drum mic opinions, anyone?

[offramp]

I've got my eye on one of the drum mic "kits"; I won't say which brand, but I would like to hear from any of you who have used them... manufacturer, performance, quality, price, etc.

yesyesyes, I know..."get a 57" Can't afford it, right now, for as many as I need (unless you know someone who's unloading three good, used 57's at an unbeatable price). Currently, I'm using a 421 on the kick, and a 57 on the snare. Whatever I have left is what I use on the toms; this rotates form time to time, but I would like all three toms to have the same mic, and that isn't doable at the moment. So, I'm kinda thinking--on one hand--all I need is three, and on the other hand, "well, if the price is right, I could get a whole package (5 mics), have consistency through the kit, and be good with it". Some kits come with clips, I notice, which would be cool. Overheads are not a necessity, here, as I'm using a pair of 414's, and I have other options should I tire of that sound. And, I usually can get a good, full sound out of the kick, snare, and two OH's; the tom mics are good, then, for capturing discretes for anyone who desires them. Either way... I like to be flexible.

 

So...let 'er rip.

[Eric Beam]

my setup seems to be working very well.. i use a audix D6 and a beta 52 on my 22" kick, a sen e602 on my 16" kick., e604's on the toms, 57 on snare batter, d1 on snare side, 414's overheads, 4041's on hat&ride. i have the audix package and the e6XX's as you can see. both are really good. i highly recomend the sen stuff. really nice.. i'm going to be getting e906's for some other tom mic options soon..

[Lee Flier]

The little Audix tom mics are actually pretty decent, and the Senn e604's aren't bad either. I would not use the mic clips for recording... too much resonance is transmitted from the drum shell to the mic.

 

I use Beyer M88's on rack toms myself, 421 on floor.

[Sp3nc3r]

I've been using an e602 on the kick, an e609 on the snare (and on rare occasions, a 57) Beta 57a's for the toms, either 414's or SM81's for overheads, Oktava for hihats, and most recently, a VP-88 for far room mics (more like reverb...).

 

Seems to be working, I haven't had any complaints

 

Cheers!

Spencer

[offramp]

This is all very nice--and thanks for the responses--but I'm not seeing much info in the way of "kits", which is what I'm asking about. I'm wanting to know if anyone has purchased a kit--3, 5, 7, 8, 9, whatever mics from ONE manufacturer--and what their reactions are.

[Lee Flier]

Offramp, those kits are really made for stage work, not recording, although some people use them for recording anyway. I've heard the Audix and the Sennheiser kits live, and I prefer the Sennheiser although the Audix was OK too. I think the tom mics for the Senn package would probably translate to the studio OK (if you don't use the mic clips), but I haven't tried it.

[sidereal]

I've used those e604 Sennheisers in the studio and they record suprisingly well on toms. Birch wood, G2 clear heads, and those Sennheisers make a pretty sweet tom sound.

[Guitr777]

Our drummer bought a set of VERY inexpensive Nady mics (Nady DMK 7) from Musician's Friend. I was skeptical at first, but to my surprise they actually sound pretty good!

 

7-piece drum mic package (with case) for $169.00. Not too shabby for those of us on a tight budget.

[Knott]

Hello, i'm new here

 

you can go too for CAD mics, they had a Drum kit packaged I don't remember the price but they are cheap and sound very well for their price I test them on a demo recording.

 

But the bass drum mic sounds too flat, no punchy at all, so here i always choose beta52 or D112 they are great to get the punch out of the drum and into the PA or recordings as well.

[alcohol_]

I'm using the Josephson C24 for overheads. Actually, I found that they sound better set up about 2 feet from the closest cymbal and spread apart by about 2.5 feet; set at the front of the drums just above the outer edge of the tom toms (about 2.5 ft above the tom. (need a picture).

 

I got the Earthworks Drum Kit CD and I think the Josephson's compare well to the Earthworks. They are $1000 for a matched pair.

 

So I'm using a 5 mic setup. The Josephson's for the overheads, A 57 above and below the snare and Beta 52 on the Bass Drum.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Less is more. For recording, I use fewer mics (typically, two or three), though live I use many mics.

 

In my opinion, most "drum mic kits" are made up of mics that couldn't pass muster as real mics, so they package them as a cheap kit of 'specific purpose' mics to sell the mediocre design.

 

Buy a real mic. It will be useful everywhere, all the time, and is in the long run a better value for any studio than a $200 kit of dedicated mics. Examples include the aforementioned Beyer M-88, Senn 421, EV RE-20... even the stalwart Shure SM-57 sees a lot of use everywhere when recording.

 

At the Benedum Center, the Senn drum mic kit is used. They don't sound any better than any other choice, but the convenience (no mic stands) seems to be the big selling point. I had the chance to check out the Audix kit on a recent Sam Moore gig (Sam and Dave). shrug. Didn't impress me much. Your milage may vary.

