Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 I was hesitant to post this because of the lame factor but I respect the opinions of the members of this forum and would like your thoughts. Please be honest. Our new rhythm guitarist just sent me an e mail asking if he could bring his 6 year old to practice tonight. Here was my response. We tried this before with Maxs daughters and it just didnt work out. It gets too loud for them, they get restless, etc If they go downstairs then my wifes evening changes and I promised I wouldnt let that happen (again). Sorry. He then cancelled because his wife has plans tonight and she cant keep the 6 the old with her. No other explanation of what the emergency was, if there was one, etc. (not that it really mattered, that is his business). We all have kids and we are all able to figure it out. The practice is always scheduled for the same day. We have moved the practice day if someone needed it to be moved, but to cancel on the day of practice is poor form. The nice guy in me feels bad because I really want to keep this band moving forward and I worry that the rest of the band may think I am a prick. The thinking part of me feels like 1) this may not be a big enough priority for him 2) he didnt plan well and that is his problem, not mine 3) this may not be a big enough priority for him. 4) 6 year olds dont belong at a loud practice. 5) this may not be a big enough priority for him. Unfortunately it really is my problem now. I know this is not a new topic really; I just wanted a reality check from the gang here. Am I too short on patience? "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getz out Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Is this a bar band or a "I make my living playing in this band" kind of band? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanD Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 At age 3 I started to go to my fathers practices. The other band members had older kids and we played together. It was a large place so we could get away from the loudness. If his child is well behaved and can wear ear protection it should be fine. However if this is a release for some of the members it may not be fun and you have to draw the line somewhere. It really is up to the band. I would say take a vote to it. There are a lot of personality factors that go into this that cant be assesed via forum. Best of luck Ross. P.S. Although at age 6 cant the kid come close to taking care of themselves... do homework (1st grade right?) etc etc. I dont ahve kids so maybe I'm a little off:) Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 getz76 Loaded question. Doesn't matter to me which it is. Everything has to start somewhere. It is more difficult to add expectations latter than to start with them. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getz out Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Is this a bar band or a "I make my living playing in this band" kind of band? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 see above "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getz out Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Okay, so what are the plans for this band? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 My six year old is in bed at 7pm. If she stays up later and gets tired it is World War III in our house. Even if it is a Friday, it would ruin our weekend. We don't practice on a Friday because people like to go out. I guess his wife wants to go out too. How old are your kids Ross? What are they doing if your Wife is busy and you are practicing in your house? I guess they are older and you may have forgotten the complete nightmare that life is juggling what everyone wants to do. I think you are right though, his family should be able to run a diary. However in my experience Guitarists are often quite flaky in this respect. Must be the artistic temprement Practice without him, and talk to him in a couple of days when you are in a better frame of mind. Emails whilst being good are not the best form of communication. He should have called you and talked in the first place. Feel the groove internally within your own creativity. - fingertalkin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by getz76: Okay, so what are the plans for this band? Sorry if I seem deflective. The plans for the band are to play out (for money) 3-4 times a month, which is doable around here. Bars? yes. Other venues? I hope so. Do we make our living doing this? No. I am at a different place, I guess. I tend to bust my butt when working on something I want to be successful at. Maybe a little too much type A personality but it is just the way I am wired. I am actually very flexible and reasonable and respectful of everyone's time. I don't view this as something that I do if nothing better comes up. It really is like a second job to me, even if just for the sake of playing and doing it right! "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyC Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 We solved the a similar problem (guitar player's wife worked evenings) by moving the practice to his house so he wouldn't have to pay a babysitter to practice. Isis, Isis, Ra Ra Ra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenstrum Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Yes and No. Yes, you are being unreasonable. Crap happens even with the best laid of plans. Sometime practices have to get canceled because life intervenes. And it has always been my theory that your family ALWAYS comes first. No, you are not being unreasonable. A loud practice is no place for a 6 year old and you don't provide baby sitting duties. My advice: Be reasonable with your requests for practice and what is expected. If he can't live up to that, then find someone else. But make sure EVERYONE is on the same page. Tenstrum "Paranoid? Probably. But just because you're paranoid doesn't mean there isn't an invisible demon about to eat your face." Harry Dresden, Storm Front Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butcherNburn Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Be as diplomatic as you can but follow your gut. It's not cool to cancel practice on practice day but it happens. At least he asked before just dragging her along. It's hard to do but, as long as everyone doesn't think about this a whole lot, it won't be a problem looking forward. It's when we all stew in our juices the meat falls apart. If you think my playing is bad, you should hear me sing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by Tenstrum: Yes and No. Yes, you are being unreasonable. Crap happens even with the best laid of plans. Sometime practices have to get canceled because life intervenes. And it has always been my theory that your family ALWAYS comes first. No, you are not being unreasonable. A loud practice is no place for a 6 year old and you don't provide baby sitting duties. My advice: Be reasonable with your requests for practice and what is expected. If he can't live up to that, then find someone else. But make sure EVERYONE is on the same page. One practice a week, on Friday unless a conflict occurs, then another day, if possible. Reasonable. I agree things happen and families do come first. this feels like poor planning/different priority. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getz out Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Once a week on Friday... was the rehearsal for an upcoming show that required a rehearsal, or just a standing rehearsal date? If it was just a standing rehearsal date and the guitarist called to cancel after trying to work out a situation with family, then yes, I would say you are unreasonable. If you want a strict band schedule with people who will treat the band as a job, you should find those types of players to fill out the band. Be prepared to pay them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by getz76: Once a week on Friday... was the rehearsal for an upcoming show that required a rehearsal, or just a standing rehearsal date? If it was just a standing rehearsal date and the guitarist called to cancel after trying to work out a situation with family, then yes, I would say you are unreasonable. If you want a strict band schedule with people who will treat the band as a job, you should find those types of players to fill out the band. Be prepared to pay them. Absolute passion for playing is what I guess I am looking for from the folks I play with. Maybe a fantasy. If someone were scheduled to receive a million dollar prize tonight at rehearsal they would likely be there. Not the same thing, but speaks to setting priorities. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getz out Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 It sounds like you are looking for employees. These are people that usually want to get paid. I am still unsure; what is the purpose of the rehearsal. Do you have a gig lined up? If not, why not? Are you doing cover songs or originals? It sounds like there might be a lack of direction in the band. If you are asking a guy to leave his 6-year-old daughter to rehearse with a band with no gigs... I remember the thread about the band and money. My view... if you are in a cover band and you have competent players, you should be able to show up to a rehearsal and be in near-gig form. Rehearsal in a cover band should be to work out kinks, not perform major work. If you cannot do this, then it is most likely either some or all of the players are not cut out for a serious/semi-pro cover band. If that is the case, I highly doubt you will get the level of dedication you desire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 No gigs lined up. The guy that cancelled is the guy that needs the most work to come up to speed for the covers. I agree with you that it shouldn't take a lot to "play" the covers as a band. Also, we still need a real singer. So perhaps it is unreasonable to expect any serious committment from someone that isn't being paid to show up. Sorry for the sarcasm but I just don't get it. If 4 or 5 people are trying to get together to accomplish something (a gigging band) and they meet only once a week, it really doesn't work for it to be a first line option to cancel. The odds don't work for the goal to be met any time soon. Someone will always be missing. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lug Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Child + http://www.rubinville.com/dailydave/uploaded_images/nyquil-745340.jpg Problem solved...next? You can stop now -jeremyc STOP QUOTING EVERY THING I SAY!!! -Bass_god_offspring lug, you should add that statement to you signature.-Tenstrum I'm not sure any argument can top lug's. - Sweet Willie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted January 5, 2007 Author Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by lug: Child + http://www.rubinville.com/dailydave/uploaded_images/nyquil-745340.jpg Problem solved...next? Thanks.... I needed that. Maybe I'll take some too, just to tone it down a little. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Iverson Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 These ARE issues. I still play occasionally with a guitarist I used to be in a band with, but it's hard to practice at his house now because his kids interrupt him with "daddy, daddy..." a lot. Even when you tell them, "hey look, your daddy is working now on something. Please let us practice. Don't you have some video games you can play with?" These are not obnoxious brats.. they just don't seem to understand that we're not just messing around for fun. And since they're not mine, I can't really tie them to a chair and stuff a rag in their mouths! (No I'm not a sadist into torturing children. I just want them to go play elsewhere for a little while!) Hopefully we can practice over at the flute player's house in the future, whose wife can watch HIS kids - at least in theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lug Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by Ross Brown: Originally posted by lug: Child + http://www.rubinville.com/dailydave/uploaded_images/nyquil-745340.jpg Problem solved...next? Thanks.... I needed that. Maybe I'll take some too, just to tone it down a little. No need to thank me, I put my pants on the same way as everybody else, one leg at a time. Only, once my pants are on, I make gold records. You can stop now -jeremyc STOP QUOTING EVERY THING I SAY!!! -Bass_god_offspring lug, you should add that statement to you signature.-Tenstrum I'm not sure any argument can top lug's. - Sweet Willie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yourlord Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 We have similar problems in our band. Everyone in the band has wives/kids. We practice at my house, and it drives my wife nuts when the other band members bring their kids/wives over with them. Our kids can play upstairs and she'll watch em just fine, but when the other members bring the fam over they invariably destroy the house unless my wife plays the role of warden. I'm a hard ass when it comes to practice. We only practice once a week, and we adjust the time however we need to in order to allow everyone to be there. But at the same time, family is more important than a band. If this is not a pattern I wouldn't freak out. If it becomes a pattern then you'll need to have some hard conversations and make some hard decisions. Blowing off practice because your wife has to take a final, visit her dying parents, etc, is one thing. Blowing off practice because your wife wants to get her toe nails painted is crap. Feel free to visit my band's site Delusional Mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
