Microsoft�s Surface Book 2 ships on November 16

[ElmerJFudd]

Microsofts Surface Book 2 ships on November 16:

13.5-inch for $1,499 and 15-inch for $2,499

 

[video:youtube]

 

Microsoft today unveiled the Surface Book 2, available for the first time in two sizes: a 13.5-inch, like its predecessors, starting at $1,499 and a new 15-inch, the largest Surface laptop yet, starting at $2,499. Both feature up to 17 hours of battery life, a USB-C port, and the latest 8th-generation Intel Quad-Core processors. Surface Book 2 will be available for preorder on November 9 and starts shipping on November 16...

 

Panos Panay, head of engineering for all of Microsofts devices, declared that the Surface Book 2 transforms the boundary between the desktop and the laptop. In terms of graphics, Panay shared that the 13-inch is three times more powerful than the original Surface Book and that the 15-inch is five times more powerful....

 

There is no laptop thats ever pushed this much computational power in this form factor, Panay declared. Its just not happened. It is truly a beauty and a beast....

 

in addition to the two full-size USB-A ports, theres now also a USB-C port instead of a Mini DisplayPort. This is the first Surface device to include a USB-C port...

 

The full Surface Book 2 specs are below, broken down by the three models.

 

13.5-inch, starting at $1,499:

 

Display: 3000 x 2000 (267 PPI), 1600:1 contrast ratio, 10 point multi-touch

CPU: Intel Core i5-7300U with 3.2GHz Max Turbo

Model: 8GB RAM and 256GB SSD

Graphics: Intel HD Graphics 620 integrated GPU

Dimensions: 312mm x 232mm x 13mm-23mm, 12.3 x 9.14 x 0.51-0.90

Weight: 1533g (3.38lbs) total, 719g (1.59lbs) for just the tablet

Power Supply: 39W with USB Type-A charging port (5W)

 

13.5-inch, starting at $1,999:

 

Display: 3000 x 2000 (267 PPI), 1600:1 contrast ratio, 10 point multi-touch

CPU: Intel Core i7-8650U with 4.2GHz Max Turbo

Models: 8GB RAM and 256GB SSD or 16GB RAM and 512GB SSD or 16GB RAM and 1TB SSD

Graphics: Intel UHD Graphics 620 integrated GPU and NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 discrete GPU with 2GB GDDR5 graphics memory

Dimensions: 312mm x 232mm x 15mm-23mm, 12.3 x 9.14 x 0.59-0.90

Weight: 1642g (3.62lbs) total, 719g (1.59lbs) for just the tablet

Power Supply: 95W with USB Type-A charging port (5W)

 

15-inch, starting at $2,499:

 

Display: 3240 x 2160 (260 PPI), 1600:1 contrast ratio, 10 point multi-touch

CPU: Intel Core i7-8650U with 4.2GHz Max Turbo

Models: 16GB RAM and 256GB SSD or 16GB RAM and 512GB SSD or 16GB RAM and 1TB SSD

Graphics: Intel UHD Graphics 620 integrated GPU and NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060 discrete GPU with 6GB GDDR5 graphics memory

Dimensions: 343mm x 251mm x 15mm-23mm, 13.5 x 9.87 x 0.57-0.90

Weight: 1905g (4.20lbs) total, 817g (1.80lbs) for just the tablet

Power Supply: 95W with USB Type-A charging port (7.5W)

The rest of the specs are the same across all three:

 

OS: 64-bit Windows 10 Pro with Creators Update

Battery life: Up to 17 hours, up to 5 hours in Tablet Mode

Wireless: Wi-Fi IEEE 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac compatible, Bluetooth Wireless 4.1, Xbox Wireless built-in (15 only)

Ports: 2x USB Type-A 3.1 (Gen1), 1x USB Type-C with video, power in/out and USB 3.1 (Gen1) data, full-size SDXC card reader (UHS-II), headphone jack (3.5mm), 2x Surface Connect ports (1 in tablet, 1 in keyboard base)

Security: TPM 2.0 hardware chip for enterprise security, Common Criteria (CC) EAL4+, FIPS 140-2 level 2, Windows Hello face sign-in

Sensors: Ambient light sensor, accelerometer, gyroscope, magnetometer

Cameras: 5.0MP 1080p video @30FPS (front), 8.0MP 1080p video @30FPS with auto-focus (rear)

Audio: Stereo Speakers with Dolby Audio Premium, Windows Sonic for Headphones included, Dolby Atmos for Headphones compatible

Keyboard and Trackpad: Full size backlit keyboard with 1.55mm of full key travel, glass track pad with anti-fingerprint coating and improved multi-finger gestures

Modes: Laptop Mode, Tablet Mode, View Mode or Studio Mode

 

 

 

 

 

 

[burningbusch]

The 13.5" with i7 looks very impressive for the price, $1999. That's a quad-core i7 with discrete 2GB GPU (gaming capable). A 13" Macbook Pro with i7 is only dual-core and has integrated GPU but costs $100 more.