 

In the long run, there is no free lunch.

 

 

Bill

[Knott]

I had to agree with "bpark@"

 

If your wallet can handle such an inversion, you should go for something better, tha can work as well in live as in studio situations.

 

From the range of the PRO mics, the less expensive are AKG D112 (Cardioid - Dynamic) and C418 (Hyper - Condenser) they sound very well in lieve and studio and thera are meny studios that use them as well as the standard drum mics And they hava a very low profile, so in live the are very discrete.

 

But in the end the budget decides, and you better go for the one that doesn't dry your bank account hahaha

[Knott]

oooppppssss

 

whataa grammarrr

[Bandit]

If you are close miking, you want to isolate rour toms with a mic on each. I bought three Beyer Dynamic 201s that make my toms sound like cannons. There are cheap mikes, especially if purchased used. You can also get a very good sound with using just two or three mics, strategically placed. One on the bass, usually a low frequency resonse condenser. One mic in front of the kit, a condenser, about the heigth of the drummers head. Make sure the mic picks up the toms and snare, not the bass drum.

If a third mic is needed, (And you may find it is not), place a 57, or again, try the 201, right over the head of the drum. You are on a tight budget, but, understand this. The most important weapon in your studio arsenal is your microphone. All sound eminates from this. I would suggest the Audio Tecnica 4033, high quality condenser, as the room mic. This mic is relatively inexpeznsive, and extremely versatile.

Often when using many mics at once, phase cancellation will rear it's ugly head and actually make the kit sound smaller. I don't think you want to go out and buy a mic kit, but experiment on your own until you find what works for you.

Hope this helps,

Mike

[offramp]

Bandit, I don't think you and I are on the same page.

[adam b_dup1]

what i just got is the Samson drum mic package. It has 3 tom mics, 1 snare, and a bass drum. Comes with clips and a case. All for 150$ from Samash.com. They are very nice sounding mics for the price and hold up good.

[gmd]

Actually, I have stopped using individual mics on the toms altogether. I've found that if you use your overheads correctly you just don't need them. In fact, I have a friend in LA who gets a great drum sound everytime using only ONE mic on the entire kit! (Yeah, I know you don't believe it, and neither did I until he came over and got a great drum sound on my kit with just one mic. He used a Neumann 103, about three feet in front of the kit, and played with height and angle placement a bit before we started recording. Sounded great...)

[offramp]

gmd, I've been doing that for years, but sometimes you need discrete mic'ing. Especially if it's requested of you.

 

Here's my first single mic setup, circa 1990

http://homepage.mac.com/echohaus/.Pictures/Onemic.jpg

 

The results were fantastic; unfortunately, they're also locked up on a 2" reel of 456 that I have no way of playing.

 

 

I'm kind of disappointed in some of the responses, here; I ask a question about a very specific thing, and I'm getting answers all over the place including one suggesting I not mic the toms.

This isn't what I asked.

 

Please, re-read the original post.

 

If you have had experience--or know someone who has--about these mic kits, please share, the good/bad/ugly/whatever.

 

I'm finding positive reviews on the Nady stuff, as well as Audix; haven't heard much about the Samsons, aside from an earlier post, here. In fact, now that I think about it, I haven't heard much about Samson mics, in general. Sometimes, that's a good thing; is that the case here?

[Den]

Hi there everyone...brand newbie here!

 

My 2 cents...for what it's worth.

 

Mic packs will range in quality of sound depending on the value you are looking for. Simple. I stray from using them for recording, because they just don't meet recording requirments. They are not bad for the money, but just do not cut the mustard.

 

I have found that they will either leave your drum sound dull, or too tinny sounding. Nady will always be my last choice for any type of micing, that's just from my experience with their products in general. I can't comment on any other brands, because of my lack of use.

 

I too have used seperate mics on toms, live and studio, and found I get the best results this way.

 

Sorry I couldn't offer up any more info.

[Basshappi]

My drummer just bought one of the Shure drum mic kits, the 5pc I think.He got them on sale at GC think he said he paid $200. I can't wait to set them up and try them out. I'll post my impressions of them as soon as I get the chance.

 

I have heard good things about the Audix and the CAD sets from people who have used them.

[Dave Scoven]

Hi Offramp!

 

I understand being on a budget. I don't know if I can help, but I'll give it a try.

 

Don't worry about consistancy. Different drums sound better with different mics. You have a 421 and a 57. You're off to a great start. If you need a setup to do live work, I'd recommend moving your 421 to the floor tom. A 421 is a MUCH better floor tom mic than a kick mic. Use the 57 on snare top. Now you need a new kick mic and two rack tom mics. Invest in an AKG kick drum mic. The Sennheiser e604 mics on your rack toms will sound great.

