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There are a lot of quality tape delay/echo emulation pedals out there- I've got a Catalinbread EchoRec, and will soon be following in the footsteps of Eric Johnson by getting one of ther Belle Epochs as well. (He has 3 of those on one of his recent touring boards.)

Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: âNinety percent of everything is crapâ

 

My FLMS- Murphy's Music in Irving, Tx

 

http://murphysmusictx.com/

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Mark- can you cite some very specific song examples of the type of sound you're looking for? Can you tell us what you do and DON'T like in the sound of what you're getting with the MF? That could help us figure out an analog or maybe even digital solution for you here... I think that Winston had a really good idea there in your trying out echo-pedals in front of your amp's input, as well as in its effects-loop...

 

There are a lot of quality tape delay/echo emulation pedals out there- I've got a Catalinbread EchoRec, and will soon be following in the footsteps of Eric Johnson by getting one of ther Belle Epochs as well. (He has 3 of those on one of his recent touring boards.)

 

Other than having a lot of extended delay-time available that would go untapped (pun unintended) by Mark Schmieder, the Catalinbread Belle Epoch, placed in front of his amp's input, might net a really satisfying sound.

 

Or, Mark- you might consider shelling out for an old original EH Deluxe Memory Man. Those are FANTASTIC sounding analog-delay echo pedals! As far as I know, its original designer, Howard "Mick" Davis, will still repair/restore/optimize/modify them for optimal performance. He had a few for sale years ago, he might again.

 

 

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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Oh, I have Deluxe Memory Man and don't like it at all on guitars. Not even sure yet that I like it so much on analog synths and/or rare usage on bass guitar.

 

Yeah, I think I'm just not a delay man. Just as I am very sparse in my use of reverb. I don't even use chorus or flanging (or phasing) much anymore.

 

So I think it's just one of those things, where an effect may only have a few sweet spots but that's good enough.

 

The Caitlinbread stuff sounds good.

 

My main problem with the MF Delay is that it gets boomy really easily. But I haven't tried it in the effects loop yet, or on other amps.

 

As a producer, I am always conscious of mud and of colliding frequencies. The biggest conflict I have with guitarists when recording, is the near-universal insistence on having lots of "bottom" in their sound (except for the true studio-experienced professionals I occasionally deal with).

 

I even sculpt away a lot of bottom from my own bass sound when I record, to make room for the kick drum.

 

Anyway, everyone has been a big help in framing the evaluation process, explaining some historical context, describing era-specific delay styles/types, and in recommending some others to look at.

 

I think I'm going to have to hold off on further evaluation at this point though, and see if I can work with the MF Delay using EQ and HPF's to tame the boom. I was just hoping to finalize some stuff soon so I can make clear decisions about segregating my guitar, bass, and keyboard effects to different pedal boards.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Ann P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico Bari, Dano Bari

Select Strat/Tele, Am Pro Jazzmaster, LP 57 Gold, G5422DC-12, T486, T64, PM2, EXL1, XK4, Voyager

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I liked the old Memory Man as a chorus pedal. As a delay pedal not so much.

"It doesn't have to be difficult to be cool" - Mitch Towne

 

"A great musician can bring tears to your eyes!!!

So can a auto Mechanic." - Stokes Hunt

 

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Oh, I have Deluxe Memory Man and don't like it at all on guitars. Not even sure yet that I like it so much on analog synths and/or rare usage on bass guitar.

 

Yeah, I think I'm just not a delay man. Just as I am very sparse in my use of reverb. I don't even use chorus or flanging (or phasing) much anymore.

 

So I think it's just one of those things, where an effect may only have a few sweet spots but that's good enough.

 

The Caitlinbread stuff sounds good.

 

My main problem with the MF Delay is that it gets boomy really easily. But I haven't tried it in the effects loop yet, or on other amps.

 

As a producer, I am always conscious of mud and of colliding frequencies. The biggest conflict I have with guitarists when recording, is the near-universal insistence on having lots of "bottom" in their sound (except for the true studio-experienced professionals I occasionally deal with).

 

I even sculpt away a lot of bottom from my own bass sound when I record, to make room for the kick drum.

 

Anyway, everyone has been a big help in framing the evaluation process, explaining some historical context, describing era-specific delay styles/types, and in recommending some others to look at.

 

I think I'm going to have to hold off on further evaluation at this point though, and see if I can work with the MF Delay using EQ and HPF's to tame the boom. I was just hoping to finalize some stuff soon so I can make clear decisions about segregating my guitar, bass, and keyboard effects to different pedal boards.