 

Busch.

[ElmerJFudd]

Yeah, there is no doubt in my mind this MacBooks are very specially the models their engineers sit down to beat.

 

Panos Panay says, The Surface Book 2 is twice as performant as the Macbooks in the market now. So if you took the 13-inch and you compared it to the 13-inch, you would see its two times more powerful. If you did the same with the two 15-inches, you would see its two times more powerful. That includes the fact that theyre delivering 30 percent more pixels in both. And probably the most important data point is 70 percent more battery life on your Surface Book 2 than on your Macbook Pro.

 

Would be nice if they ran OSX and Mainstage, hosted my AUs.

But obviously most of these are also available as VST and there's Cantabile.

[AnotherScott]

I keep meaning to get around to trying Gig Performer on my old Surface Pro that I've hardly touched.

[Ed A.]

Too bad it doesn't run macOS.

[burningbusch]

Unless Apple's hardware options improve significantly and are reasonably priced, I'm going Hackintosh to replace my Mac Pro. People seem to be having excellent results with these. It's not my fault Apple forgot how to make computers.

 

But I like having a Windows machine as well.

 

Busch.

[Strays Dave]

I'm interested in a Surface but there's some buzz about its reliability. I'll hold off for now. I'm interested in an app called StaffPad. A notation app.

 

 

https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2017/8/10/16125294/microsoft-surface-consumer-reports-hardware-freezing-shutdowns-problems

[Mills Dude]

... I'm going Hackintosh to replace my Mac Pro. People seem to be having excellent results with these.

 

I've build several Hackintosh'es. The build is generally painless, especially if you follow the TonyMac recommendations. Stick with a Gigabyte motherboard, etc ...

 

The only downside is upgrading MacOS versions. Upgrade path is not smooth. I still have one of my Hacks running Snow Leopard.

[AnotherScott]

The only downside is upgrading MacOS versions. Upgrade path is not smooth. I still have one of my Hacks running Snow Leopard.

If you're not using it for internet, there is little reason to upgrade a Mac OS from whatever configuration is working for you. Of course, a new tempting app or app upgrade might come out, just as we're often tempted to buy new keyboards even though what we have is working just fine! But really, the only reason I've ever *needed* to update an older Mac to a newer OS is because of the net. The old browsers eventually stop working on many sites that start using newer HTML or security implementations.

[Synthaholic]

Heads up.

 

https://www.consumerreports.org/laptop-computers/microsoft-surface-laptops-and-tablets-not-recommended-by-consumer-reports/

 

Microsoft Surface Laptops and Tablets Not Recommended by Consumer Reports

The problem is predicted reliability, with estimated two-year breakage rates of 25 percent

[xKnuckles]

Nice advert! I have had my surface pro 4 for over 2 years and it has never broken. Seems very reliable. I love it and would recomment it to anyone. It has gradually assimilated most of the things which I used to do on my ipad and is a complete delight to use. I am glad to see that these new surfaces have detachable keyboards. I use mine as as a tablet all the time now that I have started using it on gigs.

[cedar]

I'm interested in a Surface but there's some buzz about its reliability. I'll hold off for now. I'm interested in an app called StaffPad. A notation app.

 

 

https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2017/8/10/16125294/microsoft-surface-consumer-reports-hardware-freezing-shutdowns-problems

 

I bought a Surface a couple of years ago, I think, shortly after StaffPad was released. I then discovered that StaffPad didn't really fit my needs. Now, I use the Surface primarily for reading the newspaper during my commute, and for carting along all my sheet music to gigs/rehearsals.

 

I wish the screen was bigger so that I could read the music more comfortably (and maybe have the option of displaying 2 pages of music at once. But I don't think the expanded screen on the Pro is likely to make much of a difference in that regard.

[RABid]

I had an original and a 3rd generation. No problems.

[jimkost2002]

Surface reliability is not as bad as the hype would have you believe.

A colleague has a SP3 hes used as a daily driver since release day.... he is now going to upgrade to an SB2, but have his Pro 3 as a faux iPad.... still works great from where i sit.

 

I dont see them as being any worse than Macs, but Dells and HPs are still the WORST in QC

[MurMan]

Heads up.

