1500$ or so for Yamaha, Seagull, or Zager

[Vetecho43]

Hi.  I'm new to guitar forums.  I am primarily a finger style player yet strum lightly without a pick.  I am also deaf in my right ear so guitar tone is relative to this.  I am in the market for a Yamaha AC5R, Seagull Artist Mosaic Bourbon Burst, or, a Zager Zad80 series.  What do you think I should get?

[KuruPrionz]

If you can find one, a Rainsong OM 1000.

Of your choices, I'd probably pick the Yamaha, I've had great experiences with their products. They have excellent QC in my experience. 

[Larryz]

Vetecho43, I would suggest trying all 3 and see which one feels the best in your hands...good luck, welcome aboard and good hunting! +1 on Yamaha as I've heard positive reviews on their acoustic guitars...😎👍

[Caevan O’Shite]

1 hour ago, KuruPrionz said:

If you can find one, a Rainsong OM 1000.

Of your choices, I'd probably pick the Yamaha, I've had great experiences with their products. They have excellent QC in my experience. 

I'm sure that's a very fine guitar- and a very, consistently reliable one through any weather or climate! But- even used, isn't that going to run around double or more the stated price range? Correct me if I'm wrong!

Now... Yamaha guitars ARE very good quality, with excellent quality-control and consistency. And Seagull guitars are also generally well regarded in the low and mid price range. I've played examples of both here and there over the years.

But reading up on the Zager 80 series that you mention- which I have NOT happened to try in my hands- is the one of those three that makes me WANT to try one out; especially if it's got a Cedar top- I love Cedar topped flat-top steel-string and classical guitars! (And I also play fingerstyle, 100% of the time, never using a pick.)

So, me, I'd be strongly tempted to try a Zager- and if it disappointed, worse case scenario, well, there's probably a return provision, am I right?

Please let us know which guitar(s) you go with, and keep us posted!

 

Best of luck! And welcome to the Guitar Forum!
   
 
 

[KuruPrionz]

2 hours ago, Caevan OShite said:

I'm sure that's a very fine guitar- and a very, consistently reliable one through any weather or climate! But- even used, isn't that going to run around double or more the stated price range? Correct me if I'm wrong!

Now... Yamaha guitars ARE very good quality, with excellent quality-control and consistency. And Seagull guitars are also generally well regarded in the low and mid price range. I've played examples of both here and there over the years.

But reading up on the Zager 80 series that you mention- which I have NOT happened to try in my hands- is the one of those three that makes me WANT to try one out; especially if it's got a Cedar top- I love Cedar topped flat-top steel-string and classical guitars! (And I also play fingerstyle, 100% of the time, never using a pick.)

So, me, I'd be strongly tempted to try a Zager- and if it disappointed, worse case scenario, well, there's probably a return provision, am I right?

Please let us know which guitar(s) you go with, and keep us posted!

 

Best of luck! And welcome to the Guitar Forum!
   
 
 

I will admit that it's been a while but I found one used on eBay for $1,200 and put it on my brother's account. He still has it and he loves it, great guitars.

And, I found one locally on craigslist that I picked up for $900 cash. After playing my brother's, I had to have one. I still have it and I still love it. 

I also have a WS-3000 12 string, I spent many years seeking the best 12 string guitar I could find. I've stopped looking, I found it. That one did set me back $1,600 but it was a return and virtually like new. 

 

Seek and ye shall find...

 

And, welcome Vetecho43, pardon my manners but we're all glad you are here!!! This is a great place to discuss guitars. 

 

[Caevan O’Shite]

3 hours ago, KuruPrionz said:

I will admit that it's been a while but I found one used on eBay for $1,200 and put it on my brother's account. He still has it and he loves it, great guitars.

And, I found one locally on craigslist that I picked up for $900 cash. After playing my brother's, I had to have one. I still have it and I still love it.

Excellent! I apologize, I had glanced at a few results of  hasty Google search and they must have been pretty "high-ball" asking-prices...

[KuruPrionz]

23 minutes ago, Caevan OShite said:

Excellent! I apologize, I had glanced at a few results of  hasty Google search and they must have been pretty "high-ball" asking-prices...

They were not cheap when new but some people just can't get used to playing a "plastic" guitar. Used prices vary, only well-to-do will purchase and sometimes they don't care and sell things too cheap. 

 

It's the best sounding acoustic guitar I've played and it plays easily as well. I fingerpick and flatpack on acoustic guitars, it's great for either purpose. 

Very even response and more high frequency content as you move up the neck than any wooden guitar I've ever played, which is easy because the cutaway is well designed. At the same time, the highs are not obnoxious at all, sweet and balanced. It just sounds "clearer". 

 

After I'd had mine for a few years I realized that I never played my 1970 Martin D-35 at all. I had that guitar since I was 19 (66 now) and it just sat. I felt bad about that so I sold it to somebody who loved it and will play it. I didn't show them the Rainsong, that might have ruined their delight. 

