Schematic for Barbetta Sona SE-41 needed

[analogman1]

As the title says...my Barbetta Sona SE-41 has seen better days, and my amp tech needs a schematic of the amp section.

I've tried a google search but no luck.

 

Anybody have any suggestions? Thanks in advance...

[BluesB3]

Try this: http://www.barbetta.com/html/Support/support.html

[obxa]

Is Barbetta still in business? Last website update was 2002. I've got two 31's and had same problem that local techs can't work on them.

 

I wonder if you have this problem: There seems to be common issue with all of them in that they won't work until you either turn up the XLR input to full and back down again, or give it a good smack. Most times that's enough to get you through the night.

 

I did the "mail in just the amp" thing to Tony back in the early 2000's and it worked for a while, but then same problem returned.

[analogman1]

Tried to call.

I think I officially own a "doorstop"...

[skipeb3]

Well... Barbetta isn't really in business, but Tony Barbetta is still kinda there, with a shop in his home. I live in SoCal, so I've brought my Sona 41 to him a few times. I have 2, and they're awesome...when they work, which is most of the time. He's had one of mine for a year and a half..."fixing it". Well, trying to. Basically, forced me into getting a new system because I couldn't depend on my 41's, and that's too bad, because they sound awesome. I've been using my pair of 41's for about 25 years.

I've had a recurring problem with one of them - always the same one - and yeah, customer support is really sketchy. I'm lucky I'm local, because if I wasn't...you get the picture.

Tony has some serious health issues, and he does get back to me when I contact him, but not right away, I'm sorry to say. Too bad, because I like the guy, and he did make a great product.

He has a new model, that really isn't in any sort of production, which is too bad, because it looks really nice. Could be the best keyboard amp out there if it ever went into full scale production.

[analogman1]

If I can't have the amp repaired maybe I will gut the cabinet and have my tech just give me an input to use it as an extra monitor.

Such a shame, though...

[obxa]

Thanks for the update Skipeb3.

 

Tony was always a great guy. I was an early adopter of the 31. He was real interested in how it was holding up and how I was using it, and of course talking about the old New York music scene.

When I was still on the road passing through, I invited him to a local show and he was starting to have health issues back then. I wish him all the best.

 

I bought my 2nd 31 "later" edition used from a friend of mine for cheap, and that's the only one still working - but barely. 2 of them used to be a great compact stereo rig, and great for vocal monitors or a Jazz PA. Used it for some rehearsals last year, but probably wouldn't trust it on critical gig these days.

I guess these fall under the small company "boutique" risk factor.. I've also had gear from Motion Sound and the Space station folks, and I think I've learned my lesson.

 

Got a brilliant bass player friend that's an ex-Sony engineer who does repair on the side- and he's always wanted to do a tear-down of the 31 to see if he could figure it out. I might finally take him up on it.

 

As Analog man said looks like they'll mostly serve as door stops, but the 41 is big enough to use as an extension cabinet. I'm not super tech savvy, but you could do this yourself. The amp board is easily removable, and the speakers terminate to a multi jack that can be replaced with a 1/4 or speakon.

 

These were the closest thing to ideal- I still can't understand how the 3 biggest keyboard companies can't make a decent amp...

[Moonglow]

I have a Barbetta SE-32 in my music room. That amp was a warhorse for many years, got me through a ton of weddings and other function gigs. Lightweight, powerful, and sounded great. It still works, but is noisy. I"m sorry to hear of this gentleman"s health issues. He was always friendly and helpful when I spoke with him and sent me some endcaps free of charge when one of them cracked during transport. I agree that he made great a keyboard amp. Best in show, IMHO.

[Gene Foltzer]

On 6/28/2021 at 11:49 AM, obxa said:

Thanks for the update Skipeb3.

 

Tony was always a great guy. I was an early adopter of the 31. He was real interested in how it was holding up and how I was using it, and of course talking about the old New York music scene.

When I was still on the road passing through, I invited him to a local show and he was starting to have health issues back then. I wish him all the best.

 

I bought my 2nd 31 "later" edition used from a friend of mine for cheap, and that's the only one still working - but barely. 2 of them used to be a great compact stereo rig, and great for vocal monitors or a Jazz PA. Used it for some rehearsals last year, but probably wouldn't trust it on critical gig these days.

I guess these fall under the small company "boutique" risk factor.. I've also had gear from Motion Sound and the Space station folks, and I think I've learned my lesson.

 

Got a brilliant bass player friend that's an ex-Sony engineer who does repair on the side- and he's always wanted to do a tear-down of the 31 to see if he could figure it out. I might finally take him up on it.

 

As Analog man said looks like they'll mostly serve as door stops, but the 41 is big enough to use as an extension cabinet. I'm not super tech savvy, but you could do this yourself. The amp board is easily removable, and the speakers terminate to a multi jack that can be replaced with a 1/4 or speakon.

 

These were the closest thing to ideal- I still can't understand how the 3 biggest keyboard companies can't make a decent amp...

Did you have any luck getting your Barbetta repaired?  Or possibly repurposed?  I have 2 model 41's that lose volume suddenly. 
 

I Actualy tried a QSC K12.2 and it was NOTHING compared to my Barbetta!!

