So, I had my wife arrested last night....

[TyPie]

Dean,

 

I truly feel for you all. There is nothing quite so gut-wrenching as matters of the heart. I sincerely hope for a peaceful, happy resolution for all involved, if possible, without passing judgement on anyone. It can and does happen to the best and worst of us! I hope you all can work things out!

[deanmass]

Quiet night.

 

I got asked by her to pay for a lawyer for her pre-trial hearing, which I will. I asked her to call and make an appt. tomorrow.

 

I also found out her parents went to my moms house and left a note. It said 'Your son had my daughter arrested. I am mad call xxx-xxxx'

[Programgirl]

Dean, I feel your pain and I'm sorry to hear about it. I've also been in the desperate position of having to choose between sucking up the abuse or picking up the phone, and I can relate to the anxiety and stress you've been feeling. I went through a lot of similiar things during the weeks my ex was locked up and the time I spent wondering what I was going to do next, without getting more than a couple hours of sleep a night. I have also dealt with the in-laws reaction to my 'inability to be a supportive and understanding wife', and I know how much that sucks.

 

The fact is, if you were afraid of being harmed, you did the right thing. There is no reason you have to live in fear and misery, and I think anyone who assumes you failed to pay adequate attention to your wife needs to consider this before commenting. And really, when it comes down to it, you know that something really needed to change, right? It's good that you were able to realize that before it really was too late.

 

Hopefully when all is said and done you two will still be friends, and you will have both learned valuable lessons from this experience. In the meantime, hang in there and take care of what needs taking care of. Time will help you work out all the rest. I wish you all the strength and coping skills you need during this rough time.

[deanmass]

I re-posted my original...

 

RE: The rest from Ani....ack!

[E-money]

I have to agree with Ani.

You say that this co-worker "has become a family friend", but it's pretty clear that your wife doesn't feel that way.

Granted, I think your wife went off the deep end, but telling her about the babysitting thing was throwing gasoline on the fire.

I hope everything works out for the 2 of you. Just remember, you chose each other, and you chose to have kids together. You both need to choose to do the right thing for your kids.

[deanmass]

The only thing I added was the family friend line, because I copied it to another friend to give them a heads up. I relized I had not mad that clear. You cannot say that ALL the stuff you wrote hinged on that one line.

 

The baby sitting thing is not only true, but she was asking me. I asked her Are you SURE? Because I had avoided telling her.

 

Ani, I don't know WTF you read the first time, BUT this is the post with one additional line. This woman has watched our children, been to our house for BBQ's with her husband, and we have been to her house as a family. Both of her daughters have babysat for my kids. I am sorry if my original post was no perfect, but jesus christ...4th of July weekend, My wife got drunk and was throwing marshmallows at the table I was at with this gal, her husband, a 4 other friends. My band played a relay event this woman is a chair of, and my wife attended. They were introduced YEARS ago, and the first time socially at HER house with a 3 couple dinner.

[Franknputer]

Wow - sorry you're going through this, dean. Hope things get better soon.

 

And don't worry about the opinions of others & their judgements about what's wrong with YOU. None of us is qualified to give you that sort of advice.

 

There is no such thing as 'good' jealousy; it is a negative emotion. But, how it manifests itself & makes a difference is important IMO. If it lets you know that more attention is in order, then perhaps it serves a positive purpose; but if things are well, and people are secure in their selves & their relationships, then there should be no reason to fear others' involvement in your lives.

[Dan South]

Imagine this ficticious scenario. A guy is bummed because his wife doesn't seem to be interested in him anymore, so he asks three friends for advice.

 

Friend 1: Buy her flowers, nice red roses! My wife LOVES roses.

 

Friend 2: Yeah, flowers are great, by MY wife goes bananas when I give her chocolates!