 

If you want a setup for studio only, you might consider a different route. You don't need to buy anything. Leave the 57 on snare and the 421 in your kick. Set up your 414s using the modified Glyn Johns technique that I explain in another thread on this drum forum. Don't worry about the spot mics on the toms -- you'll great a great tom sound and beautiful imaging from your 414s using that technique. You'll be really pleased with the results. If you must have spot mics for the toms (you mention that it's requested), the Sennheiser e604 pac (three mics, $330 from Musician's Friend) is the way to go, I think. Just be sure to use them as spots and not as the main mics -- leave that job to your 414s!

 

Dave Scoven

dscoven@verizon.net

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Originally posted by offramp:

I've got my eye on one of the drum mic "kits"; ...

 

...get a 57" Can't afford it, ...

 

...I'm using a 421 on the kick, and a 57 on the snare. Whatever I have left is what I use on the toms;

 

Overheads are not a necessity, here, as I'm using a pair of 414's, and I have other options should I tire of that sound. And, I usually can get a good, full sound out of the kick, snare, and two OH's;

 

the tom mics are good, then, for capturing discretes for anyone who desires them. ...

 

So...let 'er rip.

Okay, you haven't liked the replies, and you have already got the best answer for your situation sitting there, but you aren't content with it. Let's see what we can discuss.

 

As Lee says, those mic kits are for stage work. They suck for recording. In my opinion, they suck, anyway. Awful mics. yuck. (I've had the chance to check out a couple of different offerings, more than once, on more than one drummer, in multiple venues live. I definitely would never record with that junk. Your milage may vary.)

 

But you have nice mics that you are using now, and you know how to use them. You just 'want to remain flexible'. In that interest, let me suggest that you continue doing what you are doing... use the 421, 57, and 414s, and when someone wants spot mics on their toms, put up whatever you have around. Doesn't cost you a penny.

 

As to you not being able to afford three 57s (at about $75 each) yet being able to afford a five mic array (usually including a nifty carrying case, which sells as many kits as the mics themselves...)...well, that sort of narrows the quality of the mic kit you are considering.

 

But if the soul still craves more drum mics, consider the oft-cast-off Shure 545, 565, etc. These can be found used all over the place for between $25 and $50. They look about like a 57 or 56 (the same mic only in a permanent stand mount instead of handheld/clip version) and have about the same components, but are brushed silver with about a three inch black band up by the capsule. This is an inexpensive answer that leaves you with a handful of multipurpose full range mics, rather than a kit of mediocre mics that weren't good enough to be 'real' mics and had to be limited to drums. (If you look at some of Eddie Kramers photos of Hendrix in the studio, there are 545s all over the place, including on his vocal and guitar.)

 

I won't go into recording basics with you here.. it would be lengthly and perhaps a waste of time. But your four mic system is one more mic than I usually use, and your existant mics are nice choices. At some point, allowing the client to tell you how to record is similar to allowing the inmates to run the asylum. I agree that it pays to be flexible, but you also are the guy with the studio... hopefully they are paying you for your knowlege and expertise, not just for the pile of gear.

 

Bill

[offramp]

Well, I've kind of given up on the idea, anyway.

(And thank you for not going into the basics; I've been at it more on than off, for over 20 years, now.)

 

I've gotten responses in other areas that would indicate they're great, and around here, they suck. So, the jury's really split on this one.

As it stands now, is how I think I'll leave it. 421 on kick, 57 on snare, 414's on OH (and soon I'll be trying out my BK-5B's on OH, just for the ribbon hell of it), a 58 on my floor tom, and an AKG D160E on each of the rack toms.

To make matters worse, I rediscovered some old drum tracks I recorded about a year ago, when I had just the four mic setup going, and after stepping back from it for a bit, have really realized how good they were. So I'll probably not fuck with it too much more.

[Dave Scoven]

I like the Sennheiser e604s. The frequency response is 40 - 18k, with a 5 db bump at 5k or so. High SPL. They are small and therefore easier to get optimal placement.

 

The SM 57 frequency response is comparable -- 40 - 15k, with the same bump. The e604s are a little more money -- about $110 each compared to $75 each. I wouldn't use an e604 on snare, but on rack toms (as spot mics), they work well live and in the studio (mount them on stands in the studio, as Lee suggests). On a 16 or 18" floor tom, I'd go with a 421. Obviously, if you can afford it, it would be optimal to use 421s on all toms. But I really like the little e604s. They are real mics ;-)

[HiRoller]

Oktava MC012's are nice on toms and can be used on lots of other things when not tracking drums.

[Dave Scoven]

I agree with HiRoller. I am using the MXL 603S as spot mics on toms and love them. I get 90% of my drum sound from the overheads, but the spot mics are still important to me.