Best productions with most limited gear

[AmadMozart]

From time to time I sit back and think of how my project studio has grown over the years, or of how I get bitten by the "gear" bug - you know, that nagging, evil, insipid little bug that tries to convince me that if I only had "x" or "y" in your studio, then I could.....well, you get the point [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img] My gear was pretty limited when I first started a home studio, but it forced me to learn a lot about how to use that equipment to get the most sound. I dug out one of those old productions and threw it up on my web site to share, and think it would be neat if others dug out early productions and listed some of the tools they were working with "way back when" The song "Yours" (link somewhere below) was recorded in the late 80's when I was using the following set-up: Tascam 234 Syncassette (4 track cassette recorder, except we were only able to record on three tracks since track four contained the FSK tone which synchronized the midi sequencer) One Shure SM58 microphone (yes, everything that needed a microphone those days, got this one) A Tascam 238 8 input, 4 bus mixer Cakewalk running under DOS on PC's Limited (precursor to Dell) Turbo XT (I think it was an 8 MHz 8086 processor with a 20 Mb hard drive) A Roland D50, Ensoniq EPS, EMU Proteus, and a Rhodes MK80 made up the midi arsenal. A Midiverb something or other for FX When I look back at this track - it reminds me of how much can be done with so little when you really stretch both yourself and the gear - and whenever I get the gear bug, I remember this track and ask myself if I am honestly squeezing everything I can out of what I now have to work with, or am I falling once again into the "if I only had a....." trap. I hope you enjoy the track, and I hope some of you have similar stories and songs to share. Cheers, Mark http://www.broadjam.com/artistprofile/artistindex.asp?artistID=936

[D. Gauss]

pick a great record pre-1960, be it miles davis, gene vincent, or the london philharmonic....live to 2-track. it doesn't get much better with less fuss! -d. gauss

[strat0124]

Excellent recording and performance. Thanks for showing what can be done with supposedly "lesser" gear. I've got a 238 as well, it's definitely a lion in sheeps clothing. Yes Virginia...there is a Santa Claus.....

[-]

It's only with time that it's been considered a classic, but Nick Drake's [url=http://www.cdnow.com/cgi-bin/mserver/SID=774630443/pagename=/RP/CDN/FIND/album.html/artistid=DRAKE*NICK/itemid=294345]Pink Moon[/url] is pretty much (I think) just two mics recorded in a hotel room. And the title track was good enough to be used in a car commercial not too long ago. At the end of the day, I guess it all goes back to the song and the performance... The production is important, but it's secondary. At least, that seems to be the common link with stuff that holds up over the years.

[Anderton]

I've been archiving some of my older material lately, and have been going through some of the same issues. Overall, I have to say that the music I'm making now sounds better and is more mature than what I was doing back in the 4-track days. But I was more inventive back then in some ways; because I had such a limited tool set, I got more out of each tool. I'm not sure if this is good or bad -- for example, on one tune I wanted a harpsichord sound and didn't have one, so I recorded guitar at half-speed and when sped up, it sounded kinda like a harpsichord. Now I can just punch up a sample, and the results sound more like a harpsichord...but the guitar sounded cooler. I did a CD in 1989 called Forward Motion that was quite successful. I used a Mac Plus running Master Tracks Pro to drive a bunch of MIDI instruments in real time (Kawai K3, Yamaha TX81Z, Emulator II, Alesis MIDIverb, HR-16, etc.), all mixed down through a homemade mixer into a borrowed Fostex DAT. It still sounds pretty good...I'm not sure it would be any better if I was to re-record it today. Interestingly, George Martin said the same about a lot of the Beatles' material; he felt that with all the options available today, the material might have actually ended up sounding worse.

