McCartney is an embarassment

[D_dup3]

Lest others misinterpret (as I think mbl did, to a degree) my comments at the beginning of this thread, let me say that while I think McCartney is a true child of showbiz, he was a vital part of the Beatles creatively & not just in the poppy end of things. He was much more intellectual than he gets credit for &, especially in the later Beatle years, his lyrics stand up very well. I also think that in terms of longer musical pieces (like side 2 of [b]Abbey Road[/b], parts of [b]Ram[/b] or "Live & Let Die") he did something in rock music that only Brian Wilson even attempted...& PM did it better. But he is a bit too eager to please. ...as far as using recent tragedy as a springboard, lets consider who's recently topped the charts & tour circuit with a show built around his "everyman" image (which is as PR as can be)...

[D_dup3]

[quote]Originally posted by Alndln: [b] [quote]Originally posted by jonnyvommit: [b] in about 20 or 30 years us gen-X'ers will be paying $300 and sobbing our eyes at Dave Matthews [/b][/quote]I think crying at a Captain Beefhart show would be a tad more houmorus.[/b][/quote]Alright! Let's get on to the Cayaptain!

[KHAN]

[quote]Originally posted by gmd: [b]Hey "HIPPIE"-Excellent post! (That's what I was looking for, actually.) [/b][/quote]I hear you gmd. The thing is, you won't always get thoughtful comments when the original comments that you are defending are worded this way. [quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b]After watching Paul McCartney's love letter to himself he is the most cheezy, embarassing figure in rock. How much more money does a billionaire need?) The whole "let's wave the American flag" trick is the oldest one in the book, and shows what little class McCartney has left. I could go on and on about the show, but basically the guy is so cheezy and out-of-touch it's pathetic. Something tells me that McCartney has always been like this, It's ironic that the two intelligent, witty and iconoclastic Beatles have gone and left us with the two who have none of those traits... I realize McCartney is a god to many, and when you worship somebody you become blind to reality. To me guys like Paul, Mick Jagger, etc., are phoney. They came up in the sixties pretending to be such anti-establishment hippie rebels and the truth is they're no more rebellious than Wayne Newton or Ronald Reagan. Paul is the worst example of what I mean by these sixties phonies peddling their corporate nostalgia. As for "Driving Rain", what I heard of it made me want to vomit. He couldn't write a good song now to save his life. It's pathetic music, He's like a punch-drunk former boxer trying to make a comeback. [/b][/quote]mbl is not someone looking for intelligent debate. He wants to post his thoughts in a inflammatory manner, and watch the shit fly. To that end, bravo. FWIW, I agree with some of the points made here, they were just made in such a childish manner, that I can't take it, or mbl seriously.

[doc taz]

[quote]Originally posted by d: [b]But he is a bit eager to please.[/b][/quote]And what's wrong with that? I'm a Gen X-er too, and while I tend to prefer more progressive music (esp. anything progrock/metal) that doesn't mean I can't get anything out of folks like McCartney. I find it to be an insult when people say that his tickets are overpriced. Yeah, they're a bit much, but you have to consider the venues that he plays in, folks! Not to mention the fine crews and roadies you have to pay. These guys spend long hours at their craft, often not being to move as freely as the artists they back up. The roadies crews, and yes, management (etc.), serve an important responsibility. Hence, the ticket prices. (I do wish agencies like Ticketmaster would go easy on some of the charges though.) At least I'm not paying to see N'Sync or all the blonde bimbos who pass themselves off as God's greatest gift to art or whatever... I mean, if you don't want to go, then don't go! :rolleyes:

[Steve111]

Abe Jr. rocks!

[D_dup3]

Taz, I watched; I taped; I like Paul but I recognize that his desire to be well liked sometimes keeps him from doing what would actually make him [i]more[/i] respected & loved---[i]that's[/i] what might be "wrong" with that.

