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SoundJack - low latency solution for internet rehearsal
#3051646 06/29/20 05:24 PM
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Spoke with some university friends today trying to rehearse remotely. In addition to advancements being made with JamKazam (new version due out soon) they tell me SoundJack is doing a good job. The example below has both slow and fast tempo numbers and these two are hitting together surprisingly well. The example also shows live performance streaming making use of a second computer to take the burden off of the first.



https://www.soundjack.eu/

If you give it a go, let us know what you think!


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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3051674 06/29/20 07:08 PM
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thu

Now I just need people who want to play with me. frown


The great thing about music is that there's always something to learn. The frustrating thing about music is that there's always something to learn!
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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
Joe Muscara #3051678 06/29/20 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Joe Muscara
thu

Now I just need people who want to play with me. frown

No respect, Joe. My girlfriend calls me. She says, “come over, there’s no one home”. I went over, there was no one home.


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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3051680 06/29/20 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ElmerJFudd
Originally Posted by Joe Muscara
thu

Now I just need people who want to play with me. frown

No respect, Joe. My girlfriend calls me. She says, “come over, there’s no one home”. I went over, there was no one home.
rimshot


The great thing about music is that there's always something to learn. The frustrating thing about music is that there's always something to learn!
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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3051766 06/30/20 04:07 AM
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This little raspberry pi pc is apparently optimized for low latency with SoundJack,
https://symonics.com/fastmusic/

They are talking about 15ms latency within a 16 mile radius. Video is through a different app and is a bit slower. Audio interface is a focusrite over USB.

There’s a video demonstration in the link above but I can’t insert it here.


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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3051779 06/30/20 11:00 AM
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I am skeptical. This morning, the round-trip ping to a guitar player across town (7 mi) was 64-70 ms.

Re: Some having success with SoundJack
Bradley B #3051791 06/30/20 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Bradley B
I am skeptical. This morning, the round-trip ping to a guitar player across town (7 mi) was 64-70 ms.

That’s not good for the music making.
A bit more info. Are you plugged into Ethernet on both sides? And using a low latency audio interface on both sides?


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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3051802 06/30/20 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ElmerJFudd
There’s a video demonstration in the link above but I can’t insert it here.
I was feeling the latency - particularly when the female vocalist took a verse. Either that or her phrasing was really weird.


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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
Wastrel #3051804 06/30/20 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Wastrel
Originally Posted by ElmerJFudd
There’s a video demonstration in the link above but I can’t insert it here.
I was feeling the latency - particularly when the female vocalist took a verse. Either that or her phrasing was really weird.

Yes, I’m under the impression that the second demo was over 5G.

Her phrasing was odd, but I don’t know if that was latency as much as just her. The internet is inherently slow and efforts to make live play quick enough to be effective and satisfying have been lacking. So any steps toward improving the tech are welcome... especially of we're going to be careful about sharing breathing room for some time yet. A silver lining, perhaps.


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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3051813 06/30/20 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by ElmerJFudd
Originally Posted by Bradley B
I am skeptical. This morning, the round-trip ping to a guitar player across town (7 mi) was 64-70 ms.

That’s not good for the music making.
A bit more info. Are you plugged into Ethernet on both sides? And using a low latency audio interface on both sides?
This was a round-trip network delay test between source/destination WAN IPs. It was measured by my ASUS router. The minimum round-trip time was 63 ms. Usually, the one-way delay is taken to be half of that.

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Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3052012 07/01/20 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by ElmerJFudd
Originally Posted by Wastrel
Originally Posted by ElmerJFudd
There’s a video demonstration in the link above but I can’t insert it here.
I was feeling the latency - particularly when the female vocalist took a verse. Either that or her phrasing was really weird.


Her phrasing was odd, but I don’t know if that was latency as much as just her.
Maybe the perceived latency at her end was causing her to be hesitant. IDK


Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.
-Mark Twain
Re: Some having success with SoundJack
ElmerJFudd #3052760 07/05/20 10:06 PM
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Ye canna beat th' laws o' physics, Jim!

I think that the best case scenario that they put in the videos will always be way better than real world results, but that's just me being cynical.

In my case it's not that useful, as most of my favorite jamming partners are well outside a 15 mile range... like, WELL outside... like, northern England....


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
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Re: SoundJack - low latency solution for internet rehearsal
ElmerJFudd #3052937 07/06/20 10:22 PM
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Ok, simultaneous play from North Carolina to Rhode Island. That’s pretty far, there is a lag it’s quite low, when they sing together more noticeable. Their server simply must prioritize low latency audio over video and maybe even over audio quality? - and since traffic is far less than Zoom or Skype or Facetime they can get better performance. Still needs both people to be plugged in with Ethernet to router and to have low latency audio interfaces on the host computers.




“ Their audio connection is through SoundJack, a free online audio service that has very low latency/lag. This makes it possible for Wendy and Eden to make music and respond to each other with minimal lag/latency. Most other online connectors have such noticeable lag that real-time collaboration is not possible.

They set up their SoundJack systems by carefully watching videos on the SoundJack site and with guidance from Dr. Ian Howell, their colleague in Boston. If you want to investigate these online options, his research is extremely helpful. https://www.ianhowellcountertenor.com...

If you're a musician, coach, or teacher looking for the fastest possible high-quality audio connection (and you are, because otherwise our performing and teaching options may continue to be severely limited by the pandemic), check out SoundJack.
CleanFeed is another option and we've had some success with it as well. You can see our video experiment here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyF-p...
InternetMIDI is another interesting option to get high-speed MIDI device connection in a music lesson. Eden has tested this successfully. Our friend and colleague David Sabella has more information: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIsXV...

InternetMIDI: www.timewarptechnologies.com (both need to purchase the program and have MIDI devices connected)
SoundJack: www.soundjack.eu (free but there is a learning curve; some tech skill and adjustments are mandatory; works best with fastest processors and routers)
CleanFeed: www.cleanfeed.net (very easy to use but more noticeable lag; free and subscription versions are available)

Wendy's site: https://www.wendyljonesmusic.com/
Eden's site: www.edencasteel.com
Wendy and Eden are both members of The SpeakEasy Cooperative and the National Association of Teachers of Singing.”


Live: Casio PX-560, Roland VR-700
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