[AmadMozart]

[quote]Originally posted by Anderton: [b]Overall, I have to say that the music I'm making now sounds better and is more mature than what I was doing back in the 4-track days. I did a CD in 1989 called Forward Motion that was quite successful. I used a Mac Plus running Master Tracks Pro to drive a bunch of MIDI instruments in real time (Kawai K3, Yamaha TX81Z, Emulator II, Alesis MIDIverb, HR-16, etc.), all mixed down through a homemade mixer into a borrowed Fostex DAT. It still sounds pretty good...I'm not sure it would be any better if I was to re-record it today. Interestingly, George Martin said the same about a lot of the Beatles' material; he felt that with all the options available today, the material might have actually ended up sounding worse.[/b][/quote] Craig, Thanks for sharing with us your thoughts on some of your earlier productions. I think the biggest change over the past 15 years has been in my songwriting - the maturity you mention - the ability to understand that "less is more" and not try and overproduce everything with every sound, trick, or tool I have at my disposal. I have often been tempted to go back and re-do some of those four tracks - and at the end of the day I don't, because I am certain I will only succeed in destroying some of the magic that was there in the original - as imperfect as many of them might be from a purely technical or sound quality point of view. Cheers, Mark http://www.broadjam.com/artistprofile/artistindex.asp?artistID=936

[Master Zap]

YOu wanna hear some LIMITED GEAR!? As in "I wrote the software myself on a computer way before PC, built the mixers in cardboard boxes, wired up my own A/D converter to make rudimentary 'sampling', 'multitracked' via two casette decks" primitive gear? Here are [url=http://www.master-zap.com/presskit/oldies.swf]pictures[/url] and here are [url=http://www.mp3.com/youngzap]sounds[/url] - ENJOY [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] Note the 1982 vintage speech synthesis in "I wanna d-d-d-d-d d-d-d d-d-dance, uh-uh uh uh uh" [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] WARNING: 20 years until autotune is invented [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] /Z

[Gus Lozada]

Mine !!! [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] Check it out @ [url=http://www.mp3.com/trax_mx]www.mp3.com/trax_mx[/url] A PC, an Ensoniq synth, a 5 dollar PC Microphone and a bunch of Plug Ins... ------------------ [b]Gustavo G Lozada[/b] Moderador de: [url=http://www.musicplayer.com/nuestroforo]MusicPlayer.com/NuestroForo[/url] [i] "La voz en Español en Música y Tecnología"[/i] [url=http://www.mp3.com/trax_mx]GusTraX[/url] @yahoo.com

[dansouth]

Gus is the undisputed heavyweight champion of limited gear productions!

[Pro Jules]

"Move on up" by UK band Primal Scream was mixed by Producer Jimmi Miller and an engineer chum of mine. The engineer told me that as a act of bravado / a gag they mixed the song with just one echo plate. Sounds good! A clasic even... Jules

[AmadMozart]

[quote]Originally posted by Master Zap: [b]YOu wanna hear some LIMITED GEAR!? As in "I wrote the software myself on a computer way before PC, built the mixers in cardboard boxes, wired up my own A/D converter to make rudimentary 'sampling', 'multitracked' via two casette decks" primitive gear? Here are [url=http://www.master-zap.com/presskit/oldies.swf]pictures[/url] and here are [url=http://www.mp3.com/youngzap]sounds[/url] - ENJOY [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] Note the 1982 vintage speech synthesis in "I wanna d-d-d-d-d d-d-d d-d-dance, uh-uh uh uh uh" [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] WARNING: 20 years until autotune is invented [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] /Z[/b][/quote] Oh man, I am digging the early years, Zap [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img] Reminds me way too much of myself at that age at least in terms of the total music obsession taking hold right at puberty. Does anybody remember the exact moment they *knew* that making music was going to be there obsession forever? I can tell you the exact moment for me, Christmas of 1972. At that point in my life, I was taking classical training on the clarinet, and had had little or no exposure to popular music. My parents didn't even own a hi-fi, let alone a stereo. That year my Dad bought a stereo system and my siblings and I gave each other LP's for presents. My older sister got me the Beatles 1967-1970 collection (the Blue Album). And with the headphones on so as not to upset my folks, I listened. The first cut I listened to was "I Am The Walrus" - and it was all over. I had no idea that was even possible with music. Goo goo ga joob, Mark ------------------ http://www.broadjam.com/artistprofile/artistindex.asp?artistID=936

