Stomp Boxes - what's hot, what's not

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Originally posted by Philip O'Keefe:

Bill, I bought a Digitech RP-6 years ago for similar reasons. The delay and mod effects are not too bad, especially for live use, but IMO, the distortions suck.

 

Yep. But in my opinion, most distortions suck. Nothing sounds as good as the direct guitar/amp connection. I beleive that this is a big part of what made Guns N Roses popular with guitarists when they first came out.... none of the mush of the typical pointy-headstock guitar through every pedal on the planet that was so popular at the time.... just that Les Paul through a Marshall sound that has such immediacy.

 

Few distortion pedals cut it if you start to get picky about tone. The Rat has it's proponents. The Chandler is a classic. Anyone want to offer some others?

 

Yeah, I have an RP-6....it was cheap, though not as cheap as the RP200. I went for the 200 to replace the 6 because of size, and because the newer design was a little cleaner.

 

I'm not at all up on current pedals, so I need all the suggestions that I can get. Seeing the Ibanez show up so often surprises me.... are they suddenly desirable? You couldn't give them away five years ago, and they were common in used music stores, at firesale prices.

 

That about the old yellow TurboDistortion?

 

Bill

[Philip OKeefe]

I don't know about the yellow turbodistortion (you mean the Boss? I never cared for their OD / distortion pedals that much), but the seasick green TubeScreamers were always my favorite dirt boxes. Maybe some of the new "boutique" stuff is better - I don't know. Like you, I'm a bit out of date in my knowledge of pedals... but I agree - generally distortion from the amp is much better than anything from a pedal. At least the pedals I'm currently aware of.

[Teahead]

Originally posted by Philip O'Keefe:

Something new for overdriving the front end of the amp. And I thought, as long as I'm asking, I might as well find out what else is new / cool out there in stompbox land that I might not have been exposed to by musicians in the studio.

I'll try to remain objective here, but both these guys build pedals that just blow me away and are the most down to earth and damn nice folks you could wish to meet, so it won't be easy(!) The Bi-Comp and the Java Boost would make a mean combination with that Uni-Valve though!

 

Best of luck...

 

Tea.

[Teahead]

Or given your penchant for Tubescreamers...

http://www.stevesmusiccenter.com/KeeleyTS808Big.jpg

Keeley also offers a modified TS808 reissue for $249, with upgraded components and a true bypass switch. If you like the stock sound, you'll certainly appreciate the improvements he makes...

 

The Ibanez TS808 offers a vintage look and sound. Many people are wondering if it needs mods since it's the Holy Grail TS808 with JRC chip installed. Sure it does! If you look at the board, it's the exact same as the TS9 and has the same "faults" if you will. Limited bass reponse that cuts so much that it appears as a huge midrange hump in the sound. Limited Gain range...doesn't get clean enough or on the other side, doesn't get enough distortion. Also, the lack of transparency or muddiness becomes a problem for many users.

 

All these things are fixed with our mods. Keeley's approach is to give you the most out of this classic pedal.

The TS808 needs mod work! It is really the same thing as the TS9 re-issue with just a new JRC chip in it. But the chip is not the main problem with the unit or the magic part needed to make it sound perfect. Keeley Electronics mods these pedals with 1000's of units worth of experience in making people happy. So instead of telling you about the "MOJO" we do to it...we'll tell you like it is! ;-)

 

The bass response is improved to the point of perfection. It is nice and tight and not muddy at all. We upgrade that cap from a 0.047 to a 0.1uF and at the same time we increase the gain possible when the drive control is turned up. That resistor is dropped from a 4.7k to a 2.4k. Keeley also makes the pedal so it cleans up more We take the 51k and lower it to 20k. This is our More/Less mod. You get both more drive and less drive as well as all the sweet stock spots in the middle of the control. Keeley also upgrades the 1uF electrolytic caps to high tolerance, great sounding, more consistent 1uF metal film caps. This type of thing is done in all HI-FI stereos and audio gear.

