Dak Lander Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 There will be some issues involved in file transfers. WAV files are just too large for many of the folks involved. MP3 files have that loss of quality that some people can hear. Alternatives? Shorten: FOR PCS FOR MACS MONKEY\'S AUDIO It's my impression, from the website that one program will run Monkey's Audio on both Mac and PC. If anyone has used Monkey's Audio on a Mac let us know. Linux is another matter I can't help with, nor can I help with BeOs. Our Joint "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it." The Duke... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nursers Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 Hiya Dak, I know dBunny swears by Shorten, haven't tried it myself though... The Keyboard Chronicles Podcast Check out your fellow forumites in an Apple Music playlist Check out your fellow forumites in a Spotify playlist My Music: Stainless Fields Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dak Lander Posted May 20, 2003 Author Share Posted May 20, 2003 HiYa back Nursers. I'm a Shorten fan too though the Monkey's Audio seems to be a great program too. We used it on a mixing exorsize similar to GT3's Mix-fest. It worked very well, very similar to Shorten. Damned fingers won't work sometimes....Maybe it was the RUM???? NAHHH! Our Joint "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it." The Duke... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big K Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 yea.. I think that the way to go is to use MP3 (what ever rate) then switch to wavs for the finial mix stuff. .. anyone used ogg vorbis?? my buddy said its the shit! cheer Kevin Nemrava Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brakka Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 Shorten is pretty great, and it's free for all systems. But you can't just email a Shortened track to someone. Hotmail allows 1024K max. I don't have any webspace, but I'm looking into it. I may just get some cheap space and give the password to everyone on my team for the duration of the project so everyone can upload. Other managers seem more than happy to use snail mail, but I'm not married to that yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_3guy Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 On the Mac graphics side of things, we use Stuffit to compress files. I've never tried it for wavs or aiffs . . . What about zip? Steve www.seagullphotodesign.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anifa Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 Originally posted by Brakka.: Shorten is pretty great, and it's free for all systems. But you can't just email a Shortened track to someone. Hotmail allows 1024K max. I don't have any webspace, but I'm looking into it. I may just get some cheap space and give the password to everyone on my team for the duration of the project so everyone can upload. Other managers seem more than happy to use snail mail, but I'm not married to that yet. Brakka, did you catch this post I made over in Craig's SSS in response to your last post in that thread? Anifa Platinum Member Member # 27160 posted 05-20-2003 01:57 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by Brakka.: Oh, that post was an idea for a collab project to try if the "fantasy league" idea fizzled, which it was at one point. I personally think six months is too long, but if teams are using snail mail, that might NOT be too long. A few days to listen and record, a few days in the mail- that's a week right there. Maybe we can shoot for three months (Sept. 1st) and adjust if we need to. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for the consideration Brakka; September is the month where school starts back up and book orders go in, then it leads directly into the holiday season which is non-stop until after New Years Day. I work for the Post Office as many already know... Delivery seems to be mostly on track after the Anthrax scare, as we are actually teamed with Fed Ex now for delivery. They are delivering the bulk of our Priority Mail and ALL of our Express Mail. Most people do not realize this. The main place where mail delivery is withheld is in the Washington, D.C. area where political figures might be targeted. I wouldn't mind hosting mp3's for all teams throughout the tracks process, web space permitting and considering the fact that the entries would not be overwhelming to upload. Fortunately, I'm on broadband. Depending on how much bigger this thing grows.... at this point, I could probably do this comfortably. There are others with web space who have volunteered space as well. The snail mail process will definitely slow down the plans, and also, if anyone knew the number of DAMAGED packages containing CD's and cassette tapes that I've witnessed in an 18 year career; they would hesitate making this the norm of delivery. I have an article written on my web site pertaining to haphazards of shipping media storage discs. The critical information begins about half way down the page. http://musicbizbuzz.net/trade/worldtradeetiquette.htm I'm not trying to diss the Post Office at all; most of the damage occurs due to improper address format or inadequate packaging; actually a customers non-compliance to address standardization and postal regulations. I'm going to try to stick to keeping Fantasy League posting over here in the Collaborator's Corner; as per request of Nursers. I guess that many of use feel that we are abandoning Craig's house because this league will keep us ALL very busy for the next few months. You can take the man away from his music, but you can't take the music out of the man. Books by Craig Anderton through Amazon Sweetwater: Bruce Swedien\'s "Make Mine Music" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim P. Dyndale Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 What about using WinRAR to compress normal 16bit .wav files? Or isn't there a version of RAR for Mac? -Joachim Dyndale -------------------- Einstein: The difference between genius and stupidity is: Genius has limits My Blog... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brakka Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 No macRAR, and I think Shorten is better. Hey Dak- So if you host mp3's for your team's project, how will people get them to you for you to put online? a 2 or 3 MB file is way too large to email as an attatchment. Interesting stuff there about the post office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anifa Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 Originally posted by Brakka.: No macRAR, and I think Shorten is better. Hey Dak- So if you host mp3's for your team's project, how will people get them to you for you to put online? a 2 or 3 MB file is way too large to email as an attatchment. Interesting stuff there about the post office.I have a friend in Ohio that I collaborate with occasionally, and also DAK and I have shared files on projects; we use email to transfer mp3's routinely. No problem.... at least not on a cable modem. AOL might boot you off, or take forever in the upload, but I have used dial up servers to transfer mp3's; just takes a lot longer. The problem would come in when trying to pass .wav files through electronic wire; not even the best servers out there will accept files this big... something in the range of being recorded at 1411kbps. As far as mp3 transfers; there might be persons involved that communicate through their jobs where maximum file transfer limits are in place. Government offices do NOT allow large files to be received as attachments, nor do they allow large files to be sent out. Also, hotmail accounts and cut rate ISP servers do not allow large file transfers; so that would probably let hotmail users and Juno type servers out. Anyone using any broadband servers or a recognized dial up ISP like AOL, MSN, Prodigy, and likewise would probably not have too many problems uploading their files; just a time factor for those on dial ups. You can take the man away from his music, but you can't take the music out of the man. Books by Craig Anderton through Amazon Sweetwater: Bruce Swedien\'s "Make Mine Music" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brakka Posted May 20, 2003 Share Posted May 20, 2003 So what service do you guys use for email? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anifa Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 Originally posted by Brakka.: So what service do you guys use for email?I'm on Road Runner/Host Depot. My Pop3 server (Incoming Mail Server) is hosted from my domain host at musicbizbuzz.net, and my SMTP server (Outgoing Mail Server) is Road Runner. I believe DAK uses Verizon, or at least that is what his address reads. Barrie has sent files through SBC DSL. I used to run AOL on a 56K dial up modem and the average download or upload of an mp3 about 3 minutes in length recorded at 128K took about 28 to 35 minutes to transfer, but it could be done. If you tried to run another browser simultaneously, you were GUARANTEED to get booted by AOL or to have your system crash. Some times you didn't need to be doing ANYTHING else; AOL was bad to time out, especially during moderately heavy traffic hours. You can take the man away from his music, but you can't take the music out of the man. Books by Craig Anderton through Amazon Sweetwater: Bruce Swedien\'s "Make Mine Music" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dak Lander Posted May 21, 2003 Author Share Posted May 21, 2003 I am on Verizon DSL. For the collaboration files probably the best way to go would be via ftp to a given site. The whole thing can be set up with a password so only the team members could upload or download. Shorten worked very well for that, as did the Monkey's Audio. Both de-compressed very well too. I could not detect any degradation in the sound files that were up and down loaded compressed and then un-compressed for import to the Program. Someone on the team would need to have enough server storage and bandwidth for the large amount of transfers that this type of collaboration will entail. I'd only suggest mp3s as a fairly quick way to get an idea to someone. For that a lower, say 64Kbps would probably suffice and maybe even a bit lower so modem uses could get a idea file without downloading all night long, as a wav would do. Only valid tracks would need to be ftp'd to the server for use. At 128Kbps a 3 minute tune will be roughly 3MB, at 64Kbps, 1.5MB and at 48Kbps just over 1MB. Sonically there probably won't be much of a difference between 48 & 64 but the time for modem users will be the factor to consider. I use SmartFTP. It's free for personal use. I've detected no spyware emedded in it and it's really a piece of cake to use. Our Joint "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it." The Duke... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brakka Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 I'm on a mac. There are good and bad things about that, let's not get into that here. I just signed up with HASweb. 