joegerardi Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Hey, guys: Now that my rig is starting to approach something near what I want it to be like, I'm going to need your help figuring out how I'm going to amplify it. In the past, because of playing out live, I used a BiAmp Mixpak 6+, and ran mono to a Peavey SP112. That is not an issue anymore, because these creaking bones don't play out, so what I'm looking for is home amplification only. I don't need a lot of power, except for headroom, and I'm assuming that I want to run in stereo. Additionally, I don't want to spend a fortune, because this is only hobby stuff anymore. Give me an idea of what I could use, what's out there, and how it works. To help a little more, I usually prefer a mixer/powered mixer configuration with separate speakers over an all-in-one box like the Roland Cubes, for example, but I want to hear what you folks think. Thanks. ..Joe Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 I recommend powered monitors, along with a small non-powered mixer. Definitely stereo. As far as the monitors go, it pretty much comes down to what you want to spend. The more that you spend, the better the speakers get. I spent a bunch on mine, but I'm one of those people who believe that your monitors are one of the most important things in your studio, if not THE most important. If you specify a price range, I'm sure that we can give you some recommendations. It'd also be helpful to know the size and characteristics of your room as well, along with your application - I'm guessing that you want a studio-type listening environment, or a pseudo-live type thing? As far as the mixer, sort of the same deal applies...what do you want to spend? It also helps to know how many inputs you need, and just as importantly, how many do you think that you'll need in the future? Do you just want a monitoring system, or do you see yourself headed down the path to recording? That will be an instrumental question in determining your mixer. If you're prepared to spend at least $1K, you should be more than fine. Less than $500 and you're pushing it in terms of quality unless you buy used, and even then... Hope that helps some, dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 Originally posted by Dave Bryce: I recommend powered monitors, along with a small non-powered mixer. It'd also be helpful to know the size and characteristics of your room as well, along with your application - I'm guessing that you want a studio-type listening environment, or a pseudo-live type thing? No, no studio, this is just for playing in my living room, which is 12x16, and fairly empty, in the single man's vein: i.e. There's a great computer setup, the keyboards, a leather recliner, the entertainment center, and little else! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif . I have no more illusions about recording. Now I just play for my own enjoyment As far as the mixer, sort of the same deal applies...what do you want to spend? It also helps to know how many inputs you need, and just as importantly, how many do you think that you'll need in the future? Do you just want a monitoring system, or do you see yourself headed down the path to recording? That will be an instrumental question in determining your mixer. Probably 12 channels if it's a stereo mixer. 2 each for the QS7, the NanoSynth, 1 for the DPX-1, and room to grow, because I still want a K2kR and a Vintage Keys. If you're prepared to spend at least $1K, you should be more than fine. Less than $500 and you're pushing it in terms of quality unless you buy used, and even then... Hope that helps some, dB I'm looking to go as cheaply as possible, because as I stated, this is just for personal enjoyment anymore, and I've been out of it so long, I just don't know what's out there. Thanks for making me clarify my needs. It does help. ..Joe Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gus Lozada Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 I suggest you to take a look to the following equipment: 1) Mackie 1202 VLZ Pro Mixer @ here 2) Event PS 5 Project Studio Monitors @ www.event1.com , click on "Products" (Top) then on "Monitors) (Left). If they are beyond the prices you're looking for, you will see what's currently available, cheap and smart enough for your requirements. Your living room sounds cool... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif ... single man? ------------------ Gustavo G Lozada Moderador de: MusicPlayer.com/NuestroForo "La voz en Español en Música y Tecnología" GusTraX @yahoo.com This message has been edited by GusTraX on 07-03-2001 at 01:28 PM Músico, Productor, Ingeniero, Tecnólogo Senior Product Manager, América Latina y Caribe - PreSonus at Fender Musical Instruments Company Instagram: guslozada Facebook: Lozada - Música y Tecnología www.guslozada.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod S Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 Joe - if you're on a budget I would recommend the rolls line mixer (can't remember th p/n but they only offer one). 