What matters MOST with Guitar Tone?

[AROIOS]

7 hours ago, Anderton said:

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If it was called "sustainwood," we wouldn't be having this discussion   Denser woods do make a difference with sustain, because less of the string energy is transferred to the wood through the bridge.
...

This reminds me of a comment from Joe Pass decades ago about building an ideal guitar body out of a piece of train rail.

[AROIOS]

1 hour ago, The Real MC said:

 
Les Paul had done that back in the 1920s or 1930s.  He didn't build a body, he took a piece of train rail, installed a pickup on it, and stretched guitar strings over the pickup with bridge and nut saddle.

...Have you any idea how HEAVY those train rails are?!?  They are ordered by weight per foot, and the smallest one would be 60 pounds per foot.

Great tone and a nice workout, a true win-win!

[Notes_Norton]

Train rail - whew! Do they use railroad ties for frets? 😉

 

I read that someone made a few guitars out of Lucite, and they were also way too heavy to be practical. I wonder if they improved sustain.

 

I saw a video years ago about a guy who made a strat out of cardboard, and it still sounded just like a strat.

 

My Parker DF weighs about 5 pounds. Part of the reason I chose that guitar was the weight. I play sax, wind synth, flute, guitar, tactile MIDI controller, and vocals on the gig. That means a lot of ||: putting one instrument on the stand, picking up another, :|| repeat as needed. Weight becomes a factor.

 

I was playing an 8 pound Less Paul (imitation Les Paul by LTD) and the Parker sustains longer than the LTD.

 

There are a lot of other things I like about the Parker too.

 

Although I played a little guitar since I was young, mostly barre chord rhythm in bands when there was no sax part, and I doubled on bass, I picked up guitar seriously later in life. It's a whole new adventure, and I'm having a lot of fun learning how to do different things with the strings (and the fingers).

 

Notes ♫

[KuruPrionz]

2 hours ago, Notes_Norton said:

Train rail - whew! Do they use railroad ties for frets? 😉

 

I read that someone made a few guitars out of Lucite, and they were also way too heavy to be practical. I wonder if they improved sustain.

 

I saw a video years ago about a guy who made a strat out of cardboard, and it still sounded just like a strat.

 

My Parker DF weighs about 5 pounds. Part of the reason I chose that guitar was the weight. I play sax, wind synth, flute, guitar, tactile MIDI controller, and vocals on the gig. That means a lot of ||: putting one instrument on the stand, picking up another, :|| repeat as needed. Weight becomes a factor.

 

I was playing an 8 pound Less Paul (imitation Les Paul by LTD) and the Parker sustains longer than the LTD.

 

There are a lot of other things I like about the Parker too.

 

Although I played a little guitar since I was young, mostly barre chord rhythm in bands when there was no sax part, and I doubled on bass, I picked up guitar seriously later in life. It's a whole new adventure, and I'm having a lot of fun learning how to do different things with the strings (and the fingers).

 

Notes ♫

Ampeg made guitars and basses with clear Lucite bodies. Keith Richards of the Rolling Stones played one for a while. 

I've played them, great guitars but too heavy for gigging in my opinion. I also prefer lighter guitars. 

My brother has a Parker Fly, one of the early ones. I like it, nice and light. 

 

One year at NAMM long ago, Ibanez had one of their Artist series guitars mounted on a heavy duty stand. It was solid brass, the entire thing. Great sustain but crazy. Cool marketing prop for NAMM though...

[Anderton]

1 hour ago, KuruPrionz said:

Ampeg made guitars and basses with clear Lucite bodies. Keith Richards of the Rolling Stones played one for a while. 

I've played them, great guitars but too heavy for gigging in my opinion. I also prefer lighter guitars. 

The Ampeg ones were re-issues of the original Dan Armstrong models. I have one that was worked on by Dan himself, along with a prototype pickup for country music (the guitar had slide-in pickups, so you could change them) that was never released commercially. It's quite the collector's item

 

I used the guitar for Mandrake's last gigs after my beloved Rickenbacker was stolen, and yes, the sustain was great. The biggest problem was playing smaller clubs with hot, variable lighting because the plastic responded and the guitar went out of tune. Luckily, the relatively heavy gauge strings I use seemed to mitigate that somewhat. Also, around that time we were doing a lot of larger-size outdoor venues, so any lighting wasn't close up, and the air around the guitar was ventilated by natural airflow.

[CEB]

I have and do own a lot of guitars.  Too damn many.  But the guitar that out sustains anything I ever had in the herd was a very early Candy Apple Red Japanese Strat that I installed a Dimarzio X2N in the bridge.  Anything with an X2N will sustain, even if its made of plywood.  LOL.

 

I loved that Strat.  It got stolen in 87 along with my old Les Paul.  It still makes me sick.  That Les Paul is now worth more than my house.

[CEB]

Those Lucite guitars are friggin back breakers ..... No, just nope maybe when I was 20.

[KuruPrionz]

2 hours ago, Anderton said:

The Ampeg ones were re-issues of the original Dan Armstrong models. I have one that was worked on by Dan himself, along with a prototype pickup for country music (the guitar had slide-in pickups, so you could change them) that was never released commercially. It's quite the collector's item

 

I used the guitar for Mandrake's last gigs after my beloved Rickenbacker was stolen, and yes, the sustain was great. The biggest problem was playing smaller clubs with hot, variable lighting because the plastic responded and the guitar went out of tune. Luckily, the relatively heavy gauge strings I use seemed to mitigate that somewhat. Also, around that time we were doing a lot of larger-size outdoor venues, so any lighting wasn't close up, and the air around the guitar was ventilated by natural airflow.

