Let's Hear It! Your Favorite Synth Patches

[bill5]

Thought y'all would like this given the topic: https://www.synthmania.com/Famous Sounds.htm

 

I'm strictly a soft synth guy, so the topic is probably N/A for me otherwise 

[marino]

I've always been curious about how *exactly* George Saunders (Solar Quest) achieved this well-known bass line. Well, it's mostly one note, but it's the articulation that counts here. I doesn't seem much at first listen, but I have attempted to reproduce it on various synths and was able to approach it quite closely, but some magic was always missing.
I'm told it's a 303, but there is obviously some distortion stage, which is perfectly calibrated in type and amount. Timbre modulation seems to be a bit more complex than simple cutoff and resonance tweaking. Probably, compression is involved as well. Then the delay effect does its thing...

 

 

[CyberGene]

2 hours ago, JazzPiano88 said:

Chick was all stock minimoog and totally stock FM.

I recently watched a video of a guy who demonstrated the most famous patch people associate with Vangelis, the CS80 brass. And it turns out it’s a stock preset on the CS80. Vangelis only added reverb (and possibly other effects). We all know that he’s a good synthesist and not a preset guy but in any case, sometimes it’s about popularizing a stock patch rather than inventing it yourself. I get what you mean when you say Joe Zawinul is more into synths and their programming/manipulation than Chick and Herbie. Blame it on my preference of the latter two, but because I like their playing and improvisation approach better, intuitively their synth work sounds better to me, even if it’s stock patches only. 

[jazzpiano88]

9 minutes ago, marino said:

I've always been curious about how *exactly* George Saunders (Solar Quest) achieved this well-known bass line. Well, it's mostly one note, but it's the articulation that counts here. I doesn't seem much at first listen, but I have attempted to reproduce it on various synths and was able to approach it quite closely, but some magic was always missing.
I'm told it's a 303, but there is obviously some distortion stage, which is perfectly calibrated in type and amount. Timbre modulation seems to be a bit more complex than simple cutoff and resonance tweaking. Probably, compression is involved as well. Then the delay effect does its thing...

 

 

I was chasing a rabbit and found a nice video on bass synthesis where they do some really nice real time creation of bass sounds based upon preconceived goals. 
 

This might give you some ideas … just throwing it out there in case it could be helpful as a starting point to end up with that cool sound of George’s

 

 

[marino]

1 hour ago, JazzPiano88 said:

I was chasing a rabbit and found a nice video on bass synthesis where they do some really nice real time creation of bass sounds based upon preconceived goals. 
 

This might give you some ideas … just throwing it out there in case it could be helpful as a starting point to end up with that cool sound of George’s

 

Thanks, I have seen that video and I have already built several synth bass sounds in that fashion... however, that Solar Quest sound is based on different premises: Big aggression factor mixed with a sort of cleanliness, extreme timbral flexibility, and the right type of distortion. I suspect that along with classic timbral modulations like cutoff and resonance, the distortion amount is controlled in real time. I have achieved good results with fm...

Also, it retains a certain clarity even at high distortion level; this tells me that in case an analog synth was really used, it was a single oscillator affair (like on the 303 indeed).

[Tusker]

8 hours ago, marino said:

Also, it retains a certain clarity even at high distortion level; this tells me that in case an analog synth was really used, it was a single oscillator affair (like on the 303 indeed).

 

👍 👍

 

Thank you for bringing this beautiful piece of sound design to light. It's a vivid example of how the little things, done just right, can lead to something truly exceptional. It reminds me a bit of David Williams' guitar on Don't Stop Till You Get Enough and similar tracks. Just one simple note, but oh, what a note!

 

It’s really about exploring the various shades of that one note, right?

 

I'm no TB303 aficionado, but I've dipped my toes into their world, curious about what makes the TB303 tick for them. Some rave about the "accent" circuit, while others chatter about how the slow capacitor discharge in the decay phase lets quicker repeated notes open the filter wider, creating a sort of musical "rise" across a phrase. We've played around with this feature on a Minimoog, but here it's showcased on a TB303. The best soft synths model this aspect of the decay. Several do not. The snarl on the higher and later notes might be some additional clever knob tweaking, who knows?

 

Anyway, it all comes together so well - that perfect distortion (perhaps MXR?) perfectly dialed in on a perfect little synth creating a sound that’s just spot on. The ostinato above the TB303 and the drums around the TB303 are also beautifully designed to complement, but to stay the <bleep> out of the way. 

[marino]

3 hours ago, Tusker said:

Thank you for bringing this beautiful piece of sound design to light. It's a vivid example of how the little things, done just right, can lead to something truly exceptional.

