The Kurzweil PC1se has arrived!

[Ceasefire]

i now have a POWER STRIP!!! i'm a real keyboard player now hah

 

just took the doggies out of a long 3 hours walk so .. gotta do some chores, clean up this place a bit, but then it's me and the PC1se all afternoon baby

 

hoo waaa!

[ProfD]

Originally posted by Is There Gas in the Car?:

Originally posted by keysplease:

I don't know how much of a benefit... 5.5 to 10 inches would be...

I...

 

M U S T N O T C O M M E N T...

 

M U S T N O T C O M M E N T...

 

M U S T N O T C O M M E N T...

 

 

Is There Gas in the Car?

The NBA is way overrated. Who really wants to be a X-mas tree?

[Billdar]

Considering the interest in the marketplace and some great reviews of the PC-1se, I wonder if Yamaha might just come out with new 76 key S90ES "compact" this year. I think that it would give the Kurz some real competition if it was a bit lighter and had the mod wheels on top as well, which would eliminate a few inches of width.

 

But then I'd have major GAS, which I have been successfully avoiding of late!

 

Bill

[Dave Pierce]

bumping my question...

 

--Dave

 

Originally posted by Dave Pierce:

Originally posted by jimtheswede:

So far, I am really having fun playing with some of the synth sounds - really expressive and they just sound so great! I haven't checked any of the other newer romplers out there to compare, and I suppose I am late to the PC1/2 party, but I can't can't stop playing with some lead sounds like "Solar Lead".

Ceasefire and jimtheswede -- thanks very much for the nice reviews!

 

I would love to hear more about the synth sounds on this guy. When the PC1x first came out, I got all excited about trimming my rig down a bit. But after further thought, I concluded that I probably wouldn't be happy with ROMpler synths (I use an Alesis Micron VA today). So if I'm still hauling three boards, the rig isn't much trimmer.

 

But if I could get reasonable synth leads out of this, I would probably buy one in the next few months. I mainly use synth leads on old-school funk tunes, I don't really use pads or anything else.

 

As a comparison point, I absolutely loathe the synth patches on my Roland RD-700 -- they sound flat and lifeless to me. OTOH, I LOVE the Micron -- very analog like.

 

Thoughts, anyone?

 

--Dave

[ITGITC]

Originally posted by Dave Pierce:

I would love to hear more about the synth sounds on this guy.

 

But if I could get reasonable synth leads out of this, I would probably buy one in the next few months. I mainly use synth leads on old-school funk tunes, I don't really use pads or anything else.

 

Thoughts, anyone?

 

--Dave

Hi Dave.

 

I'm making the assumption that the programs for the PC1se are the same as on my PC2X.

 

If this is true, then here are the (five) synth programs:

 

35 FantAsmAtron

36 AtmAz

37 Celestial Comet

38 DYN Comper

39 Ruth Buzzy

 

There may be some synth SETUPS that I need to add to this list.

 

I haven't used these programs in performance, so I hesitate to offer an opinion as to whether they would work for you. Perhaps there are others here who will.

 

If you want additional information about the controllers used with these programs, they're listed at the end of the user's manual which can be downloaded from Kurzweil's site.

 

Tom

 

 

edit

 

WAIT!!

 

I forgot all about the additional synthsounds in Version 2 of the OS.

 

These include:

 

032 Janet's Comp

033 Mild Sheen

034 Scrape Glass

035 Air Society

036 Push Air

037 Alien Salt Mine

039 Imperfect Storm

 

I think all of these are synth programs, but I may be mistaken since I'm not at my PC2X. Not so sure about 032 Janet's Comp.

 

Again, there are SETUPs available. I can't tell which of these are synth setups without being at the PC2X.

