Moonglow Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 My classic rock "concert" band is thinking of doing this tune. I actually learned it a long time ago, didn't touch (ha) it for some time, but started screwing around with it again last night. About 75% of it came back rather quickly, but I'll need to go back to the woodshed for the rest of it. Dare I say it's one of the easier "Emerson" songs to pull off. Has anyone here played this song live? How did you handle those claps, finger snaps, sandpaper, and wood block (I think) rhythm parts? I think Keith played them on keys when E. L. Powell toured, but I once heard a recording of a cover band that elected to simply not do them; instead the drummer played a semi-open/sloppy high-hat on beats 2 and 4 during those segments. The synth tones appear fairly straightforward, mainly the uber-fat synth brass, vox/choir, and a sort of metallic/string-bell type of thing. Any other tips/suggestions? Below is a video reference. Thanks! [video:youtube]lRsXvZiiNNY Quote "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apple Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 I played this live in a full-time cover band 1987..played it on a Korg remote midi'd to a Memorymoog and switching from lead and choir and bell sounds..the drummer covered the sound effects enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgoo Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 I did the song back when it was current. I programmed the percussion parts into a HR-16. Worked well. I played the main line on my old Memorymoog Plus. I remember one night I launched into the line and one of my oscillators hadn't tuned. It was pretty embarrassing. Now it's funny, but it wasn't at the time! Quote Custom Music, Audio Post Production, Location Audio www.gmma.biz https://www.facebook.com/gmmamusic/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marczellm Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 Palmer always played it like this: [video:youtube] Quote Life is subtractive.Genres: Jazz, funk, pop, Christian worship, BebHop Wishlist: 80s-ish (synth)pop, symph pop, prog rock, fusion, musical theatre Gear: NS2 + JUNO-G. KingKORG. SP6 at church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 I did it way back when. This was a killer when it came to keyboard mapping- it was one of those rare songs where I never played a sound from the keyboard I was playing- it was always from something else because of what had to go where... IIRC, I re-mapped the Korg M1 drums to have the sounds on the lowest octave so it could be played on my MKB-300, and I played it with my left hand whilst the right did the choir accompaniment under the melody. I think I mapped the sounds to C, D, Eb, F, because the chord for the verse was Cm. You're right: it's not very difficult- it is one of the easier ELP pieces, on par with "From the Beginning," I'd say ..Joe Quote Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnotherScott Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 Palmer always played it like this Yes. Even before they ever played it live, ELP did a "cover" version of this Emerson, Lake, and Powell track on a box set where they also covered other stuff that each of them had done without the others, and that's how Palmer put his own spin on it. So this is actually the more authentic ELP arrangement, despite being the less well known version of the song! [video:youtube] the drummer covered the sound effects enough. Personally, I think that's ideal. They are essentially percussion parts. While it is unlikely that his rig includes all sorts of auxiliary percussion, lots of drummers these days have trigger pads for samples. Quote Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real MC Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 That whole album was great, but waaaay too much reverb on EVERYTHING. It was the 80s... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABECK Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 Palmer always played it like this: [video:youtube] Ouch, for a while there, I thought this was a "Shreds" video. That Hammond is dreadful. The Alesis is good (David Brice patches??) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Husker Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 That whole album was great... ^This Really loved the Mars adaptation on that album... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyS Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 The 1986 live show was awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnotherScott Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 The 1986 live show was awesome. It was the loudest thing I'd ever experienced in my life. Quote Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucktronix Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 "Touch And Go" was my first foray into ELP, albeit with the realization that the "P" was for Powell in this instance. Nevertheless, it was the "crack in the door" that got me further into the earlier ELP stuff. Quote Kronos 88 Platinum, Yamaha YC88, Subsequent 37, Korg CX3, Hydrasynth 49-key, Nord Electro 5D 73, QSC K8.2, Lester K Me & The Boyz Chris Beard Band Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stokely Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 "claps, finger snaps, sandpaper, and wood block" Normally these would be firmly in my "who cares, nobody will ever, ever notice or care" category.