 

Well, it's a well-know anthem of the Acid Trance genre. (teaching sound design in school brings you to know a lot of stuff from the younger generations...  )

 

3 hours ago, Tusker said:

I'm no TB303 aficionado, but I've dipped my toes into their world, curious about what makes the TB303 tick for them. Some rave about the "accent" circuit, while others chatter about how the slow capacitor discharge in the decay phase lets quicker repeated notes open the filter wider, creating a sort of musical "rise" across a phrase. We've played around with this feature on a Minimoog, but here it's showcased on a TB303.

 

Very interesting about the decay phase. Btw my 303 is long gone, but the main feature seems to be its 3-pole filter, which can stand high levels of resonance without killing the body of the bass range like the Minimoog.

I think that the 303's internal sequencer was not used in this case. It just can't articulate long phrases like that. So no "accent", and no gliding from particular sequence steps. They probably used an external sequencer. The timbral modulations sound automated to me: You can tell from the *exact* repetition of whole sections. There were a few hardware modifications available, allowing cv control of most parameters.
Unless of course they simply copied/pasted the audio! 🙃

 

All this, *assuming* that it really was a 303! I wasn't able to find a conclusive word to confirm it...

[Tusker]

29 minutes ago, marino said:

Well, it's a well-know anthem of the Acid Trance genre. (teaching sound design in school brings you to know a lot of stuff from the younger generations...  )

 

👍 👍 It's the first time you've mentioned a 303 in here. I didn't even know you had one or followed Acid Trance. The students have got to be fun.

 

One of these days you should consider posting a subset of your materials Carlo. I am sure they are excellent and there is a real hunger for systematic sound design instruction. I direct people to the Gordon Reid articles or the McGill University Modular repository but those are getting old. 

 

30 minutes ago, marino said:

There were a few hardware modifications available, allowing cv control of most parameters.

 

The devilfish mod has filter cv and there are complete eurorack 303s like Acidlab with more control. Some of the guys at muffwiggler have modules like these. Some of them might know George Saunders. There is a wide consensus that the filter slope is 24db/oct and not 18db/oct as initially assumed. Apparently the early attempts to duplicate it as three pole were erroneous. I am not an EE. Please correct me if I am wrong on this story. I am not a 303 guy but it is an interesting synth. Your larger question about the source of variation on this track remains a puzzle don't you think?

 

35 minutes ago, marino said:

Unless of course they simply copied/pasted the audio! 🙃

 

🏆

 

Ha Ha. Perhaps not!! 😀

[AROIOS]

19 hours ago, marino said:

I've always been curious about how *exactly* George Saunders (Solar Quest) achieved this well-known bass line...

 

The higher notes remind me of what BT did for the Fast and Furious OST
 

 

[AROIOS]

Here's one of my favorite bell sounds: "Fanta Bell" of Roland U-20.

 

It's obviously derived from D-50's famous "Fantasia" patch, and was often heard in early 90's Pop and Pop_Jazz productions.

 

This patch has more body than most others in the bell category, and cuts through the mix very well, just like DX7's iconic "Tub Bells" patch. It's a shame Roland did not include it in their subsequent romplers.

 

 

 

 

[CyberGene]

I remember that I liked that bell patch as a kid, hearing it in numerous local TV-programs used for various children song arrangements but it’s been so enormously overused I can hardly make myself not throw up when hearing it again and again…

[AROIOS]

On 11/19/2023 at 9:16 PM, CyberGene said:

I remember that I liked that bell patch as a kid, hearing it in numerous local TV-programs used for various children song arrangements but it’s been so enormously overused I can hardly make myself not throw up when hearing it again and again…

It's interesting how we don't get tired of the sound of piano in a similar way.
 

I've seen plenty of remakes and live versions of classic 80's/90's Pop and Pop_Jazz tunes where the arrangement deviates from the signature sounds that defined those songs, and the result just sound lacking.

Here's one example where the change of the drum sound just ruined the song for me:
 

 

[CyberGene]

16 minutes ago, AROIOS said:

Here's one example where the change of the drum sound just ruined the song for me

 

Indeed. I’m not a huge fan of the typical in-your-face 80s drum madness but it’s how it is and what makes that sound. The remaster moves the drums way too subdued in the mix and the song loses its 80s power pop appeal (even if a bit kitschy). And don’t get me wrong, I occasionally have guilty pleasures with those songs, there was warn and earthy feel to them that is completely lost in the modern overly perfected production. That being said, I think we shouldn’t try to make the same sound and music nowadays, it’s kind of a cultural appropriation in a way, although I oppose that term. 

[AROIOS]

21 minutes ago, CyberGene said:

...That being said, I think we shouldn’t try to make the same sound and music nowadays, it’s kind of a cultural appropriation in a way, although I oppose that term. 

Keep opposing it and don't give in to ideological fads. Self-censorship is the last thing we need in music.