 

Friend 3: Oh, no. Never, ever, EVER give your wife flowers or chocolate. No, sirree! I can tell you from EXPERIENCE that that's a bad idea. I gave my wife flowers and chocolate when she was released from prison for burning down the strip joint where she used to moonlight when she wasn't too stoned on crack to actually hold a job, and when she saw the gift she assumed that I was cheating on her - which I never did, except one time with her best friend, but her best friend was the one who came onto ME, and my wife never found out - oh, so anyway, she assumed that I was cheating on her and she hit me in the head with a tire iron and stabbed me with a hunting knife.

 

So, BELIEVE ME, my experience tells me that you should NEVER give your wife flowers or chocolate unless you want to be bludgeoned and stabbed.

 

----

 

Some of the ACTUAL REPLIES on this thread remind me of Fictional Friend 3's advice.

[Lee Flier]

ROFL Dan!

[Programgirl]

You know, I didn't want to start anything with Ani, but after reading through all of her literary works, her responses are really starting to irk me, so I'm going to throw my two cents out there.

 

First of all, I would like to point out that everyone deals with their situation the best way they know how, and they way you personally choose to cope will not always work for someone else. Your passages where you indicate that you encourage and agree with coddling the abuser to calm them down sound ridiculously co-dependant to me. Maybe some of us aren't willing to tolerate abuse from anyone under any circumstances, and don't believe there is any reason we should. Maybe you should have your daughter arrested next time she behaves the way you described - it's obvious she has issues and you're probably not helping her by letting her continue to treat people that way. Of course, that's just my take on the situation, and that doesn't necessarily make it an accurate or appropriate point of view.

 

It sounds to me like Dean's wife went completely around the bend, and since there were threats and children involved the best thing to do was get her out of the house. Perhaps Dean didn't have the prerequisite psychology degree needed to de-escalate the situation, or maybe he just wasn't calm enough to do it at the time. Whatever the case, having her arrested is better than using a physical response to subdue her any day of the week, and I think Dean made a wise choice. If my significant other were man-handling MY children, you better believe I would put a stop to that right-quick using any means necessary.

 

Dean should have the right to interact with female co-workers in a platonic way without having to defend himself. Being married doesn't mean you have granted someone ownership of your actions. If she can't handle that, then it is obvious the problem is with her ability to trust. And just because she has a problem with it doesn't mean that Dean has to change who he is to appease her.

 

Finally - telling someone the truth is not verbal abuse. There is a vast difference between, "they don't trust you" and, "you're a psychotic bitch who shouldn't be near children". I don't see anything negative in Dean's response to his wife's question about the babysitting situation - she asked, he answered honestly, and she then proceeded to behave in a completely unacceptable way. A rational person may have been unhappy with the response but they wouldn't have then proven that person right by turning on their own children.

 

I think it's obvious that you're biased toward women in these situations and cannot accept that men can also be victims of abuse at the hands of their spouses without having done something to the woman to cause it. Maybe it's due to what you have experienced in your past - that would certainly be understandable considering the stories you have put down here. But it's a dangerous and sexist assumption, and you may want to give that a thought before commenting on this type of circumstance again.

 

Again, all merely my opinion.

[Tedly Nightshade]

Can't follow all this, but I will say, it's usually something a person will come to regret to get the cops, social workers, etc. involved with something when they didn't absolutely, undeniably have to be.

 

They tend to put their own interpretations on events and it's hard to call them off once you started.

[Tedly Nightshade]

Well, after reading the initial post, now that there's something there to read...

 

You blew it Jack. I've blown it before in similar ways. Cops have come into my life before over domestic disputes in my parents' home (mine at the time) and my own, and it was always a really bad idea. Fortunately nobody was stupid or stubborn enough to press charges, so nothing came of it. Nothing but a serious loss of trust that is basically nonrepairable until many years later, maybe.

 

That's an abuse of the police department. They have way better things to do. You escalated the situation from berzerk and destructive but nobody's in real danger to the point where thugs with guns were in your house. You brought guns into your house, over fists, and from what I can tell, very ineffective and futile fists.

