OT: Web Site Opinions

[J. Dan]

Well, we're well overdue for a web site redesign. I was mostly waiting for updated pictures (that actually have the current band members in them), but now that those are done, it's time to get moving. Our web site is 6 years old. I didn't even do the original one - the original band leader moved on. I've made changes but kept the look the same. I went to dynamic (database driven) content so I didn't have to keep writing html pages every time our schedule changed, and made it easier to automatically pull up club info, etc., but for the most part, it looks like it has since 2004.

 

OK, so here's my challenge. I have lots of good ideas for content, but I'm stuck at square one with how I want to do the navigation (menus) and overall look and feel.

 

1) I want to keep it familiar enough that when people hit it, they don't think they hit the wrong site, and feel comfortable with it if they've been visiting for a long time. Bare minimum: same logo, similar color scheme, etc.

 

2) I don't like the Kluge (if that's a word) of menus in the middle of the home page - you have to read through them to figure out where to click. I want the home page menu to be quickly obvious where to click for what you want.

 

3) Top or Side Nav? I always struggle with this on any site I've ever done. Which do you guys prefer? I suppose it depends on the layout, so...

 

4) Do you like having something on each page that tells you where you are? I was thinking our logo on top of the home page, then on all other pages, something saying what it is, but put the logo maybe down the side. Sort of how it is now, but take up the whole screen and maybe keep menu at top?

 

5) Theme: This is where I'm struggling the most. I want the whole site to look 80's and look very professional. In some ways, these can be mutually exclusive. A few things I thought were to keep with the pacman theme like our logo, but I don't want it to look like an arcade game site. I also thought about Back to the Future: Put an animated flux capacitor in the corner, and when you mouse over menu items, lightning bolts flash out to button. I'd probably have to do flash for this, which brings me to the next question....

 

6) How do you feel about flash sites. My opinion has always been that they look good, but I hate waiting for them to load, and if anybody manages to hit it with a weird browser or something, or has an old version, you have those issues to deal with. I DO already have a mobile version of our site (hit it with your mobile device and you should get it automatically). But just curious of your opinions.

 

I find if you try to mix and match too many different things on your theme, it looks busy and unprofessional. So I really want to try to get a simple, common theme going. I also hate web sites that look awesome, but you can't figure out how to navigate to the info you want. I'm a real stickler for making it easy to get to exactly what you want with as few clicks as possible, in a logical way. Another challenge: our logo looks best on lighter backgrounds, yet most other content/menus/etc look best on black backgrounds... hmmm. I hate the "framed" look, and transistions often require a lot of larger images. Thoughts?

 

Point me to any web sites you think are particularly well designed/layed out... keeping in mind what I'm working with.

 

Thanks!

[Bridog6996]

Flash looks good, but they can distract from the most important thing: info. It can be a pain in the ass on the end user, and that's the last person you want to annoy. Not that Flash necessarily needs to be avoided entirely, but often times people go overboard. Surfers don't want to wait to find the info they want. Load times, downloading plugins, glitchy/slow performance on those with older machines: all of these factors are killers. For reasons such as those, most good web designers will generally advise against Flash. Simple and clean is best, especially since lots of people these days use their cell phones to surf the net.

 

And please, NO SOUND! Nothing bothers me more than sites with music and/or sound effects. Having a streaming music player is fine as long as it doesn't automatically start when you load the page.

 

I think your site looks pretty good the way it is now. Everything is pretty concentrated into a relatively small boxed-in area, though. It you made use of more of the page that would take care of the congestion you mentioned. If you're looking for a change, don't be afraid to make drastic alterations as far as graphics, layout, etc. You're not going to scare anyone off. In fact, people who have been seeing the site for years will welcome the change of scenery. There's no need to stick to the same idea just because it's already there.

 

If you want to take a lot of the headache out of designing a site, using a template-based editor like Wordpress or Joomla is very helpful. Find a template with a layout you like, then go in and edit it as you see fit.

 

Some artist websites that I think really get the job done:

 

radiohead.com

beneventorussoduo.com (tasteful use of Flash)

tapesntapes.com

brokensocialscene.ca

 

 

[Jim Alfredson]

You should make it look like a Commodore 64 boot screen. Now THAT'S 80s! All your pictures could be ASCII or 8bit bitmaps.

