Kenny Werner Effortless Mastery

[JamPro]

I have been thinking a discussion of Kenny Werner's book Effortless Mastery might be interesting for this crowd.

 

So...has anyone here tried Mr. Werner's method of meditation, affirmations, imagery, and relaxation to improve their piano playing?  How dedicated to the method are you?  How easy or difficult is it for you to use the method in your piano playing?  Have you noticed a difference?  Was the difference "meh" or "magnificent"?

 

Perhaps my biggest question: in a piano world where there is already too much to study and practice, where do I find the time to include this?

 

 

[b3plyr]

The biggest take away from Effortless Mastery is get rid of your ego. And he provides a lot of help in figuring out how to do so. As to the meditations, I don’t like them. There are a number of better ones you can find anywhere. But the idea is pretty good. If it helps you get rid of your ego, the book is for you. Finally, the book is not really a method per se. It is worth reading, though. Very easy read.

[JamPro]

Yes, but what does it mean to "get rid of your ego"?  Kenny Werner suggests when you "get rid of your ego", there are no bad notes.  As someone who spends about half of my piano practice time playing classical music, I most certainly play bad notes, so it would seem getting rid of my ego requires giving up playing classical music.  Indeed, I think Mr. Werner is telling me my ego is driving me to desire to play classical piano music correctly, instead of accepting the music my fingers can play right now. 

 

And that seems very wrong to me.

 

I suggest Mr. Werner is putting forward a very definite method which he describes in Chpt. 16 as four distinct steps: 1) mediation to "attain inner balance"; 2) moving your fingers abstractly on the keyboard  while in a meditative state; 3) moving your fingers musically on the keyboard while in a meditative state; 4) a process of change and growth.  This process of change and growth is where Mr. Werner says you begin actually working to improve the capabilities of your fingers to say, play correctly a piece of classical music.  But Mr. Werner advises such work can only come when one is in that meditative and presumably egoless state.

 

As a college and grad student, I meditated every day for 30-40 minutes doing simple mindful attention on breathing.  So I am practiced at that, yet I don't think I ever achieved an egoless state.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Sean M. H.]

2 hours ago, JamPro said:

Yes, but what does it mean to "get rid of your ego"?  Kenny Werner suggests when you "get rid of your ego", there are no bad notes.  As someone who spends about half of my piano practice time playing classical music, I most certainly play bad notes, so it would seem getting rid of my ego requires giving up playing classical music.  Indeed, I think Mr. Werner is telling me my ego is driving me to desire to play classical piano music correctly, instead of accepting the music my fingers can play right now. 

 

And that seems very wrong to me.

 

 

 

 

That's a valid point...I don't recall if he ever explicitly states it, but that book and his overarching measage is inherently geared towards jazz and improvisational music than classical music.  His whole point is that only our own ego and fabricated expectations allow the concept of "wrong" notes to exist...to your point, that doesn't really work if your performance is literally meant to reproduce a written work as closely as possible as in classical repertoire. 

 

With that said, I do think the book is a worthwhile read and can help reshape some unhealthy mental blocks.  I, like most people I would bet, read the book and found value in the theme, even though I never actually started doing the meditations.

[Joe Muscara]

I should be the resident expert on this subject because I've taken two of his courses, the first on Steps 1 and 2 in Summer 2021 and one on all Four Steps that just finished last month (he gave those of us who did the steps 1 & 2 course a discount on the second course but we got something out of going through steps 1 and 2 again for sure).

 

His teaching has evolved through experience since writing the first book and he has written a second book. It covers some of the changes and updates but the basics are still the same. I really like this book, maybe more than the first.

 

One of the things he focuses on when teaching the four steps is what you might call Step Zero. As he likes to say, "it's so easy, an American can do it, with a chicken leg in one hand and a drink in the other. All you have to do is watch yourself breathe for twenty seconds. All the crap that you might be worried about, 'I'm no good', 'my kids don't listen to me', 'my wife doesn't love me', 'I don't have money for the rent or the mortgage', whatever it is, let it go for twenty seconds. You can have it all back after the twenty seconds. Go."

 

[You don't have to time a precise twenty seconds. Just don't try to make it anything more. And, if you struggle to watch yourself breathe for twenty seconds, make it ten.]

 

This step is fundamental to practicing the other four steps. You return to it again and again to get whatever it is in your mind (your ego? your father? that teacher that whacked your knuckles with a ruler?) out of your head and let your fingers (or embouchure or voice if that's your instrument) do what they already know how to do.

