Need some input from the synth masters

[Bridog6996]

I just recently started diving into the world of synthesizers. Picked myself up a Juno 106, and I've been having fun playing around with it. Anyway, to the point. I'm trying recreate as closely as possible this particular sound (click the link for a short clip) from the piece "Mild und Leise" by Paul Lanksy. Some of you might recognize this clip, as the band Radiohead sampled it for their tune "Idioteque." I'd like to play this tune with my band, which is the reason for the question.

 

To you synth guys, is this something I can recreate on the Juno 106? I've been able to get somewhat close, but since I'm a noob to synths, it's basically just trial and error for me. I mean, I could just sample the chords, but I'd like to actually be able to play it if possible.

[gliderproarc]

Well I can't say I am a synth master, but I can say that I too would like to know how the sound was made.

 

At first it sounded like frequency modulation, but the tones seem to resemble the wavetables on my Prophet VS soft synth aswell. It might just be a patch that requires user mixing of waveforms to achieve the sound. It has a very 'digital' sound to it, you just need waveforms that match those timbres, a little LFO routing to get that slight vibrato, and you should be good.

 

I wish I knew what was going on on the keyboard during that line. Are the harmonics being triggered by the patch, or what the notes the player is using?

 

Good question. I would love to hear an answer.

[eric]

That sounds like a bell with a slow envelope. Juno 106 could do it, but I think you need 2 oscillators to get the tuning of the bell right. My JX8P has some presets that sound almost like that, but percussive. It also sounds like the DX7 tubular bells with slow attack.

 

The Juno has some bell sounds in the presets - basic analog bell sounds - not as metallic or realistic as the MP3. You could play around with these by upping the attack and simulate the sound.

 

Regards,

Eric

[Bridog6996]

The basic tone isn't so much the problem. I can get a bell-like tone that sounds pretty close, but it's still missing that "mettalic" quality that Eric mentioned. Like I said, I'm a real beginner with synthesizers.

 

A little more background on the piece: I was able to find out that Paul Lanksy recorded this piece in 1973, which must have been the very dawn of computer music. That was back in the days when a computer was the size of a small apartment and literally weighed a ton. I'm assuming this means that the technology used for recording the piece was fairly primitive compared to anything used today. Back then, I'm thinking they probably had to use punch cards to input information. So there probably wasn't any actual keyboard used. Maybe knowing that might help you guys put in context?

 

I'll keep plugging away at it. Thanks for the tips!

[ksoper]

Sounds like a ring modulator on...something. I know you probably don't want to have to buy another piece of gear to make the sound, but if you want to nail it, think about a ring mod. Moog makes a nice one.

 

k.

[Sven Golly]

Originally posted by Bridog6996:

A little more background on the piece: I was able to find out that Paul Lanksy recorded this piece in 1973, which must have been the very dawn of computer music. That was back in the days when a computer was the size of a small apartment and literally weighed a ton. I'm assuming this means that the technology used for recording the piece was fairly primitive compared to anything used today. Back then, I'm thinking they probably had to use punch cards to input information. So there probably wasn't any actual keyboard used.

Ummmm... perhaps in 1953 that might have been the case... as a point of reference, ARP released the ARP 2500 in 1970, and the Minimoog first came out around the same time. Hell, Switched On Bach was released in 1968! As for computers, the first Apple computer came out in 1975. Not exactly the dawn of time, here...

 

We now continue your regularly scheduled synthesis discussion, already in progress.

[Bridog6996]

Heh, guess I was a little off on my estimate of 70s technology. As you can tell, I wasn't alive at that time. Otherwise, I would have known better.

 

Edit: Just found this page (thanks Google) where Lansky himself gives some further insight into this piece. Interestingly enough, I was right about the punch cards! Still can't get my Juno 106 to sound like it though...

[Sven Golly]

Originally posted by Bridog6996:

Heh, guess I was a little off on my estimate of 70s technology. As you can tell, I wasn't alive at that time. Otherwise, I would have known better.

Hehehehe... no worries. As for the punch card guess, I was using punch (and bubble) cards well into the 80's, in my high school data processing classes using the PDP-11 microcomputer. Alas, this digresses from the purpose of this thread.

 

Still can't get my Juno 106 to sound like it though...

No, nor will you get it sounding exactly right... Lansky states in the article you linked to that the sounds were generated using FM synthesis; your Juno 106 uses subtractive synthesis. Given the complexity involved with FM synthesis, I'd suggest you just sample the sounds, otherwise by the time you get the programming figured out on an FM synth, you'll be old and grey.

[Jazzwee]

Originally posted by Bridog6996:

A little more background on the piece: I was able to find out that Paul Lanksy recorded this piece in 1973, which must have been the very dawn of computer music.

Hopefully my memory is ok (for the 30 and under crowd). This time in history was the beginnings of mass market use of computer chips. Calculators (scientific calculators) were getting common. I remember LED watches, Green CRT on computers (which meant the end of punched cards). This was the fuel for the make-you-own-computer era in the later 70's. Although the IBM PC did not show up until 1982, so called "mini-computers" were pretty common in the 70's.

 

From this maybe you can infer what could have been done in music at that time. Certainly there was a lot of spacey sounding music already like sounds in 2001 Space Oddyssey (1968). Remember Star Wars came out in 1977 so they were probably making that in 1974-1975.

[Bridog6996]

Getting back to something Sven said...yes, the Arp was around at that time, and so was the Minimoog. Synthesizers had been around for quite a while at that point. But even still, the idea of composing music using a computer, which is a different kind of animal, must have been a pretty new idea in 1973 right? That's all I'm saying.

 

Anyway, I think I'll just give up and sample the chords. After all, that's what Radiohead did, so if it's good enough for them.....

[midinut]

or find a used Yamaha DX-7 cheap!