CyberGene

I love Diva, it’s the best virtual synth I’ve ever used but I think it’s not exactly the easiest to understand. Call me stupid but for the life of me I can’t remember what the LFO depth knob actually does (it’s not LFO depth) and why you hear vibrato when it’s zeroed and why you stop hearing vibrato when it’s maxed out 😲 Once I spent hours scratching my head figuring out why it’s “reversed” and I wrote some notes down, that I recall whenever I start creating a new patch to save me some headaches: Understanding the “counterintuitive” LFO depth mod knob: Basically, the knob does not set the amplitude/effect of the LFO to its destination. Instead, it determines how much of the LFO amplitude is affected by the mod source. So, since LFO1 is hard linked to osc pitch in the vibrato section and if we use mod wheel as mod source: - setting the knob to zero will mean that there is constant vibrato regardless of mod wheel. - if set to maximum, only the mod wheel determines how much vibrato (amplitude) there is. - If in between, both constant vibrato will be applied and an additional mod wheel vibrato will be added - If we select “none” as mod source, it’s equivalent to a constant of zero or the same as mod wheel at zero position, however the mod wheel won’t affect vibrato or other LFO destinations

I can’t add anything more to this thread. I’m also one of those who can only play (semi) decently on, and get inspired only by, quality (real) instruments or the best digital emulations. Maybe I’m a lesser musician, whatever.

Nothing beats the real hardware for good tactile feel. I’d recommend a Behringer Model D which is a replica of Minimoog. Sounds good, feels good, simple to understand.

Thanks, sounds promising. I'm looking for a second keyboard on top of my CP88 (or third above the Hydrasynth) for exactly that type of band and music (+ a bit of pop/rock) and stumbled upon the Nord Wave 2 and the specs and sounds are really impressive. The price not so much, but still OK.

So, did you keep it? 🙂 And if so, what do you think about it after nearly two years now?

I understand the engineering fun of modular (I’ve only used the virtual Model 15 on my iPad) but I am yet to hear a sound made on a modular system that makes it worth the hassle nowadays. Software synths and semi-modular (or even pre-patched synths in the traditional layout with a simple mod matrix) are good enough to make any synth sound IMO.

Software engineer, mostly backend with Java. For the last 10 years I’ve been working for VMware.

As I said, I'm very OCD-driven and so I just decided to reinstall my macOS Ventura and I will be really careful with software. I only installed Logic and U-He plugins and I plan on using only them for the foreseeable future. No careless audio software installation unless strictly necessary.

Then why is it a background service? If it's only run when you do these particular tasks, it can be a standalone app without a background service. A background process might not be shown in the activity monitor. The OS treats background services differently than the regular processes. And you are not looking at the activity monitor 24/7 😀 It can activate itself exactly when you are busy with other apps. Depending on how well (or bad) it's implemented, it can either be very lean or bog down the entire system. It's a computer program that can do conditional things, it's not a permanent process with a permanent/static CPU load that you can take as a reference. And then, when you have many of these background processes, their total CPU usage might not be miniscule. But there are other aspects to background processes besides CPU and memory usage. In my particular case I had system files messed up by background processes. The mere fact an audio-related software can actually overwrite system files (since these background processes are apparently given elevated permissions to do their job, or they wouldn't be able to mess up system files) is even more worrying here. You assume the software is well written and with good intent. But that's just an assumption. As a software engineer myself I can assure you from my many years of practice that there are bugs even with the best software in the world (and that's not the best software in the world, let's face it, is's an auxiliary functionality written by their less talented developers because the top guns are dedicated to the critical audio engine) and also there are often a lot of untold decisions made by companies that are far from being honest, just remember how Zoom used to open a local port without revealing that, for the purpose of being able to automatically initiate meetings from the Calendar app, bypassing the security limitations of Safari/Calendar. Crap like that is endless. I applaud your optimism about people and humanity but I have my reasons to always start with the assumption we have the worst developers creating an unneeded app with the worst intent. Please note, I'm not saying my problem was caused by the NI stuff. I suspect Steinberg or Avid because those two were installed around the weekend when the problems happened. But it just means that any of these (including NI) can become a nuisance. P.S. Also, a background process may lay dormant for hours/days and be programmed to do its job when it detects, for instance, that there is file activity in the audio plugins folder. Just imagine they implemented some anti-piracy features that start re-scanning their plugins and library against tampering. And it's badly written, so it activates not only when their own files are being tampered with but also when any other plugin is doing file read/write activity in the audio components folder (e.g. another plugin is caching some data in the same folder temporarily). And you end up with lowered system performance in the worst possible moment although all have been good otherwise. It's just that these background processes are crap and should be avoided as much as possible. Not seeing that happening of course, since the big companies do what they please but it's certainly not happening when we actively avoid talking about it and accept it as normal. No, it's not.