 

The fourth step, where you really apply the method to learning and practicing, is completely applicable to classical and other "fixed" styles of music. The beauty part of the method is that it's deeper, instead of being wider ("there is already too much to study and practice"). In other words, as you get better on the one little thing you focus on in your effortless mastery practice, you're training yourself to be better overall and you'll see the results in your other practicing and playing. The fourth step has you practicing without ego. You are even told to be excited when you play something wrong, because then you know there's something to work on. In the book, he talks about the learning diamond, and that's really important for this. When you're learning something, you can't play the whole example, 100% correct, at tempo, from the space. You might try to see what happens, then when it's not played right, you say, "oh, cool, I need to work on that part" and you break it down like we are all supposed to when we practice, small segments, as slow as you need to in order to play it correctly and remain in the space. And you work on it, staying in the space, and take breaks if you need to because you're slipping out of the space.

 

Kenny does a lot of free masterclasses, and in fact has one coming up on 16 February. Free Masterclass on Effortless Mastery and Rhythm. I can't recommend checking this out enough. Every time I've attended one of the free classes, it really drove home the points I'm making here. He gives a lot of this info away. He also posts useful stuff on Instagram at https://www.instagram.com/effortlessmastery/

 

I really believe that "Step Zero" has changed my life. While I do meditate some, I do it irregularly, but I do step zero a lot. And it's taught me that a lot of what goes through my mind is crap. It's allowed me to let go more often than I used to, and my life and the ways I deal with it have gotten much better. It has gone beyond music for me. Even if that was all I got from the courses, it was worth it.

[Legatoboy]

I went to one of his gigs and spoke with Ken a bit here in Stonybrook at the 'Jazz Loft' performance space a jazz museum .... I really should read that book... he played great..wonderful deep player.. the Tristano, Warn Marsh, Mosca, Konitz etc... study I was steeped in was along Ken's lines of thought...Larry Bluth my teacher was involved in that stable pf players  here in NYC as a young man and gave me a lot and I had my plate full when I went to hear Ken ... They all loved Zoot Simms, Charlie Christian, Bud of course and Lady Day .... now that I'm retired and Larry passed 3 years I really have the time now to read it and consider much ..

 

I asked Ken about his teaching and he mentioned his online one on one lessons to me but I was still actively studying with Larry (RIP), he was an awesome teacher and person... left a real void in his passing .... but he left myself and many other wo studied him with much to be thankful for .....  Larry had studied with Sal Mosca for 24 years and Larry had done 3 years at Berklee in Boston prior.   Sal also studied with Lennie for 11 years. But Sal really had his own thing and was about Lennie's age I believe, maybe a bit younger... Sal was considered less derivative than many other folks who studied with Lennie who tend to sound just like Lennie .... which, even  Lennie or Larry would have said is a wonderful thing, Larry played like neither  .... they often pointed things like that out in their studies.... your supposed to come out the other side you, not them! Pretty much the main ideas ... but the skill set.... that was a different story... everyone had to do the work... that was the same!    

[JamPro]

Thank you Joe M. for sharing your experience with us.

 

I like Mr. Werner's example of how children approach music in an "egoless state": kids will gleefully sing the same song again and again with the high excitement of simply knowing there is a song and they can reproduce it as often as they like.  For kids, they are not concerned with the correct notes and whether it is sharp or flat or wrong or whatever, simply with the joy of making music (an egoless state).

 

And of course anyone who has spent time with young children knows while they don't care if you sing their song sharp or flat or with wrong notes: they will sing it right along with you.  But in general, kids will be very upset with you if you sing the wrong words.  So I suggest that the childhood egoless appreciation of music is not as egoless as some believe.

 

And as I said above, I have done years of meditation, and I don't think my mediation ever resulted in  an "egoless state" sustained enough to play piano using Mr. Werner's methods.

 

Here's the thing for me: if I have to wait until I achieve an egoless state to play/practice the piano, I'll spend all my time wondering if I am in a egoless state, and my fingers will never get to the keyboard.

 

And the Zen buddhist will tell you: if you are meditating with the goal of achieving an egoless state, you will remain a prisoner of your ego - because your meditation is indeed now being driven by your ego.

 

So I definitely see the no-wrong-notes, child-like appreciation of music as something I can achieve, while think the idea of a mental egoless state is not practicably achievable without powerful hallucinogens.

[Montunoman 2]

I do like his work a lot but do have some trouble repeating “ I’m a master, I’ m great”

 

I’m better than many, worse than others, but I’m no where near what I consider a “ master” like Oscar Peterson, Chick Corea, Dave Brubeck, Art Tatum, Bill Evans, Herbie Hancock, Duke Ellington, Glen Gould, Rachmaninoff, Horowitz, Chopin, Mozart, Beethoven, Bach…. 
 

 

[Joe Muscara]

2 hours ago, Montunoman 2 said:

I do like his work a lot but do have some trouble repeating “ I’m a master, I’ m great”

 

I’m better than many, worse than others, but I’m no where near what I consider a “ master” like Oscar Peterson, Chick Corea, Dave Brubeck, Art Tatum, Bill Evans, Herbie Hancock, Duke Ellington, Glen Gould, Rachmaninoff, Horowitz, Chopin, Mozart, Beethoven, Bach…. 

