KeyboardEric Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 I'm not that great at programming on my boards but I'm trying to practice using the VA engines to get better. I know enough basics to get around but that doesn't mean I'm any good yet. Lately I've been working on TOTO Brass. I twiddle with the different settings forever, going back and forth, but I'm afraid I don't have the skills to nail it. Or I have something I'm happy with at home at home but when I get to practice it just doesn't work like I thought it would. I've watched a lot of the tutorials on youtube on how to make this brass sound but those sounds don't seem right compared to the original. And they all claim it's easy to program. Maybe my speakers are off or it could just be tough to recreate the exact sound and feeling of the original? TOTO Brass aside, I found this video not too long ago where he walks you through how to make 5 classic synth sounds. I wish there were more resources of this quality: He explains each step so I actually feel like I'm getting the process. I like building sounds from scratch like this. Any tips out there on nailing that TOTO Brass or other ways to build your synth skills? Or just want a thread to talk about what sounds you've been working on lately? Here is an opportunity! Quote dreamcommander.bandcamp.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanael_I Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 If you want to improve rapidly, try Syntorial. It will teach your ear very quickly... Highly recommended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr88s Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 Any tips out there on ... other ways to build your synth skills? Or just want a thread to talk about what sounds you've been working on lately? Here is an opportunity! A year or two back I was in the exact same position as you, quite possibly struggling with programming a brass sound for Africa. In my quest to improve my VA programming skills, I started a thread where I asked forumites to challenge me with sounds of their choosing. I worked on them and posted results as links to videos I uploaded to YouTube. The exercise was invaluable! Quote Nord Stage 2 Compact, Yamaha MODX8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyboardEric Posted December 16, 2019 Author Share Posted December 16, 2019 If you want to improve rapidly, try Syntorial. It will teach your ear very quickly... Highly recommended. This looks cool. I will def check out the free lessons! In my quest to improve my VA programming skills, I started a thread where I asked forumites to challenge me with sounds of their choosing. I worked on them as posted results as like to videos I uploaded to YouTube. The exercise was invaluable! great idea! Quote dreamcommander.bandcamp.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marino Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 *Very* quick tutorial for Toto brass: Assuming you have two oscillators, set one to sawtooth wave and the other to pulse. Detune them. 2-pole lowpass filter. For both the amp and the filter envelope, make the attack short but not instantaneous, and a medium release. Long decay and high sustain for the amp envelope, long decay (but shorter than the amp) and half sustain for the filter envelope. Resonance - just experiment. Every filter has a different response to resonance. If you have a third envelope, try making the resonance enter slowly, so that it has its maximum peak as the cutoff reaches its minimum (end of filter env's decay). And now, the main ingredient: Use the amp *or* filter envelope (try both) to modulate PWM of the pulse oscillator. Here, it's difficult to give precise indications... just try different starting points for the PW, and different modulation amounts. Heard by itself, the pulse osc should give a sense of "closing down" over time, even without filter modulation. Here you have your basic sound. To further enhance it, try doubling it with an "unison" function (assuming your synth allows), using detuning and stereo spread as well. You could also use a slow, smoothed S&H to *very* slightly alter one of the oscillators' tuning over time. Add chorus and reverb to taste, and you're done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matted stump Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 I have found that using an envelope generator to make the pitch blip slightly helps emulate a real horn settling into the pitch of the note. Quote Moe --- "I keep wanting to like it's sound, but every demo seems to demonstrate that it has the earth-shaking punch and peerless sonics of the Roland Gaia. " - Tusker http://www.hotrodmotm.