[Super 8]

[quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b]There were more shots of the audience crying in there over-priced seats than there were of the music being played. ($80.00 dollars for NOSE-BLEED seats? $300 for the floor? [/b][/quote]That seems odd to me. I have a friend who just went to see him this fall, and I can't imagine that he would be the type to shell out for big-buck tickets. He LOVED the show by the way. But that is his subjective opinion. [quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b]His overweight, over-playing drummer kept speeding up, mainly because he is such a ham he doesn't pay attention to what the others are playing. [/quote][/b] Hmmmm. Well lo and behold, look who's on the cover of Modern Drummer this month! He is a BIG fellow too, isn't he. Too bad I havn't read the interview yet, or I might have something better to write here! [quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b] Yes, he co-wrote some of the greatest rock songs of all time, but that was 30 years ago. He hasn't written anything great since "Maybe I'm Amazed" in 1970. Something tells me that McCartney has always been like this, but that John and George managed to keep him from ruining the Beatles. [/quote][/b] Personally, I think he's still a fantastic song writer, but I'm sure someone more knowledgeable on McCartney than myself will tackle this one. [quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b]It's ironic that the two intelligent, witty and iconoclastic Beatles have gone and left us with the two who have none of those traits...[/b][/quote]HEY! You go a little easy on Ringo, Mister! Ringo is very dear to us. Ringo played his part! If you want to get critical at him over the whole Pete Best thing, (the world's most unfortunate [i]non-Spinal Tap related[/i] drummer) then I guess I can understand. But apart from that, you leave Mr.Conductor alone! :mad: You have been warned... :evil:

[george costanza]

Ringo, too, was better than he gets credit for. He, like Harrison, was in company that would've overshadowed anyone. While there's ongoing dispute about what tracks he was usurped on by PM, that only happened later on. Many Beatle tracks have drum parts that were quite unlike anything by other rock bands & while both McCartney & Lennon (& Martin) gave him direction, much was his own style.

[Nraki]

Well, I'm from Japan. I listened to "Hey Jude" and found the Beatles when I was 15. (because the Japanese music text books put "Hey Jude" on them (in Japanese)!!!!!!!! ) :eek: Isn't it cool? :D I was shocked and fell in love with The Beatles. :cry: And, most importantly, his performances are not as good as before. :cry: Now, He's married to the woman who is almost 30 years younger than him. :cry: I think it's really difficult for the Rock starts to leave coolly. I wouldn't say he is an embarrassment, (He still palys fine.) but I understand how you feel. Paul was a legend to me. But, I guess I should understand he's a very normal person,too. He should do what he wants to do.

[Jazzman]

Well I saw most of the show on TV. When I was younger, I thought the Beatles sucked, didn't like to hear all of these love songs. Thought Ringo was a bad drummer compaired to me, the bass player was playig simple bass lines and almost no articulation just filled in the gaps, guitar licks were cool, rythum gutar was average playing in my mind then. The vocals were good, but the hair.......the British accent..... The girls were going nuts over these guys. Good looking as they were, well dressed, and started to take over the air waves. Next was the other British groups that came to the States, one after the other to look and sound just about the same, play their tunes and it seemed that was all that I was hearing.....geez! I could't stand it. What happened to the music in the States??? Well I really didn't like them then, but liked a few of their tunes that I felt was good in my mind. Realized that they were on the charts for years, and just thought they would go away......eventually. Well they didn't. They eventually had other's competing with them for the air waves and it seemed to be ok. When I watched the program the other night, a couple of songs that was played by Paul alone sounded just as well as if the whole band were playing. I realized that the talant was there, the songs will live on forever, and there will be some people that will remember them because , like me, grew up in that time frame. To quote my wife," That goes to show you that the songs are still good even when the song is only played with one instrument, the melody is there" I still don't like ballads to this day, but the writing of their songs was well thought out and did have meaning wether they were thinking about this country or theirs. I feel that Paul did an excellent job for the people during that show. I was supprised that he did hit the high notes, didn't catch where he didn't. I know he broke down when the folks in the audience lifted heart signs up in front of him when he started a tune that caught him off guard. I believe he was sincere, prodessional, young at heart.......while having fun on stage. I'm pretty sure he knows where he got his break here in the States. He is now reaping the benifits from the Beatles as a household name, and that is fair because he worked his A** off to get there. Yes he is well liked buy some and still can carry on a tune. Oh buy the way he has improved musically since the 60's initial songs hit the charts. I wish I could say the same for my talants now, 30 years later. Elton John........He sucks, can't stand the guy, or the way he dresses, talanted........but his music to me sounds like bubble gum music. Sorry. I feel he's not even in the same ballfield as Paul in talant, looks, professionalism, or in music. Just my thoughts...... Jazzman :cool:

