Kawai ES 120 (replacing the ES 110)

[ewall08530]

The long awaited upgrade to the Kawai ES 110 is coming.   $899 preorder at Kraft.  
I’m very interested in this t be the gigging version of the larger, heavier ES 520 that I practice on and love.  
 

https://www.kawai-global.com/product/es120/

[ElmerJFudd]

25 minutes ago, ewall08530 said:

The long awaited upgrade to the Kawai ES 110 is coming.   $899 preorder at Kraft.  
I’m very interested in this t be the gigging version of the larger, heavier ES 520 that I practice on and love.  
 

https://www.kawai-global.com/product/es120/

This came up recently in another topic.  But, yes.  Glad to see it.  The ES-110 is a nice pick at its price point.  

[16251]

1 hour ago, ewall08530 said:

The long awaited upgrade to the Kawai ES 110 is coming.   $899 preorder at Kraft.  
I’m very interested in this t be the gigging version of the larger, heavier ES 520 that I practice on and love.  
 

https://www.kawai-global.com/product/es120/

Sounds like GAS. 520 only about 6 lbs heavier and has a great interface to add some nice effects and having a nice stereo image from built in speakers, Midi 5pin. The 110/120 has none of those features. This of course is my opinion but I did own a 110 only to sell to buy a 520.

[ewall08530]

It’s definitely GAS but I love keeping the 520 home and having another piano (now it’s the Rd 88) for taking out and gigging. 

I can think of 3 restaurants I play regularly where having the slimmer (by

almost 4”), ES 120, makes a more comfortable fit in the space they give you. 
If with the ES 120 I can come close to replicating how it feels and sounds when I play the 520, it would be worth it. 

ES 520:
 52 3/4”(W) x 14 3/4”(D) x 5 3/4”(H)

 

ES 120:

  Width:  51 3/8".  Depth: 11”    Height:  6” 

[stoken6]

No 5-pin MIDI is a fail. Plenty of other boards make the same mistake.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[ewall08530]

42 minutes ago, Jazz1642606857 said:

I have already placed my order for the ES120. I listened extensively to its SoundCloud demos side by side with the ES110 demos. Demo # 4 reveals a warm new close mic recorded sampling of a top Kawai grand piano, superior to the tinnier  ES110 samples. 

i have loved playing  my ES110 for 2-3 hours per day the past 2 years. So I am glad to get the ES120 because it has the same excellent RHC action as the ES110 but with Kawai’s best SK-EX piano samples.  These samples, also found in the 520 and 920, somehow render  melodic runs in a more connected manner,  the notes seem

to flow into each other in a more excellent pianistic way. They improved the Rhodes nicely and boosted the power amps by 30%. It still weighs in at 27 lbs.

 

 

The SK-EX Piano samples that I love in my ES 520 are why I’m getting GAS for this lighter and smaller footprint Kawai.  

[mynameisdanno]

Ugh, no 5-pin MIDI?  The ES110 was the last decent feeling compact slab 88 with a blank top that still had it, I was hoping they'd keep it up.  Guess I better see if I can find an ES110 on closeout.

[Kawai James]

2 hours ago, mynameisdanno said:

Ugh, no 5-pin MIDI?  The ES110 was the last decent feeling compact slab 88 with a blank top that still had it, I was hoping they'd keep it up.

Yes, I was also a little disappointed to learn that 5-pin MIDI would be removed from the ES120.

However, given the choice between 5-pin MIDI and USB-MIDI, I think the majority of ES120 customers would prefer the latter.  Lack of USB-MIDI on the ES110 was seen as a negative for many potential customers, even a reason not to buy in some cases.  Sure, you can add a MIDI to USB adapter relatively easily, however most folks expect this kind of connectivity to be built in - if it's not, they'll go elsewhere.

 

Ideally, the ES120 would have included both USB-MIDI *and* 5-pin MIDI, however for one reason or another this did not happen.

 

Kind regards,

James

x

[AnotherScott]

3 hours ago, mynameisdanno said:

Ugh, no 5-pin MIDI?  The ES110 was the last decent feeling compact slab 88 with a blank top that still had it, I was hoping they'd keep it up.  Guess I better see if I can find an ES110 on closeout.

 

For those who do need the 5-pin DIN MIDI, the remaining hammer action digital pianos under a grand seem to be:

...with speakers:
Korg SP280, 42 lbs (with stand), $900
Casio PX360, 26 lbs, $1000

...without speakers:
Korg D1, 35.27 lbs, $700
Kurzweil SP1, 27.25 lbs, $900

The Korgs don't have USB, the Casio and Kurzweil do.

