PLX18O Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 I'd like to get hold of that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x factor music Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 i would avoid the books and tapes route...if you are serious, take a few lessons with a voice teacher in your area. there is no way a CD or book can provide feedback and direction if you are doing the wrong thing. there is probably a good music school or university within a couple hours of just about anywhere... other than that, just practicing on your own every chance you get can help. listen long and hard to michael bolton. do all you can to emulate his rich, warm tone and gifted control. sweet, dear michael bolton. jeremeyhunsicker.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Bolton Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 Say what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistybass Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 Watch it, Bolton, you pansy-assed wimp. Your music reminds me of a toothache because I always hear it in the dentist's office. When are the dentists in the world gonna play some Guns n Roses? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Bolton Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 Axl you lard ball! Kneel before my flowing locks, worship the divine voice of Bolton. Lay off the donuts you has-been, and stop screeching. You need some voice coaching buddy, and I'm the guy to give it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miroslav Posted March 15, 2001 Author Share Posted March 15, 2001 Originally posted by Tedster: ...the days when they used to set (albeit carefully and scientifically place) several mics in a studio, one for vocals...and have some big band leader with Tony Bennett come in and do the tracks? And you had the "capturing" of the performance...(performance being the key word)... Phil Spector - The Wall of Sound - Mono "...be my, be my baby now, oh oh oooh..." - Ronnie Spector Goose bumps,...still! Top THAT!!! miroslav - miroslavmusic.com "Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistybass Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 Coaching? I gotcher coaching right here, strap-on, uh, Bolt-on. As soon as I'm done laying some whoopass on that jerk Vince Neil, I'm comin' after ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 I hear you, Miroslav. Ronnie Spector was a babe in her day, too. What a great song. "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throatsinger Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 Great topic! This is an issue for me, bigtime. Regular bu vocals are easy, but with the throat-singing, I often have to be able to sing extremely low in one style, and extremely high in another, in the same key. While keeping 2-3 notes in tune. In my wife's keys (natch, much higher). Keeps me busy http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif Steve/Big Sky Steve Sklar http://khoomei.com http://www.bigskyrocks.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Bolton Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 You're too fat now to be comin' after anyone Waxl. Face facts man, everyone loves an old crooner, but who cares about a washed out old metal freak? You're past your sell by date, and I'm just getting into my prime baby! Now waddle off and go and snort some coke or somethin'. Can't you see you're ruining Miroslavs beautiful thread? This message has been edited by Michael Bolton on 03-15-2001 at 12:12 PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miroslav Posted March 15, 2001 Author Share Posted March 15, 2001 Ah, you singers are all just a bunch of prima donnas! Hey, ain't this fun. Maybe we should each adopt a celebrity hero and then do posts in that celebs character. Like Axl and Michael, although I think this Michael is "real" and not just an impersonator...yes??? Seriously though, some really good vocals/singer tips here!!! miroslav - miroslavmusic.com "Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistybass Posted March 15, 2001 Share Posted March 15, 2001 Hey, mullethead, did they glue that fake mop on your receding hairline cue ball? Just coming into your prime, yeah, right. Comin' into the prime of fighting off 65 year old groupies. Or maybe you like them that old. "Hey, baby, you probably heard my last release when you were getting your dentures fitted. If you take 'em out, I got something for ya!" HAHAHAHAHA But, I'll concede to Miroslav's thread. Just remember who really can sing: "KNOCK KNOCK KNOCKIN ON HEAVEN'S DOOO-WOOORRRR". I bet you can't put that many syllables in the word "door". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Foster Jenkins Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 Michael, you are my absolute FAVE! Smooches, kisses, a rose thrown with a gasp and a sigh! And as we are speaking of roses- Mr. Rose, remember what Ted Nugent said- "You don't listen to an Axl, you grease it!" You have, I trust, seen the motion-picture-talkie "Deliverance", have you not? One can, however, learn much about proper singing technique from the well-supported and utterly natural- "au natural", as the French say- squeals of pigs, and mud does so keep the "peau" young and freche. (seriously, great thread, you folks are dy-no-mite. To Mr. O'Keefe's suggestion, I would add- acappella and outdoors, at a BBQ for instance, with a keen ear listening and not letting on to what they are up to. No mics, no reflective walls, no self-conciousness. Also, there is in some low male voices a second "mini-passaggio" at about e-f-f# below middle C, although that's probably considered "pre-war theory" as I've never heard mention of it except from very old teachers and books, but once you hear it, it's not theory, is it now. Powerful "head voice" and "falsetto" male singers are often basses and bass-baritons in "full voice", pretty cool, eh? Check out the Don Cossack Choir- the soloist Beresoff, if ailing or ale-ing memory serves. Working on a good solid non-breathy head voice will help the "kernel" of the lower notes- once again pre-war, but still valid as far as my skinny gray-haired ass is concerned. Range is more about "discovery" than "manufacture", and perhaps a lot about accepting more of who you are than what society has