[rold]

Best four track cassette based recording I ever heard was a Mike Patton project - an album full of strange mouth and verbal noises... [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

[Crushed]

Whereas you guys are harkening back to the glory-days, I harken back to last week! I've got a chezzy setup at home with a couple of mikes a computer, cubase, and I had to play all the instruments myself. That's primitive for today. Check it out. ------------------ http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/292/izzy_epstein.html

[Gus Lozada]

[quote]Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com: [b]Gus is the undisputed heavyweight champion of limited gear productions![/b][/quote] I wish that does not mean it sounds [i]THAT[/i] bad... or limited... But yes, in this specific case, creativity over resources was the rule. ------------------ [b]Gustavo G Lozada[/b] Moderador de: [url=http://www.musicplayer.com/nuestroforo]MusicPlayer.com/NuestroForo[/url] [i] "La voz en Español en Música y Tecnología"[/i] [url=http://www.mp3.com/trax_mx]GusTraX[/url] @yahoo.com

[Curve Dominant]

The following tracks on this site were all recorded on a Tascam 424 Portastudio 4-track cassette machine. All the vocals were tracked with a Shure SM57, and everything else was recorded direct in to the 424. No mic pres; front end processing consisted of the cheapest outboard gear available on the market: Alesis Nanocompressor, and Alesis M-EQ 230. • "Jus D'Orange Ou Pamplamousse" • "Sugar" • "I Remember Carol" • "Put Your Feet Across The Great Divide" [url=http://www.mp3.com/TransluxTheater]www.mp3.com/TransluxTheater[/url] ...those were the days. A little one bedroom apartment at 23rd and Spruce Street, second floor front. If, while I was tracking vocals, a Septa bus drove past, or a car alarm went off, or gunfire, etc....I either re-cut the track, or it ended up in the mix. E [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

[Chip McDonald]

k.d. lang Ingenue. 1/2 inch 16 track. Nice outboard gear I suppose, though. Miss Lang on vocals would sound good singing on an answering machine, though, so I guess that doesn't count. Hmm. "Garage Days Revisited" by Metallica - with Ted Nugent producing no less - sounds fantastic to me. But that's just "sorta old" mid 70's gear. Best scooped-metal guitar sound ever. Hmm. NO, I know! Steve Vai, _Flexible_. From what I've heard, Fostex 1/4 inch 8 track, Fostex board, cheesy outboard gear. ------------------ [b]New and Improved Music Soon:[/b] http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald

[Master Zap]

[quote]Gus is the undisputed heavyweight champion of limited gear productions! [/quote] He had a *PC*. I had a Swedish [url=http://www.hogia.se/pcmuseum/datorer75-84/sverige/ABC/ABC80/abc80.htm]ABC80 computer[/url] !! He used software off the net! I wrote all software myself!! He had the A/D and D/A built into his soundcard! I BUILT my own A/D and D/A card!! He had an ENSONIQ synth! I had a Yamaha CS-5! He had actual samples available from external sources, no doubt 16 bit. I had to sample everything myself, in 7.3 bits! (crappy ZN499 converter [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] ) He had a harddisk! I had 160kb FLOPPY DISKS! He probably had RAM in the MEGABYTES I had 32K of RAM. Yes 32 KILObytes. 32768 bytes. To [i]SHARE[/i] between code [i]AND[/i] samples!!!!!! He had a $5 microphone.... Okay so I had a $9 microphone. Tsk tsk [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] /Z This message has been edited by Master Zap on 08-23-2001 at 03:39 AM

[Jeff Klopmeyer]

Geez, I can't believe you peeps haven't brought up Bruce Springsteen's [i]Nebraska[/i]. Recorded with a Portastudio and an SM57. Gear is great, but talent and passion is still the key. - Jeff

[AmadMozart]