[David Emm]

On 11/19/2023 at 8:15 PM, AROIOS said:

Here's one of my favorite bell sounds: "Fanta Bell" of Roland U-20.

It's obviously derived from D-50's famous "Fantasia" patch, and was often heard in early 90's Pop and Pop_Jazz productions.

This patch has more body than most others in the bell category, and cuts through the mix very well, just like DX7's iconic "Tub Bells" patch. It's a shame Roland did not include it in their subsequent romplers.

 

Really? There's been a version of it in every one I've touched. Its so iconic, they can't leave it out. The problem is the same one with the Phil Collins gated snare, ubiquitous DX7 EP, that Vangelis CS-80 preset and the sampled James Brown shout: overexposure. Its a beautiful sound and darned near inevitable once the means to build it appeared, but its also forever frozen in an 80s eye roll. You can play it for your grandmother, though; she was too busy to watch "Star Trek: The Next Generation" or the 100 commercials that dropped it in.

 

I like to play it a little once in a while, but if I used it in a song now, I'd deserve to be rolled in flour and fried. Its Synth Law. 

[JoJoB3]

#1: All the sounds in the Optigan library on  microfiche

 

 

[ProfD]

On 11/22/2023 at 4:03 PM, AROIOS said:

It's interesting how we don't get tired of the sound of piano in a similar way.

IMO, piano has been used on everything but it's sound has not been associated with any particular overplayed song(s) that have made both the sound and song obnoxious to some listeners.😁😎

[AROIOS]

On 11/22/2023 at 4:45 PM, David Emm said:

 

...The problem is the same one with the Phil Collins gated snare, ubiquitous DX7 EP, that Vangelis CS-80 preset and the sampled James Brown shout: overexposure... its also forever frozen in an 80s eye roll...

 

34 minutes ago, ProfD said:

IMO, piano has been used on everything but it's sound has not been associated with any particular overplayed song(s) that have made both the sound and song obnoxious to some listeners.😁😎

I can guarantee you that there are far more boring songs featuring a piano or an acoustic guitar. And do I need to remind everyone the irony of folks dumping their analog gear for pennies in the 80's, and coveting them again 20 years later? How about a round of "19th century eye roll" for orchestral music?
 

I don't look at sounds as fashion statements. It's healthier to treat them as storytelling and stylistic tools. Simply because oil painting was "overused", doesn't mean we have to all switch to markers.
 

Hans Zimmer certainly weren't feeling self-conscious when he uses that 80's Vangelis CS-80 swell in "BladeRunner 2049" (2049! for God's sake 😆).  And a Power Ballad can usually benefit from a gated verb snare, and piano layered with FM or SA EP.
 

Guys, we've all been out of high school for decades now. The only person who's likely gonna cringe over us not sounding cool enough, is ourselves. 😆

[ProfD]

49 minutes ago, AROIOS said:

I don't look at sounds as fashion statements. It's healthier to treat them as storytelling and stylistic tools.

Same here. It's all about how a sound is used in the context of making music.

 

The only limitation is the creativity or lack thereof from the individual(s) using the sounds/instruments.

 

Boards of Canada have presets named after them.

 

Clearly, there are folks who know how to extract something out of these KB boxes old and new.😎

[AROIOS]

22 minutes ago, ProfD said:

...Clearly, there are folks who know how to extract something out of these KB boxes old and new...😎

It's both satisfying and empowering to extract new sounds out of old gear, especially considering how much companies like Roland have been programming patches for their "new" rompler boards, largely using samples and synth engine from the early 90's.

[ProfD]

10 hours ago, AROIOS said:

It's both satisfying and empowering to extract new sounds out of old gear, especially considering how much companies like Roland have been programming patches for their "new" rompler boards, largely using samples and synth engine from the early 90's.

No shortage of posts from me mentioning how every manufacturer continues recycling the same ole sounds in their latest KBs. 😁

 

IMO, what's missing in today's music is the imagination and creativity that made synth sounds iconic back in the day. 

 

Manufacturers are rehashing sounds and too many folks are content with using those sounds the same old way.

 

That's why it warms my KB-loving heart to hear cats like J3PO, Nick Semrad and Anomalie do their thing with synths.😎

[CyberGene]

1 hour ago, ProfD said:

No shortage of posts from me mentioning how every manufacturer continues recycling the same ole sounds in their latest KBs. 😁

 

IMO, what's missing in today's music is the imagination and creativity that made synth sounds iconic back in the day. 

 

Manufacturers are rehashing sounds and too many folks are content with using those sounds the same old way.

 

That's why it warms my KB-loving heart to hear cats like J3PO, Nick Semrad and Anomalie do their thing with synths.