[miroslav]

[quote]Originally posted by mbl: They need to get the hook out like in Vaudeville days...[/quote]Wouldn't it be great if we could do that here...? It's obvious that some folks who were too young to have experienced first-hand that something special that occurred musically during the 60's... ...will have an even harder time understanding why it is still so popular today...why people have turned musicians and songwriters into icons...why they pay $300 for a seat to hear them, even though they don't have that same sparkle they had 30 years ago... ...or why many of us that WERE around to experience the 60's, think much of today's "rock music" is shit. If you have something better to say musically...then say it...otherwise you come off a bit green. Jealousy can be ugly...and an embarassment.

[Rim]

You are ALL idiots! That's not Sir Paul, that's Billy Shears and have been since Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Heart Club Band. You all have been fooled by the biggest swindle in history. Korn rulez. (Do I really need to? Oh alright, here you go: ;) :D :freak: )

[Lee Tyler]

I don't know where some of you guy's "ears" have gone, but Paul not only sang well, I think he excelled, especially in the improvisational realm as well. Many times I hear opinions,and I just cannot believe the comments on the same material are yin and yang all the way...in almost every regard. I think a bit of pre-conceived bias is in play here. I am a singer myself. If he sounded like shit, even in one tune, I would notice it like a shit-stain on a chrome bumper. I saw an artist on top of his game deservedly in the spotlight, kicking major musical ass, performing some incredibly memorable songs that [i]generations[/i] sing today and will sing for many years to come. Does the word "melodic" come to mind? This is a major component of a "memory". Far too sparsly conceived nowadays. And then there is the [i]eclectic[/i] , avant-garde folks who look down to pop music as pure pablum. Well, it ain't. It will be around as long as there are folks that like that shit. And that is the overwhelming majority of the population. Whether it's jazz, techno, new age....there is great stuff in most every genre. Just don't mess with pop. It makes $$$$ for a good damn reason. Folks like it. And thank the lord that some adult top-40 contemporary stuff is out there like Creed, Vertical Horizon, Five for Fighting, etc...and similar groups producing pop as to balance the nasty-ass-angry-spoken-word-poorlypoetic-decent-beat-urbanshit out there that reverberates through the airwaves with no "memorable" qualitites whatsoever. Like a friggin mushroom...another one "will come up in no time", right. Paul was great, is great, and will be great well after he passes. I believe this may be his last series of concerts.....because of his age......his "swan song". Accept him graciciously for he has given us, even those who dislike pop and the Beatles, something very special. It's called a "REFERENCE". Like a smell, a feeling, a taste, a memorable visual......and those are not easy to come by nowadays, with the phoney-ass "sing by the numbers" stars out there, with studio "magic", autotune and all the other wizardry that can "fool" the kiddies. I rest my case. ---LEE

[mbl]