The Casio has a pitch bend wheel; the Kurzweil has pitch bend and mod wheels, and also expression pedal input.

In the sub-30 lb category of the ES110, it looks like the only options are the PX360 (a bit pricier than the Kawai), and the Kurzweil (but then you lose the speakers).

 

[mynameisdanno]

17 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

 

For those who do need the 5-pin DIN MIDI, the remaining hammer action digital pianos under a grand seem to be:

...with speakers:
Korg SP280, 42 lbs (with stand), $900
Casio PX360, 26 lbs, $1000

...without speakers:
Korg D1, 35.27 lbs, $700
Kurzweil SP1, 27.25 lbs, $900

The Korgs don't have USB, the Casio and Kurzweil do.

The Casio has a pitch bend wheel; the Kurzweil has pitch bend and mod wheels, and also expression pedal input.

In the sub-30 lb category of the ES110, it looks like the only options are the PX360 (a bit pricier than the Kawai), and the Kurzweil (but then you lose the speakers).

 

 

Thanks for that round-up.  I guess I should say "decent-feeling to me", actions being subjective.  I've just never gotten along with the Korg or Privia offerings.  The Kawai ES110 is just such a standout in its class, as far as the feel of the action is concerned.

 

18 hours ago, Kawai James said:

Yes, I was also a little disappointed to learn that 5-pin MIDI would be removed from the ES120.

However, given the choice between 5-pin MIDI and USB-MIDI, I think the majority of ES120 customers would prefer the latter.  Lack of USB-MIDI on the ES110 was seen as a negative for many potential customers, even a reason not to buy in some cases.  Sure, you can add a MIDI to USB adapter relatively easily, however most folks expect this kind of connectivity to be built in - if it's not, they'll go elsewhere.

 

Ideally, the ES120 would have included both USB-MIDI *and* 5-pin MIDI, however for one reason or another this did not happen.

 

Kind regards,

James

x

 

Yeah, it hadn't even occurred to me that the ES110 was missing USB MIDI.  I can see how USB is a smarter choice for the market as a whole, if a choice has to be made.  The needs of live musicians are admittedly niche when weighed against the market as a whole for a keyboard in this price range, but the ES110 just feels so darn good, in such a compact, easy-schlep package, works so well as a weighted controller for Nords, and has been more roadworthy than I ever would have guessed.  It's just annoying to lose a key feature on an otherwise perfect and reasonably priced unit.  Oh well.

[funkyhammond]

I also have my eye on the ES120. I'm not sure if the lack of 5-pin MIDI will be an issue for me or not but, in case down the road it is, do people have any experience with any adapter that goes from USB MIDI to 5-pin MIDI (instead of the other way around)? I have found a few "USB MIDI Host" boxes online by Kenton, DoreMIDI and Disaster Area Designs but the one big drawback is that they all require external power. I thought that the USB connection from the keyboard could also power the boxes but I guess not.

[16251]

Great action and footprint of 110/120 and if your objective is to play acoustic piano then great. But, for me, that wasn't enough. I missed having a decent Rhodes with the ability to add effects. If you own or buy a ES110, then you can easily add a module with better EPs, etc. cause of 5pin Midi. The ES120 would require added hardware. I know someone on this forum will remind me that the 110/120 has a reasonable and usable Rhodes sound; sure it is usable but is kind of bland. It does have a stereo pan effect but it is not programmable. <I kept reminding me of that but I went through a Reface CP and even bought a Mojo61 cause it had a great Rhodes sound and excellent effects but then the ES520 came out and it had everything I wanted. Again, if it's acoustic piano then "Live long and prosper."

[Kawai James]

2 hours ago, 16251 said:

If you own or buy a ES110, then you can easily add a module with better EPs, etc. cause of 5pin Midi.

That's true, although I would argue that an iPad and something like NeoSoul Keys will sound better than most (all?) hardware modules.
USB-MIDI facilitates that, as does the relatively low-latency Bluetooth MIDI onboard, if you wish to pursue the wireless route.

 

James

x

[AnotherScott]

5 hours ago, funkyhammond said:

 I have found a few "USB MIDI Host" boxes online by Kenton, DoreMIDI and Disaster Area Designs but the one big drawback is that they all require external power. I thought that the USB connection from the keyboard could also power the boxes but I guess not.

USB Host (type A) connections can supply power. These boxes you're talking about are hosts themselves, so they connect to the keyboard's slave (type B) ports, which never supply power.

[ewall08530]

1 minute ago, Jazz1642606857 said:

ES120 Demos on SoundCloud

I've ordered mine from Kraft.

Same here…