 

We also gold socket the chip so that you can experiment if you hear one chip is better than another etc...

 

We also upgrade the tone control circuit and take the .22uF Tantalum to a 0.18uF for better control and response from the tone control. This allows you to get a more full sound on the lower end of the tone control.

 

Keeley also improves parts of the fet switching so that you have a better clearer tone, both on and off. We check all the factory solder joints so that you don't have power supply problems anytime soon! The resistors we use are metal film to reduce noise in the system as well. Obviously, This is not the kinda of MOJO many others talk about. So think twice before sending it off to a man that promises you very little substance.

 

Why is Keeley's cheaper?!?! Because we're bad to the bone and efficient as hell! Plus! we're musicians that know expenses and a few bucks here and there mean a lot.

 

How do I know this is the right way to mod the pedals for the masses? Because we take feedback from customers and turn it into reality. This is where YOU GUYS have led us to the perfect Tube Screamer sound! Shoot, THANK YOU!!!

Tea.

[Big Red 67]

Does he still make upgrade kits Tea?

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by bpark@prorec.com:

Yep. But in my opinion, most distortions suck. Nothing sounds as good as the direct guitar/amp connection. I beleive that this is a big part of what made Guns N Roses popular with guitarists when they first came out.... none of the mush of the typical pointy-headstock guitar through every pedal on the planet that was so popular at the time.... just that Les Paul through a Marshall sound that has such immediacy.

Hmph. Try a Les Paul straight into an Ampeg, now THAT'S in yer face!

 

But in general, I agree.

 

I admit though, I'm more into trying new stompboxes these days, at least for recording (on stage it's the volume pedal, the Echoplex and the Vox Tone Bender, none of which I use too much except for the volume pedal)... partly because there seem to be quite a few cool ones coming out and partly because my second band Orange Hat is ALL about the wacky noises. So now I have this alter ego who is into stomp boxes.

[picker]

Originally posted by Lee Flier:

So now I have this alter ego who is into stomp boxes.

If you don't already have one, get you a Heet Sound E-BOW. There are more sounds in that little thing than you might imagine. Tie it up with some deep reverb or echo, a little chorusing and/or flanging, and who needs a synth?

I used my ebow with some different patches on an Alesis Midiverb IV; some really deep reverbs to blur the attack even more than the Ebow does by itself, some pitch shifting to thicken the sound, a little echo for harmony-sounding stuff on ascending and descending patterns. Very cool...

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

My ebow doesn't work for shit.

 

Bill

[Lee Flier]

I do have an E-Bow actually, have had it for years. And yes I have used it with Orange Hat. Combined with the Echoplex it's pretty whacked out.

[Teahead]

Originally posted by Big Red 67:

Does he still make upgrade kits Tea?

I'm not sure Red...I know you can send your Tubescreamer off to either Keeley or Analogman and they'll upgrade it to TS808 specs. All the info is on their sites.

 

Tea.

[Teahead]

Originally posted by Lee Flier:

My second band Orange Hat is ALL about the wacky noises. So now I have this alter ego who is into stomp boxes.

You want freaky noises? Check out Lovetone!

 

Tea.

[Dave da Dude]

Lee,

my second band Orange Hat is ALL about the wacky noises. So now I have this alter ego who is into stomp boxes.

"Variety is the spice of life." Hokey, but true.

 

btw Lee, I "heard" over on the Band Forum that you (gasp) sold your Gold Top LP Is that true?

[Tedster]

I'm getting this vision of Lee, er, coming out of the closet (of sorts) playing her Line 6 Variax, only a souped-up model with a Floyd Rose and a pointy headstock...with some huge pedalboard and a Line 6 amp...drum machine...prog keyboards...

 

Now, here's an effect I'd bet you would love, Lee...an old Echoplex.

[Philip OKeefe]

Tedster apparently has developed a death wish.

 

Tea, that's exactly the type of advice I was looking for - thank you for being so helpful.