 

You're taking a chance when you call the heat in- you could end up in jail yourself. It becomes the whim of the man with the gun, not a good situation at all. You're lucky it came out no worse than it did, which is plenty worse, but at least as far as I can tell from the initial post your extremely upset and losing it wife didn't resist going with the men with the guns and the handcuffs (something to be avoided, to be sure), and get roughed up or even, and it happens, sexually roughed up by the police.

 

Like I say, I've fucked up before, plenty of times, and what I write is from experience, my own and second hand. Perhaps if you could have been a fly on the wall in the station house hearing the cops make coarse small talk about your wife...

 

Anyway, people fuck up, it happens, do what you can to right it- and I would expect some years to pass before trust can be regained. Understand that whatever she did to you and the house, you brought it to the point where she was imprisoned, however briefly, under physical threat up to and including violent death. That's heavy. Weigh it.

[Programgirl]

Originally posted by Ani:

Notice that when he revised his initial post he emphasized that he was NOT hurt by placing it in parenthesis.

So? That makes it ok for her to behave that way, just because nobody got hurt this time? There were plenty of times I found my ex's hands around my throat when he was too drunk to actually do any damage - it doesn't make it any less traumatic than if he had actually left bruises.

 

Perhaps you were an only child and never had any sibling rivalry, and I would certainly venture to say that you have never attempted to raise a child of your own; let alone two.

I've birthed one child and raised two that weren't mine and no, I wasn't an only child. I don't see what the point of that is. Abuse is abuse no matter what your family circumstances are. A person directing unreasonable rage toward others is a person who needs help, IMO.

 

If you had any situations with your own kid, you'd send them to a juvenile home or prep school; no doubt. You'd certainly make a great mother.

You have got to be kidding me. You think just because I might see a child that needs help I'm not qualified to give, that automatically means it would come natural to me to abandon my own children when they became inconvenient? I don't believe you know enough about the kind of person I am to make that assumption. This petty statement is beneath us, don't you think?

 

Remember, you wrote the details down for us to read and draw conclusions from; my conclusion is that the behavior you're describing is out of control. Maybe you should deal with your situation instead of attacking others about how they're dealing with their situations.

[Joachim P. Dyndale]

Dean,

 

I'm truly sorry. I'm greatly impressed by your handling of the situation, and the way you handled Ani's posts.

 

After reading this thead (well, OK, I skimmed through a few posts - mainly because I wanted to focus on you and Ani) I get the impression that Ani has misinterpreted just about every aspect of this situation. Sorry Ani, but I simply can't beleive we read the same 1st post in this thread!

 

And Ani, that story about Dean deliberatly setting this up in order to get out of the marriage without ebing blamed for anything is some of the most far-fetched shit I've ever heard. Sorry for the lingo, but that thing just sucked big-time. It seems Deans situation has really hit a nerve with you. Please deal with it somewhere else.

 

Oh, and Dean - that "What did you expect? Duh..." post was in all likelyhood sarcastic and in support for you

 

It seems you truly love your wife and you're willing to put up with a lot to keep together. That's the way to go, and I'm glad to learn there are still people who beleive that a marriage is worth saving - even if it costs a lot (not in terms of $$). You PROMISED your wife AND God that you'd stay together 'till "death do you part". However, yuo should not be a prisoner. If her jealousy is so bad that you basically can't be around other women - for any reason at all, no matter how innocent - then yeah, it's HER problem and SHE has to dael with it. If she won't admit to that and try to do something about it - thus making it impossible for you to have anything resembling a normal life - you should file for seperation. And YOU should get the kids. She should be forced to take a "time out" and think through a few things...

 

And anyway... Ani - it seems you didn't notice that the kids clearly sided with Dean here. Their reaction is most likely the most revealing "clue" in this "mystery".

 

Um... I'm gonna go to bed now. It's 03:36 A.M. now and I have to be at school at 08:00...

 

Dean, I truly hope you manage to work things out. My thoughts and my prayers go to you and your family.

