Yamaha DXR8 vs DXR8 Mk2.....anyone compared them?

[Reezekeys]

Of course the TS speakers are better - that's by design! The TXs are for cheap guys like me who 1) appreciate the low cost & light weight, and 2) can live with the decrease in power and sound quality vs the TS line. I know the TS has just been refreshed to 4xx models. I'm not sure I would call the TX series "ancient" though - they're still in Altos' low-end product lineup. Perhaps with their bare-bones feature set, there's no rush to upgrade them with more features that might make them more expensive or heavier. Why do that, when it was their low cost and light weight that influenced me to try them? I was willing to risk the $280 investment to see just how much I'd be giving up vs my K8s. They will certainly not replace the Ks the way the Ks replaced my Mackie 450s. I still will work on tweaking my patches to get as good a sound I can from these cheap speakers. I just wanted to share that they got loud enough for a very loud straight-ahead jazz gig without limiting or distorting. Baby steps!

[AnotherScott]

From the description, the little Altos sound like the Behringer B208D. If you don't need a lot of low end, they crank surprisingly loud without sounding stressed, though piano tone is not great. Weight and price are probably competitive with those Altos. (And even though they all have 8" woofers, don't expect the same bass out of the B208D that you get out of a ZXa1, QSC K8.2, or even Alto TS308. (I have no idea how the TX compares there.)

[ElmerJFudd]

Based on Al’s comparison on a pair of tt08a vs 610S - I’m curious if any forum folks have had a chance to use the 408S in solo piano, jazz combo situation and can share how it sounds vs 610S and the usual suspects - in 8 or 10”.  
 

 

[Reezekeys]

3 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

And even though they all have 8" woofers, don't expect the same bass out of the B208D that you get out of a ZXa1, QSC K8.2, or even Alto TS308.

 

Oh for sure, forget solid low end with these TXs (at any level approaching loud). I'm pretty sure I won't be using them for gigs where I need to play LH bass! But they really did hold up nicely for AP and EP sounds on a fairly loud gig (well, loud to this old guy!).

[Al Coda]

8 hours ago, Reezekeys said:

Of course the TS speakers are better - that's by design!

 

Yes, I´m aware of that.

Bi-amped and more headroom by more amplifier power is an advantage.

Nothing against the TX series,- these are in the market for a long time.

The TS3 series speakers were almost as cheap like the TX were,- I remember about 250 bucks and less per item @Thomann.

Rising costs caused by Covid and now runaway inflation changed that until they became unavailable.

The TS4 series isn´t what I wanted because I won´t benefit from bluetooth audio and I hate buying features I don´t need.

I was just only surprised TS3 is sold out completely and TX being available still.

 

 

A.C.

[Al Coda]

1 hour ago, Reezekeys said:

Oh for sure, forget solid low end with these TXs (at any level approaching loud).

 

The advantage of these compact and lightweight 2 way speakers is,- you can easily combine w/ an active 12" (or 15") sub on demand, and THEN, the 175 WRMS for the tops is adequate.

 

I myself, I prefered the TS310 because of the almost identical frequency range and SPL compared to the TS312.

There was a minor difference only.

 

And, according to advertised amplifier power,-

 

when I read these advertised "show up" 1000 and 2000 Watts of Class D power, I don´t believe anyway.

The measuring methods for speaker and amplifier power ratings are just too different and obscure.

And who needs 2000 WRMS into a single 10" or 12" speaker handling about 300WRMS at max.?

I understand more and up to twice the amp power a speaker can handle makes sense.

 

 

A.C.

 

 

[Reezekeys]

The TS4xx series are replacing the 3 series, no? That's what I assume. This might explain why the 3s are sold out - Alto stopped making & shipping them when the 4xx series were ready. (My speculation). The power amp specs are the same, correct? The 4s just add bluetooth?

 

I see the TX408 at Sweetwater for $289. The K8.2 is $850. Same "2000" watts. Quite a big price difference!

[Al Coda]

22 minutes ago, Reezekeys said:

The TS4xx series are replacing the 3 series, no? That's what I assume.

 

Yes, I guess that´s correct,- unfortunately.

 

23 minutes ago, Reezekeys said:

This might explain why the 3s are sold out - Alto stopped making & shipping them when the 4xx series were ready. (My speculation).

 

Yes and no,- just because it doesn´t explain why the TX series isn´t sold out.

I understood, the TS3 series also replaced the TX series because the TS series became to be "bi-amped".

 

25 minutes ago, Reezekeys said:

The power amp specs are the same, correct? The 4s just add bluetooth?

 

A.t.m., I´m too lazy to investigate to be 100% correct, but I guess you´re right.

Like you, I think it´s all about the bluetooth.

In fact, i´d not be willing to pay for.

I also don´t want to control my gear via a cellphone/ app.

Old fart, you know ... I don´t even use a smartphone ...

 

OTOH, I don´t care because I always find ways compensating for a loss.

And I think you´re fine w/ the TXes for your needs.

Otherwise you wouldn´t use.

 

I´m envy you can play w/ Adam and Gene.

