bvdd Posted July 9, 2001 Author Share Posted July 9, 2001 Yea, except that .. It's a double whammy in a 3 piece band when the guitar guy STILL won't play any rhythm. Sheeessh. Then the bass and drums decide they have to fill up all those EMPTY spaces. That's a true Kodak moment right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve LeBlanc Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 reminds me of how disappointed I was to learn that BBKing is also ignorant of most of what's around him and is totally focused on his soloing only. I just don't think this is accurate...I saw the U2 movie where he told Bono and company that he doesn't play chords but I think he really meant he wasn't going to come out and learn U2's chords. I've seen BB King play great rhythm guitar, BB is Great. http://www.youtube.com/notesleb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Flier Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by bvdd: It's a double whammy in a 3 piece band when the guitar guy STILL won't play any rhythm. Sheeessh. Then the bass and drums decide they have to fill up all those EMPTY spaces. LOL!!! No doubt! Talk about a train wreck! --Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip McDonald Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by Lee Flier: Hey, let's have a contest! Everybody record the first two measures of "Little Wing" and we'll post 'em on the net somewhere and compare... LOL... No, but I'm saying Little Wing has a lot of rhythmic detail that's completely missed sometimes, and if a person can't play "loose" it's *really* evident when they play that song. A certain person with the initials KH comes to mind.... I don't get the rhythm vs. lead concept, anyhow - it's both music and there shouldn't be a seperation, but for some reason there is and likewise I think that's why people don't "play" rhythm anymore. There are *a lot* of guitarists that don't realize the concept of improvising with chord fragments/comping, much less improvising in a pure sense anyhow. It shouldn't be "chords and lead playing", it should be "presets vs. improvisation", whether it includes chords, diads, or single notes. If you only knew how many times a new student comes in and asks if their guitar is a "lead" guitar or "rhythm". Even had one kid long ago refuse to learn chords because "this is a lead guitar".... ------------------ New and Improved Music Soon: http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/ / "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrg music Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by Chip McDonald: I don't get the rhythm vs. lead concept, anyhow - it's both music and there shouldn't be a seperation, but for some reason there is and likewise I think that's why people don't "play" rhythm anymore. There are *a lot* of guitarists that don't realize the concept of improvising with chord fragments/comping, much less improvising in a pure sense anyhow. It shouldn't be "chords and lead playing", it should be "presets vs. improvisation", whether it includes chords, diads, or single notes. If you only knew how many times a new student comes in and asks if their guitar is a "lead" guitar or "rhythm". Even had one kid long ago refuse to learn chords because "this is a lead guitar".... Now that's what I call a truly intelligent viewpoint! Well said Chip... I seem to recall a rather well known player telling me once that you cannot be a great lead player without being a great rhythm player in its truest sense, ya hafta learn to play rhythm before you can play great lead, they are completely intertwined. I for one, am very proud to call myself a rhythm player who then went on to play lead and in todays strpped down to the bone band scenarios you couldn't just stand there doing nothing when you weren't playing lead could ya? Simon ------------------ ...remember there is absolutely no point in talking about someone behind their back unless they get to hear about it... ...remember there is absolutely no point in talking about someone behind their back unless they get to hear about it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bvdd Posted July 9, 2001 Author Share Posted July 9, 2001 "I just don't think this is accurate...I saw the U2 movie where he told Bono and company that he doesn't play chords but I think he really meant he wasn't going to come out and learn U2's chords. I've seen BB King play great rhythm guitar, BB is Great. " Steve, That's the show I saw too .. did I hear it wrong? Wasn't there something about BB not knowing where he was in a song as far as chording goes, he only relates to his solo fingering position? I'm be happy to be wrong on this one. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott from MA Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by bvdd: It's a double whammy in a 3 piece band when the guitar guy STILL won't play any rhythm. Sheeessh. Then the bass and drums decide they have to fill up all those EMPTY spaces. Actually, the Minutemen pulled this off amazingly. In a lot of their songs, D. Boone didn't play much (if anything) while he was singing. It would be just Watt and Hurley (bass/drums) during the vocal sections, and then Boone would rip out some guitar between verses. I don't suggest this for MOST bands, but it sure worked great for them! Scott (just another cantankerous bastard) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strat0124 Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by bvdd: Yea, except that .. It's a double whammy in a 3 piece band when the guitar guy STILL won't play any rhythm. Sheeessh. Then the bass and drums decide they have to fill up all those EMPTY spaces. That's a true Kodak moment right there. Just wondering how the guitarist could get away with that. Might as well just have a singer, bass, and drums. How could a three piece EVER play anywhere if the guitar player was just a Lead guitar player? Down like a dollar comin up against a yen, doin pretty good for the shape I'm in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott from MA Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by strat0124: Just wondering how the guitarist could get away with that. Might as well just have a singer, bass, and drums. How could a three piece EVER play anywhere if the guitar player was just a Lead guitar player? (See "Minutemen" post above) It also occurs to me that Primus is a lot the same way. There's really not a lot of "rhythm guitar" parts in their songs. Scott (just another cantankerous bastard) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bvdd Posted July 9, 2001 Author Share Posted July 9, 2001 Well Stratman, time to pull out my trusty New England example again. Believe it or not, around here that's how most guitarists in a 3 piece band play. And as I said before, the bassists and drummers do their part by filling in all the 'missing time'. Oh it's a delightful thing. The only good part occurs when these bands get booked in Legion's and VFW's. They start their Hendrix, Cream, and Grand Funk on steroids show, and these weekend warrior Garth Brooks wannabes have a caniption fit. I agree it can be done, but I think the players would have to know exactly what their formula is .. and stick to it. I started doing something I call 'Reverse Dynamics' back in the early '80's where the idea was .. if I did a guitar solo, I had the bass player and drummer play as thick, straight, and strong as they can - but on HALF volume. No fills or passing tones, drummer stays on the hihat .. period. This allowed me to play a clean, single note solo and the band still sounded full. If it's only the number 4,5, or 6 song of the show, folks are taping their feet and they're hooked for the night. If it's the last song in a set, we bring everything to a climax - together. It's a great psychological trick that works any where, especially in small rooms. Of course it also works well for me because I'm playing strong rhythm most of the night. It's a tremendous contrast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strat0124 Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Well there are good examples and bad for sure. I play in a three piece with a singer. There are some songs that work well with single line solo's, but I try to incorporate some licks sorta a cross between Lonnie Mack and Albert Lee, maybe with a little Johnny Winter thrown in. It's sometimes a bitch to make it all sound full in that setting, but if you nail it, so damn sweet. I play alot of slide, and I try to keep those same mindsets there as well. It ain't impossible, and though it sometimes would be cool to have another guitarist there doing this or that (1) It'd cut my pay (2) I wouldn't have near as much fun. I just like the sound and idea of doing a Rhythm-Lead, without skipping a beat, ripping a passage and returning to the groove seamlessly. I'm not gonna go out on a limb and say it happens everytime.....but moreso than not. And the only reason is, I've had to do it out of necessity for many years, and it's the way I learned. Listen to the North Mississippi Allstars......excellent three piece kicking major ass. Down like a dollar comin up against a yen, doin pretty good for the shape I'm in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 10, 2001 Share Posted July 10, 2001 If you take a look at SRV Live at the El Mocambo he does some great stuff where he does both lead and rhythm. Check out "So Excited". I can't find it on any of his CDs so I suspect it was just kind of a warmup tune, but he mixes it up quite well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.