To answer some of the accusations made about me and maybe clear up a few things: 1. No, I didn't start this topic to "bait" anyone, nor am I just trying to piss people off. I wanted to make a legitimate point. 2. I'm 23 years old, which doesn't mean jack one way or the other. 3. I've been playing guitar, drums and keyboards in mainly rock/alternative type bands for 11 years. 4. I actually LIKE some Beatle's stuff, and have been exposed to a hell of a lot of it through friends and older siblings. I'm just sick of hearing about them ALL THE F'N TIME! They keep getting promoted for one thing or another because it's such a cash cow. 5.The fact that so many of you got pissed off proves my point about blindly worshipping these false rock "gods". (Man, it's as bad as if I was dissing someone's religion!) 6. Since this is a MUSIC forum, I presume everyone here is either a musician, recording engineer, etc. Music is about pushing the CREATIVITY envelope, not wallowing in the long gone past. 7. There is TONS of great music being made TODAY. Foo Fighters, Tool, Incubus, Fat Boy Slim, etc. The sixties was no better in any way than today. Get OVER it, that was FORTY years ago! You don't need to give washed up losers like McCartney any more of you hard earned pesos. Support today's music instead...

[linwood]

I guess we all know now he's just some dumb kid. Next Thread...............

[Hippie]

..and don't sing 'Happy Birthday' anymore at any birthday parties, damnit. That melody is too old! -so, that means it sucks.

[T. Ehl]

[quote]Originally posted by gmd: [b] As for guys like T. Ehl, why are you wasting time with your silly posts of "idiot"? If you disagree let's see a better reply than that.[/b][/quote]title of this thread is mccartney is an embarrassment when a better title comes along so will a better reply

[T. Ehl]

[quote]Originally posted by KHANfucious: [b]mbl is not someone looking for intelligent debate. He wants to post his thoughts in a inflammatory manner, and watch the shit fly. To that end, bravo.[/b][/quote]the nail is driven solidly by kahn

[techristian]

[b]I don't know where some of you guy's "ears" have gone, but Paul not only sang well, I think he excelled, especially in the improvisational realm as well. [/b] Ok Lee. If you say so??? Now what is all this noise about a FAT SLOPPY DRUMMER? I didn't notice any serious drum boo boos, because I was concentrating on McCartney. Do we have something against FAT PEOPLE , as well as old people? I'm not a spring chicken either. I'll be 48 next summer, and yes I'm overwieght. But if my knees hold out, I may do some of my fastest drumming in the next 2 years. I am already playing some things way faster than I did 20 years ago. In fact, I'm trying for a Guiness world record. I never said that McCartney should quit. I only said that he should stay away from the songs that he was straining his vocal cords on. Big difference. Dan http://teachmedrums.com

[T. Ehl]

[quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b]my point about blindly worshipping these false rock "gods". (Man, it's as bad as if I was dissing someone's religion!)[/b][/quote]religion perhaps blind no [b]7. There is TONS of great music being made TODAY.[/b]tons yes great no [b]washed up losers like McCartney [/b]idiot

[steadyb]

[quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b]2. I'm 23 years old, which doesn't mean jack one way or the other.[/b] Other than the fact you have no idea what the hell you're talking about. [b]7. There is TONS of great music being made TODAY. Foo Fighters, Tool, Incubus, Fat Boy Slim, etc. The sixties was no better in any way than today.[/b][/quote]Yeah, I see what you mean...Jimi Hendrix, Brian Wilson, The Rolling Stones, The Beatles, Motown, The Who...yep, [i]they're no better [b]in any way[/b] than Foo Fighters, Tool, Incubus, Fat Boy Slim, etc., you know... the GIANTS of music[/i]. Thanks for the wisdom of a guy who spent the last 10 years playing Nirvana covers.

[KHAN]

[quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b] I've been playing guitar, drums and keyboards in mainly rock/alternative type bands for 11 years..[/b][/quote]I can't believe I had the nerve to contradict someone with such a formidable resume. I guess Sir Paul really [b]IS[/b] a pathetic poser. I hope someday he can at least come close to measuring up to your body of work.

[mbl]

Man, you guys are easily offended, and not easy to communicate with. Did you read my above post? (The one with the numbered sentences.) Some of you are acting like children. I only pointed out the absudity of this recent love letter tv special by billionaire Sir Paul and the silliness of this whole sixties "infatuation", which he milks. How can anybody disagree with that? You don't see the absudity of "creative" people (musicians) wallowing in the past? I stand by all my statements... (And it feels SO GOOD to be right!

