If your DAW doesn’t have stem separation yet…

[ElmerJFudd]

Moises as a VST with a download and try. 
 

https://moises.ai/features/stems-vst-plugin/

 

The software machines they’ve built for this is getting implemented all over the place so only a matter of time before it’s standard feature.  

[Kawai James]

Does Moises perform the stem separation on the computer itself, or is the audio uploaded and manipulated within the cloud?

[ElmerJFudd]

31 minutes ago, Kawai James said:

Does Moises perform the stem separation on the computer itself, or is the audio uploaded and manipulated within the cloud?

I have up try the vst.   I’ve not installed their software, only used the browser version such does accept uploads.  

[D. Gauss]

Every DAW ever made has "stem separation."  It's called tracks and faders, and mute/solo/pan.

[Tusker]

Thanks for sharing it. Seems quite mind-blowing. The value seems to hinge on the quality of audio separation.

 

I could see it being invaluable as a practice tool, or for creating backing tracks for casual vocalists. But is it useful for creating professional quality content? Am I missing other useful workflows?

[ElmerJFudd]

10 minutes ago, Tusker said:

Thanks for sharing it. Seems quite mind-blowing. The value seems to hinge on the quality of audio separation.

 

I could see it being invaluable as a practice tool, or for creating backing tracks for casual vocalists. But is it useful for creating professional quality content? Am I missing other useful workflows?

Well, it depends on what the professional quality content is.  Remember, sampling has been prevalent in popular music for decades now, and many very successful recordings in various popular genres are purposefully not using samples of great resolution or fidelity.  In fact, sampling from records with the flaws of the medium (scratched vinyl, aging needle) are instantly recognizable because the samples aren't perfect.  Creative people will destroy a sample to find a unique sound.  There are plugins for distortion, analog tape modelling, lo-fi, bit crushing, etc.  All purposefully employed. 

 

Stem separation quality will likely improve, probably using some algorithms to rebuild data that is lost or wasn't even present.  But there surely will be music released that uses samples created with stem separation.  Once the tool is there, creative people will use it.  

[Tusker]

Sure, there was a lot of creativity in sample usage and there will be creative uses with this today. We can look forward to some entertaining lawsuits!

 

I could see using it to deconstruct well known recordings. Isolate and reharm a Sinatra "My Way" here and garnish it with a "Goo goo a joob" from the Beatles there. Parody and humor may be the first fruits. Let's see what happens.

 

 

[AnotherScott]

5 hours ago, D. Gauss said:

Every DAW ever made has "stem separation."  It's called tracks and faders, and mute/solo/pan.

 

Sure, a stem is basically a submix. But the goal here is to extract (separate) a stem out of a completed mix.

[zeronyne]

The new one in the MPC OS is basic but very very usable. They did not overengineer it with esoteric features or a complex UX. 

[Docbop]

Came across this last night and nice comparison of the Serato and MPC stem software.   Differences but no clear winner. 

 

 

[ElmerJFudd]

5 hours ago, Tusker said:

Sure, there was a lot of creativity in sample usage and there will be creative uses with this today. We can look forward to some entertaining lawsuits!

 

I could see using it to deconstruct well known recordings. Isolate and reharm a Sinatra "My Way" here and garnish it with a "Goo goo a joob" from the Beatles there. Parody and humor may be the first fruits. Let's see what happens.

 

 

I think you’re probably right, as we’re seeing with vocal timbre mimics and sound alike counterfeit recordings.  Social media is filled with them - some are lousy, some funny and some are close enough to fool the most discerning ears.  
 

https://lalals.com/

 

https://www.acestudio.ai/

 

This is also a legal gray area until laws catch up.  What does it mean to “steal” the timbre of a singer’s voice?  Plenty of singers without an established name would love to be absorbed by the software - to be paid a one time fee, or to have a licensing fee for use in commercial recordings.  And some established artists may be willing to license their timbre while others may hate the idea and look for legal ways to shut it down.  I don’t know how long it’s going to take to get some rules for this playing field.  
 

Extracted vocal lines or instrumental parts, re-purposed for commercial recordings. There are already rules in place for sampling that apply here.     

[Docbop]

Legally sampling is a minefield, but most artists using samples are getting clearance for them and most not artist are approving the clearance.   Where that can and does get ugly there are no laws about amount of payment for using a cleared sample the artist can ask for as much as they want.   One famous Hip Hop tune used a handful of samples and one of the shortest samples they used was the bass pattern off Lou Reeds Walk in the Wild side.  At first Reed refused to clear the sample then came back and said I will clear it for 100% of the royalty.  The group was behind schedule and tune they thought was going to just be a filler track so they agreed. The tunes ended up their biggest hit and they have made zero from it.   

 

Now others if they don't get a clearance and they feel the sample is key to the record will rerecord the music.   The engineers that do this are scary good with amazing ears.  Kanye's engineer has had to do it a few times for Kayne tunes.   He will rerecord a sample right down to slightly out of tune guitar strings and synths.  If a rerecording no clearance is needed. 

 

Now what I've done and is to take a drum sample that grooves like crazy then most DAW's today have audio to MIDI convertors and converted and groovy drum track to MIDI and just use whatever drum sounds I want.   So I wonder if that will be considered a rerecording?  Yes, the legalities of ownership with modern tools is going to interest how judges rule on them.  

[David Emm]

24 minutes ago, Docbop said:

Legally sampling is a minefield

 

The longer I've seen that mess unfold, the less I've considered the idea worthwhile. Sure, its unfortunate that you can't drop in a moment here or there as an homage, but why sully my own juices with an entirely avoidable external battle? I can write reasonably well without needing to lift diddly from elsewhere. The less "legal" you can make it, the better your art will smell.

 

I think it was BT who said "The music business is a den of sin and inequity, but there's a downside, too."     

[D. Gauss]

5 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

 

Sure, a stem is basically a submix. But the goal here is to extract (separate) a stem out of a completed mix.

 

Exactly my point. You do not need a DAW for this.  Plenty of dedicated, stand-alone and online tools for that.

[ElmerJFudd]

29 minutes ago, D. Gauss said:

 

Exactly my point. You do not need a DAW for this.  Plenty of dedicated, stand-alone and online tools for that.

Yes, the code for this is fairly new and developers have jumped on using what has been shared as open source to build their own software tools (which a lot of us are already using) - the most obvious uses for me have been for faster transcribing by ear or creating play along tracks for practice (just bass and drums for example).  I have not been very interested in using it as a compositional tool... but remix makers have been dying to have tech that provides them solo vocal stems from artists who do not release them.  And now we are starting to see how MPC style music producers will take these extracted parts and slice them up into short samples to write new things with.  

 

Who are the first DAW developers to see this is a feature DAW owners will want inside the DAW?   FL Studio, MPC Stems, Serato Studio, MixCraft, RipX DAW, Audacity and I am sure there are others that will have it within the year.  It's just another feature of digital music editing that was not possible (or at least not reasonably easy to do with useful results) before.  So, the feature is just a new tool that will be added like others before it.... pitch correction, time stretching without altering pitch, editing the pitch of individual notes within a complex audio recording (melodyne), or changing the timbre of a singer to sound like another, AI mixing and mastering.

[Polychrest]

2 hours ago, David Emm said:

I think it was BT who said "The music business is a den of sin and inequity, but there's a downside, too."     

 

“The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side.”

 

Hunter S. Thompson