* Flip side, those are really exposed so probably *something* needs to go there. Flip/flip side, nobody has likely heard this song in forever so it won't matter LOL *I realize there are bands that try to get things exactly right. Not my cup of tea, too much work, but I respect the amount of effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Williams Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 I've covered "The Score" and "Locomotion" live, but only done T&G at home. Does that count? I used filtered noise on four different pitches to do that part, if I remember right. I probably also sequenced that part. :-) I had always assumed that all the reverb was applied to the top pitch of each passage because Lake could not hold the notes for more than about 500 ms. BTW, when I went to see ELPalmer on the Black Moon tour, I was very disappointed in their "cover" of T&G -- it lost all its energy IMO. Quote -Tom Williams {First Name} {at} AirNetworking {dot} com PC4-7, PX-5S, AX-Edge, PC361 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnotherScott Posted February 15, 2017 Share Posted February 15, 2017 I've covered "The Score" and "Locomotion" live The Score, cool, you might be the only guy that's ever covered it. ;-) I've thought about it... Quote Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonglow Posted February 16, 2017 Author Share Posted February 16, 2017 BTW, when I went to see ELPalmer on the Black Moon tour, I was very disappointed in their "cover" of T&G -- it lost all its energy IMO. +1 I never cared for the "cover" version either. Not sure if it was Keith or Greg who said it, but I recall one of them referring to E.L.Powell as the "power line-up." Check out the Greg Lake interview at the link below. A couple of interesting quotes: "Cozy was great. When he joined the band, it was very, very nice,...Hes a great player, and a lovely guy. But the strange thing was, it wasnt ELP anymore. The chemistry was different. Not necessarily bad, but just different. Theres something that Carl brought to the band which made ELP. "...Carl Palmer is very effervescent. It wasnt so much that there was a good drummer and a bad drummer. It was that Carls personality was so energetic, and ELP missed that ingredient. It had been based around that chemistry. When that chemistry changed, you had another band actually. It was a good band. But it was a different band from that which the public had made popular. And that made for a fracturing of continuity. Greg Lake discusses the one-off Emerson Lake and Powell Quote "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real MC Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 ELPowell was my first exposure to Keith Emerson. I'm still drawn to the power of that trio, Greg is correct that Cozy gave ELPowell a drive and power that didn't exist with ELPalmer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 Well, technically, "Touch and Go" is itself a cover of a cover, as it's borrowed from a classical adaptation of an English folk melody. I do love using this melody to test out synths though. I have found that Prophet-family synths come very close. Quote Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B3Nut Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 My fave cut on that album is "The Miracle"...."So here we stand between the gates...upon the dawn the eagle waits..." The thick chords blow my mind... Quote --- Todd A. Phipps "...no, I'm not a Hammondoholic...I can stop anytime..." http://www.facebook.com/b3nut ** http://www.blueolives.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksoper Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 I fell down this rabbit hole last night. Watched a number of ELPowell live numbers, then found the 90 min documentary that accompanied the High Voltage ELP reunion dvd. Powell really kicked that band in the ass. May be the best that material ever sounded. (No disrespect to Palmer, but, you know.) I hate that I didn't pay more attention to ELPowell when it came out. And I'm really glad I saw the Emerson/Lake show after seeing the documentary. Kind of pulled it all together. Quote 9 Moog things, 3 Roland things, 2 Hammond things and a computer with stuff on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonglow Posted February 19, 2017 Author Share Posted February 19, 2017 Well, technically, "Touch and Go" is itself a cover of a cover, as it's borrowed from a classical adaptation of an English folk melody. Interesting Mark, thanks for sharing. Many years ago I was in a hotel lobby and heard a recording (i.e., Muzak) of what I thought was Touch And Go performed by a string section. I recall thinking that was a strange song to be featured in that format (i.e., strings), but perhaps it was a classical adaption of the English folk