"Not even Jazz"

[Ross Brown]

Gig on Friday we played "White Room". Just as we went into the guitar instrumental, the whole thing fell apart. I thought it was ok, just not White Room anymore... At the break, my wife asked me what happened. I told her but said I thought we recovered OK. She said "no, it was bad. It wasn't even jazz".

 

Rest of the night was very good. I love my wife. She tells it like she sees it (and she is not a big fan of jazz, evidently).

 

 

[Chewbubba]

I hate it when that happens. I can SO relate...

 

Sorry. I'm glad the rest of the gig went well in spite of the meltdown.

[Bottomgottem]

A regrettable circumstance, but a great quote.

[moot]

That's a great story Ross. Been there more than I care to remember.

You know it's bad when . . .

[jeremy c]

Love that quote.

[Phil W]

Yes, great quote!

[Tom Capasso]

She's clever and brutally honest. I have one like that at home, and it isn't always easy.

 

Not sure what part fell down, but we found that most of us had a different sense of how to time coming back in than the drummer did (going from the 5/4 to the ending guitar solo section). One of the guitarists said to wait a long time to build the drama (letting whatever we ended with ring for a while). Then the drummer hits the hat 4 times and we're all in together. Not as completely clean as coming in without a cue, but it works pretty well. We do have some times where we just hit things together without a cue, because we can count....

 

The "oops" will happen again for both of us.

 

Tom

[Griffinator]

You're a white room.

[Griffinator]

Then the drummer hits the hat 4 times and we're all in together.

 

Or you can do what they actually did - which was cue off a simple snare shot. We use that mechanic all the time - instead of drummer counting off 4 beats (how painfully obvious) we just have him do a 1-count snare hit and start the next measure.

 

In "White Room" it'd go something like this:

 

WHACK! "At the"

1-beat "party, she was kindness..."

[jeremy c]

o.t.

I saw Cream live in 1968 (at the Grande Ballroom in Detroit). When they played White Room, it was the first time I had ever heard a wah wah pedal. And it was Eric Clapton playing it through a Marshall stack. I thought that I had died and gone to heaven.

 

(0r maybe that was the drugs)

[Steve Force]

o.t.

I saw Cream live in 1968 (at the Grande Ballroom in Detroit). When they played White Room, it was the first time I had ever heard a wah wah pedal. And it was Eric Clapton playing it through a Marshall stack. I thought that I had died and gone to heaven.

 

(0r maybe that was the drugs)

 

http://idealposters.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/jc020L.jpg

 

Jack at that show

http://www.angelfire.com/ca/oldtimers/images/GrandeBallroom69.jpg

 

http://www.angelfire.com/ca/oldtimers/images/GrandeBallroombob.jpg

 

Source: http://www.angelfire.com/ca/oldtimers/TourPics.html

[jeremy c]

Yeah, Steve, I remember seeing you there.

[Steve Force]

 

I wish I would have been there....

[Ross Brown]

Then the drummer hits the hat 4 times and we're all in together.

 

Or you can do what they actually did - which was cue off a simple snare shot. We use that mechanic all the time - instead of drummer counting off 4 beats (how painfully obvious) we just have him do a 1-count snare hit and start the next measure.

 

In "White Room" it'd go something like this:

 

WHACK! "At the"

1-beat "party, she was kindness..."

 

That is what we (try to) do. I believe the cue was missing. The drummer was about to head to the wrong part. I was split between what the drummer did and what the guitarist was doing. I did not help it, evidently. Was ugly. Very ugly...

[Tom Capasso]

Griff - We never had to think about it except the last time (not when the singing starts up), because it's a bit longer. It's obvious, but we don't think it's painful.

 

I'd have loved to see that show, but I didn't get to many concerts (still don't!).