 

This site is actually hosted on a C64! http://www.c64web.com/

 

Old skool, sucka!

[Dave Horne]

I always find it rude when a web site forces a full screen. I also agree - no uninvited sound.

 

For me, simple is almost always better than complex ... except when it comes to harmonies.

[J. Dan]

I'm totally with you guys on the "no uninvited sound" thing - that drives me absolutely nuts.

 

Yeah, I generally had wanted to stay away from flash, but a lot of the sites people have pointed out that they liked were flash, and I've done them before, and I have it, so I COULD do it. I was just thinking of staying away from it for the reasons Bridog6996 listed. And I particularly like the 2 middle links there. I thought the RadioHead site was way too busy with all the text.

 

B3-er, that cracks me up. My old band was also an 80s band and I had the idea of doing an all-green monochrome looking web site. I ultimately decided against it but did some email flyers in that style. One had 1's and 0's for the background. I made it a contest that the first person to decode it and send the result back to me would get a free round of drinks at our gig. One of my geeky friends from Engineering School replied within about 10 min with the Visual Basic code, and input file, and an output file - correct of course. It was our songlist in 8-bit binary representation of the ASCII characters.

 

But anyway - that's kind of what I mean about the balance between being 80's and looking professional to a potential corporate client.

 

Maybe I'll stick to my original idea of basically keeping the site look the same, just expand it for todays larger screen areas and update the images and menus. I thought it was fairly decent as well, but lately I've gotten comments from several people that it looks outdated and not as professional as it should be.

[Eric Jx]

My 2 cents:

 

You're asking whether you should use side or top navigation, as if one is inherently superior. That decision should be based on the layout of the rest of the page. If you decide that the home page is going to be dominated by one picture which happens to be landscape, then it makes sense to put the menus on top. On the other hand, if you are going with a picture with a portrait aspect ratio, then left side menus work well.

 

RE: The fun vs professional struggle.

Have you considered making a second site for your corporate work?

You can tone that one down, giving it a professional feel, and have that address printed on your business cards that you give out to perspective corporate clients. I don't think there is a way to make a site look both 80s retro and professional.

 

If you're redesigning your site, you should stay away from popup windows. Your current site uses popups under the meet the band page. Internet Explorer won't open the popup window unless you disable a warning.

[J. Dan]

You're asking whether you should use side or top navigation, as if one is inherently superior. That decision should be based on the layout of the rest of the page.

 

Yes - I was just curious if there was any consensus as to what people preferred - either from preference of look, or where they inherently go to click.

 

RE: The fun vs professional struggle.

Have you considered making a second site for your corporate work?

I don't want to do separate sites, but I may keep this in mind for the pages that they are most likely to visit, while still keeping in the same general layout and scheme of the overall site

 

If you're redesigning your site, you should stay away from popup windows. Your current site uses popups under the meet the band page. Internet Explorer won't open the popup window unless you disable a warning.

 

Absolutely, definitely. The big one now is the bio page - I already have the content for that page mostly designed. The content will update within the page when you click the person. It will load with the overal band info and update content based on who you click. I don't like popups - the guy who originally did the site had lots of them. I got rid of some of them as I've made changes. The new site will have none.

[MidLifeCrisis]

1) I want to keep it familiar enough that when people hit it, they don't think they hit the wrong site, and feel comfortable with it if they've been visiting for a long time. Bare minimum: same logo, similar color scheme, etc.

 

Color scheme is important. That is part of what brands your site and your logo. No matter how many time MSN changes their home page, the color scheme and logo immediately let you know you are on MSN

 

2) I don't like the Kluge (if that's a word) of menus in the middle of the home page - you have to read through them to figure out where to click. I want the home page menu to be quickly obvious where to click for what you want.

3) Top or Side Nav? I always struggle with this on any site I've ever done. Which do you guys prefer? I suppose it depends on the layout, so...

 

 

These are somewhat related.

 

Industry standards these days is to have a top nav.