[Joachim P. Dyndale]

I hope what Ted's said is true - generally. Like - that's how it is, always. If so I feel sorry for every American because your legal system seems to suck... I'm not saying that our legal system here is perfect. No such system is. But if it's very common for police officers to sexually harass female's - then your police academies dont know what they're doing. They should have a thorough revision of their regulations for what kind of people they send out as police officers.

[Tedly Nightshade]

Originally posted by Joachim P. Dyndale:

I hope what Ted's said is true - generally. Like - that's how it is, always. If so I feel sorry for every American because your legal system seems to suck... I'm not saying that our legal system here is perfect. No such system is. But if it's very common for police officers to sexually harass female's - then your police academies dont know what they're doing. They should have a thorough revision of their regulations for what kind of people they send out as police officers.

Physical harassment may or may not be common, but it happens. Verbal harassment is de rigeur.

 

Basically, you start something you can't stop- you can't call off those dogs. Once you've said sic' em, it's out of your hands.

 

Like I say, I've done similar things, that's how I know what a bad choice that is and how very, very long it will take to repair trust.

 

And that's going by the revised original post as if it were fact, not as testimony from a biased source. You can't help but be biased when it's your home it and you did it. I know- it's been my home before.

[Duddits]

Just from a voyeuristic point of view (and I feel a little voyeuristic checking out this thread) there's two things going on - the exchange between Ani and Dean, and the exchange between Dean and his wife. The real story is obviously between Dean and his wife -- the story that we hardly know anything about. Of course it makes sense that we don't know much about Dean and his wife since what's happening with them isn't happening here.

 

I know I may just be a cat, but in my opinion, I think Dan kind of hit the nail on the head for me. I just don't think that Dean has provided enough information for Ani to draw the kind of conclusions she's drawing. Obviously, she's relating his situation to hers, but there are millions of other situations it could be related to that would lead to millions of different conclusions.

 

Ani says "But in your scenario, the said person did not come onto a public forum boasting about how he had just had his wife arrested for abuse after having brought another female home."

 

I really don't see anything that smacks of "boasting." That Ani would characterize his messages as "boasting" says something about how she is reading what he's writing.

 

Ani says: "The man says he loves his wife, and yet taunts her with the presence of a woman"

 

Based on what he says, I don't see his actions as "taunting." If they are, than I plead guilty to taunting on a daily basis. By that logic, Dean's on-line conversation with Ani would probably go beyond mere taunting if his wifey ever found out about this thread!

 

So do I think Dean is all innocent and his wife is all guilty? I HAVE NO FRIGGIN IDEA. For all I know, Ani has underestimated his culpability, and maybe he's even worse than she can imagine. Who knows, maybe he doesn't even have a wife. Maybe he has one and keeps her in a hefty bag, or two. My guess is he has a wife, he doesn't keep her in a hefty bag, and I really don't know what her side of the story is. But frankly, I don't much care about his wife's side of the story because this is Dean's thread not hers.

 

And since it is his story, all I can do is take him at his word. And if I take him at his word, it sounds like Dean's wife rather than Dean was to blame, and it's impossible to evaluate whether his reaction was appropriate or not. But as a dramatic incident in his life -- in anyone's life -- my God! -- it makes sense to want to vent, express, and chat about it, so why not online: virtual confession, therapy, commeraderie, empathy.

 

So, hope things work out. Wish I had some good advice, but anything I could say has already been said. I don't know. If you love her keep her, if you don't, dump her. I had a relationship with a certain someone recently but even though there's lots of love, we drive each other crazy, so it just didn't work out. Although we still do some work together. It didn't come to blows tho. See, now you've got me doing it: relating your experience to my own. Is there any other way?

 

meow.

[Tedly Nightshade]

Originally posted by Joachim P. Dyndale:

I hope what Ted's said is true - generally. Like - that's how it is, always. If so I feel sorry for every American because your legal system seems to suck... I'm not saying that our legal system here is perfect. No such system is. But if it's very common for police officers to sexually harass female's - then your police academies dont know what they're doing. They should have a thorough revision of their regulations for what kind of people they send out as police officers.