 

Seeing this thread reminds me of the first Traffic album. There's one tune that has a jazzy feeling, and before and after there are the sounds of people talking. At the end, the last voice you hear says something like "but...I'm in jazz" or something like that. As if jazz is the only cool thing (this was in 1966-67). And that's going to put Traffic earworms in my head for the rest of the day ("Hole In My Shoe" is playing at the moment).

 

Tom

[The Bear Jew]

Do you really need the snare shot (flam?) at the start of that last verse with the vocal? You'd think the "At the..." vocal cue would be enough to bring the whole band into the verse. That vocal cue could come in free time, really, because it acts as a "1,2" count that'd bring the band in together, regardless of how long the last note had been held. Having that snare shot in there doesn't necessarily guarantee that everyone's gonna stop at the same time... you still need to count until you hear the snare.

 

That last part... the one that goes into the solo... THAT one could use a flam to get everyone in at the right time, and, once again, everyone could hold the last note until the drummer cues everyone back in with a loud-ass snare shot.

 

And yes, I am aware that I am a loud-ass snare shot.

[Ross Brown]

Yes. At the end is where we use the cue. Vocal cues elswhere.

 

 

[Griffinator]

Do you really need the snare shot (flam?) at the start of that last verse with the vocal?

 

Well, strictly from an arrangement perspective, I view their use of the flam to bring back the vocal is almost like the hypnotist snapping his fingers to wake you out of the dreamy interlude.

[b5pilot]

That is a great line! Ah, meltdowns. I hate when they happen, and they happen far more than I'd like.

[Big Daddy from Motown]

Hey Jeremy I was there!

[jeremy c]

I was looking at the pictures that forceman posted.

I was mistaken. I was not at the 1968 show, I was at the 1967 show and the song with the wah wah must have been Tales of Brave Ulysses.

 

I went to the Grande quite often in those years: I lived in Ann Arbor. I saw Clapton again with Blind Faith at Olympia Stadium in 1969.

 

And all you younger people who are jealous have probably seen a lot of bands that I haven't, so we're even.

[jeremy c]

She could have said, "you guys were great! that almost sounded like music!"

 

That's what I would have said (with a big grin on my face).

[Ross Brown]

yea, me too!

[Big Daddy from Motown]

At the 67 show clapton played the painted "SG Les Paul"

 

In 68 he played the firebird in the pictures.

 

The Blind faith concert at Olympia he played the Strat Blackie.

 

Jack Bruce was on fire for both Grande concerts. I spent several years of my young life trying to sound just like Jack Bruce. I still hear some of his influence on my playing 40 years later.

[Juancarlin]

She could have said, "you guys were great! that almost sounded like music!"

That's what I would have said (with a big grin on my face).

 

On the other hand.. my friend, that one with the awesome bass collection, once said to a fellow musician on stage, between songs.. something like.. "You' re SO out of the concept, you' re even insulting music itself.. so DO music a favor and stop doing THAT, whatever you' ve thought you were doing' ..."

 

Well, that was about 12 or 13 years ago. Now my friend knows WAY better than that (and also plays a lot better too), and the "offender" is not only friends back again with him, but they also play together in a non-music-insulting environment Which also happens to be an awesome sounding 60s local artists revival show

 

So the "Almost like jazz" is somewhat of a softie... wait, YOU are a softie

[Griffinator]

You're a revival.

[Ross Brown]

Tommorrow nights "White Room" spot on the set list has been replaced by "Sunshine of Your Love". Must be the Cream spot on the song rotation. We'll see how it goes.... usually no trouble with that one, but you never know...

[TimR]

Bottlers.

 

It's like riding a bike, you've got to get straight back on if you fall off.

 

You may never play that tune again if you don't do it tommorow.

[Ross Brown]

Not afraid to try it again. We are beyond that. Singer tracks set list and venues to avoid playing same material we we play each time at venue. White Room will come around again, probably next Saturday.

[Jode]

If you play a mistake once, it's a mistake. If you play it twice, it's jazz.

 

-Unknown