But you are a master, of your own thing. It's not about comparing yourself to others, in fact, that's part of what you need to rid yourself of. We all do it, don't get down about that either, but when you're practicing or playing, if you're telling yourself you're not good enough, not as good as Herbie or Chick or Johann, does that get you anywhere? Of course not. So why not let it go?

 

Besides, I bet each one of those players could tell you about how they can't do what the other guys do. Each one is/was unique and great in their own way, but might not be able to do things the others did. I bet Herbie would tell you to not focus on that. He would tell you to work on you.

 

I was at a jam on Saturday and there was another keyboard player there. I'm listening to him and thinking, "hey, he's pretty good, he's nailing those parts." Meanwhile, I felt like I wasn't. I wasn't beating myself up about it, I haven't played with anyone since January 2020, so I know I'm rusty. No big deal. During the break, he comes up to me and says he's going to let me play most of the stuff, he's struggling, his hands are cold, etc. and that I was playing well. See what I'm saying? We were both great, though we weren't hearing it.

 

2 hours ago, JamPro said:

So I definitely see the no-wrong-notes, child-like appreciation of music as something I can achieve, while think the idea of a mental egoless state is not practicably achievable without powerful hallucinogens.

I understand why you're saying all this, but I think you're putting too much on it. The space isn't nirvana, it's just where you can let go of all that crap that comes to your mind for a while. Like I said, the practice is to get into the space, work on your craft, and if you come out of the space, either get back into it, or step away. It's as simple as that.

[b3plyr]

20 minutes ago, Joe Muscara said:

But you are a master, of your own thing. It's not about comparing yourself to others, in fact, that's part of what you need to rid yourself of. We all do it, don't get down about that either, but when you're practicing or playing, if you're telling yourself you're not good enough, not as good as Herbie or Chick or Johann, does that get you anywhere? Of course not. So why not let it go?

 

Besides, I bet each one of those players could tell you about how they can't do what the other guys do. Each one is/was unique and great in their own way, but might not be able to do things the others did. I bet Herbie would tell you to not focus on that. He would tell you to work on you.

 

I was at a jam on Saturday and there was another keyboard player there. I'm listening to him and thinking, "hey, he's pretty good, he's nailing those parts." Meanwhile, I felt like I wasn't. I wasn't beating myself up about it, I haven't played with anyone since January 2020, so I know I'm rusty. No big deal. During the break, he comes up to me and says he's going to let me play most of the stuff, he's struggling, his hands are cold, etc. and that I was playing well. See what I'm saying? We were both great, though we weren't hearing it.

 

I understand why you're saying all this, but I think you're putting too much on it. The space isn't nirvana, it's just where you can let go of all that crap that comes to your mind for a while. Like I said, the practice is to get into the space, work on your craft, and if you come out of the space, either get back into it, or step away. It's as simple as that.

This is the post to read! Great synopsis, Joe. You nailed it!

[David R]

The biggest takeaway I got from Effortless Mastery was the “practice triangle” (practice the whole piece, practice at tempo, practice perfectly - you can only have 2/3 until you have mastered the material). It restructured my practice time and my focus; it revolutionized how I learn music. Also his definition of “play effortlessly” meaning relaxed and without stress also really helped my playing. The meditations/affirmations were less my speed.

[Montunoman 2]

Yes Joe, that’s a good way to look at it and there’s no point to compare yourself to others. 
 

I had a teacher that I considered a great master. His main thing was classical, he could read anything, and also had perfect pitch and could play back anything he heard, even jazz material. He had great hands, speed, power, touch….. 

 

Once he asked me to play something that I like to play, not the classical stuff he assigned me. I played a boss nova type vamp, then a few boss’s nova standards like Wave. He told me he could never play like that, even if he really tried too. He told me my rhythmic feel was perfect for that style, and was in awe of how could just “ spontaneously improvise “ . I was thinking he was just being nice, trying to motivate me, but I got to thinking, that we all have own thing going on. Floyd Cramer vs Chick Corea? The comparison is pointless as they both do their own thing beautifully. 

 

 

 

[obxa]

Sometimes I get the creepy feeling this forum is watching me.  I literally just pulled out Kenny's book yesterday for something to ( re) read for plane travel this week.   Like most books of self help and philosophy, you can  take nuggets and form your own pastiche belief system.   I found a  huge amount  of worthwhile info in the book.  Years have passed since I last read it, and wanted to see if I'd pick up some new insight. Particularly because of some changes I'm making in my career. 

 

The book has helped at times when I really  needed it.   I'm reading again because I've still  never totally conquered that question of why you can have an awesome night where it all falls into place, and another where you're just trying too hard to recreate  and chase that same experience and feel like a rank amateur. 