Physical harassment may or may not be common, but it happens. Verbal harassment is de rigeur.

 

Basically, you start something you can't stop- you can't call off those dogs. Once you've said sic' em, it's out of your hands.

 

Like I say, I've done similar things, that's how I know what a bad choice that is and how very, very long it will take to repair trust.

 

And that's going by the revised original post as if it were fact, not as testimony from a biased source. You can't help but be biased when it's your home it and you did it. I know- it's been my home before.

[YourMotherShouldKnow]

Dean,

 

You've gotten about 18 different interpretations of your situation. At the very least it should be clear that you're on your own in identifying what's best for you.

 

Bringing the state into it (judges, police, social workers) is a total crapshoot. Like the people here, they might decide anything at all about you, arbitrary or not. What they decide may resemble justice and it may not. That's an extra burden for you on top of your already difficult situation.

 

Keep it simple, do you trust your wife? Your answer will trump any social conventions.

 

Good luck, dude! The world isn't as crazy as it seems.

[videoeditor1]

Ani,

 

The general consensus is...

 

1. This is Dean's thread. Keep your responses focused, tight and relatively on point.

 

You said:

Divorce is one of the most traumatic experiences that a young child can endure, outside the death of a parent

Yes, and being violently raped.

Or seeing your parent raped.

Or seeing someone beat the crap out of your parent.

Or being forced to eat shit; on mumerous occasions;

Or seeing a bus run over your sibling's head.

Or seeing a bunch of guys drop your brother's guts and having to walk said brother to the hospital.

Or losing a limb.

 

Let's be real for a minit. In the grand scheme of things, divorce is divorce.

 

...and yes, we still cool.

[Programgirl]

Well Ani, I certainly am happy that you have resources to help you cope, and that you took advantage of them. I hope all goes well for you and your family in that endeavor.

 

I have to disagree wholeheartedly with your opinion that Dean provoked the situation to the point it got to, and then retaliated against what he had created by having his wife locked up. She is an adult, if she didn't like his behavior she could have walked away from the situation herself instead of getting physical. That's what grownups do.

 

Maybe I find myself more empathetic of Dean's ordeal because I remember very strongly what it was like to feel so backed into a corner by a spouse's behavior that I felt I had no choice but to call for help. Maybe my strong belief that nobody should be forced to play along with another person's bad behavior just to keep the peace, and that one person has a right to disagree with another person without being attacked plays a role in my opinion too.

 

In any case, this discussion has gotten way off course, and now it's on the verge of getting ugly, so I think I am done with it.

[phaeton]

Anifa-

 

You read a lot of those paperback smut novels, huh?

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by Ani:

Dean,

 

There are others that read your initial post too... You have added a LOT more than one line.

 

There was not one mention of a DOG or the surrounding events in your original post, NOR a hubby of the woman or anything about their vacation....

....You DID mention this, I am startign to cook dinner (fried chix and mashed potatoes...dumped it all after) but you didn't go into the details of the dialogue as you have here. Especially the part where she says " I don't want that 'person' on my property again."

 

NONE of this was present in the initial text....

 

...This is an alteration because it was not until later that you added the part about the insulin...

Errrhhh... Ani, yes all of these things WERE in the original post. I read it carefully and I remember very well all of those things being there.

 

I think this is a case where your own experiences have clouded your perception of the situation way too much for you to be of much help to Dean, and it might be best for you to let go of it.

[deanmass]

Police are professionals, and I sought their help. My wife had 3 weeks previously threatened to slit her wrists. She had just hit me many times in front of my child. She ran upstairs. I did not know what to do. I called professionals.

 

My wife and I have been in couples counseling for 2 monthes.

 

I have been seeing a therapist weekly for 1.5 years because my wife refused to go.