 

PC2 Setups

 

001 Dance C7

002 Unison Line

003 Tek Jam C6->

004 Heavenly

005 Synth / E Piano

006 SmoothBass/Pads

007 Dads Bad Clav

008 Odyssey Pad

009 CenturyGroov C7

010 Oom pah pah

011 Contemplation

012 Brass & Strings

013 Dramatize

014 After Hours

015 Piano Trio

016 KB3 Setup

017 Touch Orch

018 One Man Trio

019 HolidayInnMiami

020 Ambients

021 CrypticNiteGlo

022 Seascape

023 Rhythmic Chase

024 Rhumba Combos

025 E Bass/E Piano

026 Babaganooj

027 Warm Fusion

028 Ostinato / Lead

029 Dr. Cranes

030 Perc/Organ Jam

031 VoxJazzCombo C7

032 Wheres Syd???

125 PC2R Control

126 Internal Voices

127 Clear Setup

128 Default Setup

----------------------

[Dave Pierce]

Thanks, Tom.

 

Damn. I've really got to find a store that has one of these babies for me to try out. GC isn't stocking Kurz anymore, and they seem to be the only Bay Area store that's stocking a reasonable supply of keyboards these days.

 

--Dave

[Finale]

[HAL voice] Dave, [/HAL voice]

 

In the PC2X (and probably in the PC1SE as well) you have at least 30 quite usable synth programs to choose from (excluding synth pads), since you also have some good synth presets under the "pop keys" and "clavier" categories. Some of them more for lead solos, some of them being monophonic, some of them synth bass very close to a true Moog sound.

 

But remember these are factory presets. With the help of the PC2 Manager freeware, you can build your own complex synth programs and set-ups, using what Kurzweil refer to as the "keymaps" or, in other words, the samples corresponding to VCO waves.

 

Speaking only of pure synth waves, you have :

• 4 sine waves
  
• 4 sawtooth waves
  
• 1 triangle wave
  
• 2 square waves
  
• 1 pulse wave
  

 

to choose from.

 

Remember that you can also mix synth waves with any other types of samples to create complex sounds. For example, you can use delay control on layers so to vary the timbre in time, à la Korg Wavestation (wavesequencing). And there are tons of other things to do playing with the Kurzweil available programmability. You can also assign whatever you want to any slider or button for each of your custom programs/set-ups.

 

Months/years of programming fun in perspective.

[ITGITC]

Thanks Cydonia.

 

I was going to say that, but I was waiting for you to chime in.

 

What took you so long?

[Finale]

Originally posted by Is There Gas in the Car?:

I was waiting for you to chime in.

 

What took you so long?

Had to go shovel about 3,5 metric tons of snow so I can get out of the house tomorrow.

[eric]

Originally posted by Cydonia:

But remember these are factory presets. With the help of the PC2 Manager freeware, you can build your own complex synth programs and set-ups, using what Kurzweil refer to as the "keymaps" or, in other words, the samples corresponding to VCO waves.

 

Speaking only of pure synth waves, you have :

• 4 sine waves
  
• 4 sawtooth waves
  
• 1 triangle wave
  
• 2 square waves
  
• 1 pulse wave
  

 

to choose from.

 

Remember that you can also mix synth waves with any other types of samples to create complex sounds. For example, you can use delay control on layers so to vary the timbre in time, à la Korg Wavestation (wavesequencing). And there are tons of other things to do playing with the Kurzweil available programmability. You can also assign whatever you want to any slider or button for each of your custom programs/set-ups.

 

Months/years of programming fun in perspective.

Question: Is all this VAST synth power (I think that is the Kurzweil nomenclature, right?) accessible from the keyboard UI itself, or does it require computer software to tap into it?

 

Question: How is the learning curve for making the most out of the Kurzweil?

 

Question: If someone wanted quick access to lots of synth sounds beyond the presets, are there some good 3rd party sounds available?

 

I ask these questions because I have very limited exposure to Kurzweil instruments. There are no dealers anywhere near me. I used a PC88 for a handful of shows a few years back as part of a backline rig and I also owned an ME-1 for a few months. Otherwise, I'm not well-versed in the Kurzweil technology.