dictated. ) love, Florence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Submersible Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 especially with guitar based rock songs. on guitar, nothing sounds like an open G chord. so if the vocals aren't makin it, try retuning versus straight transposition. EXCELLENT POINT! It's a little discussed fact that typical guitar keys are lousy for the optimal range of many singers. Pretty much the whole "screeching, verging on falsetto" rock vocals we've grown so accustomed to can probably be traced to two things: constraints of the guitar tuned to concert pitch, and poor vocal monitors in the typical live situation! Alternate tunings and capos can go a long way. I think of Pavement as a good example--Stephen Malkmus gets to sing in a comfortable low tenor/high baritone range without sacrificing all those cool open string guitar riffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ang1970 Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 So they just let this kind of crap go on here? How disappointing. Miro, come get some tips on RO. We'll hook ya up, and treat your thread with some respect. We have a sandbox for the little kids to play in too, so they don't feel left out. ------------------ Ang1970 is: Angelo Quaglia AQ Productions http://www.recording.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 Originally posted by Ang1970: So they just let this kind of crap go on here? How disappointing. Miro, come get some tips on RO. We'll hook ya up, and treat your thread with some respect. We have a sandbox for the little kids to play in too, so they don't feel left out. Been too busy to post for a while, catching up on the last couple of weeks' threads now, which are always entertaining, often encouraging, and at times enlightning. Reading this thread, I cannot find one instance of either Miroslav or his topic being treated with disrespect. I see rather enthusiasm, the desire to answer the question in "real life", even if that means resorting to home-spun terminology, and statements made with thoughtful qualifications, as well as some good-natured joking. Thank you Craig Anderton forum people for loving what you do and not boring the living fuck out of me with petty assumptions of hierarchy. - Cameron Bobro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Bolton Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 Cameron? Yeah! Angelo? Boooo! Axl? Oh forget him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 Thanks to EVERYONE for their thoughtful and entertaining comments. For those of us who may be new to the biz or just less experienced(like me), these topics can be quite helpful. I just recently began working with a fantastic female vocalist; we've been making minor key adjustments so that we can alternate lead on verses, and even alternate harmonies on refrains/choruses. This topic certainly has helped me understand what's going on. We DO use alternate tunings AND capos to make the guitar fit our vocal "comfort zones". Thanks again, Bob Wood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x factor music Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 tuning down a half step, drop d and open tuning used to be primarily done for 2 reasons, methinks....first and foremost was to preserve a singer's voice in a live/tour situation. second was it sounded real cool in metal and progressive music. now i think it's more and more common in popular music thanks to the eddie vedder syndrome - where the typical male vocalist has gone from a clean tenor to a bellowing baritone, and the lower tuning is to accomodate this more popular style of singing. aside from elvis and bill medley, the tenor has pretty much always been the standard in male popular vocals (ie "pop" music). since grunge, this trend of lower baritone vocals has made things interesting, but it's lowered our expectations for what sounds "right" as well...we accept someone like scott stapp as a megastar singer, who sounds like he is clenching his teeth while digesting a baby walrus. 11 years ago, this guy would have been working at dairy queen, as the thought of being a big time rock and roll singer would have been unthinkable. i'm not putting down this style of singing, as the lower register and baritone voices sound great - no better or worse than a tenor, alto, or soprano (take aretha franklin or toni braxton as an example on the female side). i just think that the lower tunings and open tunings etc that you hear in popular "guitar" music these days is to accomodate the less trained singers out there. let's face it, i don't think the great michael bolton needs diane warren to write a song in drop d for HIM... jeremeyhunsicker.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x factor music Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 angelo, i went to your site, and it looks pretty cool. i couldn't find the sandbox, however. please post a link. thanks! jeremeyhunsicker.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistybass Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 >>So they just let this kind of crap go on here? How disappointing. Miro, come get some tips on RO. We'll hook ya up, and treat your thread with some respect. We have a sandbox for the little kids to play in too, so they don't feel left out. So, Florence, you think I'M the one with the peg up my ass? Hey, Angelo, what's your favorite mic? Why don't you pull it out of your rear end and lighten up a bit, it's making you walk funny. I suppose you only believe in haughty discussion about spectral dissonance phase reversal or some high and mighty sounding shit like that. I work with people like you. Wear ties on midnight shifts. Walk around with tent pegs shoved up their asses. No humor allowed. Why don't you go back and write a paper on post preamp gain stage filter calibration or something that sounds like that. Your wittle grad school fwiends miss you since you-ums got your PhD in snobbery. I'd bet you're a fun guy to be in the studio with: BAND: "Hey Angelo, how was that take?" Angelo: "The output stage on the bias calibration was a bit sibilant. If I cut three dB from the optimal bandpass oscillator I can cut harmonic frequencies above 15000 Hz by several dB and hence improve the overall dynamic fluctuations thereof." BAND: "Huh?" Smooches, Michael. I've got to go visit grandma in the retirement village in St. Pete. I'm sure I'll hear a couple (hundred) of your songs while I'm there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ang1970 Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 For when you want to let your hair down and act like an idjit: RO "Virtual Bar & Grille" - http://www.recording.org/cgi-local/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=101 Sorry guys, guess my anal retentiveness got away with me. I had this silly idea that posting joke messages using somebody else's name was rude and bordering on illegal. Guess I was wrong. Nobody here seems to mind, so I'll let you all live the way you like. Thanks for the abuse guys. It really helped me learn more about vocal techniques, and it was a lot of fun too. (Not) Sorry I can't stay and write more, I don't have the luxury of taking 7 years to complete an album. Later. ------------------ Ang1970 is: Angelo Quaglia AQ Productions http://www.recording.