 

I have to admit, I could never do his meditations.  With the utmost apologies to Kenny that  It's for the shallowest of reasons:  My suspension of mindfulness couldn't get past his accent.    I'm originally from Brooklyn, it felt too much like I was listening  to someone from the neighborhood.   Again shallow and stupid, and my own problem- and shouldn't take away from the wonderful great stuff he's presenting. 

 

  I will give it another shot.

[Joe Muscara]

15 hours ago, obxa said:

My suspension of mindfulness couldn't get past his accent.    I'm originally from Brooklyn, it felt too much like I was listening  to someone from the neighborhood.   Again shallow and stupid, and my own problem- and shouldn't take away from the wonderful great stuff he's presenting. 

 

I'm from Long Island, I get it.  

 

For me personally, I've tried to take what I find useful in the meditations and think them to myself instead. But for me, I do best when I just clear my head and get all thoughts out. Just doing the 20 seconds watching yourself breathe I mentioned earlier has helped me immensely. I find it helps with the awesome one time and suck the next thing, too. I try to approach each performance the same way, whether it "matters" or not. That's the closest I have gotten to being consistent in my playing.

[Doug Robinson]

I read it years ago, just before my first big time recording session in NYC with a couple of major jazz musicians playing my tunes. It really helped me. I never got into the meditations and even though I've read and recommended it several times ever since, this is the main thing that has stayed with me:

 

I believe it's the perfect tool for those millions of people who say they used to play something and wished they'd never stopped. This will help them get rolling again, imo.

 

A small child thrashes away at a piano, for example, and has the time of his life even though he sounds terrible. Then we get him lessons and he gets pretty good but ultimately quits because he gets bored or isn't as good as he thinks he should be or as his teachers think he should be.

I try to get back to that infant stage when I'm playing with a good trio. Feel good and have fun making music, nothing more. Even if I played better, if I didn't feel good and wasn't having fun, I'd probably retire.

[Al Quinn]

I read Kenny’s book and feel I’ve benefited greatly. I did the meditations but don’t anymore. However, by doing them I experienced the state of mind that he says is so important. It’s a familiar place to me because I’ve been there before. Some call it “the zone” and some call it the “flow” state. It’s the place to be for playing any type of music. As Vinnie Colaiuta says “Thought is the enemy of Flow.” The question is how to get there.
 

I think Kenny helps us with Effortless Mastery. There is no ego in the Flow state.There are no distractions. There’s no little guy on my shoulder criticizing this that or the other thing. When I took Chick Corea’s online class he talked about these concepts but in his own way. He refers to how a child learns and is very child-like in his approach to his art. I wasn’t expecting this from Chick and it really got my attention.
 

Since reading Kenny’s book a few years ago, getting into the zone has been a top priority for me and where I’ve realized the biggest improvements in my playing. One of the coolest things I’ve found is that by shifting my attention to my left hand and literally letting my right hand play anything it wants, my right hand ideas come from a flow state and are so much more coherent, fluent, and logical. I actually didn’t find this myself. It came from a Kieth Jarrett interview I read where he said whenever he thinks about what his left hand is doing he messes up. And, from a conversation I had with Glenn Zaleski where he told me to try this as a way to gain hand independence. I think any intermediate or above player will likely benefit from trying this. It’s just another way of getting into the zone; although in this case the right hand is in the zone, the left hand gets some conscious attention, and there are no mental resources available for any of the BS we need to get rid of.

[Joe Muscara]

Kenny recently did an interview on a podcast with Berklee teacher and songwriter Scarlet Keys. It's two parts, lots of great insights.

 

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/kenny-werner-on-effortless-mastery-and-being/id1593031703?i=1000595808203

[Montunoman 2]

On 2/9/2023 at 6:37 AM, Al Quinn said:

One of the coolest things I’ve found is that by shifting my attention to my left hand and literally letting my right hand play anything it wants, my right hand ideas come from a flow state and are so much more coherent, fluent, and logical. I actually didn’t find this myself. It came from a Kieth Jarrett interview I read where he said whenever he thinks about what his left hand is doing he messes up. And, from a conversation I had with Glenn Zaleski where he told me to try this as a way to gain hand independence. I think any intermediate or above player will likely benefit from trying this. It’s just another way of getting into the zone; although in this case the right hand is in the zone, the left hand gets some conscious attention, and there are no mental resources available for any of the BS we need to get rid of.

Al Quinn made so many great points, but the LH is so important for us keyboardist. That’s why I always return to boogie. Even though I never have the intention on performing this style, it is a beautiful way too experience a LH that can go on auto pilot, while the RH is free to improvise. It my hope to get to that level with more complex styles too, but I feel like boogie based blues is my gateway.