[bill bosco]

i have a sona 31c that i eventually gave to a friend , worked great for a few years , then suddenly stopped . a few weeks later it started working again . i think

he's still using it

[The Real MC]

Tony Barbetta has not - and will not - release schematics.

 

The Achilles heel of the Barbetta amps is the LM391 audio power driver IC.  They have been out of production for years and that's the component that tends to blow in Barbetta amps.

 

Years ago I bought a used Barbetta Sona 31 (early model with black face) after hearing a friend's 31c.  I was very impressed with the sound of his Yamaha CP70 going through it.  My unit had two defective input pots which I replaced with trimpots because the originals weren't available.  I was aware of Barbetta amps blowing LM391s so when I got mine I was cautious not to run it too loud.  So far so good.  It is too bad that they aren't made anymore, they are the best compact keyboard amp I have ever heard.  They even sound good with Moog Taurus pedals!

[skipeb3]

Gene, no I haven't gotten in back. The last time I spoke to Tony was about a year ago. He had a stroke, and I haven't been able to get in touch with him, or his assistant.

I'm kinda on the fence about even trying to get my 41 back. I have a new amp system now, and if I got my 41 back it may just join my other 41 gathering dust in the garage.

I have too much gear already doing that...

Still, a shame since my 41's sounded awesome.  They were absolutely the best keyboard amp there was, especially if you used two in stereo.

[obxa]

Sad to hear about Tony.

 

Funny this post got resurrected-  Actually used my newer 31 a few weeks ago as a bass amp for a small bluegrass gig I occasionally moonlight with.  Used a P-bass and acoustic Uke-bass w pickup-  sounded great w/plenty of headroom.  Load- in was a breeze.    Had to do the usual "turn  XLR to 10, then give it smack routine" but it stayed on the whole gig. 

 My older 31 is long dead.   I also miss them as a stereo pair for keys but have moved on.   IEMs 98% of the time for band stuff, and  Bose compact for solo gigs. 

 

Thanks for the info on the Lm391 Real MC.    I really wish one of the bigger keyboard companies would make an offer to Tony to buy or license his technology and update it. That would be a great win for him, them, ....and us.  

[zxcvbnm098]

6 hours ago, obxa said:

Sad to hear about Tony.

 

Funny this post got resurrected-  Actually used my newer 31 a few weeks ago as a bass amp for a small bluegrass gig I occasionally moonlight with.  Used a P-bass and acoustic Uke-bass w pickup-  sounded great w/plenty of headroom.  Load- in was a breeze.    Had to do the usual "turn  XLR to 10, then give it smack routine" but it stayed on the whole gig. 

 My older 31 is long dead.   I also miss them as a stereo pair for keys but have moved on.   IEMs 98% of the time for band stuff, and  Bose compact for solo gigs. 

 

Thanks for the info on the Lm391 Real MC.    I really wish one of the bigger keyboard companies would make an offer to Tony to buy or license his technology and update it. That would be a great win for him, them, ....and us.  

I was thinking the same thing. Motion Sound would be an ideal candidate I would think....

[Gene Foltzer]

9 hours ago, skipeb3 said:

Gene, no I haven't gotten in back. The last time I spoke to Tony was about a year ago. He had a stroke, and I haven't been able to get in touch with him, or his assistant.

I'm kinda on the fence about even trying to get my 41 back. I have a new amp system now, and if I got my 41 back it may just join my other 41 gathering dust in the garage.

I have too much gear already doing that...

Still, a shame since my 41's sounded awesome.  They were absolutely the best keyboard amp there was, especially if you used two in stereo.

What are you using instead?  I got a QSC K12.2 and it's not as  loud  as my Barbetta 41. I'm told the Barbetta had a built in preamp, and to get the K12.2 as loud is need to use a mixer as a preamp. Not sure if that's true but the QSC is going back.  

 

I'd love to know what's the next best thing.  Thanks!

[skipeb3]

Gene, I’m using 2 Harbinger V4112.

I had never heard of them before. I looked at just about every powered speaker/monitor out there, and there seemed to be something missing from every one of them…missing some feature that made my Barbettas such good kybd amps. They all seemed to be either too heavy, too much $, controls were in the wrong place to be able to get at them easily, no EQ, etc.

 

My understanding is it’s an in-house brand from Musicians Friend/Guitar Center. They had pretty much everything I was looking for, and they were the least expensive.

I bought one to see how it was gonna work on a gig, and when it sounded really good, I got a second one.   

 

I basically just play piano/organ & wurlie through them and I’m totally happy with them.

[Reezekeys]

20 hours ago, Gene Foltzer said:

I'm told the Barbetta had a built in preamp, and to get the K12.2 as loud is need to use a mixer as a preamp.

 

Are you kidding me, a 2000 watt speaker? If it's not as loud as the Barbetta, you're not driving it hard enough at the input. That's very easily corrected - set it to mic, not line level. Turn the gain down first, of course - you might make yourself deaf! Mic level input stages can be overdriven much easier than line level inputs, so you'll probably have to experiment with proper gain staging but I can't believe a K12.2 isn't loud enough for you. I have old K8s and used to switch to mic level at wedding/corporate gigs playing with an excrutiatingly loud bands. On the older Ks at least, the mic/line selector is just a pad. These days, if I have to switch to mic level to make myself heard, I don't do the gig!