 

And yes, they are remarkably stable, Nice up here where we have so much rain and sometimes dry heat in summer or snow/ice in winter. It does not care about temperature or humidity changes within reason. If it didn't have electronics I'm pretty sure you could wash it with a hose, fill up the body with water and then dump it out and let it dry and it would be fine. 

[surfergirl]

Welcome to the forum. I can't help you with guitar choice. The acoustic I've ever played is my mothers beat up 30+ year old Yamaha. If it were a cat it would have 1 life left. But good luck with your choice, what ever it is.

[Winston Psmith]

First up, welcome, Vetecho43!

 

My first recommendation would be to sit down with a handful of Guitars in your price range, and try as many as you can. I realize that only works if you live near to a store that carries quality Acoustic Guitars, and that Zager are only available online, which makes it hard to try them out.

 

I've never bought a Guitar online, because I refuse to buy a Guitar I haven't held in my hands first, period. To me, that's the ultimate test, how it feels and sounds when I play it.

 

While brand names and model numbers can help point us towards features we may prefer - a particular wood for the top, or a particular curve to the neck - individual Guitars can vary greatly, even among Guitars by the same maker, or even the same model. Don't limit yourself by choosing a brand or model before you've gotten to try it, or compare it to other Guitar brands you may not have originally considered. Good hunting!

 

[KuruPrionz]

35 minutes ago, Winston Psmith said:

First up, welcome, Vetecho43!

 

My first recommendation would be to sit down with a handful of Guitars in your price range, and try as many as you can. I realize that only works if you live near to a store that carries quality Acoustic Guitars, and that Zager are only available online, which makes it hard to try them out.

 

I've never bought a Guitar online, because I refuse to buy a Guitar I haven't held in my hands first, period. To me, that's the ultimate test, how it feels and sounds when I play it.

 

While brand names and model numbers can help point us towards features we may prefer - a particular wood for the top, or a particular curve to the neck - individual Guitars can vary greatly, even among Guitars by the same maker, or even the same model. Don't limit yourself by choosing a brand or model before you've gotten to try it, or compare it to other Guitar brands you may not have originally considered. Good hunting!

 

This is entirely sensible. 

On the other hand, I've been a professional guitar tech for many years and there are lots of great guitars out there than don't play great but can. 

Not sure about the newer Martin guitars but for many years they shipped their guitars with high action - partly because a big part of their market was "Strum/Bangers" who were in Bluegrass bands and needed the volume you can obtain with higher action and heavier strings and partly because it is much easier to lower the action on a guitar than it is to raise it so starting higher meant that more players could be pleased in the end - if they had a guitar tech set up their guitar. 

 

All I'm saying is that most guitars in the $1,500 range should play and sound great but you might be better off to spend $1,200 on the guitar and $200-300 on having the frets leveled, crowned and polished, the saddle and nut height adjusted, the truss rod dialed in and a preferred set of strings put on so it plays how YOU like it to play. 

I've seen very few modern guitars that could not be made to play well with a setup for the preferences of the owner/player and all of them were cheap pieces of crap. 

[ElmerJFudd]

You have to play it.  There’s no way to know if it feels and sounds like it should belong to you without playing it.  The last time I was in the shop I was looking for an acoustic for the Mrs.  I figured I’d walk out of the shop with a Yamaha or a Seagull.  Nope, I wound up with a Big Baby Taylor.  Side by side, switching between it just resonated better and the neck shape was very comfortable - to me.  

[Caevan O’Shite]

1 hour ago, Winston Psmith said:

I've never bought a Guitar online, because I refuse to buy a Guitar I haven't held in my hands first, period. To me, that's the ultimate test, how it feels and sounds when I play it.

I haven't, either- yet...

 

44 minutes ago, KuruPrionz said:

...most guitars in the $1,500 range should play and sound great but you might be better off to spend $1,200 on the guitar and $200-300 on having the frets leveled, crowned and polished, the saddle and nut height adjusted, the truss rod dialed in and a preferred set of strings put on so it plays how YOU like it to play.

Indeed. In fact (and as I'm sure you know), ultimately that needs to be done with any guitar to make it 'just-right' for the given player.

 

  

36 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

I wound up with a Big Baby Taylor.  Side by side, switching between it just resonated better and the neck shape was very comfortable

An excellent choice!
        
 
 

[ElmerJFudd]

On the upside, depending on the online dealer you pick, there will be X amount of days permitted to play it and be content with your selection.  

[KuruPrionz]

2 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

On the upside, depending on the online dealer you pick, there will be X amount of days permitted to play it and be content with your selection.  