getz out Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by yourlord: Blowing off practice because your wife has to take a final, visit her dying parents, etc, is one thing. Blowing off practice because your wife wants to get her toe nails painted is crap. Keep up that type of mentality and you start to notice that the pool guy is always at your house, but you don't have a pool... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerk Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 This doesn't help with the immediate problem, but maybe you should see if there is a dependable teen living as close to your house as possible, that might be interested in being the 'band' sitter when needed, in thier house.....for a price. Sometimes money has to be invested in stuff other than gear. A week of practice lost, is a weeks gig lost, unless you double up in order to catch up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeronyne Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by yourlord: Blowing off practice because your wife has to take a final, visit her dying parents, etc, is one thing. Blowing off practice because your wife wants to get her toe nails painted is crap. Are you for real? Do people really still think like this? Are you married? "For instance" is not proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil W Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Wives definitely need looking after. I think you should leave it some time to cool off. Is it a regular thing or is this a one off; there may be a valid reason. Personally, I don't generally rehearse with a band I'm already playing with too often unless the money is considerable, there's a bunch of new arrangements or a new member. If I told my wife I was off to rehearse every week for no pay and no gig I'd be out on my butt! I'm guessing that one of the main reasons you rehearse every week is that you are not gigging so the rehearsal is, for you guys, the positive musical experience. You rehearse partly because that's a chance to play. I'm not saying this to be confrontational, honestly, and I'm probably picking the worst time to say that as you're still sore. You are completely right that a Friday night rehearsal is not an appropriate place for a six-year old and you're wife being pressed into baby-sitting is not a happy or viable option. I try to never cancel out on something the same day but I'm guessing that the guy had some pressing reason and you should cut him a little slack provided it doesn't become a habit. Send him a CD witha bunch of new songs to learn or something similar to catch up. Chill a little Ross, give it a little time then think again. We all have our crises occasionally. All the best, mate! http://philwbass.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy c Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 I don't see why the six year old can't sit in a corner with a gameboy and some really good earphones. If it doesn't work out, then you can gently suggest that he doesn't try it again. Once I almost brought my son as a two year old to a gig because the babysitter canceled. Twenty-two phone calls later I got another babysitter, who got there one minute before I had to leave the house in order to get to the gig on time. Relax a little, Ross. Free download of my cd!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerk Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Ross, As an added note....I would rather cancel practice than allow kids there. I feel that the person providing the rehearsal space, and who assumes the hassles that go along with it, should not be asked to provide a place to entertain others kids. I had 3. I would not have considered taking them to rehearsal when they were young. They are a 'distraction'. It is better to be one member short and work on what ever you can (tightening up beginnings and endings, harmonies, etc.) than to have the whole band distracted and interupted by the kids. There is always 'homework' too. I'm sure your missing member has some that he can be attending to while he is absent. It's better than nothing. When I work with a band, it seems I spend twice as much time on 'homework', as I spend on band rehearsal. If everyone does, then rehearsal is much more productive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil W Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 "I don't see why the six year old can't sit in a corner with a gameboy and some really good earphones." A portable DVD player has been a great purchase for me in this type of situation. http://philwbass.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yourlord Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Originally posted by getz76: Keep up that type of mentality and you start to notice that the pool guy is always at your house, but you don't have a pool... Originally posted by zeronyne: Are you for real? Do people really still think like this? Are you married? I am married. My wife would never even attempt to schedule something as inconsequential as getting her nails done during our scheduled band practice. She just wouldn't go there. It's no different than when she goes out with the girls she works with at the office. They plan it, and I make sure I'm available to watch the kids so she can go. If you're married and your wife would force you to miss a band practice so she can get her nails painted then she is more selfish than I could stand to be married to. That would be like me telling her she can't go to a meeting for a club she was in (or something similar) because I want to polish my bass that night. It's ridiculous on it's face. IF his guitarist's wife had something important to do, and he couldn't make it because he has to watch his kid then no big deal. If he misses 3 practices every month because his wife is getting her hair done then there is a problem. How do any of you ever get anything done in a band if any particular person's wife/SO at any given time can derail every single practice session? I don't expect absolute commitment above anything else in the world. But I do expect commitment. The band has the commitment of me and my family. Everyone else set aside their time, brought their gear, etc, and their SO's made sacrifices so they could attend practice. If one of the members doesn't at least make an attempt at showing up to most of the sessions it's not what I would call fair to the rest of the band, or their families. S**t happens, but it doesn't happen every week. Feel free to visit my band's site Delusional Mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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