melody you are referring to. I do love using this melody to test out synths though. I have found that Prophet-family synths come very close. I think Keith originally used an Oberheim Matrix-12, MIDIed to one or two other synths, for that huge synth brass sound. In the Keyboard magazine interview, I recall him characterizing that patch as a "delicate balance" of sounds. When ELP toured during the 1990s, Keith used an Alesis QS-8 when they played Touch And Go. I believe our esteemed moderator, Dave Bryce, was involved in the programming of that patch/multi. Quote "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrokeys Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 The tune has had a long life. It appears in Ralph Vaughn Williams's "Fantasia on Greensleeves" within the classical realm. and is the folk song "Lovely Joan" of which there are numerous versions and recordings. It would have been nice to have heard Greg Lake sing it in that form..."Lucky Man" style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 Yeah, I was too tired to look it up last night, but both Vaughan Williams and Holst set that melody to orchestral treatment (or wind ensemble, to get more technically accurate), in their folk song suites. I almost said Oberheim, but decided not to as then I'd have to take the time to think about WHICH Oberheim, so it was simpler just to recommend a Prophet for the sound. But I do think the OB6 would come closer. Quote Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moj Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 This is the Keith Emerson Band from the Moscow Concert 2008. I like this more than the ELPalmer cover from the "Return of the Manticore" box-set. Marc Bonilla admirably sings, Keith adds a bit more delay/reverb to the keys and the drummer plays a bit like Cozy Powell. A bigger symphonic sound without the "finger snaps, claps, sandpaper" effects. This live version is better than the disappointing live ELP concerts from 1997. [video:youtube] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Paxton Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Something I've always wondered about: When he plays the line up an octave at the end, there's that descending 16th-note counterline in the left hand. On the record it sounds like it's in thirds, but live he played it as a single-note line. Just wondering if anyone has succeeded in playing it in thirds? I once played it in a band with two keyboardists, where we played it in thirds between us and it sounded great. But by myself, no thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonglow Posted February 20, 2017 Author Share Posted February 20, 2017 I'm going to give that 16th-note counterline a try with my left hand, although I may have to play it on another keyboard or use some sort of split. Below is what I got for that line, I think it is the same as what Greg does on bass. The line descends to the second "F" and then goes back up for the last four notes. G F Eb D C Bb A G F G A Bb C Quote "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Paxton Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Yeah, that's definitely there and I think that's what he played live. But then part of my brain thinks I'm also hearing a third below that for the first half of the line (that is, the first eight notes) same scale starting on Eb. If so, I suspect it was an overdub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Paxton Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 By the way, I'm curious as to why you'd need another board or a split? It's the same sound as the lead line, and the ranges don't clash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonglow Posted February 20, 2017 Author Share Posted February 20, 2017 By the way, I'm curious as to why you'd need another board or a split? It's the same sound as the lead line, and the ranges don't clash. I'm hearing a different synth tone for that descending line. It's most noticeable on the "Emerson, Lake, & Powell Live In Concert" CD, especially the last time through that part. I don't know if Keith was using his GX-1 during that tour, but it kind of sounds like it. But yeah, in the end, I'll probably just simplify and use the same synth brass patch. What I'm also finding really cool are the moving chord changes he plays along with the synth lead, which are introduced toward the middle of the song. In the live CD there is a section where those chords are considerably louder than the lead, which made it much easier to figure out what the hell he was doing...and useful because he also plays the same chords during a subsequent verse. The patch he uses for the chords again sounds like a GX-1. Quote "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonglow Posted February 21, 2017 Author Share Posted February 21, 2017 I've covered "The Score" and "Locomotion" live The Score, cool, you might be the only guy that's ever covered it. ;-) I've thought about it... Poor video quality, but cool nonetheless: [video:youtube] Quote "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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