[Hippie]

idiot, and proud of it.

[Lee Tyler]

You don't remember the woman we slept with decades ago, kiddo. You don't know the experience OR the times as some of us 40'ish folks went through, as I don't know the experience of the folks now in their 80's who dug Tommy Dorsey and the big band era. You have yet to learn to accept that as folks get older, they "hold on" to what they listened to when they were young, impressionable, and seeking love. This has gone on for generations. You can hold on to your piss-poor attitude all you want. That is your right. But take a lesson here, it will serve you well in life later... [b]"It's not what you say, it's how you say it"[/b] P.S. One person's wallowing, is another person's....ready for this snapperhead.... [b]MEMORIES.[/b] Glad you think you are "right". You need chill and grow up. ----LEE [quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b]Man, you guys are easily offended, and not easy to communicate with. Did you read my above post? (The one with the numbered sentences.) Some of you are acting like children. I only pointed out the absudity of this recent love letter tv special by billionaire Sir Paul and the silliness of this whole sixties "infatuation", which he milks. How can anybody disagree with that? You don't see the absudity of "creative" people (musicians) wallowing in the past? I stand by all my statements... (And it feels SO GOOD to be right![/b][/quote]

[whitefang]

Been busy in this thread! whew! But I'll chime in with my pittance... The only part of that McCartney special I didn't like was the chopping up with background footage. I couldn't care less about watching Paul walk into the sound check. But what pisses off the McCartney fans I know is when I claim this new band he's got with him is far better than Wings, IMHO. Paul always WAS a schmoozer. That wink and head nod is sort of his trademark, Y'know? And although I can't claim to have ever been a big fan of Sir Paul since the Beatle split, he DID do some tunes I really liked. One of them was "Comin' Up", which is one they chopped up on the special. All this horseshit about '60's music better or worse than what's going on today is silly. There are differences, to be sure. If you look back honestly, not ALL that '60's stuff was all that great. Or did you all forget about "Henry The 8th", "Bottle of Wine", "San Jose" and the like? Whitefang

[Hippie]

Bottle of wine, fruit of the vine, when you gonna let me get sober.. Damn Whitefang, I haven't thought of that song in 25 years. But you know, I'd still rather hear that than...Incubus. :)

[Jazzman]

Listen to the music backgrounds for the autmotive comercials today.....60's music. The songs picked for these comercials were cool back then and are still cool today. The production and promotional folks are milking Paul too. They would drop him at a heart beat if he didn't make any money for them. It is only embarassing because you know he is an old fart, but his musicianship in the business is still as good as it was years ago. Look at some of the young artists today. They need to be sexy on stage, with half of their body showing just to get you to watch them and to sell CD's and videos. I feel that there needs to be some talant with the show. These folks are a dime a dozzen now with the 20 people on stage doing the same moves in the background. All of them look alike now, what a drag. Back then YOU were the talant and YOU were the only person on stage to prove it. Hey Paul is doing Cover Tunes like you. :D Ps......the Keyboard Forum is making a comp. CD with Beatles tunes......and the're getting charged up about it too. :eek: Jazzman :cool:

[Moronix]

[quote]Originally posted by mbl: [b] 2. I'm 23 years old, which doesn't mean jack one way or the other. [/b][/quote]Yes it does. You never knew what it was like to have sex and not worry about AIDS. You have no firsthand idea about the battle between Disco and Rock. you don't know what it was like smoking a joint and watching Nixon look in to the TV camera and say "I'm not a crook" What about the first time the Sgt Peppers album hit the stors? When you see any old fart rocker, however sad they appear now, just understand that things were happening before you were aware of the world, and they were just as cool in there own time as ANYTHING that catches your fancy today. Robert Moron----ix The name stays

[gmd]

This is one interesting thread, and It seems that opinion is splitting along age lines. I have yet to see one guy over 40 agree with the 23 yr. old who started this topic. Somehow that's odd to me. I'm surprised that the whole "generation gap" thing is alive and well, especially among musicians... :rolleyes: