Yngwie Booed in Brazil

[Marvster]

This one falls under Amazing Gig Stories.... Derek Sherinian (formerly of Dream Theater and now with Yngwie's band) posted this letter on his site. I can no longer find the original on the site, but he has now issued an apology. http://www.dereksherinian.com Marv * * * * * First of all, I would like to preface this letter by saying that I am not a fan of one using their musical status to promote religious or political beliefs. I am also not one to post on message boards, but something happened to me on stage last night that I feel compelled to write this letter. I am currently the only American in Yngwie Malmsteen's touring band. What happened at last night's gig in Porte Allegre, Brazil was shocking. Midway through the set, Yngwie finished his guitar solo spot with the "Star Spangled Banner." The crowd of about 1500 people started immediately booing very loudly, and throwing shit on stage. The crowd started chanting, "O S A M A !!, O S A M A !!!" To see the Anti-American rallies on CNN is bad enough, but to be in the middle of one is scary beyond words. So after Yngwie's solo we had about 5 more songs to play. All of my spirit was gone. I finished the set disgusted, and without looking at the crowd for the rest of the show. After the final song, the band went to the dressing room. I told Yngwie, " I refuse to go out for the encore under any circumstances, FUCK THESE PEOPLE." Yngwie went back on stage by himself and played the "Star Spangled Banner" again to a choir of loud boos. He then said on the microphone, "God Bless America and FUCK YOU ALL" and walked off stage. The crowd went into a riot and started throwing shit on stage. We immediately were rushed back to our hotel. I have no idea of the status of our gear. I want to thank Yngwie for backing me up, and for standing up for the USA. To the people in Porte Allegre, you should be ashamed of yourselves. I don't give a fuck if I ever play your peasant infested third world city again. God Bless America, Derek Sherinian This message has been edited by Marvster on 10-10-2001 at 09:50 PM

[Philip OKeefe]

I've never had much respect for Yngwie as a person before - In all the interviews with him that I have read and seen, I've found him to come off as someone with an overinflated self image and an ego that couldn't fit into most stadiums, yet alone the average house. Sure, the guy's incredibly fast of fingers, but to me, that's not the most important thing about musicianship - While I appreciate technical virtuosity, I prefer music as heartfelt expression that moves me, instead of pyrotechnics and gymnastics. And his has always stuck me as falling squarely into the latter category. But if this is indeed true and not just a hoax, my impression of him just rose a couple of notches - vulgar language notwithstanding. Is he even an American citizen? Either way, as someone who lives here but is not a citizen, at least he spoke up for the USA. And if he IS a citizen now, he just proved (again, assuming it's a true story) that people who have "adopted the USA as their own country" are oftentimes some of the most fervorent and loyal about standing up for it. Phil O'Keefe Sound Sanctuary Recording Riverside CA http://members.aol.com/ssanctuary/index.html pokeefe777@msn.com This message has been edited by pokeefe777@msn.com on 10-10-2001 at 10:18 PM

[Marvster]

Lots of hoaxes going around, but this story is true. There are, however, conflicting accounts of how it went down. Check: http://www.yngwie.com/News/index.html#newsitem1002178800,11318 Marv

[Chip McDonald]

[quote]Originally posted by Marvster: [b]What happened at last night's gig in Porte Allegre, Brazil was shocking. Midway through the set, Yngwie finished his guitar solo spot with the "Star Spangled Banner." The crowd of about 1500 people started immediately booing very loudly, and throwing shit on stage. [/b][/quote] Just read all the links. Bizarre; one would assume a crowd of people would understand the context, but apparently not. It's also indicative of the mood of a lot of foreign lands for the U.S.. Unreal. It would seem most of the world as the attitude towards the U.S. akin to that of a spoiled child. IF Sepultura (Brazilian metal band) was playing here - and such a tragedy occured in their country, AND they played their national anthem - people in the U.S. would think "cool". The Brazilian's behavior does much to counter balance the "ugly American" bias; 10 points to Yngwie, I say fuck them, too. The world has become spoiled, and thinks the U.S. is it's father. This is why I was against the NWO when it started coalescing finally in the late 80's: *the world isn't ready yet*. ------------------ [b]New and Improved Music Soon:[/b] http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald

[Rod S]

[quote]Originally posted by Chip McDonald: [b] It's also indicative of the mood of a lot of foreign lands for the U.S.. Unreal. It would seem most of the world as the attitude towards the U.S. akin to that of a spoiled child. IF Sepultura (Brazilian metal band) was playing here - and such a tragedy occured in their country, AND they played their national anthem - people in the U.S. would think "cool". The Brazilian's behavior does much to counter balance the "ugly American" bias; 10 points to Yngwie, I say fuck them, too. The world has become spoiled, and thinks the U.S. is it's father. This is why I was against the NWO when it started coalescing finally in the late 80's: *the world isn't ready yet*. [/b][/quote] Incorrect. The US comes across internationally as if it thinks it owns the world, and unfortunately, it does come across that way more than once. Your comment just re emphasizes the point. The US think it rules above everyone else 'the wold has become spoiled' spoiled by what? Having watched a lot of concerts in Brazil, the common attitude of 'rockers', specially heavy metal bands, is FUCKING CONDENSENDING (Ozzy Osborne comes to mind when he played down there). While I do agree that the mention of Osama Bin Laden is inapropriate, I wouldn't be surprised if the dumbass was having an attitude problem. They swear at the public (assuming people don't understand), don't treat gigs responsibly (they are a third world, what do they care? - exact words, unfortunately can't remember who it was). BTW, Sepultura is not representative of brazilian rock, or of Brazil. They suck, and only have been popular here. I wouldn't care if they got in stage and pissed on the brazilian flag. Ask anyone down there, no one knows who they are. Chip, I expect more from you than to judge a culture by the attitude of a few in front of a crappy guitar player who thinks to highly of himself and was probably intoxicated. Brazil has always been political allies of the US, and there has never been a strong anti-american attitude, not more than anywhere else. Yes, I haven't read the links, and I won't bother. The way the news of anything that happens in brazil is so hyped and twisted here I wouldn't believe any of it.

[rold]

[quote]Originally posted by Rod CA: [b] Brazil has always been political allies of the US, and there has never been a strong anti-american attitude, not more than anywhere else. [/b][/quote] Things may have changed, thanks to the "war on drugs". Ask any south american villager who was living near a coca plantation when a US-sponsored crop duster sprayed Agent Orange all over their plantations. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] (Please note coca is used for a variety of purposes, in food, etc., not only for cocaine.) I have read reports and interviews of south americans complaining about losing all their food crops, livestock, their children and elderly getting respiratory problems and skin burns, though no one seemed to listen and the gov't refused (violently at times) to talk about it. For those who haven't seen my earlier posts, some health effects attributed to use of Agent Orange include: - child death - 7 various cancers - severe psychological and personality disorders - liver disfunction ...to name a few. To see a list of currently known effects, click here: http://www.lyghtforce.com/HomeopathyOnline/Issue5/articles/ritchie_orange3.html I am not an anti-american (have many good friends there), definitely do NOT sympathize with terrorists (I can't so much as kill a spider), but I cannot agree with campaigns such as this, and would understand anti-american sentiment *if* I were in their shoes. To me, food and healthy children are more important than any campaign, whatever the spin, and if those were removed from my family, I'd be quite angry and directing that anger at whoever took those away. PLEASE - whatever you don't do, next time elections come, do put foreign policy high on your priority lists when making a vote. DEMAND your candidates spell out their foreign policy initiatives word for word before you place your vote. Foreign policy can no longer be ignored; 09/11 is proof of that. Having said all that, I think the brazilian crowd was out of line. Peace to you all, Harold This message has been edited by rold on 10-11-2001 at 04:05 AM

[Hazy Hill]

[quote]Originally posted by Rod CA: [b] BTW, Sepultura is not representative of brazilian rock, or of Brazil. They suck, and only have been popular here. .... Ask anyone down there, no one knows who they are. [/b][/quote] Incorrect! Back in the '80s, when they released "Beneath The Remains" in 1989 and later on "Arise" in 1991, they became so popular in the metal scenes all over the world, including Brazil. You may not like them but it is so unfair to say that "they suck"! "Beneath The Remains" and "Arise" are very remarkable and great albums in the history of Metal. ------------------ Ufuk Onen [url=http://www.SisProductions.com]www.SisProductions.com[/url] Ankara, Turkey

[soapbox]

The old saying, "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" comes to mind here. After all, "The War on Drugs" sounds like a good idea at first glance; and our country's support of Israel has its roots in sympathy for the survivors of Hitler's holocaust. The problem lies in the fact that it's a big world out there; and despite the power of the US, our understanding of this big world is finite. The goal of having an informed electorate, crucial to a strong democracy, requires a lot more focus on international events. After all, good intentions don't always lead to good outcomes; and when that happens, we need to know about it. When people out there get angry with the US, our first response is that they are attacking our way of life. Sometimes that's true; other times, they may simply be telling us that our policies didn't turn out as planned. Is that so difficult to believe? After all, how many times have our government's policies failed at home? My guess is that policy failure happens more frequently abroad; because, at least in the US, we understand our own culture. There's an awful lot of blame and "F*** you"s being thrown around right now. Anger is understandable; but solutions demand a new approach. My two cents.

[Tusker]

Looks like a text book case of miscommunication to me. Yngwie may have intended to share his compassion and sorrow about September 11th..... but how do you expect a crowd to know it wasn't a blood thirsty celebration of the bombing currently going on...? "And the rockets’ red glare, the bombs bursting in air" Imagine if this was played agressively, at loud volumes, with no explanation. I think this fracas was likely not about US foreign policy but insensitivity to unintended messages. Maybe it's a personal lesson and not a national one. That said, I do agree with comments people have made about our international influence not being adequately coupled with knowledge, compassion and empathy. The US has no peer among the nations. Noblesse oblige. Regards, Jerry This message has been edited by Tusker on 10-11-2001 at 09:05 AM

[Calfee Jones]

The US is one of the biggest providers of foreign aid in the world. There is a lot we do wrong, but there is a lot we do right. I imagine there were plenty in the audience who have the attitude "Screw the establishment" - whoever they perceive it to be at the time. And remember, people can say and do some remarkably stupid things when they are in groups. Take some of the comments on this thread for example...

[Chip McDonald]

[quote]Originally posted by Rod CA: [b] Incorrect. The US comes across internationally as if it thinks it owns the world, and unfortunately, it does come across that way more than once. Your comment just re emphasizes the point. The US think it rules above everyone else 'the wold has become spoiled' spoiled by what?[/b][/quote] Someone attacks Brazil, an ally, who comes to their rescue? If the U.S. wasn't around for the past 20 years, would the borders on the globe look the same as they do now? Who spends more on foreign aid? That we have been attacked, and they do not see that in part as an attack on them as well, ignores the fact that in the grand scheme of things they're one of many countries that don't have to fear being taken over because the U.S. is around as a stabilizing force. What would the middle east be like if we weren't around? Would there even be a middle east? On the flip side - what would the U.S. economy be like if it didn't spend itself into the ground during the Cold War, isolated itself and not invested in foreign nations? The rest of the world would be much crappier and the U.S. wealthier. A lot less stable as well. Ignoring that is behaving "spoiled". [b]of 'rockers', specially heavy metal bands, is FUCKING CONDENSENDING (Ozzy Osborne comes to mind when he played down there). While I do agree that the mention of Osama Bin Laden is inapropriate, I wouldn't be surprised if the dumbass was having an attitude problem. They swear at the public (assuming people don't understand), don't treat gigs responsibly (they are a third world, what do they care? - exact words, unfortunately can't remember who it was). [/b] So it's his own fault? Like I said, the U.S. doesn't *have* to do business with Brazil... [b]BTW, Sepultura is not representative of brazilian rock, or of Brazil. [/b] They are the best representative of a known metal band from Brazil I could think of in that moment. I did not state otherwise. [b]They suck, and only have been popular here. [/b] Your opinion of their band has nothing to do with the subject. [b] I wouldn't care if they got in stage and pissed on the brazilian flag. Ask anyone down there, no one knows who they are. [/b] Curiously, one of the reasons I thought of them is because I used to have two brothers I taught that were from Brazil, that seemed to think they were the greatest thing ever. YMMV. [b]Chip, I expect more from you than to judge a culture[/b] I'm not judging a culture. Brazilian culture has nothing to do with it, I was judging that crowd's *political* attitude, which is an entirely different thing. [b] by the attitude of a few in front of a crappy guitar player who thinks to highly of himself and was probably intoxicated.[/b] That's a very non-clouded non-biased statement.... [b]Brazil has always been political allies of the US,[b] EXACTLY, *political* allies. [b] and there has never been a strong anti-american attitude, not more than anywhere else.[/b] The only thing more anti-American than booing our national anthem would be burning our flag. Sorry, but an entire crowd booing and making supportive remarks of bin Laden constitutes "anti-American attitude" in my book. *Again* note I am refering to that specific crowd, and have been. I am as big a criticiser of U.S. policy as you will find, but at the same time I'm not going to ignore idiotic behavior when I see it. ------------------ [b]New and Improved Music Soon:[/b] http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald This message has been edited by Chip McDonald on 10-11-2001 at 01:19 PM

[surfjunkie]

posted by Chip: [i]IF Sepultura (Brazilian metal band) was playing here - and such a tragedy occured in their country, AND they played their national anthem - people in the U.S. would think "cool".[/i] i'll bet one American in a million would even [b]recognize[/b] Brasil's national anthem.

[strat0124]

Ever wonder why Brazilian nuts and peanuts are the only thing left in the mixed nut bowl?

[surfjunkie]

america unfairly favors almonds and cashews. ALL NUTS ARE CREATED EQUAL

[surfjunkie]

even yngwie

[Steve LeBlanc]

The following is what I posted on a different BBS a few days ago in response to this: [quote]I don't give a shit if I ever play your peasant infested third world city again. God bless America, Derek Sherinian."[/quote] Well, if it's true...I suppose I don't blame him for not wanting to play there anymore but the last comment is pretty fucked IMO. I mean, maybe these people hate America so much because corporations supported by our government have been destroying age old Rain forests to raise cattle that feeds fat American slobs who eat McDonalds for lunch 3 times a week. Also wtf do these peasants know about the recent terrorist attacks on our country really...they aren't all sitting around watching 32" Sony Televisions either. If you really put yourself in their shoes, well maybe the U.S. National Anthem isn't what you want to hear. P.S. Before you post that I'm anti-american or unpatriotic...just know that I most definitly don't think that I am and will be highly insulted by anyone who says that I am. This message has been edited by Steve LeBlanc on 10-11-2001 at 05:05 PM

[Hazy Hill]

[quote]Originally posted by Steve LeBlanc: [b]The following is what I posted on a different BBS a few days ago in response to this: Well, if it's true...I suppose I don't blame him for not wanting to play there anymore but the last comment is pretty fucked IMO. I mean, maybe these people hate America so much because corporations supported by our government have been destroying age old Rain forests to raise cattle that feeds fat American slobs who eat McDonalds for lunch 3 times a week. Also wtf do these peasants know about the recent terrorist attacks on our country really...they aren't all sitting around watching 32" Sony Televisions either. If you really put yourself in their shoes, well maybe the U.S. National Anthem isn't what you want to hear. P.S. Before you post that I'm anti-american or unpatriotic...just know that I most definitly don't think that I am and will be highly insulted by anyone who says that I am. [/b][/quote] Steve, I'm not American and I don't live in the US. I've been to your country only once, back in 1995, had a great time there, liked it there, and unless in some other countries not even a single person treated me different because I was a foreigner. But let's put this aside for a second... Whether you like a country or you hate a country, in my opinion terrorism should neither be supported nor be tolarated. And, yes of course we should not judge a portion without getting the whole picture. That does not mean all the Brasilians support and favor terrorism against America. Maybe just a bunch of brainless losers like the ones who booed Yngwie. ------------------ Ufuk Onen [url=http://www.SisProductions.com]www.SisProductions.com[/url] Ankara, Turkey

[Martin O]

What part of 'chanting OSAMA OSAMA' do these people not understand?!? THEY CHANTED 'OSAMA OSAMA'!!! They are s h i t. They being the CROWD at the concert. Not the 3 guys in the back row that didn't represent the majority. THE CROWD CHANTED 'OSAMA'. Stop defending them. EVERYONE knows what happened whether they have 32" tv's or not. Let all Americans watch our worldly neighbors closely. And we will remember those that cheered the act that left 5,000 dead.

[Martin O]

And what about the 'wheres the proof?' cries? Maybe I'm incorrect but didn't Osama threaten terrorism against U.S.? Isn't that proof enough?!?!? Even if he didn't do it -- he threatened it!! But our targeting him is unfair?!? because theres no 'proof'? Stupidity.

[rold]

[quote]Originally posted by Martin O: [b]What part of 'chanting OSAMA OSAMA' do these people not understand?!? THEY CHANTED 'OSAMA OSAMA'!!! They are s h i t. They being the CROWD at the concert. Not the 3 guys in the back row that didn't represent the majority. THE CROWD CHANTED 'OSAMA'. Stop defending them. EVERYONE knows what happened whether they have 32" tv's or not. Let all Americans watch our worldly neighbors closely. And we will remember those that cheered the act that left 5,000 dead.[/b][/quote] I'm not clear on what exactly they chanted. On the official site, it says they chanted "Brazil Brazil". http://www.yngwie.com/News/index.html#newsitem1002178800,11318 This message has been edited by rold on 10-11-2001 at 06:35 PM

[Steve LeBlanc]

nevermind...I assumed you edited your post, you didn't...on another BB someone edited their post of the same topic. My fault. You might want to edit your post though because it's different than every other version of the story I've seen. You post is the only one that has the crowd chanting "Osama, Osama". Maybe yours is the correct one, I don't know for sure, I could be wrong. This message has been edited by Steve LeBlanc on 10-12-2001 at 01:53 AM

[Chip McDonald]

[quote]Originally posted by wager47: [b] i'll bet one American in a million would even [b]recognize[/b] Brasil's national anthem. [/B][/quote] That's irrelevant, it was a hypothetical scenario. ------------------ [b]New and Improved Music Soon:[/b] http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald

[Chip McDonald]

[quote]Originally posted by Martin O: [b]And we will remember those that cheered the act that left 5,000 dead.[/b][/quote] That's the point. It doesn't matter that it was the U.S. or whomever. Just as I made a remark in another thread basically trying to tone down the "ra ra America" attitude about bombing Afghanistan - 5,000+ murdered people is a tragedy. That the Brazilian crowd didn't see it that way - that the U.S. anthem being played as a token acknowledgement of that - is disgusting. ------------------ [b]New and Improved Music Soon:[/b] http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald

[Salyphus]

The really scary thing to me is that anyone would take yngwie malmsteen seriously or go see him play [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/eek.gif[/img] perhaps these people had problems to begin with? [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] I certainly wouldn't take this group to represent the Brazilian public at large. I'd boo yngwie too, if I was somehow subjected to him. This message has been edited by Sal Orlando on 10-12-2001 at 02:23 AM

[farrantaaol.com]

Not fictitious but true : Yngwie did a guitar clinic at my local music store a couple of years ago. I have known the owners for a long time and get to go see the shows and sometimes meet the players. I didn't meet Yngwie. Mr Malmsteen had a large mirror brought into his "dressing room" (The area normally used for vintage guitars) and proceeding to ponce about, preening himself, posing and ACTUALLY toasting himself in the mirror before his clinic. As you can appreciate, my opinion was still that he is an amazing, viruoso guitar player but that he was seriously in need of help !!!!!! If this story is true (which you could easily believe bearing in mind Yngwie's attitude) then I applaude and respect him for it. He would have deliberately alienated thousands of paying fans which could kill his sales in that country. He would have risked reprisal in the form of thrown objects, trashed equipment etc. Payola obviously hasn't overshadowed a strong sense of loyalty here. Terrorists are scum. Their supporters are scum. Although I am in the UK, I have a US flag flying on my desktop. If anyone wants to download it, you can find it at : stuart.messagemates.com By the way, Derek Sherinian's latest album is great - expected washy keyboard stuff but got Steve Lukather, Zack Wylde et al. Definitely worth the money.

[Tusker]

Hmmh, I find this interesting as a musician. If we assume that the crowd's behavior was triggered by the playing of The Star Spangled Banner, then.... Perhaps music is not as universal a language as we musicians would like it to be. Or at least it is one of those languages that carries imprecise and contextual meaning. Jerry ------------------ [url=http://www.tuskerfort.com]www.tuskerfort.com[/url]

[fury]

[quote]Originally posted by rold: [b] Things may have changed, thanks to the "war on drugs". Ask any south american villager who was living near a coca plantation when a US-sponsored crop duster sprayed Agent Orange all over their plantations. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] (Please note coca is used for a variety of purposes, in food, etc., not only for cocaine.) I have read reports and interviews of south americans complaining about losing all their food crops, livestock, their children and elderly getting respiratory problems and skin burns, though no one seemed to listen and the gov't refused (violently at times) to talk about it. For those who haven't seen my earlier posts, some health effects attributed to use of Agent Orange include: - child death - 7 various cancers - severe psychological and personality disorders - liver disfunction ...to name a few. To see a list of currently known effects, click [url=http://www.lyghtforce.com/HomeopathyOnline/Issue5/articles/ritchie_orange3.html]here[/url] : I am not an anti-american (have many good friends there), definitely do NOT sympathize with terrorists (I can't so much as kill a spider), but I cannot agree with campaigns such as this, and would understand anti-american sentiment *if* I were in their shoes. To me, food and healthy children are more important than any campaign, whatever the spin, and if those were removed from my family, I'd be quite angry and directing that anger at whoever took those away. PLEASE - whatever you don't do, next time elections come, do put foreign policy high on your priority lists when making a vote. DEMAND your candidates spell out their foreign policy initiatives word for word before you place your vote. Foreign policy can no longer be ignored; 09/11 is proof of that. Having said all that, I think the brazilian crowd was out of line. Peace to you all, Harold This message has been edited by rold on 10-11-2001 at 04:05 AM [/b][/quote]

[fury]