Most good sitea also have a side nav. These navs usually have a picture or important text associated with them. These are where you draw people in. You can direct them to the pages you feel are important and help sell the band the most. Most people when they first hit the site will click on whatever you made most appealing for them to click on

 

4) Do you like having something on each page that tells you where you are

 

A breadcrumb above the top nav is the way to go. They can see where they are, how they got there, and can click on to navigate back to any part of the path

 

5) Theme: This is where I'm struggling the most. I want the whole site to look 80's and look very professional. In some ways, these can be mutually exclusive. A few things I thought were to keep with the pacman theme like our logo,

 

Hate to say it, but when I think of the 80s the first thing that pops into my mind is Hair Bands. Might be an interested theme for Hair based fonts and images.

But then again, I am a techie and not really a creative designer,

 

6) How do you feel about flash sites.

 

 

I find very little more annoying than waiting for a flash to load. Maybe a flash movie on one of the sub-pages? Or a very small flash which rotates different images,

 

 

 

 

[lerber3]

For the love of dog, please fix or remove the ¨pick random place to start reading a new thread¨ feature.

 

I think the site is trying to put me at the last post that I have read, but it does not work correctly on any of the 5 computers that I regularly use (with Firefox). I have seen other complaints about this feature and explanations about how to fix the problem (which never worked for me).

 

Thanks... love the forum and the wonderful people who contribute to it!

[Bridog6996]

While I agree with you, Lerber, the OP was talking about his band's website, not the forum.

 

 

[J. Dan]

Hate to say it, but when I think of the 80s the first thing that pops into my mind is Hair Bands. Might be an interested theme for Hair based fonts and images.

But then again, I am a techie and not really a creative designer,

 

Well, there are lots of 80's hair bands out there - in fact there is a fairly popular one here in town. Although we do a little of that, we kind of try to differentiate ourselves as being more dance/(old)new wave - Madonna, B52's, A-Ha, Tiffany, Scandal, etc. So I don't want us to look like a hair band or give the impression that we are one. Just FYI - here's a temporary page I put up with our latest pics and such:

 

http://www.that80sbandstl.com/promo/links.html

 

It's hard NOT to dress somewhat hair-band-ish as those are the only outfits you can really find these days. So given the wigs and such, I probably need to go the other way with the look of the web site to balance things out and get the point across as far as our look. As far as imagery, think Rubiks Cubes, Pacman, Swatch Watches, Leg Warmers, Jackets with lots of zippers, parachute pants, etc.

 

I find very little more annoying than waiting for a flash to load. Maybe a flash movie on one of the sub-pages? Or a very small flash which rotates different images,

 

I agree. I'm thinking of maybe just using it for a small banner at the top of the page so I can put a little movement in the header - maybe fade some different images, etc. I've done that before on other sites and it's pretty small so it doesn't take long to load. Plus if they don't have flash, you can just replace it with a static image.

 

[Jason Stanfield]

If I were designing the site, I'd do the following (just my preferences, of course):

 

1. Fewer pages, but more content per page. If I designed it, the navbar would read something like:

 

• The Band -- member photos & short bios, set list, song request form
  
• Calender -- upcoming shows with links to the venues, past shows at other venues
  
• Media -- embedded (not pop-up or off-page links) MP3s, videos, photo gallery of hand-picked photos of the biggest gigs, wallpapers, etc.
  
• Book Us -- contact information, rates, and policies (24 hour cancellation notice, etc.)
  
• Awesome 80s -- nostalgia page with off-site links, games, etc.

 

Also, don't have a page with no content; a small complete site is better than a larger incomplete site. Use the addition of a new page (like the merch page) as another reason to reach out to your mailing list.

 

2. Go BIGGER. Most people are using larger-res monitors (1280x1024 or higher), and higher-res, too, meaning the pixels are a little smaller, which means the content is a little smaller. Escape the prison of 800x600!

 

3. In terms of design, a lot of your songs give rise to more retro-nouveau-deco vibe rather than arcades. Think more Miami Vice and less Bill & Ted.

 

4. Replace that gray background with something colorful. Remember, the 80s was the era of loud pastels and florescents, so ditch muted colors and go with more dynamic colors. Just don't make it so loud that the content is drowned.