True. In the end, for me it's all about the shape and size of the neck. I don't believe that there are any truly bad sounding guitars, just that there are LOTS of variations on tone. One of my favorite guitars to record is a cheap, ugly Rogue acoustic, all plywood. It sounds thin and a bit harsh live but put the right mic in front of it and that track will fall right into a mix like magic. A couple of good friends have mentioned the sound of the recordings and they like the acoustic guitar, until I point to it and they say "That piece of crap?" And, they are correct, it is a piece of crap. 😇

[ElmerJFudd]

23 minutes ago, KuruPrionz said:

True. In the end, for me it's all about the shape and size of the neck. I don't believe that there are any truly bad sounding guitars, just that there are LOTS of variations on tone. One of my favorite guitars to record is a cheap, ugly Rogue acoustic, all plywood. It sounds thin and a bit harsh live but put the right mic in front of it and that track will fall right into a mix like magic. A couple of good friends have mentioned the sound of the recordings and they like the acoustic guitar, until I point to it and they say "That piece of crap?" And, they are correct, it is a piece of crap. 😇

Your rogue is so crap that it fails to produce the frequencies you’d cut in the mix anyway.  😂

[KuruPrionz]

36 minutes ago, ElmerJFudd said:

Your rogue is so crap that it fails to produce the frequencies you’d cut in the mix anyway.  😂

Exactly!

I aimed a mic right at the soundhole, no depth, no richness. Best $20 thrift store guitar I've ever bought, lol.

[Caevan O’Shite]

1 hour ago, KuruPrionz said:

Exactly!

I aimed a mic right at the soundhole, no depth, no richness. Best $20 thrift store guitar I've ever bought, lol.

Lots o' bark, no bite or singing howl, huh?

I bet it's great for copping old time acoustic Blues sounds, or the acoustic equivalent of Hound Dog Taylor's electric tone...

[KuruPrionz]

12 minutes ago, Caevan OShite said:

Lots o' bark, no bite or singing howl, huh?

I bet it's great for copping old time acoustic Blues sounds, or the acoustic equivalent of Hound Dog Taylor's electric tone...

Kinda has that Son House tone from the older 78's. But it sounds great strummed too, I use a thin nylon pick and play over the soundhole and I smack it pretty hard. 

By itself, it sounds pretty crappy. In a mix, it sounds really good. Makes no sense but I'll take it!!!

[Caevan O’Shite]

1 hour ago, KuruPrionz said:

Kinda has that Son House tone from the older 78's. But it sounds great strummed too, I use a thin nylon pick and play over the soundhole and I smack it pretty hard. 

By itself, it sounds pretty crappy. In a mix, it sounds really good. Makes no sense but I'll take it!!!

Makes perfect sense! All those hard-edged mids and upper-mids elbowing their way through the mix.

Note that many of the classic old wood-bodied resophonic Dobros, Nationals and the like were made with plywood tops and bodies- and had a LOT of bark!

[KuruPrionz]

1 hour ago, Caevan OShite said:

Makes perfect sense! All those hard-edged mids and upper-mids elbowing their way through the mix.

Note that many of the classic old wood-bodied resophonic Dobros, Nationals and the like were made with plywood tops and bodies- and had a LOT of bark!

Yep, no clutter, no sustain and a snappy top. 

[Dannyalcatraz]

My experience with Yamaha and Seagull acoustics has been almost universally positive.  Hard to go wrong with either one.

 

Just out of curiosity, what else in your budget is available where you are?  I ask because there’s a lot to look at out there, and some quality options may not be immediately obvious.  For instance, I know that Seagull is a subsidiary of Godin, who also makes the acoustic brands Art & Lutherie, Simon & Patrick, and Norman, and LaPatrie.  As I recall, Norman is the premium brand in that list.

 

 

[skipclone 1]

Welcome Vetecho43.
I got a Seagull used for around $600-plus a tradein for a cedar top one that sounded great but had insane string tension-and if I never get another acoustic I won't mind. Great value but play first. Same for Yamaha. I'm not familiar with Zager, sorry. I generally don't advise buying guitars online, except for one major point-the shops in your area have what they have. They are going to stock the makers that people look at and say, well I heard of them, they must be good. There days, there are guitars out there that will blow your mind, and most people never heard of them. Buying a guitar online, waiting for it, hoping nothing goes wrong with the mail, getting it, finding out it's not for you and returning it-is a headache. But if it's 'the one'-debate over. Heck, I got on a freakin international flight to get 'the one'. In any case, best of luck whatever you choose.

[Vetecho43]

Thanks for ALL the responses!  I will take them to heart.

[KuruPrionz]

5 hours ago, Vetecho43 said:

Thanks for ALL the responses!  I will take them to heart.

Please keep us posted when you find your favorite. 

We love NGD posts even if we go off track most of the time, eventually. 

 

It's more that we love all sorts of guitars than anything else. 😇

[Caevan O’Shite]

2 hours ago, KuruPrionz said:

Please keep us posted when you find your favorite. 

We love NGD posts even if we go off track most of the time, eventually. 

 

It's more that we love all sorts of guitars than anything else. 😇

Indeed.