I have Rosetta 2 apps and they work with Ventura fine, nothing was needed on my side.

I'm not blaming any particular software here because there were many of them and I had about 6 different background services installed. In the last weekend I needed a notation software and installed Dorico trial which in itself installed a software licenser, a library manager (which in itself downloaded some Halion cr*p which I had explicitly disabled in the Dorico installation), an app downloader and an activation manager. In addition, there was a background service installed. I'm not sure those were easily visible in previous versions of macOS but on Ventura they are now in the System settings (BTW, the actual files are in /Library/LaunchAgents and /Library/LaunchDaemons and you can delete them but when I tried deleting some of them, the plugins wouldn't start, so those are required background services). Then I decided to try Sibelius since I wasn't very impressed with Dorico and it came with corresponding Avid cr*p and multiple auxiliary programs and a background service. I think it's one of these two. BTW, both Dorico and Sibelius seem non-intuitive to me (I'm coming from MuseScore which I used in the past, however it seems in the latest major version it's also coming with a bunch of software/library managers now). Removing all the leftovers from Avid and Steinberg took me around 20 minutes, their cr*p was all over the operating system folders. You can't imagine the sheer number of directories they drop stuff and then don't offer an uninstaller. There was actually an uninstallation script which apparently didn't remove everything. Regarding Native Instruments: I'm lucky that I don't depend on it. I only used Kontakt for my Vintage D library but after I switched to Garritan CFX as my main piano library, I abandoned Vintage D. Well, I installed Kontakt a few weeks ago since I purchased Scarbee. But I'm not currently in any need for Rhodes libraries, for the moment I will only play live with my CP88, so I will postpone installing Kontakt for indefinite time, unless I really have to use Scarbee. And I'm not putting Avid and Steinberg cr*p anymore! I'm such an OCD that I am currently considering re-installing my macOS... I think Arturia is actually OK, although it doesn't run without the background service they install. I removed it and the plugins won't start. But it seems to not be causing problems. That being said, I will try living only with U-He and Waldorf plugins for some time and see how it goes. Only if I find I'm really needing the Arturia Collection V or Pigments, will I install them again.

Let’s turn this rant thread into something useful and collect information about plugins that come with a simple installer that only copies the plug-in to the corresponding directory without relying on software managers, downloaders, background processes, licensers, etc. I’ll start with those I own: U-He Diva U-He Re-Pro 1/5 Waldorf PPG Wave 3.V Waldorf Streichfett Plugin Valhalla Supermassive The following two can be downloaded separately from Plugin Alliance although they also offer an optional PA download manager: BX Oberhausen Knif Audio Knifonium (the zip of this one is broken and they acknowledged it, so I had to install and use the download manager) What other companies/plugins you use that have simple standalone installers without cr*p?