 

Hmmm... many vintage-flavored echo pedals are slanted toward dark toned repeats, which might be contributing to a bit of muddiness in your mixes. Perhaps THAT is part of what you're not liking about many of these. Maybe brighter, cleaner, thinner toned delays would serve you better, and/or those that allow such tonal sculpting. For what it's worth, at least as an example, the El Capistan has Tape Age, Tape Bias, Low End Contour, and overall Boost/Cut parameters which all can have quite an impact on low-end and "boominess".

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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Good points. El Capistan is pretty good actually, and the ability to avoid the dark and muddy low frequency buildup is quite helpful. But I don't play guitar live (very often); I'm mostly a bassist and woodwind player plus sometimes (used to be regular) keyboardist and ethnic instrument multi-instrumentalist.

 

So, once we're talking studio vs. stage, I see no point in digital outboard effects, due to limited functionality, flexibility, ergonomics, and AD/DA conversion quality. I'm not completely closed to it; it's just a harder sell as I like to exhaust all of my "in-the-box" options first, once focused on digital vs. analog.

 

At any rate, this has all been very educational. I really didn't start focusing on electric guitar sound manipulation (amps, pedals, etc.) until a few years ago, when I suddenly met a LOT of really good guitarists who were patient enough to educate me in return for what I've done for them with my production work etc. I was too intimidated before, as I didn't leave the world of pure acoustic music/instruments until the mid to late 80's, and that was a really bad time for learning, history, buying, etc.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Ann P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico Bari, Dano Bari

Select Strat/Tele, Am Pro Jazzmaster, LP 57 Gold, G5422DC-12, T486, T64, PM2, EXL1, XK4, Voyager

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Good points. El Capistan is pretty good actually, and the ability to avoid the dark and muddy low frequency buildup is quite helpful. But I don't play guitar live (very often); I'm mostly a bassist and woodwind player plus sometimes (used to be regular) keyboardist and ethnic instrument multi-instrumentalist.

 

So, once we're talking studio vs. stage, I see no point in digital outboard effects, due to limited functionality, flexibility, ergonomics, and AD/DA conversion quality. I'm not completely closed to it; it's just a harder sell as I like to exhaust all of my "in-the-box" options first, once focused on digital vs. analog.

 

At any rate, this has all been very educational. I really didn't start focusing on electric guitar sound manipulation (amps, pedals, etc.) until a few years ago, when I suddenly met a LOT of really good guitarists who were patient enough to educate me in return for what I've done for them with my production work etc. I was too intimidated before, as I didn't leave the world of pure acoustic music/instruments until the mid to late 80's, and that was a really bad time for learning, history, buying, etc.

 

Well, then, whether by pedal or plug-in or what have you, I'm guessing that any means to roll-off a little treble and a little more bass from echo repeats, emphasizing midrange there, without wobble, warble, or degradation, would be beneficial to you.

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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Any fans of univibery?

[video:youtube]

 

Yes. Though I've yet to get any sort of 'Vibe, unless you count the UV-Sim that my Boss RT-20 does, which is good enough to make me want the real thing. I'm VERY likely to score a Fulltone Mini Deja 'Vibe 3 before too long. (I'll listen to that McCaffery Audio 'Run Rabbit Run' vid when I can; I'm at work right now... )

 

Interesting, synchronous timing, considering the reference in the pedal's name- I saw your post there while "Raise My Rent" by David Gilmour was playing on Pandora streaming audio here at work... :cool:

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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I've got the RT-20 as well, as you may recall, and have that same itch. I'm liking that Rabbit...

 

I'm thinkin' I'll stay my course toward the Fulltone MDV-3...

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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I gotta B me, U gotta B U!

 

Always a good guide in pedal, amp, and guitar choices.

 

For example, while the B9, Key 9, etc. pedals from EH are plenty cool, when I copped various keyboard sounds "the hard way" with multiple pedals and techniques, I definitely sounded much more "like me".

 

And I know a lot of people enjoy EH's POG line; personally, I can't stand that sound, and would sound like a lot of people, and less individual, if I used those for octave sounds. Thankfully, the B9, C9, etc. don't sound quite as 'POGgy' as they might.

 

:blah: Sorry! :D

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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Whereas, I don't have time to figure out how to dial in a keyboardy sound with other gear, so the EHX keyboard pedals are a godsend to me.

 

As long as people don't get too snooty about things, and realize there are many paths, things are good. Pedals are just tools.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...as are guys like me who buy 'em. ;):laugh:

Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: âNinety percent of everything is crapâ

 

My FLMS- Murphy's Music in Irving, Tx

 

http://murphysmusictx.com/

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Whereas, I don't have time to figure out how to dial in a keyboardy sound with other gear, so the EHX keyboard pedals are a godsend to me.