[quote]Originally posted by rold: [b] Things may have changed, thanks to the "war on drugs". Ask any south american villager who was living near a coca plantation when a US-sponsored crop duster sprayed Agent Orange all over their plantations. [img]http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif[/img] (Please note coca is used for a variety of purposes, in food, etc., not only for cocaine.) I have read reports and interviews of south americans complaining about losing all their food crops, livestock, their children and elderly getting respiratory problems and skin burns, though no one seemed to listen and the gov't refused (violently at times) to talk about it. For those who haven't seen my earlier posts, some health effects attributed to use of Agent Orange include: - child death - 7 various cancers - severe psychological and personality disorders - liver disfunction ...to name a few. To see a list of currently known effects, click [url=http://www.lyghtforce.com/HomeopathyOnline/Issue5/articles/ritchie_orange3.html]here[/url] : I am not an anti-american (have many good friends there), definitely do NOT sympathize with terrorists (I can't so much as kill a spider), but I cannot agree with campaigns such as this, and would understand anti-american sentiment *if* I were in their shoes. To me, food and healthy children are more important than any campaign, whatever the spin, and if those were removed from my family, I'd be quite angry and directing that anger at whoever took those away. PLEASE - whatever you don't do, next time elections come, do put foreign policy high on your priority lists when making a vote. DEMAND your candidates spell out their foreign policy initiatives word for word before you place your vote. Foreign policy can no longer be ignored; 09/11 is proof of that. Having said all that, I think the brazilian crowd was out of line. Peace to you all, Harold Hey Harold .....Why dont you try taking some of your own advise. Last time i looked , Drugs were illegal in your country too ...whats the matter, you people cant take care of your own problems, why dont you elect people who will stamp out the cancer you produce, so your government wont have to ask us to do it for you. By the way, do you think our crop dusters just showed up univited. This message has been edited by rold on 10-11-2001 at 04:05 AM [/b][/quote]

[rold]

[quote]Originally posted by fury: [b] Hey Harold .....Why dont you try taking some of your own advise. [/b][/quote] I do. [quote] [b] Last time i looked , Drugs were illegal in your country too ... whats the matter, you people cant take care of your own problems, why dont you elect people who will stamp out the cancer you produce, so your government wont have to ask us to do it for you. [/b][/quote] First, we don't ASK your government to help us, they BLACKMAIL us into "letting" them "help" us. Secondly, if you're referring to pot in your mention of "cancer", pot helps cancer patients alleviate their pain and suffering, helps them keep food down, helps them deal with the nausea from chemotherapy (to name a few), otherwise UNIMED pharamaceuticals wouldn't have created "Marinol", a synthesized version of the beneficial agents found in real pot. Pot DOESN'T *create* cancer, it is not a cancer as you so eloquently put it, rather it HELPS people suffering from cancer deal with their problems and the side effects of treatment. And thirdly, the reason the DEA and the white house think we need help is because the drug laws here aren't actively enforced, and with good reason. The people don't care. 67% of Eastern Canadians and 78% of western Canadians want it decriminalized. The cops, too, don't care. The Canadian Association of Police Chiefs have been lobbying to decriminalize pot, same with the Canadian Medical Association. You know why? [i] Because it is a relatively harmless drug. [/i] Your own surgeon general has said it is safer than aspirin. And there is no chance it is a "national security" problem like your government says it is - that is pure, dishonest garbage. [quote][b] By the way, do you think our crop dusters just showed up univited. [/b][/quote] I doubt they showed up invited. My guess would be they were pressured and blackmailed the same way every other country in the world who looks at legalization gets blackmailed - threats of trade sanctions and pay-offs for compliance. Otherwise, what are the chances of any government willing to let some other country come in and spray a nerve gas pesticide to eradicate crops that are only partially used to produce illegal drugs, while killing food crops and livestock, sickening and giving children cancer, and generally harming the environment over the foreign country's own failed and failing attempts at international control? Really sick policy, wouldn't you agree? This message has been edited by rold on 10-14-2001 at 05:33 PM

[Marvster]

[quote]Originally posted by Steve LeBlanc: [b]You might want to edit your post though because it's different than every other version of the story I've seen. You post is the only one that has the crowd chanting "Osama, Osama".[/b][/quote] Not my version, Big Guy, *Derek's* version. I simply posted his letter. :-) Marv