200 MB Web Space, 4GB Bandwith/month , Unlimited FTP Accounts 24x7. It has an interface for uploading via browser, but I think that might be for me only. Still figuring things out... For mp3, I only have one program right now that makes them, and the lowest is 128. I'll look at other free mp3 mac programs today. Oh, I might still have SoundJam... I agree that mp3 is a good idea for early stages of the project. No point in wasting bandwidth for sharing ideas or if I need to have someone redo a track for some reason. Hopefully I'll get this all figured out by the time we draft. Sometimes it takes projects for me to get off my ass and learn stuff. I'll be learning A LOT doing this thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dak Lander Posted May 21, 2003 Author Share Posted May 21, 2003 Brakka, you migh try to download MusicMatch. It has a pretty functional demo and you can adjust the mp3 compression size easily. I don't know if it works with a Mac & even if it does it may be overkill for your use & there are probably other compressors out there that only compress and don't rip, record or have playlists built on. Huh? What did I just say???? Our Joint "When you come slam bang up against trouble, it never looks half as bad if you face up to it." The Duke... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addix Metzatricity Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 CDex (look at download.com) rips AND converts .wav to .mp3 (you specify the settings). It works very well. I used it exclusively before I went to MusicMatch (I only use that 'cause I like the jukebox). "Bass isn't just for breakfast anymore..." http://www.mp3.com/Addix_Metzatricity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brakka Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 Yeah, that's PC-only. I'll be able to find a free one for mac, it's on my list. I'm learning my new web service now, and trying to figure out email. I need to wait for the DNS to propagate before getting everything going. Not sure yet what the maximum file size for attatchments will be (my email choices are Horde and Neomail). What are max file sizes for other free browser-based email services? Anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addix Metzatricity Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 Pretty small... generally less than 1MB, unless you pay extra. "Bass isn't just for breakfast anymore..." http://www.mp3.com/Addix_Metzatricity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anifa Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 Originally posted by Brakka.: Yeah, that's PC-only. I'll be able to find a free one for mac, it's on my list. I'm learning my new web service now, and trying to figure out email. I need to wait for the DNS to propagate before getting everything going. Not sure yet what the maximum file size for attatchments will be (my email choices are Horde and Neomail). What are max file sizes for other free browser-based email services? Anyone?Brakka, who is your Internet Service Provider? Your new Host comes set with e-mail accounts; you just need to configure your ISP to meet the needs. You can take the man away from his music, but you can't take the music out of the man. Books by Craig Anderton through Amazon Sweetwater: Bruce Swedien\'s "Make Mine Music" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rim Posted May 21, 2003 Share Posted May 21, 2003 Originally posted by daklander: MONKEY\'S AUDIO It's my impression, from the website that one program will run Monkey's Audio on both Mac and PC. If anyone has used Monkey's Audio on a Mac let us know.I've only used Monkey's Audio on a PC, but just wanted to add Monkey's Audio and Shorten seem to give the same performance - around 50% compression with no loss of quality. aka riffing Double Post music: Strip Down http://rimspeed.com http://loadedtheband.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrave Posted May 22, 2003 Share Posted May 22, 2003 Dak's suggestions seem to be very good. My ISP has a size limit on email attachments but I have access to download space via FTP at my job and while I am behind a firewall (making it unavailable to the general public) I can transfer between my home machine and work machine and then to the Internet. The audio file compression utilities Dak is talking about also look pretty good (They're FREE! ) and that would help when sending our finished work to the manager's repository. I don't mean to jump in on this like I know what's going on but if I might, I'd kinda like to outline a process as I understand it so far. 1. Managers receive highest quality audio files. 2. Managers provide compressed (i.e. lossy) initial tracks and/or rough mixes. 3. Player receives/retrieves MP3 (or some similar compressed file) to build on. 4. Player provides high quality audio file of their work to manager/mixer/masterer. Is this even close? One last thought is that I personally would like to have maybe a MIDI file of the chord changes so I could see the structure a bit more clearly. Not absolutely but it'd be nice. It would be great if each team had an FTP repository as a central hub for their work to be sent. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ME: "Nobody knows the troubles I've seen!" Unknown Voice: "The Shadow do!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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