10 stereo line inputs, headphone output, main outs, tape outs, send (mono, unfortunately)/return, volume balance and send level on each channel, 1U rackmout. <$200 new. I think they are fairly quiet. You may be able to get one of the Rane line mixers (similar specs) used in ebay for a similar price. They go fro around 350 new though. The mackie is an excellent mixer but I think it will run you around $700.... You may be able to buy an alesis m1 active and the rolls mixer and still not blow much more than $500. Korg Kronos X73 / ARP Odyssey / Motif ES Rack / Roland D-05 / JP-08 / SE-05 / Jupiter Xm / Novation Mininova / NL2X / Waldorf Pulse II MBP-LOGIC American Deluxe P-Bass, Yamaha RBX760 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 4, 2001 Author Share Posted July 4, 2001 Rod: Do you have a website for that Rolls? I can't seem to find one. That might just be the ticket. It's not so much that I'm on a budget as much as I'm having a hard time justifying the expense for what is a hobby at this point. Additionally, I live in a Condo, and I like the idea of the headphone for late-at-night playing. Nevermind. I found it... I appreciate the help. This message has been edited by joegerardi on 07-03-2001 at 07:44 PM Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_3guy Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 Joe, I agree with the Mixer & powered studio monitors combo. But I want to put this thought before you - Never say never. You never know about the playing live. Old habits die hard. Steve www.seagullphotodesign.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 4, 2001 Author Share Posted July 4, 2001 Originally posted by b_3guy: Joe, I agree with the Mixer & powered studio monitors combo. But I want to put this thought before you - Never say never. You never know about the playing live. Old habits die hard. Well, I would never say never, but I just can't see it anymore for a bunch of reasons. Firstly, my chops have gone to hell and it would take a year of solid practice to get anywhere near my "fightin' weight." Secondly, as I've stated elsewhere, I'm an anachronistic old bastard, and there simply isn't the market out there for the music I would want to do, especially here in Savannah: It has, without a doubt, the WORST live music scene you could ever imagine. Thirdly, with my job and life, there simply isn't TIME to play out. This direclty relates to my first point: If I haven't the time to get my chops up, I certainly don't have the time to get out and play. Lastly, it no longer holds any attraction to me. I did it for 23 years, and there's not much I could get out of it anymore. When I listen to the crap that is considered music in this day and age, I get depressed, and yet that is what the people want to hear. It's not for me. As a codicil to all this, I realize that the answer to a lot of this is to create my own music, and play that. See, here's where there's a problem: I never got much out of composing. I always considered myself a player. I enjoy the interaction with other musicians, trying to pull off the really difficult stuff live, and succeeding (or not!) The immediacy of it all, not doing stuff on sequencers in a sterile studio environment. Now, don't all you studio guys jump all over me: If that's what floats your boat, cool! I'm talking about what I really like about music. Anyway, that's why I have the current mindset I do towards my rig. Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_3guy Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 Originally posted by joegerardi: Firstly, my chops have gone to hell and it would take a year of solid practice to get anywhere near my "fightin' weight." As a keyboard guy, most times to get a gig, all you would have to do is show up & identify the keyboard in the picture. Secondly, as I've stated elsewhere, I'm an anachronistic old bastard, and there simply isn't the market out there for the music I would want to do, especially here in Savannah: It has, without a doubt, the WORST live music scene you could ever imagine. I play a with couple of other anachronistic old bastards a couple of times a month. The guy who runs the band is retired from a dock yard position. He's 52. I can't comment about you're live scene, because I consider ours here in Halifax, a very vibrant one. I have heard stories about some of the best guys in Montreal playing the most awesome fusion jazz getting $50 a nite & the only way to get a paying bar gig in LA is to win a Battle of the Bands competition. Thirdly, with my job and life, there simply isn't TIME to play out. This direclty relates to my first point: If I haven't the time to get my chops up, I certainly don't have the time to get out and play. Lastly, it no longer holds any attraction to me. I did it for 23 years, and there's not much I could get out of it anymore. When I listen to the crap that is considered music in this day and age, I get depressed, and yet that is what the people want to hear. It's not for me. I felt this way & stopped playing out for 11 yrs. Now it is very different for me. I play for the fun. Its very different then before. If I don't like a gig (material or band members) I just become unavailable (quit). Sometimes its the material that interests me or sometimes its the people or bar or location. Besides the money I earn becomes the gear that I own. I have a very enviable rig by comparison to other keyboard guys around here. Live playing funds the tunes I do on my computer, the music that I want to do. This stuff could only be played at one or two places in town. If I did get a gig at one of these places it would be 2 months down the road. But because of doing Jailhouse Rock & Hurts So Good 2 to 4 times a month, I can say I'd like to get a large diaphragm condenser mic for the top horn of my Leslie & go buy one. I read in another thread that dB was looking to play live again. But it is not right for everyone. When the time comes Joe all you need to buy is another powered 2 way like your Peavey or a Samson or JBL. Never say never because I did & I'm now gigging pretty regularly. Steve www.seagullphotodesign.