 

As long as people don't get too snooty about things, and realize there are many paths, things are good. Pedals are just tools.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...as are guys like me who buy 'em. ;):laugh:

 

@Dannyalcatraz - I'm with you on the first part ("Pedals are just tools . . ."), less sure about the second?

 

As much as I love my Guitar Synths, I also love the idea of being able to get those Mellotron sounds out of my favorite SG, without mounting a plastic blister on its face. I'll be heading up to my FLMS to check out the Mel9 this coming week. I may even have a video to share . . .

"Monsters are real, and Ghosts are real too. They live inside us, and sometimes, they win." Stephen King

 

http://www.novparolo.com

 

https://thewinstonpsmithproject.bandcamp.com

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I upgraded to the MDV-3 quite recently myself. I preferred the looks of my previous wah-pedal model (ivory) as blue is about the only colour I don't like, but I prefer the warmth and subtlety of the new version.

 

It took a lot of back and forth comparisons, and I wrote them up in detail in my eBay ad but can't remember them now. I'm the kind of person who decides and moves on; I don't believe in regrets or re-do's.

 

Off the top of my head though, I think the Fulltone MDV-3 has less range than the previous models. For me, that's a good thing, as it means more subtle expression and no fear of going into the extremes that I personally never like anyway.

 

Also, I think the chorus setting on the new version is sweeter and more distinct. The combinations of chorus/vibrato and vintage/modern can be "too much" at times, combined with the other controls, but I find that different guitars "take" better to different settings, so I'm writing those down for when I do recordings.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Ann P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico Bari, Dano Bari

Select Strat/Tele, Am Pro Jazzmaster, LP 57 Gold, G5422DC-12, T486, T64, PM2, EXL1, XK4, Voyager

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Sometimes, as you say, a more limited device is actually more suitable for the task. More focused.

 

After all, the Swiss make multitasking army knives, but you never hear about zweihanders with spoons, files, scissor, awls, and bottle openers...

Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: âNinety percent of everything is crapâ

 

My FLMS- Murphy's Music in Irving, Tx

 

http://murphysmusictx.com/

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Sometimes, as you say, a more limited device is actually more suitable for the task. More focused.

 

After all, the Swiss make multitasking army knives, but you never hear about zweihanders with spoons, files, scissor, awls, and bottle openers...

 

:D:thu:

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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  • 2 weeks later...
Radial's got a new DI box/amp simulator; they make great equipment, so this should be worth at least a look: JDX

 

Niiiiiice.... :cool:

 

Radial does make great stuff; I love my Radial Tonebone Plexitube tube/SS hybrid dual-channel Marshallesque distortion pedal. For me, it works best for feeding a digital modeler/multi-effects unit going direct to headphones, PA/monitors, or recording device. This new JDX Direct-Drive Amp Sim/DI would probably be GREAT in place of the dm/mfx, followed by my El Capistan and Flint, etc....

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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This pedal (from a company I've never heard of before today) came out about a year ago, but it just crossed my path, so better late than never. Named after the late '60s/early '70s band of the same name, the Silver Apple can get as freaky as they could.

 

[video:youtube]

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Given the £'s post-Brexit vote decline, I've been looking at gear from the UK with the vulture-like enthusiasm. One company I revisited was Rainger. I believe I posted their Air Traffic Controller earlier in the thread. Here's another couple of their unusual devices:

 

[video:youtube]

 

[video:youtube]

 

Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: âNinety percent of everything is crapâ

 

My FLMS- Murphy's Music in Irving, Tx

 

http://murphysmusictx.com/

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Here is ARC Effects' Shepherd- their updated version of the classic Violet Ram's Head fuzz.

 

 

____________ [video:youtube]

 

 

Niiiiice. :cool:

 

Judging by their proffered videos, I kinda like their Crimson King pedal, too... :cool:

 

 

____________ [video:youtube]

 

 

But, I digress... ;)

 

Now, if you like that ARC Shepherd, you'd like the V1 variant of the VFE Fiery Red Horse, which has a LOT of gain and output-volume on-tap, a Mid knob, and your choice of three different types of diodes, among many other extra features- and can probably be found for less, if you can find one. It's also smaller, a very compact pedal with a LOT of usable "bells and whistles"!

 

I'm sure that similar, perhaps identical sounds can be dialed-in with the V2 version of the Fiery Red Horse, and still for less. This version has a Bandaxall Treble and Bass EQ circuit, which boosts mids as the treble and Bass are dialed back, and cuts mids the more Treble and Bass are boosted. It also features a circuit and knob that dials compression in or out.