 

No, to the best of my knowledge Lee has not, nor will she ever sell her '52 LP. It had to be a joke, probably because of a few "extortion" pictures from the last BBQ where she was (GASP!) actually playing a Line 6 Variax.

[Big Red 67]

I'm not sure Red...I know you can send your Tubescreamer off to either Keeley or Analogman and they'll upgrade it to TS808 specs. All the info is on their sites.

I don't mind having them do it. I just don't want to let go of my pedal that long, use it to much! Maybe I should dust off the tube king in the mean time?

[Dylan]

Phil,

 

A really nice sounding and versatile overdrive/distortion pedal is the Radial Tonebone Classic (www.tonebone.com). I paid $200 for it at Guitar Center and its worth every dime. Check out the harmony central reviews on it! It can do everything from Claptons Woman Tone to Alice in Chains high-gain sounds. Plus, every control on the pedal is detailed and actually does something. Im in hog heaven running the TB into my Mesa F-30 with my SG. I got rid of the Line6 digital setup last year and now Im running an all tube signal path. Couldnt be happier! I agree with Bill that the best distortion you can get is usually from an amp cranked, however. The problem with the Mesa is though even its only about 25 watts that I have to crank the shite out of it to get the sound that Im after.

[Philip OKeefe]

Thanks for the tip Dylan. They certainly make great DI's, so I wouldn't be surprised to hear that their OD pedal rocks.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Originally posted by Dylan PDX:

 

... The problem with the Mesa is though even its only about 25 watts that I have to crank the shite out of it to get the sound that Im after.

Just extrapolating from what Miles has said, the stock Messa tubes don't go below a 4 in the Groove Tubes hardness rating. What if you replaced the stock Mesa power tubes with an equivalent Groove Tubes model with a 1-3 rating?

 

Bill

[Caevan O’Shite]

Originally posted by bpark@prorec.com:

Originally posted by Dylan PDX:

 

... The problem with the Mesa is though even its only about 25 watts that I have to crank the shite out of it to get the sound that Im after.

Just extrapolating from what Miles has said, the stock Messa tubes don't go below a 4 in the Groove Tubes hardness rating. What if you replaced the stock Mesa power tubes with an equivalent Groove Tubes model with a 1-3 rating?

 

Bill

If so, be sure to have the bias adjusted, probably a matter of resisitor values changed by swapping 'em in that Mesa Boogie.

[Philip OKeefe]

Biasing a Mesa is a PITA compared to many amps. The way they set up "bias adjustment" in their amps is a dumb design decision IMO.

[js]

Phil, since you already have a Pod XT...

 

Load up Rel 2.0. Turn off the amp and speaker sims and use the stompbox sims to the amp.

 

Sure, not as good as the real thing, but better than they have any right to be. Particularly the delay/mod effects, but the distortions actually aren't too bad either.

 

js

[Philip OKeefe]

Oh, I've been known to do that from time to time. And yes, the effects in the Pod XT are not bad - certainly a LOT better than those in my Digitech RP-6. But sometimes I like to split and send the guitar to both a mic'ed amp and to the Pod XT, and record each to their own tracks. Other times I have the Pod "free" for using it for effects... but I would still like to find a really good OD pedal, a good delay (I'm leaning towards the Danelectro Reel Echo) and a good compressor "just because".

 

Has anyone tried the newer MXR compressor pedal? I think it's called the MXR M132 Super Compressor. If so, how does it compare to a DynaComp? Is it similar, but with more options, or is it a different beast all together?

[Teahead]

I had a Dyna-Comp for a while, until I replaced it with the Keeley compressor(You Must Try The Keeley!)

 

The "vintage" Script Logo MXR pedals are the ones that have the great reputation. The Dyna-Comp, Blue Box and Micro Amp can fetch $350+ in good shape!

 

The Block Logo issues that they currently make fall short of the high standards they set in the 70s. Seems like they're trading on the good name, with an almost identical look, whilst cutting component quality and no doubt building costs too.