 

5. Put everything in the page, i.e. no pop-ups or off-site links to photo galleries, etc. Pop-up blockers can work against you, and some people find them annoying. Besides, you have a lot of empty real estate on each page; fill it up!

 

6. Link exchange with some of the indie papers you might have in SL; it serves to make you a fixture of the local night life, and improve the band's profile. Also, include links to any social networking sites you might belong to (if you don't, join them) on each page; they make great footer material.

 

7. In terms of the text, I'd avoid referring to the 80s as the past; make it sound like it IS the 80s. For instance, I'd change:

"That 80's Band" is bringing back the sound of the 80's pop/new-wave era. Comprised of ... "That 80's Band" is a fun, high-energy recreation of the 80's music scene.

... to:

"That 80s Band" is the sound of the pop/new-wave movement. Comprised of ... "That 80s Band" is a fun, high-energy band that plays all the biggest hits!

... or something like that. The name is enough to connote the nostalgia, so have some fun and live in the 80s.

 

(And not to nitpick, but remove the apostrophe from 80's. It should just be 80s, unless your intent is to indicate possession, i.e. "a band that belongs to the 80s".)

[MidLifeCrisis]

[here's a temporary page I put up with our latest pics and such:

 

http://www.that80sbandstl.com/promo/links.html

 

I looked at it as if I were looking for a band to go see live on Friday night. The one that stuck out to me, and would prompt me to go see the band is the PacMan one. Something catchy about it.

 

 

[Bridog6996]

You should make it look like a Commodore 64 boot screen. Now THAT'S 80s! All your pictures could be ASCII or 8bit bitmaps.

 

This site is actually hosted on a C64! http://www.c64web.com/

 

Old skool, sucka!

 

Somewhat off topic. There's a really cool free VSTi called Basic64 that emulates that old school 8-bit Commodore sound. It's one of my favorites.

[kanker.]

[here's a temporary page I put up with our latest pics and such:

 

http://www.that80sbandstl.com/promo/links.html

 

I looked at it as if I were looking for a band to go see live on Friday night. The one that stuck out to me, and would prompt me to go see the band is the PacMan one. Something catchy about it.

 

Yeah, it's like the other pics look a little basic by comparison. That one just pops as something a little more special.

[J. Dan]

If I were designing the site...

 

Jason, we are on the same page. Most of the things you list are exactly what I had in mind and in fact major reasons why I am redesigning.

 

I definitely want to reduce the number of pages. What I had in mind wasn't quite as reduced as what you listed, but something like this (not necessarily these names):

Home

Band/Bio - include overall band bio plus page content updates with individual bios when you click sombody

Songlist - include MP3 and video links for songs that have them... should I have an embedded player? or is this one place where it's ok to go to a new window?

Pictures

Booking Info

Calendar - include shows and clubs under the same basic menu item

Join List - sign up the email list, unless you can think of a logical place this could go on another page

Extras - links, games, promo downloads, tech rider, kind of a catch-all

 

That's 8 menu items - I figured that was good.

 

Yes, I want to make it bigger and avoid popups like the plague. When the site was first designed, 640x480 was still out there.

 

Regarding Arcade vs ... well I guess Bill & Ted as you said (actually there's a local band called Wyld Stallyns), One thing you have to consider is that our biggest crowd is college aged chicks. They weren't alive in the 80's, so we have to look like something THEY identify with the 80's. EVERYBODY associates pacman with the 80's. In fact somebody above chimed in that they liked our pacman picture the best "something about it".

 

The biggest problem I have is with color scheme. I agree that the 80s were bright pastels, primary colors, basically pretty "loud" so to speak. However, every 80s site I've seen that incorporates this look comes off cheesy. Most band sites are darker. Thus, I have to try to strike the balance of having the 80s look yet looking professional to a potential corporate client. I'm leaning towards dark or muted backgrounds with objects that pop. Our latest pictures have more color for instance. And if I incorporate Rubik's Cubes (with primary colors) and other splashes that pop, I think I can achieve the look. It's just a pretty big challenge to get it balanced right.

 

When I get further along with some ideas, I'll post some sample images for feedback. You guys have been very helpful in reinforcing a lot of my thoughts and keeping me focussed. Getting started is always the hardest part for me. Once I have a plan, I start cranking things out.