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marino Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 I have found that using an envelope generator to make the pitch blip slightly helps emulate a real horn settling into the pitch of the note. This can be useful for more aggressive/fast/bright types of (synth-)brass sound, especially when applied to only one oscillator rather than both. On the "Africa" brass sound however, I don't think it's present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyboardEric Posted December 16, 2019 Author Share Posted December 16, 2019 *Very* quick tutorial for Toto brass: Assuming you have two oscillators, set one to sawtooth wave and the other to pulse. Detune them. 2-pole lowpass filter. For both the amp and the filter envelope, make the attack short but not instantaneous, and a medium release. Long decay and high sustain for the amp envelope, long decay (but shorter than the amp) and half sustain for the filter envelope. Resonance - just experiment. Every filter has a different response to resonance. If you have a third envelope, try making the resonance enter slowly, so that it has its maximum peak as the cutoff reaches its minimum (end of filter env's decay). And now, the main ingredient: Use the amp *or* filter envelope (try both) to modulate PWM of the pulse oscillator. Here, it's difficult to give precise indications... just try different starting points for the PW, and different modulation amounts. Heard by itself, the pulse osc should give a sense of "closing down" over time, even without filter modulation. Here you have your basic sound. To further enhance it, try doubling it with an "unison" function (assuming your synth allows), using detuning and stereo spread as well. You could also use a slow, smoothed S&H to *very* slightly alter one of the oscillators' tuning over time. Add chorus and reverb to taste, and you're done. thanks for the detailed instructions. I'm looking forward to tinkering with it. I haven't seen any Africa tutorials that includes a pulse wave or PWM but it makes sense. Unfortunately I don't think the main board I program on supports PWM but there could be a workaround or I could try on my other board that has a Juno style synth built in. I have relatively low end synth gear (Korg Kross 2) so limited on some fronts. I am thinking about getting a more traditional analog style synth soon (one of the less expensive ones like Korg Monologue or Behringer MS1). Quote dreamcommander.bandcamp.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyNQ Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 The Kross has a sound called 'Africa Brass' (D121). Wondering if the Kross 2 might have the same? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marino Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 The Kross has a sound called 'Africa Brass' (D121). Mmm. I wonder if they perhaps mean this. Now, *this* would be difficult to imitate! :D Sorry... couldn't resist [video:youtube] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyNQ Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 The Kross has a sound called 'Africa Brass' (D121). Mmm. I wonder if they perhaps mean this. Now, *this* would be difficult to imitate! :D Sorry... couldn't resist Don't be sorry - that's exactly what it is. You press middle "c" and the arpeggiator plays the above from 0:49 to 0:59 on a continuous loop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyboardEric Posted December 17, 2019 Author Share Posted December 17, 2019 The Kross has a sound called 'Africa Brass' (D121). Wondering if the Kross 2 might have the same? The Africa Brass patch is definitely in the Kross 2, but it doesn't sound right to me. Maybe I am being overly particular but the attack on the filter envelope is too aggressive sounding. I thought it would be a good exercise to build it from scratch and if that doesn't work out, maybe tweak the factory version to my liking. Quote dreamcommander.bandcamp.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerrythek Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 This video might help... it's a fun watch. [video:youtube] Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyboardEric Posted December 17, 2019 Author Share Posted December 17, 2019 where can I get that shirt? Quote dreamcommander.bandcamp.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRollins Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 It's weird...they never play Africa on the radio around here, but they dusted it off last night as I was coming home from taking the kids to karate. It's been years since I've heard it. Synchronicity. (Jungian, not The Police-ian...) Grey Quote I'm not interested in someone's ability to program. I'm interested in their ability to compose and play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matted stump Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 It's weird...they never play Africa on the radio around here, but they dusted it off last night as I was coming home from taking the kids to karate. It's been years since I've heard it. Synchronicity. (Jungian, not The Police-ian...) Grey I thought the Police-ian WAS the Jungian. Quote Moe --- "I keep wanting to like it's sound, but every demo seems to demonstrate that it has the earth-shaking punch and peerless sonics of the Roland Gaia. " - Tusker http://www.hotrodmotm.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRollins Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 One of my degrees is in psychology--I tend to get literal about such things. (Plus, I never was much into The Police. Born too early, I suppose.) Grey Quote I'm not interested in someone's ability to program. I'm interested in their ability to compose and play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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