How do they do this? Repeated notes

[Pat Azzarello]

I've never been one to be able to do the Jerry Lee Lewis, repeated hammering of chords.

 

Here's another example of something I'd like to learn how to do. I've heard similar things in other genres but this is pretty darn clean.

 

 

Any advice? I'm thinking of reaching out to a great drummer friend who's also a clinician to see if he has ideas, but I don't know if it will transfer to keyboards very well.

 

Thanks in advance -

Pat

[mate stubb]

I can't help you with piano, but there is a useful trick on a real Hammond console that allows this.

 

By defeating the preset latch one can stutter whole chords cleanly by "playing" the preset.

 

Hold down a chord with your right hand. Hold down the lowest black C key with your left pinkie - that is the preset cancel and it holds the latch bar out of the way. Now press one of the black preset keys with your left thumb - the chord will only sound when you hold down the preset.

 

By alternately hammering it with left thumb and index finger, you can get fast stuttering chords. The Alfie example above or the fast stuttering chords in the solo to Hush can be done this way (although Jon I think did not do this.) I have used it to play the arpeggiated chords from Won't Get Fooled Again.

 

 

A second technique on a double manual organ would involve identical drawbar settings on both manuals and playing alternate hands. It requires some practice to play staccato enough to get the effect you want.

 

A third way would be to play alternate hands on the same manual - this would require one hand playing the front of the keys underneath the other hand playing toward the back. This can sometimes work but it is hard to keep your hands from tangling up.

[MathOfInsects]

^^^Cool.

 

Regarding the hands getting tangled up, and the Jerry Lee Lewis thing: Often the issue with repeated-note and tremolo passages is hand tension. One way around this is the oldest-fashion way: practice. Anything you do with one note, try doing with four repeating notes, alternating thumbs. Start v-e-r-y slowly, and don't increase tempo until you're so comfortable at the last tempo that you're bored. So, for example, run a scale in (let's say) C, where you play CCCC DDDD EEEE FFFF, etc, and the fingering for that is Left-Thumb Right-Thumb Left-Thumb Right-Thumb all the way up and down. Then for your next scale, let's say G, reverse the order of thumbs--go Right-Thumb Left-Thumb the whole way up and down. Your thumbs will share a key over and over, and the only way you can make this work without tangling yourself up is to RELAX. So you're practicing not just the fast repeating notes, but also the act of playing them very relaxed.

 

You can do a similar exercise using 1-2 on each hand--so CCCC would be fingered 1-2-1-2 in the RH at say, Middle C, and 1-2-1-2 in the LH an octave lower.

 

You can also do the old classical thing of fingering it 4-3-2-1 in each hand. Some people can find it hard to get the fourth finger back in time, but that can be practiced and learned too--one hack for this is to practice it 3-2-1-4, or 2-1-4-3, so that all strikes come equally regardless of finger.

 

Each option requires being relaxed. Any tension will sabotage it. So you have to practice consciously relaxing your hand and keeping it that way. So much of this kind of playing, once it's "in there," is just letting go and trusting it will happen, once you relax and deploy the skill.

 

You can do the same thing with chords. Practice alternating hands, or repeating with each hand, at a VERY slow tempo, and slow click up. Just play either repeated triads or run scalar triads--root-position chords up and down a key. (So in C, you'd play c-e-g, d-f-a, e-g-b, etc, up and down the scale.)

 

But again...relaxation is the key. You cannot deploy muscles the way you want if they are being clenched with tension. So the biggest part of this is to consciously incorporate relaxing the hand into whatever routine you pick for this.

[Moonglow]

Regarding the Jerry Lee Lewis piano technique, below is some advice given to me in a thread a long time ago which really helped. Definitely echoes MOI"s recommendation regarding muscle relaxation.

