over there, but I don't think it's a "better or worse" thing - just different. Venus, Mars... ... Moog, ARP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 18, 2004 Author Share Posted July 18, 2004 Originally posted by Yoozer: Venus, Mars... ... Moog, ARP? Nacho Cheese, Cool Ranch... ...Grolsch, Heineken? BTW...Mars, Moog. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Grace Posted July 18, 2004 Share Posted July 18, 2004 Originally posted by Yoozer: Originally posted by Geoff Grace: Yoozer, you took my comments in a broader way than I meant them. You're right about my lack of experience with the Harmony Central forums overall, and I'll take you at your word that the environment there is generally good.Well, the first part of the reply should've had an smiley after it or similar shocked emoticon (OJ is, for a lack of proper words, a eh...verbal cesspool) it wasn't meant as "you know nothing about this, so don't even try". Sorry if it looked like that. I agree with you that it hasn't been exactly "Harmony" with mr. p120 and all that, and that it's better here in the sense that it's actively moderated, but I wanted to clarify that it's not like that all of the time, and that there's certainly a helpful and friendly club of people there - more often than not . Best, Geoff My Blue Someday appears on Apple Music | Spotify | YouTube | Amazon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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