I´ve seen Dave Liebman´s "Lookout Farm" as well as Kenny Kirkland, Dean Brown, Don Alias and Gene P.  live and I love "Elvin is on the Mountain" w/ Jan Hammer and Gene Perla.

It´s all just only my favourized style of music even I did all the commercial crime just only to survive,- and that worked since about 1978.

 

anyway ...

 

 

A.C.

[dickiefunk]

I’m currently using the the older Alto TS210’s for keys and FOH PA on small acoustic gigs running piano, vocals and even a little upright bass. These work pretty well considering they only cost £180 each. However, I’m looking to upgrade these a little and am considering the following 

 

Alto TS410

RCF HD10a mkV

RCF Art910AX (built in digital mixer version)

FBT Promaxx 110a

QSC K10.2

 

 

 

[Reezekeys]

On 10/2/2022 at 11:28 PM, Al Coda said:

On 10/2/2022 at 10:35 PM, Reezekeys said:

The power amp specs are the same, correct? The 4s just add bluetooth?

 

A.t.m., I´m too lazy to investigate to be 100% correct, but I guess you´re right.

Like you, I think it´s all about the bluetooth.

 

I'm lazy too, but probably have more time on my hands than you! 🙂 So, the 4xx also adds DSP with a few selectable eq curves plus one you can program yourself from the phone. Sounds like a useful feature - something to stay competitive with other speakers that now have this feature.

[Al Coda]

On 10/4/2022 at 5:43 AM, Reezekeys said:

the 4xx also adds DSP with a few selectable eq curves plus one you can program yourself from the phone

 

 a shame I don´t use such phone ...

 

A.C.

[ElmerJFudd]

On 10/3/2022 at 11:43 PM, Reezekeys said:

 

I'm lazy too, but probably have more time on my hands than you! 🙂 So, the 4xx also adds DSP with a few selectable eq curves plus one you can program yourself from the phone. Sounds like a useful feature - something to stay competitive with other speakers that now have this feature.

I feel like for walk in setup play, needing the app to control the DSP for EQ is a pain.  I’m more inclined to EQ at the keyboard or mixer.  But we’re not the primary target for PA speakers.  
 

If the sound of the speaker is get same as the 3 series b Bluetooth and DSP doesn’t trump a good price on the 3s. 

[Bill H.]

3 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

I feel like for walk in setup play, needing the app to control the DSP for EQ is a pain.  I’m more inclined to EQ at the keyboard or mixer.  But we’re not the primary target for PA speakers.  
 

If the sound of the speaker is get same as the 3 series b Bluetooth and DSP doesn’t trump a good price on the 3s. 

Or to be more specific, an insane price on the 3s  I can pick up a pair of Alto TS312s (the model I'm most interested in) for a little over $500 at my closest GC, and after checking they're still in stock. Like (I'm assuming) many of you, they would be a great lightweight option for small room casuals where sound quality isn't critical. By practically all accounts, they have a decent enough sound for that. 

 

Once we get into the price of the 4s (almost twice that), or something like a Yamaha DXR (almost four times that), then I'm more likely to say forget it and just go with my usual cabs (in my case JBL SRX). 

 

At least for now. I don't want to derail the DXR discussion too much, because I'm also interested in them long term. Dave - I especially appreciate your hands on impressions.  

[ElmerJFudd]

49 minutes ago, Dave Ferris said:

Again this is in my house, so I should really wait until I do a gig or two with these but after extended play, I'm not at all digging the harsh, noticeably grating sound in the high register on the Yamaha P-515. It's less pronounced on the Nord Piano 5 but it's still there. I wonder how they would fare with the CP88. I don't recall that harsh sound with the K8.2s when I had them and my CP4 and first CP88.

 

Also at a quiet volume, the amp fans are really loud and highly annoying.

 

I also miss the detail of the RCFs. Basically I miss my TT-08As.

I can appreciate that, once you have something you’re happy with, it’s always difficult to replicate. 

[dazzjazz]

1 hour ago, Dave Ferris said:

Again this is in my house, so I should really wait until I do a gig or two with these but after extended play, I'm not at all digging the harsh, noticeably grating sound in the high register on the Yamaha P-515. It's less pronounced on the Nord Piano 5 but it's still there. I wonder how they would fare with the CP88. I don't recall that harsh sound with the K8.2s when I had them and my CP4 and first CP88.

 

Also at a quiet volume, the amp fans are really loud and highly annoying. I think I'll break these down and stick them in the closet and only use for the gig. I prefer listening with phones to them at home.

 

 Basically I miss my TT-08As.

 

[dazzjazz]

That’s a shame, Dave. I’ve never heard the TT’s, but if they’re that Rolls Royce then it would be hard to go backwards. For me it would be like playing a Nord C1 after owning the MAG.

[Reezekeys]

7 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

On 10/3/2022 at 11:43 PM, Reezekeys said:

 

I'm lazy too, but probably have more time on my hands than you! 🙂 So, the 4xx also adds DSP with a few selectable eq curves plus one you can program yourself from the phone. Sounds like a useful feature - something to stay competitive with other speakers that now have this feature.