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 9, 2001 Author Share Posted July 9, 2001 Dave & B3_guy: I'm wondering why you both advocate powered monitors? What are their benefits over a stereo power amp (or 2 mono power amps?) Enlighten me. I've fallen too far behind in equipment knowledge and I'm trying to get back up to speed. Thanks. Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 I'm wondering why you both advocate powered monitors? What are their benefits over a stereo power amp (or 2 mono power amps?) Mainly because of the higher fidelity. Combo amps (I assume that's what you mean here) are great for playing out, but powered monitors are hi-fi speakers with amps and other components tweaked and tuned so they sound good enough to mix a record - at least, that's the concept behind them... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif Mine are the best thing I have ever heard my keyboards through, period. It gets me more into the sound. Combo amps are just about being loud and easy to transport. The size of the space and the application are the biggest factors (right behind how much you wanna spend, of course!). If you're gonna be playing in a big space and just wanna rock, perhaps a pair of JBL Eons G2s is more what you seek. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 9, 2001 Author Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by Dave Bryce: Mainly because of the higher fidelity. Combo amps (I assume that's what you mean here) are great for playing out, but powered monitors are hi-fi speakers with amps and other components tweaked and tuned so they sound good enough to mix a record - at least, that's the concept behind them... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif Mine are the best thing I have ever heard my keyboards through, period. It gets me more into the sound. dB No, I'm talking about mixer to racked power amp(s) to speakers. That's the scenario I'm used to, but with all you folk talking about the powered monitor, I am interested in your thoughts on the differences/ pros-cons of these 2 scenaria. This message has been edited by joegerardi on 07-08-2001 at 09:57 PM Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Ahhh. Okay. Sorry for misunderstanding. When you said two mono amps, I assumed...dopey me... Well, the way that I see it, the biggest argument in favor of powered monitors vs. separates is that they are a turnkey solution. As I said above, the components are intended to work with each other, so you know that you're using amps that're supposed to be an excellent match with those particular speakers and enclosures - the very same amps that they used at the factory to tweak the monitors to their optimum performance. I like that...before I had powered monitors, I always worried how much of the sound was colored by the amp I was using. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 9, 2001 Author Share Posted July 9, 2001 Dave: Makes sense. 15 years ago, I used to design PA systems for bands, and it was the same thing. I fell in love with AB systems amps for that very reason. Whilst waiting for your reply, I went over to the JBL site, and was looking at those Eons. I think a pair of 10s would probably do me well, and I'm starting to seriously look at the Mackie SRM450 also. The freq. response is a little greater, and they use RCF speakers, which I'm greatly aquainted with from using EAW stuff, again back in my design days. (My band had a pair of SB528 subs. Incredible cabinets, but the size of a refrigerator turned on its side. I used to love the way the kick drum through them could blow out a cigarette lighter 10 feet away.) Thanks for the explanation. Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_3guy Posted July 9, 2001 Share Posted July 9, 2001 Originally posted by joegerardi: Dave & B3_guy: I'm wondering why you both advocate powered monitors? What are their benefits over a stereo power amp (or 2 mono power amps?) Enlighten me. I've fallen too far behind in equipment knowledge and I'm trying to get back up to speed. Thanks. The powered speakers are usually cheaper & less complicated set up (less room, less wires). Steve www.seagullphotodesign.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucktunes Posted July 10, 2001 Share Posted July 10, 2001 Originally posted by joegerardi: I went over to the JBL site, and was looking at those Eons. I think a pair of 10s would probably do me well, and I'm starting to seriously look at the Mackie SRM450 also. The freq. response is a little greater, Joe, If you already have a power amp, you might want to consider Mackie's C300's. They're the unpowered but otherwise identical versions of the 450's. I've been using a pair of them for a few months now, and I love them. They'll handle 300 watts each, and they sound WAY better than the EON's. Current street price is around $800 for a pair. Peace all, Steve ><> Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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