 

Microsoft Surface Laptops and Tablets Not Recommended by Consumer Reports

The problem is predicted reliability, with estimated two-year breakage rates of 25 percent

 

Consumer Reports is being ridiculous. Their "prediction" is based on several well-known reliability issues with the SP4 in it's first year. Most of the problems were related to shutdown and startup. The problems were fixed in a series of firmware updates that fixed problems with the Intel Sky Lake chips.

 

I have an SP4 from the first batch two years ago. Yeah, there were some "wake from sleep" problems, but nothing out of line that I've seen from apple, dell, hp, samsung machines I've owned.

 

Considering how much I use the SP4, it's reliability has been stellar. I run everything on it: browsers, Office, Omnisphere 2, LightRoom, etc.

[burningbusch]

Zero issues with my SP4 as well. Use it daily.

 

Nice overview here:

 

[video:youtube]

 

Busch.

[burningbusch]

... I'm going Hackintosh to replace my Mac Pro. People seem to be having excellent results with these.

 

I've build several Hackintosh'es. The build is generally painless, especially if you follow the TonyMac recommendations. Stick with a Gigabyte motherboard, etc ...

 

The only downside is upgrading MacOS versions. Upgrade path is not smooth. I still have one of my Hacks running Snow Leopard.

 

Thanks for the heads up. I only update the OS when critical applications force that on me, which is rare. Otherwise going with the final rev of a mature OS is nearly always the best approach.

 

Busch.

[Markay]

Easier said than done if you want to run the current versions of MainStage and Logic.

[AnotherScott]

Easier said than done if you want to run the current versions of MainStage and Logic.

Yup, that gets back to what I said, "a new tempting app or app upgrade might come out, just as we're often tempted to buy new keyboards even though what we have is working just fine!" Whether it's hardware or software, if what you have is working fine, there's nothing wrong with sticking with it. It's Apple's job to make you think you simply must have the latest Logic or Manstage, just as it's Nord's job to make you think you must have the newest Stage or Electro, et all. Resist! ;-)

[burningbusch]

Hacintoshes are generally desktop machines. Mine would be a replacement for a Mac Pro. I would have zero need for MainStage. I think Apple VSTs are OK but not great. I never use them. I don't use Logic. I use Pro Tools, Studio One and Ableton Live. I own some others but don't use them much. I avoid Apple's applications when possible. I don't think any of them are that great nor a necessity. I generally won't buy anything that goes through the App Store because there are no trials, no upgrade paths, no access to prior version and, in general, these developers are the first to limit their software to the most current OS.

 

In worst case, this computer would be perfectly serviceable as a Windows machine. I'm not in dire need at the moment and am holding out to see what Apple does on the pro front. People just want power at an acceptable price. They don't need two years of overdesigned BS. The machine sits under a desk somewhere. It can be ugly as sin. Users at this level don't care. But that's not the Apple way, I know.

 

Busch.

[Markay]

Easier said than done if you want to run the current versions of MainStage and Logic.

Yup, that gets back to what I said, "a new tempting app or app upgrade might come out, just as we're often tempted to buy new keyboards even though what we have is working just fine!" Whether it's hardware or software, if what you have is working fine, there's nothing wrong with sticking with it. It's Apple's job to make you think you simply must have the latest Logic or Manstage, just as it's Nord's job to make you think you must have the newest Stage or Electro, et all. Resist! ;-)

 

Apple do a fine job of tempting me to upgrade, for example addition of Alchemy and other new and updated AU's, and even down to hidden benefits that are essentially bug fixes, like the significantly better resource use in the latest version of MainStage running in the final update to Sierra.

 

No way would I prefer to be on MS 3.1 on a machine running Mavericks.

 

Interested to hear how that lines up with your experience running MainStage.

[Markay]

Hacintoshes are generally desktop machines. Mine would be a replacement for a Mac Pro. I would have zero need for MainStage. I think Apple VSTs are OK but not great. I never use them. I don't use Logic. I use Pro Tools, Studio One and Ableton Live. I own some others but don't use them much. I avoid Apple's applications when possible. I don't think any of them are that great nor a necessity. I generally won't buy anything that goes through the App Store because there are no trials, no upgrade paths, no access to prior version and, in general, these developers are the first to limit their software to the most current OS.

 

In worst case, this computer would be perfectly serviceable as a Windows machine. I'm not in dire need at the moment and am holding out to see what Apple does on the pro front. People just want power at an acceptable price. They don't need two years of overdesigned BS. The machine sits under a desk somewhere. It can be ugly as sin. Users at this level don't care. But that's not the Apple way, I know.

 

Busch.

 

Well the only reason I run MacOS is to be able to Apple exclusive Apps like MainStage. Were MainStage available for Windows I would not be using MacOS. Plus wasn't support for Yosemite and earlier dropped in the latest Pro tools update?