I feel like for walk in setup play, needing the app to control the DSP for EQ is a pain.  I’m more inclined to EQ at the keyboard or mixer.  But we’re not the primary target for PA speakers.

 

To be fair - and I'm not sure why I feel like I have to "defend" Alto - switchable EQ settings are pretty ubiquitous on PPAs these days. And the ones on the competition aren't necessarily controllable externally. I think the K.2's let you set your own EQ curve to go along with their presets and store them in one of a total of five presets - and you need to get in back of the speaker to recall them from the panel. I'm not positive, but I believe the Alto phone/tablet app lets you store more than five presets and once paired with the speaker, it stays "remembered", and you can select presets or adjust the eq from the phone - this from a quick glance at the Alto 4xx manual. I count that as a plus, if it's a needed feature. IMO the ability to adjust a speaker's eq is a bit overblown for keyboardists playing a restaurant or country club gig. If I encounter a room and/or speaker placement that messes with the basic sound coming from my QSCs, I adjust the curve manually on a "final" EQ I have at the laptop's output before we start playing.

[ElmerJFudd]

9 minutes ago, Reezekeys said:

 

To be fair - and I'm not sure why I feel like I have to "defend" Alto - switchable EQ settings are pretty ubiquitous on PPAs these days. And the ones on the competition aren't necessarily controllable externally. I think the K.2's let you set your own EQ curve to go along with their presets and store them in one of a total of five presets - and you need to get in back of the speaker to recall them from the panel. I'm not positive, but I believe the Alto phone/tablet app lets you store more than five presets and once paired with the speaker, it stays "remembered", and you can select presets or adjust the eq from the phone - this from a quick glance at the Alto 4xx manual. I count that as a plus, if it's a feature that one thinks they need. I just think the ability to adjust a speaker's eq is a bit overblown for us keyboardists playing a restaurant or country club gig. If I encounter a room and/or speaker placement that messes with the basic sound coming from my QSCs, I turn around and adjust the curve manually on the laptop before we start the gig.

Don’t get me wrong.  It’s a necessary upgrade for Alto with features that matter in their market.  I’m just saying that for my purposes I’d be more inclined to pick up a 3 series at a great price than shell out for a 4 with features I may or may not find useful.  

[Reezekeys]

Good luck finding a 3xx. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of time hunting, but out of curiosity I spent a few minutes and they seem to be sold out or unavailable at the major places - Zzounds, Musician's Friend and GC. I am finding the TS308 at Amazon, for $357 - $68 more than the TS408 ($289)! When I look there for the TS310s, I see three "just launched" stores selling them for between $329 and $511. "Just launched" = no sale, as far as I'm concerned.

[ElmerJFudd]

38 minutes ago, Reezekeys said:

Good luck finding a 3xx. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of time hunting, but out of curiosity I spent a few minutes and they seem to be sold out or unavailable at the major places - Zzounds, Musician's Friend and GC. I am finding the TS308 at Amazon, for $357 - $68 more than the TS408 ($289)! When I look there for the TS310s, I see three "just launched" stores selling them for between $329 and $511. "Just launched" = no sale, as far as I'm concerned.

The new normal.   The thread started because someone was willing to pay $1499.99 a piece for RCF TT08-A-II, but they can’t be had anywhere.  B&H has stock of Alto TS308, theoretically, but can only take pre-orders for the 408.  Regardless, they both sell at $289.  It wasn’t that long ago that one could find a deal on items being discontinued for an upgrade, was it?  I can’t remember, honestly.  Things just ain’t what they used to be.  
 

 

[Reezekeys]

Thanks for the further "derail"! JOHNNY HODGES, yea!

 

Here's to us all finding the speakers that make us happy! Right now, with my ancient original K8s and my new featherweight TX308s, I'm a happy guy. I better not ever get to hear my rig through an RCF though! 🙂 

[Mighty Motif Max]

7 hours ago, Dave Ferris said:

Again this is in my house, so I should really wait until I do a gig or two with these but after extended play, I'm not at all digging the harsh, noticeably grating sound in the high register on the Yamaha P-515. It's less pronounced on the Nord Piano 5 but it's still there. I wonder how they would fare with the CP88. I don't recall that harsh sound with the K8.2s when I had them and my CP4 and first CP88.

 

...

So this is interesting to me - one of the things I really disliked about the P-515 is that, even through its own speakers, I always felt that the tonal balance was off with the CFX sample in particular, particularly in the upper register. The finger-to-ear connection was also weird IMO, but what you're describing hearing in the P-515 through the Yamaha speakers is what I noticed with the P-515 in general.

 

My current speaker setup includes an older Yamaha MSR-100 (think DXR-8 MKI) and an EV ELX200-10P. It's a bit mismatched but it's worked well, so long as I send the right side to the MSR100 and the left to the ELX. I've used a variety of keyboards through that setup (and through the MSR-100 alone as well), but never noticed any upper-range harshness that was any worse than the QSC K10's (MKI) or Mackie Thump 12's that I've played through at some venues.