So, I have a 3-month old MacBook Air M2 which is a great computer. What am I talking... It's the greatest computer I've ever owned and it's so blazing fast for audio, I can run countless instances of U-He Diva in Logic Pro X and it would just play them without a hitch in divine quality. But it started showing some weird behavior, macOS system icons were missing, it started showing constant repeating notifications of background services, not being as snappy as it was, etc. I went through various Apple support articles but nothing helped. So, I was on the phone with the Apple Support yesterday for more than an hour, sharing my screen and they scratched their heads. After all, I agreed to uninstall temporarily all the bloatware and background services that came with various audio software: - Arturia Software Center and background service - Native Instruments whatever-center-daemon, etc. - Steinberg whatever-bloatware-stuff - Two different e-licenser bloatcr*p, PACE and whatnot - Plugin alliance downloader - Avid center-background-sh1t - .... (can't remember everything) And voila, the problems disappeared, macOS icons in the system settings are now visible and restored. They recommend running like that for a few days to see if the problem reappears and if not, then start installing them back again one at a day and see which one is the offender and then contact corresponding developer. But I'm just fed up with that crap. I'm sick of having to install one ton of pig-cr*p to be able to use a simple plugin and I think I'm vowing to leave only those plugins that can be installed in a simple way, without relying on separate downloaders, e-licensers and background processes that turn one of the finest computers into a mess. I think I'm just using Logic Pro X and all its great embedded plugins + U-He Diva and Re-Pro, two Waldorf plugins, Garritan CFX, Valhalla Supermassive.

Jeff Lorber’s way of Rhodes soloing has always been one of my favorites (after Herbie Hancock). It speaks a lot to me that he chose the CP88 for piano and Rhodes duties 👍🏻

To me a B3 is cheesy, especially for that Lesley slow/fast transition. But I love it, don’t get me wrong 😀 With that in mind, I’d say cheesy sounds/patches are those that draw attention too much towards the sound rather than the music content they carry. A piano sound is one of the most unobtrusive acoustic instrument sounds ever since you can’t modulate it, it’s rather static. So, to touch people you have to create beautiful music with it. (Well, the DX piano is also static but then it’s too specific as a timbre and is not as universal as an acoustic piano). Whenever you accentuate the timbre of an instrument then you’re already in the cheesiness category. With that in mind every instrument/timbre/sound can be cheesy, including a piano. So, it’s all nuanced.

That's good to know, so they implemented some guards. I've heard of instruments which won't prevent that and then you will end up with a bricked instrument.

What happened when you tried?

If you have a Mac, you already have a great DAW: GarageBand. Should you decide you need more pro features, you can upgrade to LogicPro X for something like 200 bucks (depending on country and currency of course) which will include so many features and instruments, some of which you can't find even in the most expensive workstations.

I find working in a DAW much easier and smoother than having to use these tiny screens with awkward UI-s on workstations and arrangers. I understand where that new mantra about hating computers and “liberating” from them is coming from but there are a lot of misunderstandings and mostly emotional arguments that preach against DAW-s. Going fully backwards to those times when you were only using real instruments, effect pedals and a 4-track tape recorder is one thing and it can be very inspiring and unlocking your creativity. Using a crippled DAW-like environment though, as in a workstation/arranger is completely different story. But it’s always good to go through a reality check.

I can’t stand that supersaw sound. I’m a fan of EDM and electronic music but the supersaw is mostly used in those types that I dislike.

YouTube has upped its game today:

Coincidentally YouTube reminded me today about this old but gold reportage about explosions. I always crack at it 🤣

Take-5 also offers stereo spread although it's slightly twisted and only available through mod matrix and there's no choice over the voice allocation scheme. The Pro-800 is mono only. I don't own a Take-5 but I've been actively researching it for the last few days since I'm interested in it. What bothers me about the Take-5 is what many people complain about: inability to see the saved values of controls when you load a patch, despite it having two screens and the main one is a big OLED screen, so that functionality could have been easily implemented. Maybe a firmware can fix this. Well, when you match the saved value for a knob, there will bi a dot shown on the 3-digit 7-segment display but that's still too awkward (you have to twist the knob slowly and observe whether the dot appears and you don't know in which direction you have to turn). People also complain about various bugs that are still not fixed and quality issues. What I like about the Pro-800 is it has a very good MIDI CC support for all its controls which means I can use my Hydrasynth as a controller and assign various Hydra sources (aftertouch, ribbon, LFO-s, envelopes, etc.) to MIDI CC. Thus it can be almost the same as a Take 5 and even more. For half the price. I'm an almost certain buyer of the Pro-800 as it seems.

The Korg Vox Continental stand allows tilting. Maybe it can be adapted for other keyboards too.

I’ve had a bass player who would often just play anything but the root, so the harmony sounded weird.