 

Not to put down or marginalize the ARC Effects Shepherd- not at all! That sure sounds like an excellent Muff-stylee, and I'm sure that I would enjoy one. I'm just kicking the ball around re: other vintage Big Muff inspired fuzztortion pedals with added midrange controls, and some such pedals that I've had experience with.

 

O0O0O0O0H, (also judging by their posted video demo) I'm also digging the ARC Gamut, their take on the venerable aulde treble booster, and the way it (A) sounds like Led Zeppelin in a box, and (B) cleans up pretty nicely with the twist of the guitar's volume-knobs...

 

____________ [video:youtube]

 

 

____________

 

Now, Rangemaster/treble booster type pedals are usually pretty simple, and as such can make a great, easy introduction to DIY pedal-building. It may or may not be worth it to you to pay a fair premium for this, the ARC Gamut, which seems to be a high quality, quiet, gainy, versatile, good toned take on a treble booster stylee with added features and conveniences. "YMMV".

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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Caev, I'm an avowed fuzz addict. If I looked, I probably have more fuzzes than any other kind of pedal. I bet the bulk of the entries on my G.A.S. list are some kind of fuzz. And a lot of fuzzes I own or on my list are updates of classic fuzzes.

 

I have the ARC Crimson. :D

 

I have a Russian Big Muff Pi, and yet I plan on getting the ARC Big Green, the Wren & Cuff Big Font, and the recently discovered McCaffery Green Vodka.

Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: âNinety percent of everything is crapâ

 

My FLMS- Murphy's Music in Irving, Tx

 

http://murphysmusictx.com/

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Caev, I'm an avowed fuzz addict. If I looked, I probably have more fuzzes than any other kind of pedal. I bet the bulk of the entries on my G.A.S. list are some kind of fuzz. And a lot of fuzzes I own or on my list are updates of classic fuzzes.

 

I have the ARC Crimson. :D

 

I have a Russian Big Muff Pi, and yet I plan on getting the ARC Big Green, the Wren & Cuff Big Font, and the recently discovered McCaffery Green Vodka.

 

My toez izz on the firzt few stepz o' that path, az well. I particularly like various octave-fuzzes, and I've found that they and 'regular' fuzzes can really work well with my whole fingerstyle "touch" and "play the amp (and pedals)"/guitar-volume-knob dynamic approach.

 

Any suggestions for fuzzes/octave-fuzzes that (A) "clean up" well, and (B) will still play nice with another pedal between them and the guitar, such as, say, a VFE Bumblebee swell/optical-compressor pedal... ? I rrreeeaallly love the sound of fuzz/overdrive/distortion ramping-up from cleaner to meaner to screamer along the sweep of a volume-swell... :crazy::love:

 

I think that you'd have a lot of fun with the V1 and V2 VFE Fiery Red Horses. And LOADS of fun and inspiration with a Foxrox Octron or Octron 2! THAT is a pedal that YOU really should have!! Put a volume-pedal after it, and echo downstream- try a single repeat, high mix to nearly match the volume level of the 'normal' signal, maybe arund 200ms or so delay-time... :cool:

Ask yourself- What Would Ren and Stimpy Do?

 

~ Caevan James-Michael Miller-O'Shite ~

_ ___ _ Leprechaun, Esquire _ ___ _

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These are the first to spring to mind.

 

The Magnetic Effects White Atom and their (discontinued) Buzzkill might be to your liking.

[video:youtube]

[video:youtube]

 

As might the excellent Thorpy Muffroom Cloud (being re-released as the Fallout Cloud after a C&D letter from EHX).

[video:youtube]

 

(The Thorpy is in my G.A.S. list. I own the other two.)

Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: âNinety percent of everything is crapâ

 

My FLMS- Murphy's Music in Irving, Tx

 

http://murphysmusictx.com/

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My new Suhr Jack Rabbit tremolo arrived today, and it is warm, transparent, vibey, subtle, yet authentic sounding. Green like the Diamond pedal that it is probably most inspired by, it wasn't originally my first choice as I didn't know about it given that it's pretty new. But I ultimately decided the Fulltone was a bit too coloured for my tastes, and felt the Suhr was likely an improvement on what Diamond offers.

Eugenio Upright, 60th Ann P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico Bari, Dano Bari

Select Strat/Tele, Am Pro Jazzmaster, LP 57 Gold, G5422DC-12, T486, T64, PM2, EXL1, XK4, Voyager

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