 

Regards,

Eric

[Finale]

Hello Eric,

 

1 - In the case of the PC series, you have a somewhat limited access using only the UI. The freeware previously mentioned offers much more programmability. The trick is to assign what you need on the synth for your custom programs so that when you are finished programming the Kurz with the software, you have what you need available using sliders and buttons. For example, I may not be able to use the UI to custom assign sliders ABCD to the "ADSR" variables in a certain preset, but once I did this with the freeware, the sliders do what I want later in a live situation. Of course, the UI is not extremely limited either and offers other good performance controls.

 

2 - The learning curve is probably not so different than with any other synth but, as you said, the PC series relies in part on the VAST platform, which offers a tremendous amount of programmability. Using a 2500/2600 user's manual along with the PC manual is of great help.

 

3 - Anyone who creates a program in the PC series can import/export it using the PC2 Manager freeware. You can't add new samples though, as they are fixed in ROM. But the way you use and modify the fixed samples/keymaps (read : programs) can be imported/exported. You can also import K2500/K2600 programs in the PC2, given that they don't exceed a certain amount of layers (since the PC series are limited to 4 layers per program) and given they don't use elements that are not available in the PC series (like "Triple Mode" and so on). I personally could successfully import some interesting K2600 programs, and they worked just right.

 

Hope this helps.

[jimtheswede]

Eric (and Dave),

Don't worry - go ahead and buy one! I did, sight unseen, and I had only heard the demos on the Kurz website. I am in total bliss with this board. It has really inspired me to play - similar to my feeling with the Electro.

 

I am getting used to the action, and really love it! I liked the action on my Kurz SP76 piano that I was using as a controller - but the PC1se is better. It is probably lighter than many piano players might prefer, but I was raised on mostly synth/organ actions, so I'm glad the action feels so comfortable to play (it's better for my chops too).

 

I would describe the overall sound of this keyboard as very "warm", and I suppose the quality of the samples and effects certainly are part of this. The effects can add quite a bit to the sounds.

 

Dave, I have been playing with the synth sounds quite a bit since a got this a few days ago because they sound so full and "warm" and are just fun to play. It is a very expressive keyboard with some great presets, IMO. I don't know about getting that "analog" feel though. (It's not anything at all like my Microkorg) I mentioned the synth sounds in an earlier post because I had read somewhere that the synths were limited and kind of weak, but I was pleasantly surprised when I played some of them -very expressive and playable is how I would describe the programs. I was playing around last night (morning) with a moogish sound and started playing around with the effects....well, there goes another hour or more!

 

I have been staying up until 3-4 AM every night playing this thing since I got it. It is almost impossible to sound crappy on this board! The preset sounds may be limited, but I haven't had this much fun playing a keyboard since I got an ARP Odyssey back in 1975. Maybe I should explain that for the last 5 or so years I have been using a Roland JV1010 for pianos and brass controlled by a SP76 stage piano, so this Kurz is a huge improvement and a major GAS release - please excuse all public outbursts of ectasy!

 

I haven't had enough time to explore anything but the presets/setups - I need to find suitable presets for the gig Fri., so I am definitely not anyone to ask about editing the sound engine, or even the midi setups, but from everything I've seen and read, the board primarily was designed to be a live performance controller that is easy to configure - and I think Kurzweil accomplished that very well. I am looking forward to being able to call up setups to control both the Kurz and the Nord during a set.

 

Sorry if I sound too excited over this keyboard -it just seems to fit my needs and wants totally! I have not sought out all the other many romplers out there, but I hope this board will be in my rig for a long time.

Jim

[Parentz Peg]

Originally posted by jimtheswede:

[qb] Wow! This is almost spooky! I was going to post a thread about how excited I am about getting my PC1se that arrived yesterday, and gigging with my Electro 61 on top. I guess this idea could catch on quick! I haven't had much time to spend with it yet, but so far I am really impressed by the quality of the sounds, and the whole board itself, and yes, it looks pretty cool too!

[Parentz Peg]

I'm looking at the PC1se and also the Nord Electro 2. Unfortunately, I can only get 1 of them. I currently have a Yamaha DGX 202 and for a $300 keyboard it has some great sounds. I'm really a piano player though and love the weighted keys on the Kurzweil. But I need the Hammond B3 sounds for some of the songs I play. What do you think of the Hammond B3 sounds on the PC1se? We got a demo of one yesterday, and didn't get to experiment enough with the presets for the B3.

[David Loving]

Funny you'd bring it up about the pc1se, but I played a gig last night with a pc1x and an electro2/61 and it worked very well together. I played organ with the electro and everything else on the Kurzweil, with occasional rhodes and wurlitzer from the electro2 played on the Kurz's keyboard. I find the output signal from the nord a little weaker but I liked the set up a lot.

[Parentz Peg]

What do you think of the Hammond B3 sounds on the PC1se? I can only get 1 keyboard and only want to carry 1 around to gigs.

[David Loving]

The pc1x and the pc1se have the same sounds. I am not crazy about the stock pc1x organs which is why I brought the nord electro along.

[Parentz Peg]

 

Just curious about the B3 sounds in the PC1se. Without the drawbars, how many B3 versions are possible? Am going to the dealer to demo this week. Can you steer me how to find all the different B3's in the PC1se? When the literature says there are "7 rotary's", does that mean there are just 7 total B3 sounds?

 

The dealer also has a PC2X which has the KB3 mode with the sliders. Will the PC1se play all the same B3 sounds as the PC2X but it just lacks the sliders?

 

Now that you have had your PC1se awhile, how do you like it overall?

 

Thanks!

[Finale]

KB3 mode refers to a Kurzweil operational mode. Both PC1 and PC2 series instruments can play B3 sounds, but only the PC2 series has the KB3 mode.

 

KB3 is a special operating mode in which the sliders/buttons become drawbars and dedicated controls for the original Hammond percussion thingies and so on. You can then choose between several "B3 modeling" patterns, something that's replaced by normal "sample sets" in non-KB3 mode. To make a long story short, more possibilities in KB3 mode for organ sounds, sure, but you still have lots of possibilities in non-KB3 mode : several B3 keymaps (sets of samples), like the B3 wave for drawbar combinations 888000000, 888800000, 888888888, etc. You also have keyclick and sine wave keymaps to complete your personal programmation of B3 sounds without KB3 mode. You can also assign sliders or buttons to do things like "percussion on/off", drawbar preset changes or other stuff, and this without the KB3 mode.

 

The "seven rotaries" refer to the number of different Leslie emulation effects available in the effects menu. So you can create as many B3 programs/set-ups as you want in the User Bank.

[jimtheswede]

Well, I love the PC1se for what I am using it for - as a weighted controller for acoustic and elec. pianos, and brass/strings mostly. It replaced my aging SP76 stage piano/JV1010 combo. I really like the action on the PC1se - weighted (but not "sluggish") with a much more solid feeling compared to the springy Electro action. The elec. pianos are really good (as good or even better than the Electro's IMO), and it has some impressive capabilities as a live midi controller.

 

It really seems each keyboard has some definite strengths that cover for the other's weaknesses, and that includes the organs. I have barely played the PC1se organs (since I'm always using the Electro for organ), but I would not really like to use the Kurz organs for much more than comping, partly because of the weighted action, and partly because of what I think is an inferior leslie sim. I just think the Nord can't be beat for having a "B3 in a bag" - it's portability and "playablity" is in a class all it's own. I guess your choice might depend on just how much you will be depending on the Kurz for organs, versus the need for other sounds/features the Nord can't provide. Each board has some weaknesses - and I would say the organs are one of the PC1se's, but the Kurz has many other qualities that the Nord lacks.