[quote]Originally posted by Jeff, TASCAM Guy: [b]Geez, I can't believe you peeps haven't brought up Bruce Springsteen's [i]Nebraska[/i]. Recorded with a Portastudio and an SM57. Gear is great, but talent and passion is still the key. - Jeff[/b][/quote] "peeps"? [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/eek.gif[/img] Is that a word? [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] Cheers, Mark ------------------ http://www.broadjam.com/artistprofile/artistindex.asp?artistID=936 http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/294/mark_coming_project.html

[strat0124]

[quote]Originally posted by Curve Dominant: [b]The following tracks on this site were all recorded on a Tascam 424 Portastudio 4-track cassette machine. All the vocals were tracked with a Shure SM57, and everything else was recorded direct in to the 424. No mic pres; front end processing consisted of the cheapest outboard gear available on the market: Alesis Nanocompressor, and Alesis M-EQ 230. • "Jus D'Orange Ou Pamplamousse" • "Sugar" • "I Remember Carol" • "Put Your Feet Across The Great Divide" [url=http://www.mp3.com/TransluxTheater]www.mp3.com/TransluxTheater[/url] ...those were the days. A little one bedroom apartment at 23rd and Spruce Street, second floor front. If, while I was tracking vocals, a Septa bus drove past, or a car alarm went off, or gunfire, etc....I either re-cut the track, or it ended up in the mix. E [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img][/b][/quote] Cool Curve.....sounds very British to me. Another excellent example of kicking it with limited gear. I've got some old stuff with phone calls in it as well.......

[Anderton]

<> Yes, but I was told they went through over 40 mastering jobs before they could get it to sound good enough for release! Not to diminish the value of Nebraska, of course, but just to point out that Springsteen never intended for those tracks to be released, so it took a lot of effort to get them ready for prime time.

[clock]

hey amadmozart, I really loved the mix. Extra clear and extra rich. I liked it so much that I went to borrow a tape machine from a friend who has had it sitting forever. It turns out its a tascam 244. Are these any relation to the 238? Its working fine, but apart from demagnetizing, what can I do to get it in perfect condition. peace

[oliveloafe]

ok, you asked for it... These recordings were done by a friend of mine and myself when in 6th grade. Last year I put them on mp3.com and tried to market them as childrens songs [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] "No More Eggs" reached #35 in the general childrens charts. All done live on my dads dictaphone (bulky thing before hand helds circa 1978) with a no name mic plugged into a guitar amp.... ouch. [url=http://www.mp3.com/oliveloafe]www.mp3.com/oliveloafe[/url] olive

[AmadMozart]

[quote]Originally posted by clock: [b]hey amadmozart, I really loved the mix. Extra clear and extra rich. I liked it so much that I went to borrow a tape machine from a friend who has had it sitting forever. It turns out its a tascam 244. Are these any relation to the 238? Its working fine, but apart from demagnetizing, what can I do to get it in perfect condition. peace[/b][/quote] Clock, Glad you liked the song and the mix - I had a lot of fun with that 4 track set-up [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img] I was using a 234 as my tape deck - I think in my original post I misspoke and said the mixer was a Tascam 238 when it was in fact a Tascam M 208. The Tascam 238 is an 8 track cassette recorder - the next natural progression of the Tascam 234 which was a 4 track cassette recorder. The 244 is a 4 track porta-studio, but I don't know if it is the same deck as what I was using - I can only assume since they are both 4 track recorders from Tascam they must be very similar in terms of specs - but where the 244 porta studio has a built in mixer - the 234 and 238 both really needed some kind of external mixer to be really useful. Apart from demagnetizing, it might need a good overall cleaning - heads, the rubber pinch rollers, etc. You can get a cleaning kit (or you used to be able) That tascam makes that gives you swabs, head cleaner, and a rubber cleaner. That is what I always used on the 234. Cheers, Mark ------------------ http://www.broadjam.com/artistprofile/artistindex.asp?artistID=936 http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/294/mark_coming_project.html