Right, the Dan Armstrong models are the ones I was thinking of, long ago in Fresno a music shop had one and a couple of extra pickups. I sort of wanted it and at the same time I disliked it because heavy. 

The Travis Bean and Kramer guitars with the aluminum necks had thermal stability problems as well, there's a video of Flock of Haircuts playing I Ran live and the guitarist is using a Kramer that quickly goes out of tune under the lights. 

[Ivan May]

What matters most about guitars is who plays them, and the different amps and guitars they used.

 

Springsteen, Brad Paisley and Keith Richards all play Telecasters, using largely Vox AC30 amps, Slash and Gary Moore both played Les Pauls through Marshall amps, and Jimi Hendrix played Strats through Fender and Marshall amps. But it all depends what guitars and amps YOU own, doesn't it?

 

I can't sound like Hendrix worth a shit, but I can play guitar just as good as he did.

[Anderton]

I think Jeff Beck would be recognizable as Jeff Beck even if he was playihg a ukulele

[Ivan May]

Just now, Anderton said:

I think Jeff Beck would be recognizable as Jeff Beck even if he was playihg a ukulele

John Lennon began his career playing a banjo. Even if John was playing a banjo, you'd still be able to tell John's rhythm guitar riffs if he were playing them on a banjo!

[KuruPrionz]

1 hour ago, Anderton said:

I think Jeff Beck would be recognizable as Jeff Beck even if he was playihg a ukulele

Jeff Beck can probably draw feedback from an acoustic ukulele. 

[Notes_Norton]

16 hours ago, Anderton said:

I think Jeff Beck would be recognizable as Jeff Beck even if he was playihg a ukulele

IMO Jeff Beck is the most technically accomplished guitarist in pop music.

 

I watched a video "Live At Ronnie Scott's" long ago, the camera crew must have been guitarists, because they zeroed in on his hands when he was doing things mere mortals cannot do on the guitar. As a sax player that got 'almost famous', I've had the pleasure of playing with some top-shelf guitarists, so my jaw does not drop easily. That video dropped my jaw.

 

I've always liked Jeff's music, the technical skill plus his talent puts him there as one of my favorites.

 

Insights and incites by Notes ♫

[AROIOS]

As this guy finds out, you can build a great sounding guitar body out of...

A workbench, some 2x4s, two dead Honda motocycle engines, and Tone Air. 😃
 

Thank God, some Good Samaritan in the comment section has already found the exact models of engines used to get that sound:

"For those wanting to replicate the last guitars tone at home, the first red engine appears to be from a 1987 Honda XL250R (twin carb) and the second silver engine is from a 1979 Honda XL500S single cam. Enjoy"

[Notes_Norton]

Tuned exhaust pipes might help even more.

[Anderton]

He's an idiot. Everyone knows Suzuki engines have a warmer sound. Honda's probably slipping him money under the table.

[Greg Mein]

24 minutes ago, Anderton said:

He's an idiot. Everyone knows Suzuki engines have a warmer sound. Honda's probably slipping him money under the table.

If you're not using a 1977 Shovelhead with a kick start why even bother?

[GovernorSilver]

On 8/2/2022 at 3:59 PM, Anderton said:

I think Jeff Beck would be recognizable as Jeff Beck even if he was playihg a ukulele

 

"In the music world, they say there are two types of rock guitarist.  1.  Jeff Beck.  2. Everyone else" - from a comedy about high school kids starting a rock band

 

Have you seen his tribute to Les Paul?  Quite a departure from what he's known for playing on his Strat.

 

 

 

 

 

[KuruPrionz]

5 hours ago, GovernorSilver said:

 

"In the music world, they say there are two types of rock guitarist.  1.  Jeff Beck.  2. Everyone else" - from a comedy about high school kids starting a rock band

 

Have you seen his tribute to Les Paul?  Quite a departure from what he's known for playing on his Strat.

 

 

 

 

 

Jeff Beck stands tall on his own mountain, I can't think of a better rock and roll guitarist and he isn't limited to just that genre by any means. 

[GovernorSilver]

18 hours ago, KuruPrionz said:

Jeff Beck stands tall on his own mountain, I can't think of a better rock and roll guitarist and he isn't limited to just that genre by any means. 

 

His playing on the covers of the Les Paul & Mary Ford tunes were real eye-openers for me. 

 

He takes on those faster chord changes with such authority and ease.

[KuruPrionz]

8 hours ago, GovernorSilver said:

 

His playing on the covers of the Les Paul & Mary Ford tunes were real eye-openers for me. 

 

He takes on those faster chord changes with such authority and ease.

I saw him live. I've seen many truly great guitarists, Steve Howe, Steve Morse, John Renbourne, Andy Summers, Adrian Belew, many more. All were fantastic and I could go on...

Jeff Beck has incomparable skills on the Stratocaster, a much larger grasp on popular music than I'll ever have and a sick, twisted sense of art of expression via loud guitar. Stands tall on his own mountain. This is great stuff, he plays jazz, he took the Strat to places that Jimi was searching for but Jeff had and put in the time. 

This is one of my all time favorite instrumentals. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMryWoRRqUc

[Notes_Norton]

The entire "Live At Ronnie Scott's" video shows what a virtuoso Jeff really is. The camera crew must have also been guitarists, because the focus on his hands when they are doing things mere mortal guitarists cannot even dream about.

 

If you play guitar, whether you like his guitar playing or not, you need to watch that video. If you can rent it and watch the bonus DVD features, they are rewarding too.

 

Notes ♫