 

I found both the Dyna-Comp and the Micro Amp to be very noisy when pushed, not good for studio and recording work. Not the greatest bypass either, my Dyna-Comp robbed high end when off.

 

The Super-Comp is a descendent of the Dyna, so whilst I can't help you with it in particular, I hope my Dyna-Comp experience is of some comparative use.

 

I have heard great things about the Barber Tone Press, which is a reasonably priced $150, the Electro Harmonix Black Finger also has a good reputation and features a 12AX7 for that magical tube compression.

 

As for delay...I just picked up a Guyatone MD3 digital delay for $90 and it blew my head off! I prefer it to any Boss "DD" I have owned and it's tiny enough to fit in the palm of your hand.

 

It self-oscillates like a tape delay when you adjust the settings whilst playing and the repeats are crystal clear, carbon copies of what you play into it. A bargain pedal.

 

Tea.

[Philip OKeefe]

Again, mucho thanks for the input Tea.

 

You Must Try The Keeley!)

 

If I can find one within 50 miles of here, I definitely will.

 

As for delay...I just picked up a Guyatone MD3 digital delay for $90 and it blew my head off! I prefer it to any Boss "DD" I have owned and it's tiny enough to fit in the palm of your hand.

 

Well, that might not be for me then. If it's pristine digital delays I'm after, I have plenty of rack stuff and plug ins that can do that. While I'm not going to spring for a vintage tube Echoplex, I usually would want something with the option of rolling off some highs with each repeat. That Danelectro Reel Echo looks like a possibility, although I have not played with one for quite a while. I'll have to cruise over to Terry's and give his a try again before I make up my mind on that.

 

BTW Tea, have you ever tried a Radial Tonebone Classic? If so, what did you think?

[Teahead]

I'm afraid not. It looks seriously well equipped and the tube is a great touch. I always keep my drive/boost pedals to two knob designs and I avoid tone controls where possible. Which puts the Tonebone way over my head!

 

The Keeleys do have internal trimmers to adjust the effect to my tastes, but so far Roberts ears have been good enough for me!

 

I tend to have one (Java Boost) set for a touch of crunch and boost and the other (Fuzz Head) set up for thicker lead tones. Then I combine them for solo screams from Hell.

 

Both are essentially "Boosters" and not really overdrives at all, I find they sound clearer because my Vox is already cranked to give a slight break up when spanked(!)

 

Full on overdrives often resulted in mush and my losing the character of the original tone.

 

You may very well find otherwise, but I think with such a wonderful and essentially simple amp as the Uni-Valve, an equally simple and wonderfully built boost will yield the best results. You have the "base coat" of tone and you need something to enhabce that, rather than blanket over it.

 

Will the Uni-Valve be set to a slight break up? Or do you want something to take it from clean to dirty? This is the biggest deciding factor to me, because there is a big difference in the pedals designed to do each and they often disappoint when chosen for the wrong application.

 

Going on the sheer number of overdrives and boost pedals available, I wish you the very best of luck with your search! I hope I've been more of a help than hindrance?

 

Tea.

[Philip OKeefe]

You've been a lot of help Tea - I sincerely mean that mate, and I appreciate all your advice.

 

The Univalve will probably be set as the situation demands. Since I rarely gig, and mostly do studio stuff, the flexibility of the amp was a big factor in my decision to get it. So what I want from a pedal is something with good tone, but not something that will "blanket" the sound.

 

For example, as I think I mentioned before, I like Tubescreamers better than something like a Ratt or a Fuzzface or a Big Muff Pi. I don't mind EQ on the pedal, but I'll probably snag a Danelectro Fish & Chips graphic EQ pedal, so that's not a requirement. But great tone, and to a lesser degree, some flexibility insofar as different tonal options, is.

 

So at this point, I'm leaning towards a Fish and Chips EQ, a Danelectro Reel Echo for the delay, and who knows what for the overdrive / distortion and compressor pedals. I will probably pass on a chorus or flanger pedal and just stick to outboard rack and plug in stuff for those as needed.

 

Again, thanks for all the suggestions and advice.