 

This fear of upgrading MacOS on a Hack seems irrational. Typically dot point updates go in like a real one. For major updates, Sierra to High Sierra for example, just hang back until Multi Beast and Clover are updated and stable for your hardware configuration.

 

Anyone who can build a Hack to work like a real one can successfully manage OS updates. And if you are handy at the control prompt you can use Clonezilla to make a backup image of your system drive so you can revert if there are issues after upgrading.

[AnotherScott]

wasn't support for Yosemite and earlier dropped in the latest Pro tools update?

Heck, I'm still using Pro Tools 7 (on an older Mac I have). I'd kind of like to upgrade to Logic going forward, but still need to access my old Pro Tools files.

 

Interested to hear how that lines up with your experience running MainStage.

I own Mainstage, but haven't used it, I keep meaning to spend time with it. But I'll probably spend time with a Surface Pro first (probably with Gig Performer), because there's some Windows-only stuff I want to play with, plus on stage I like the tablet form factor. But it would be an adjunct to the rig, not my main sound source. My interest in Mainstage is mostly academic at this point, as gigging with a laptop doesn't really appeal to me. Though who knows, if I put the time into it, maybe it will seduce me.

 

While I have used an iPad as a sound source (and am talking about using a Surface as well), I'm still hardware-focussed for the most part. I like the operational ergonomics of dedicated hardware, and the sounds are generally sufficient. I haven't been doing fly-in gigs lately, so that big benefit of being completely independent of any particular hardware hasn't been an issue. So what little VST stuff I've done has only been at home.

 

There's also a laziness factor. A lot of the time, I don't even bother hooking up my volume pedals or my Ventilator or iPad, I just plug in the keyboards and play. A laptop is yet (at least) one more thing to deal with, it doesn't really replace bringing anything else since I have to bring keyboards regardless. My setups can be ambitious until it comes time to load them and set them up, then it's often about the least amount of stuff that will decently get me through the gig!

[burningbusch]

Plus wasn't support for Yosemite and earlier dropped in the latest Pro tools update?

 

 

Yes. I'm on 10.11. That's the latest OS my Mac Pro supports. I imagine I would configure the Hacintosh with 10.12. That way I shouldn't need to upgrade for sometime.

 

Busch.

[ElmerJFudd]

Apparently the Photoshop/Premiere crowd is interested in running macOS on Surface hardware and they've done so successfully. Google/YouTube has examples of Yosemite running on Surface Pro 4.

 

If Apple keeps dragging their arse on their Pro Macs they'll get Windows converts and OS hackers. They'll likely have latest macOS running on Surface 2 within a week or two of release. And once you have it running, if you use it specifically for Mainstage/Logic - you leave it alone.

[AnotherScott]

Apparently the Photoshop/Premiere crowd is interested in running macOS on Surface hardware and they've done so successfully. Google/YouTube has examples of Yosemite running on Surface Pro 4.

 

If Apple keeps dragging their arse on their Pro Macs they'll get Windows converts and OS hackers. They'll likely have latest macOS running on Surface 2 within a week or two of release. And once you have it running, if you use it specifically for Mainstage/Logic - you leave it alone.

 

The write-up at http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsofts-surface-book-2-is-what-the-next-macbook-pro-should-be-but-almost-certainly-wont/ starts off, "If Microsoft's new Surface Book 2 ran macOS, it would be the perfect MacBook Pro."

[Markay]

Plus wasn't support for Yosemite and earlier dropped in the latest Pro tools update?

 

 

Yes. I'm on 10.11. That's the latest OS my Mac Pro supports. I imagine I would configure the Hacintosh with 10.12. That way I shouldn't need to upgrade for sometime.

 

Busch.

 

I suspect 10.13, High Sierra might be a better choice if you plan to not upgrade thereafter. 32 bit app support has been deprecated 10.13 and it is more likely to become the benchmark for supported 64 bit apps going forward.

[ElmerJFudd]

Hands on article at Tech Crunch

https://techcrunch.com/2017/11/16/hands-on-with-microsofts-high-end-surface-book-2/

 

"Microsoft shipped me a top-of-the-line 15-inch Surface Book 2 review unit with the latest Intel Core i7-8650U CPU clocked at 1.9 GHz, a discrete Nvidia 1060 GPU with 6GB of RAM, 16GB of memory and a terabyte SSD. Thats $3,299 worth of Surface Book, though at the low-end, you can also get a 13-inch machine for $1,499 with an i5 processor, 8GB of RAM and an integrated Intel GPU. In between, there are a number of other 15-inch models with Nvidia 1050 GPUs and varying numbers for RAM and disk space....."