 

Basically I agree with you, which you should know by the thumbs up I usually give you. I mean, I know where you are coming from. But for a moment I will be the devil's advocate. People nowadays are not so appreciative of those keyboardist that can play improvised type of music such as jazz, funk, gospel, R&B and the likes. And I can't blame them. Yes, these musicians are all great musicians possessing excellent improvisation skills and excellent production skills (including synth programming, arrangement, etc). But we've already heard it all so many times for way so long. Ironically, the very essence of that type of music is also its own biggest enemy. Because that type of music is a lot about mastery and mastery can be trained. Many young kids are ardent followers, they have the gift, they train their skills and they become one. One of many... And then there's decline.

 

Synth sounds in the past were iconic because it was the first time audiences heard those sounds and there were the pioneers of those styles and there was a vast empty field of exploration. Unfortunately it got exhausted long ago. There's been some revival and that's where people like J3PO, Nick Semrad, Mike Pensini, etc. come but I don't think they can have any serious impact.

[Ivan May]

I've always liked the electric piano patch on those old Yamaha and Roland keyboards. Listen to the electric piano patch on the Yamaha GS1 and you'll know what I mean.

 

 

[ProfD]

4 hours ago, CyberGene said:

Basically I agree with you, which you should know by the thumbs up I usually give you. I mean, I know where you are coming from.

 First, appreciate that we're in agreement more often than not.😁

 

4 hours ago, CyberGene said:

People nowadays are not so appreciative of those keyboardist that can play improvised type of music such as jazz, funk, gospel, R&B and the likes. And I can't blame them.

 

This very KB forum is indicative of a lack of interest in modern KB players in that genre/style of music.  Classic Rock in one form or another is more popular.

 

 

4 hours ago, CyberGene said:

Synth sounds in the past were iconic because it was the first time audiences heard those sounds and there were the pioneers of those styles and there was a vast empty field of exploration. Unfortunately it got exhausted long ago.

 

Right.  That ship seems to have sailed.  But, it's not keeping synth enthusiasts from rehashing those same sounds.

 

IMO, appreciation for modern KB player-led music regardless of genre/style has been in decline for almost 3 decades and counting.

 

The KB heroes of many forumites here are either dead or very close to the finish line.

 

In modern music and cover bands, most KB players and their instruments and sounds has been relegated to supporting roles. 

 

No shortage of threads here with KB players not having enough stage space for their KB rigs and/or song selections being made without KB parts.  Also, the music being played on those gigs does not lend itself to synth programming or sound design.  A preset will do.

 

4 hours ago, CyberGene said:

There's been some revival and that's where people like J3PO, Nick Semrad, Mike Pensini, etc. come but I don't think they can have any serious impact.

 

Right.  The musical landscape is nothing like it was in the 1980s when synths were still relatively new.

 

I won't let the cat out of the bag but I'll open it up in terms of the future I see:

 

KB players capable of consolidating their musical influences and utilizing their musicianship, imagination and creativity along with KB technology will produce *new* musical gumbo.  It will be based on live performance.  AI won't be able to reproduce it.😎

[AROIOS]

15 hours ago, ProfD said:

...

IMO, what's missing in today's music is the imagination and creativity that made synth sounds iconic back in the day.

...

Yup, Roland for one was never the same after Eric Persing's departure.

[AROIOS]

13 hours ago, Ivan May said:

I've always liked the electric piano patch on those old Yamaha and Roland keyboards. Listen to the electric piano patch on the Yamaha GS1 and you'll know what I mean.

GS1 being an FM machine, this EP patch sounds surprisingly closer to Roland's warm SA sounds than the glassy sound typical of FM.

[jazzpiano88]

12 hours ago, AROIOS said:

On 11/24/2023 at 11:52 AM, Ivan May said:

I've always liked the electric piano patch on those old Yamaha and Roland keyboards. Listen to the electric piano patch on the Yamaha GS1 and you'll know what I mean.

GS1 being an FM machine, this EP patch sounds surprisingly closer to Roland's warm SA sounds than the glassy sound typical of FM.

 

Always loved this patch ever since I heard it on Yellowjacket's Revelation.  

I've programmed it on the Montage with aftertouch to create an opening filter effect.

[AROIOS]

7 minutes ago, jazzpiano88 said:

 

Always loved this patch ever since I heard it on Yellowjacket's Revelation.  

I've programmed it on the Montage with aftertouch to create an opening filter effect.

The version I first heard and played on the stereo most was the one featuring Take 6. Come to think of it, that tune might have been my gateway drug to Gospel. 😃

[Justin Havu]

The DX7 solo patch at 2:23.  Simple, but expertly played.

 

 

[AROIOS]

6 hours ago, Justin Havu said:

The DX7 solo patch at 2:23.  Simple, but expertly played.

 

That patch is most likely from the TX rack, attached below is a demonstration using its "J GTR" patch.