 

Think wrist movement, almost like the motion you make when knocking on a door. The rest of your arm, including the forearm, should be relatively still, but relaxed. The key is to flick your wrist upward, not downward. Let gravity take care of the downward part. Start slow by letting your hand sit loosely on the keys, then lightly lift your hand (again, not arm) upwards with your wrist as the pivot. Imagine someone has a string around your hand and they're pulling it up. When it's an inch or two above the keys, imagine that same person suddenly lets go of the string, and just let your relaxed hand drop into the keys. That's the basic idea. Take that same motion and speed it up. At a faster speed, you have to make the movement a little more compact, but just focus on relaxation. At a faster speed, it'll end up being more of a little "flick" than a lift. You can accompany the wrist drop with a slight arm drop to accent certain chords in the rhythmic pattern as well. Just always be thinking: relaxation.

 

As Byrdman said, you'll want to be aware of any tension that may creep in. If you can get the motion down you should pretty much be able to keep it going in your sleep. Endurance, as it pertains to piano playing, isn't about getting your muscles to handle more stress, it's about the exact opposite. It's about minimizing stress so that your muscles have less work to do.

[ksoper]

Echoing the above advice, unless your left hand has something really important to do don't be afraid to use two hands. Diffie's stuff was full of hammering. When the tempos were spirited one hand was fine. For the insane bluegrass tempos two hands saved me. Was it recorded like that? Who cares?

[CEB]

Old Jedi mind trick. Think, keep the center of the palms relaxed. Have a good weekend.

[Jazz+]

Easy on organ, much harder on a weighted action (it needs a high performance action return like on high end acoustic grands).

212121212121 fingering. Lead with the 2 finger and not the thumb (thumb plays the "+" of each beat)

 

[video:youtube]

[Piktor]

Pat Azzarello, thank you for asking this question. I am appreciating all of the answers.

[re Pete]

Damn, she must string pianos too.

[Pat Azzarello]

I'll experiment a bit more.

 

I've used the multiple fingerings for single notes but the chords are the problem. I'm thinking about this for gigs where i use either my SK1 or more likely a controller keyboard like the Impulse 61 with VB3 V2 running on a laptop. I do have a real B3 (RT3 actually) but it doesn't leave the house so the preset technique is more difficult on a clone.

 

Thanks for the ideas.

[BbAltered]

There is actually an exercise for this in Book 2 of Hanon.

 

When playing triplets on the same note, fingering goes: 3-2-1-3-2-1-3-2-1-etc

When playing 16ths on the same note, fingering is: 4-3-2-1-4-3-2-1-4-3-2-1-etc

 

Yes - it is possible to use the same idea when playing 2-note chords (thirds, sixths). With some adjustments, you can tackle triads this way,

 

As always, start with the metronome at 40 bpm and gradually increase. Keep the arm, hand, and fingers relaxed and supple - i.e. don't increase the tempo until your arm, hand, and fingers are relaxed and supple.

 

I once attended a Bruce Hornsby solo performance where he played repeated notes in the RH while soloing with his LH, and then in tempo played repeated notes in the LH while soloing with his RH, and continued to switch back and forth over the course of 3-4 minutes of continuous playing.

[Jazz+]

dbl post

[Jazz+]

It's not Hanon.

To play the added side notes and harmonic thirds that are reached out to, on down beats , it's only possible with 2121212121 , see Brian Auger or Monty Alexander. Watch the Japanese lady in slow motion, she does it. it's standard Jimmy Smith technique and called "the sputter" or alien lick

21 21 21 21 21 ,

[Moonglow]

Emerson for the win! Check out the repeated single note during the organ solo at 6:35.

 

[video:youtube]

[Jazz+]

313131 same concept as 212121 (probably easier), thumb on the "+", allows for the neighboring note hits

 

[video:youtube]

[CEB]

Just listened to the opening of that OP organ lick. Did anyone mention trigger points and ask what you are playing organ on?

 

PS - I just saw where you have the SK1. Check the settings on the SK1 and make sure it"s set for high trigger. I got my SKX and the default wasn"t a high trigger point and it played like crap. I couldn"t machine gun anything. The board needs to be set for a high trigger point.