 

I wish there was such a thing as the "perfect" one keyboard solution, but obviously I haven't found it! If all you need are great organs, Rhodes, Wurly's and Clavs, and limited acous. pianos, I think the Electro is pretty hard to beat as a one keyboard solution, especially considering it's size and fun factor. If you don't use the organ heavily, and need a quality piano sound with good action, in a very versatile board intended for live use, the Kurz might be the right choice. I'm just very lucky I now have one of each and don't have to make the choice between the two!

[execlass2]

Good luck with the PC1SE.

I sure would like to see a 76-key version on the new PC3 as well.

[jook]

The elec. pianos are really good (as good or even better than the Electro's IMO)

 

It's real nice to read about someone enjoying their gear so much. Still dying to hear some audio samples comparing the Rhodes and Wurlies on the PC1se and the Electro though!

[Parentz Peg]

Cydonia and Jimtheswede: Thanks to both of you. That's exactly the information we were looking for. I guess there never will be the perfect piano and organ in one unit because of the key action. Sounds like Kurzweil is at the top of the list for piano and Nord for organ.

 

Thanks!

[jimtheswede]

Jook - I haven't forgotten about the audio comparison, but just haven't found the time or the best way to do it yet. I have been wondering how to compare equally, given the many types of EPs you can load the Electro (I'll have to check to see which ones I've loaded into mine) vs. the preset voices on the PC1se. It's a project I'd love to contribute to the forum if I can.

 

Oh...here's my perfect keyboard.......I'd like to see a keyboard such as the new Nord Combo, except with a weighted bottom board for the Stage acoustic and EPs, and a top manuel with waterfall keys using the Stage Organs, Clavs, and synths! That would be pretty close to what I'd consider perfect (except I haven't found a Stage to play yet to justify my opinions). And, it would be red! :grin: I sure hope those swedes have one on the drawing board - it would be a huge success for them I'd imagine.

[onebee]

Well I'm jumping on the electro/pc1se bandwagon.

 

I'll have more free time than usual this weekend so when it arrives I'll do my best to host some samples and share my first impressions...

[zahush76]

i think that the pc1se sould not be compared with the nord electro 2 - but with the nord stage. the nord electro is a good instrument, but a limited one - compared with the stage. and the nord stage is a proper competition to the pc1se. the ep's on the stage are new samples - and are much better and more detailed than the nord electro's. and compared with the pc1se, it's also better. the stage's ep are more up to date - than the 4 year old sound card of kurzweil. and if live use is what you're after - than the stage has much more tweaking options. not to mention of course the b3 emulation which is the best on the market (besides the new c1, also by clavia).

[b3_john]

[snip] not to mention of course the b3 emulation which is the best on the market (besides the new c1, also by clavia).

And you say this because you've actually played a Nord C1?

 

John

[zahush76]

[snip] not to mention of course the b3 emulation which is the best on the market (besides the new c1, also by clavia).

And you say this because you've actually played a Nord C1?

 

John

 

well no, but it's a simple question of logic. the nord electro and the nord stage have the best b3 emulation - based on the majority of opinions, and i own a stage so i know.

as for the new c1 - they say it has an improved tonewheel emulation and that it's a new generation.

so now there are two options:

1)it's as good as the electro and the stage's b3 sound

2)maybe it's even better

and in any case it can't be worse

[WWW]

agreed! Gimme a Nord C1/Stage - basically a 2 tier stage with weighted keys on bottom and waterfall on top, and it lets you route organ, synth, clav, rhodes, wurly to either or both manuals.

Now THAT would solve a world of problems (especially if the bottom manual was 76 keys and the top, 61. Say GOODBYE to double keyboard setups.......

 

ARE YOU LISTENING CLAVIA???

[Billdar]

I'll second that request, Bill. That would be a killer rig. C'MON CLAVIA !!!