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistybass Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 >>I had this silly idea that posting joke messages using somebody else's name was rude and bordering on illegal. Probably would be, if anyone really thought Axl and Michael were the people posting here. It would be another matter entirely to pose as someone who regularly frequents this board. That would definitely be most uncool. But posting as Axl or Michael carries about the same weight as posting as Bill Clinton or Dubya. No harm done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inforecording.org Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 Axl Rose, hmm Bolton and Rose getting chummy. rotflmfo No harm done, more like nothing gained lol! What a waste of html ------------------ regards, bigtree recording.org regards, bigtree recording.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Bolton Posted March 16, 2001 Share Posted March 16, 2001 uh-huh 8 posts in total info@recording? From recording.org like Angelo? Man, I'm glad I can spot these assholes from a mile. How do i do it? cause I AM ONE TOO. Good thread though, till Angelo went red in the face stamped his foot. Dude, people like you scare me http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 17, 2001 Share Posted March 17, 2001 Originally posted by Ang1970: So they just let this kind of crap go on here? How disappointing. Miro, come get some tips on RO. We'll hook ya up, and treat your thread with some respect. We have a sandbox for the little kids to play in too, so they don't feel left out.... Sorry guys, guess my anal retentiveness got away with me. I had this silly idea that posting joke messages using somebody else's name was rude and bordering on illegal. Guess I was wrong. Nobody here seems to mind, so I'll let you all live the way you like. Thanks for the abuse guys. It really helped me learn more about vocal techniques, and it was a lot of fun too. (Not) Sorry I can't stay and write more, I don't have the luxury of taking 7 years to complete an album. Later. As you can see from my relatively low number of posts, I'm not exactly a fixture on this forum, nor do I know anyone here, so why am I bothering... First of all, whatever your intentions were, your original post comes off as "rude and insulting" to the "they" who moderate and oversee this forum. Perhaps others do not see it this way. I do not speak for them, but for what I feel is right, signed with my full real name. In the case of legally problematic posts and threads, it can take some time for "them"- being Mr. Anderton and his editors- to cover all the ground. The number of posts is huge on these forums. This kind of thing happened recently with a potentially troublesome thread title. The title was changed, an explanation was given- no sweat, no flaming. It took a couple of days. The main thing is, however, the implied dismissal of the serious responses to the original question, throwing out the baby with the bathwater as it were. If that was not your intention, please make that clear. If you had said something along the lines of "Miroslav, if you would like more feedback on this, come to our fine forum. To those posting joke messages using somebody else's name, I find this rude and bordering on illegal.", I believe it would have been more effective in every positive way. I don't know if you meant to imply anything by "I don't have the luxury of taking 7 years to complete an album" -first thing that came to my mind when reading that is Stanislaw Lem's commentary on how Thomas Mann was given 14 years by his publishers to write a book and authors of throwaway junk are required to churn it out once every couple of months. But if you're just saying you don't have the time to respond fully, well ain't that the truth, so I'd better wind things up here, with an on-topic comment at that. One way of discovering a great deal about a voice is to sing lullabies to infants, provided the singer hasn't learned to be cutesy with babies. With an imaginative singer, you may be able to trick them simply by saying "okay, now sing it as a lullaby to a little baby." For those who haven't figured out that knowledge is knowledge whether it flows in iambic pentameters from the prophet's silver tongue or is scrawled with a felt-tip pen on the wall of the public bathroom, maybe I should mention that I learned that from a Wagner singer. But the argument from authority is in the end effect bunk- if it works for you, it works, if it doesn't, it doesn't. -Cameron Bobro, cambobro@hotmail.com, come by for a beer when you're in town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Sayers Posted March 17, 2001 Share Posted March 17, 2001 I was listening to a Beatles freek the other day who said that Please Please Me was recorded in 10 hours. (says something about working bands and studios as the Beatles had just come off 7 nights/week in Hamburg.) The song Twist and Shout was the last song recorded cos they knew that when John had sung it he couldn't sing anything else! The take on the album is the first take cos he couldn't sing it again. He probably broke every singing teacher's rulebook when he did it but YO what a vocal!! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif cheers john Studio Design Forum Studios Under Construction Home Page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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