 

3.5 years ago after 1.5 years of asking, and 6 weeks of attending alone, she finally went, only to say that the therapist does not know what she was talking about over and over.

 

I am really trying to be cool about your endless ranting responses Ani, but I think everything that can be said and more has been said, and I think the bulk of what you said is wrong.

 

I also do not appreciate being called a liar. I added one line to the original post as far as I can remember, but being that I was very upset, I don't remember. Even with my updates, you continue to rant. I am done reading here. It has turned into a negative thing because of you. The rest of you, thank you for your posts positive and negative. Ani, maybe I'll give you my wife's cell number. At this point, I think you two would get along famously.

[eh steve]

i hit my wife once with an open hand (ding). she never hit me again.

 

that was twelve years ago. we're still together and she still loves me. yaY!

 

domestic violence sucks.

 

[Charlie-brm]

Man, there's nothing on TV tonight this good.

I mean the sparring forum, not your situation Dean. My antenna picked up on the picture right away.

 

So here's my share of free observations, based on my life experience, either personal or watching my absolute best friends of over 40 years:

 

• Many children are better adjusted after a divorce, if the divorce removes irreparable abuse and stress. Even past their teens children need nurture and stability, not a father and mother.

 

• Being the first to lay a charge sets the tone. Get anything significant on record. You won't wait to be the punching bag of the legal/child care (there's a laugh) system. IF it comes to lawyers for defense for the shit you could get falsely accused of, try not to let them drag it out for six years and milk your bank account.

 

• Dean, I'm guessing that day you thought it was OK to voice your opinion in your own house instead of walking on glass every time a gripe surfaces. And I'm guessing you knew the reaction to expect.

 

• I'm putting a note in an envelope for later; Manic Depressive (Bi-polar). But I hope it works out for you and the kids.

[Dan South]

Originally posted by Ani:

Yes Dan,

 

But in your scenario, the said person did not come onto a public forum boasting about how he had just had his wife arrested for abuse after having brought another female home.

 

Your perception that Dean was "boasting" is about as absurd as your perception that the chapters that you have added to this thread are "helping." Well, maybe in some way they have helped you, but I doubt that they've added much to Dean's experience. I hope that he has the sense to disregard most of what you've posted here.

 

If you need to talk about the ups and downs of your own life, please start your own thread. People will be glad to chime in an help in any way that they can, just as they have done with Dean. But it MIGHT be best for DEAN - the guy who came to us for help in the first place - if you would just quietly let THIS PARTICULAR THREAD go.

[Joachim P. Dyndale]

I thank the cat for the excellent response. Dean has made it clear he's done with this thread, so I suggest we act accordingly. At least I will. See y'all in another (mopre pleasent) thread!

[blackfish]

Originally posted by Ani:

Dan,

 

...and I think I need to take some time off from these forums and concentrate more on my web site.

Bye

[nursers]

Originally posted by Lee Flier:

Originally posted by Ani:

Dean,

 

There are others that read your initial post too... You have added a LOT more than one line.

 

There was not one mention of a DOG or the surrounding events in your original post, NOR a hubby of the woman or anything about their vacation....

....You DID mention this, I am startign to cook dinner (fried chix and mashed potatoes...dumped it all after) but you didn't go into the details of the dialogue as you have here. Especially the part where she says " I don't want that 'person' on my property again."

 

NONE of this was present in the initial text....

 

...This is an alteration because it was not until later that you added the part about the insulin...

Errrhhh... Ani, yes all of these things WERE in the original post. I read it carefully and I remember very well all of those things being there.

 

I think this is a case where your own experiences have clouded your perception of the situation way too much for you to be of much help to Dean, and it might be best for you to let go of it.

Ani, Lee is right here. I remember all that stuff from the original post: the dog, the husband etc.

 

With all respect, you have form on accusing people of changing posts, even complaining to Dendy, then backing off when enough people point out you were wrong.

 

As Lee said, maybe time to let it go.