Cheap, but good advice

[DrummerCafe]

Chick Corea is one of the world's leading piano/keyboardists and

composers of our day; he is also a great drummer. Read the advice

that he gives to musicians (drummers/percussionists) for playing in a

music group or band. Although this "advice" is directed towards

improvisational music, such as jazz, it still applies to every genre

of music . . . regardless of style. Enjoy!

 

 

CHEAP BUT GOOD ADVICE FOR PLAYING MUSIC IN A GROUP

 

1. Play only what you hear.

 

2. If you don't hear anything, don't play anything.

 

3. Don't let your fingers and limbs just wander--place them intentionally.

 

4. Don't improvise on endlessly--play something with intention, develop it or not, but then end off, take a break.

 

5. Leave space--create space--intentionally create places where you don't play.

 

6. Make your sound blend. Listen to your sound and adjust it to the rest of the band and the room.

 

7. If you play more than one instrument at a time--like a drum kit or

multiple keyboard5-make sure that they are balanced with one another.

 

8. Don't make any of your music mechanically or just through patterns

of habit. Create each sound, phrase, and piece with choice--deliberately.

 

9. Guide your choice of what to play by what you like -not by what someone else will think.

 

10. Use contrast and balance the elements: high/low, fast/slow, loud/soft, tense/relaxed, dense/sparse.

 

11. Play to make the other musicians sound good. Play things that will make the overall music sound good.

 

12. Play with a relaxed body. Always release whatever tension you create.

 

13. Create space--begin, develop, and end phrases with intention.

 

14. Never beat or pound your instrument--play it easily and gracefully.

 

15. Create space-- then place something in it.

 

16. Use mimicry sparsely--mostly create phrases that contrast with and develop the phrases of the other players.

 

 

 

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Bart Elliott

http://bartelliott.com

[felix stein]

Like Chick never beat or pounded his piano...bologna!

Always release the tension? Not always.

 

The rest is great advice from a true visionary. I have about 5 or 6 of his cd's.

[DrummerCafe]

Well ... I've NEVER seen Chick "beat" the piano. The point that he is trying to get across is to finesse the instrument; don't beat it into submission. Drummers that I have seen "beat" the drums ... sound like crap! I can play just as loud (if not louder) without putting a bunch of dents in the drumheads. If someyou puts new drumheads on their kit and have dents within minutes ... I would venture to say their techinque is very bad and they are "beating" the instrument. Relaxed limbs, fluid strokes, gravity, the motion of my body and some kinetic energy will allow me to have more endurance, plus play faster and longer than the one who "beats" the drum.

 

Why on earth do you think you should not release tension Felix? Are you talking musically, physically or both? Music is made up of tension and release; consonance and dissonance (Ying & Yang) ... nothing more. Just like breathing; breathing in = tension; breathing out = release. How long can you hold your breath?

 

--Bart

[felix stein]

Hey, how are the fantails doing?

 

I don't agree that beating heads till they dent is musical but I won't say it isn't musical either. You should know me better than that??!! But I have known several GREAT drummers that dented them quite easily and on any occassion where deemed necessary and one of them even taught at MI. That was Ray Lusier, he was a very very hard hitter. I have also learned that one might even use the 3rd fulcrum (fist grip) as opposed to 1st or 2nd for maximum volume, etc. When was the last time you played in your third joint? It's fun as heck, try it again some time. You mean you never pounded playing avantgaurde styles? I don't believe you BART...I am very disappointed LOL. Drummers find it hard to believe I have never broken a cymbal so I guess it's possible that you never dented a head. LOL

 

You need to get into your speed metal to hear music that never releases. It's out there. Why on earth do some people like it? I couldn't tell you. But I find it interesting sometimes. Check out that drummer from "Death" if you havn't already...he's a bad bad boy.

 

L8R

[djarrett]

Hey, Guys:

 

While at Mapex, I escorted Matt Sorum on a clinic tour of the Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico area. Talk about a hard hitter! We were changing coated powerstrokes like most folks go through, ... well I cannot think of anything folks go through that quick!

 

It did not help that, at the time, he was using 2B sticks!

 

However, I must say that he was not just BANGING. He was playing great stuff and the folks really loved him.

 

Goes to show that it really depends on what your application is.

 

Then, there is the argument for being diversified. Gregg Bissonette (one of my favorite buds) can swing like Krupa and finesse like Roach, but I saw him at the last NAMM pound behind Spinal Tap, and just saw him on VH1 Story Tellers behind Electric Light Orchestra (ELO). He by no means is a "pounder", but the day after Spinal Tap, his hands were just chewed up! He had calluses and blisters galore!

 

I think that this approach (diversity) is the key. Be able to work in any environment ... but, there will be folks that will make a living in just one genre of playing.

 

I suppose the argument can go both ways.

 

DJ

[DrummerCafe]

Bash, bang, pound, etc. can all have broad definitions.

 

I do not question the talent, musicianship, etc., of someone who beats drumheads until they are a concave disc. I too have seen and heard great players who "pound" and leave their marks on the drumheads. All I'm saying is that this does not HAVE to happen in order to produce what they do. Sometimes it's poor technique, sometimes it's just the way they've always played. I don't believe for a minute that you have to play like that in order to achieve the end result that these players get musically. I think that they could get just as much energy and sound by allowing the stick to rebound, as opposed to playing THROUGH the drum ... like a martial arts punch.

 

I was subbing for a local rock band a few years ago, and one of their "buddies" who happened to be a local drummer came up to sit in. I was familar with this guy's name so thought it would be okay for him to play my kit. After he finished playing (only 4 or 5 tunes), I got back up on stage to find my snare drum batter head beat down so far I could have poured myself a cup of coffee in the cavern and saved it for my next break! This is TOTALLY absurd! This guy had no more snap or energy to his sound than I had ... so why in God's name did he play this way? As a ran my hands over my new Bart Cave he said "just tighten the head back up and it will be fine." What a idiot! I would have liked to tighten HIS head with my fist! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif Needless to say that is the last time he will every play on my drums.

 

For me, if your drums look like they've just come through a Texas hail storm, after you play on new drumheads, there's something wrong. In my book that's bad technique. I don't care how good or famous someone might be, there's a better way to play and still achieve the energy / sound.

 

 

 

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Bart Elliott

http://bartelliott.com

[djarrett]

Hey, Bart:

Now I *am* in agreement with you on this one. Although I do know folks that have played like you suggest, most folks that play with power verses poor technique will break a head way before concaving the head.

This type of head abuse comes from a technique liken to leaving your bass drum beater on the head verses pulling the beater off the head.

 

I have also noticed that it can also depend on what type of tip you have on your sticks. I use a round tip on my stick and it does "ping" the head worse than an olive shaped tip.

 

Thoughts?

DJ

[felix stein]

Now you guys got me on this playing hard kick!

 

What I hate is when cymbals are pounded. Horrible sounding things most of the time if one were to ask me today.

 

Denting poor technique and poor stick choice? I have to agree on this one. But I know a few dickhead drummers where if they ever asked me to sit in (although they wouldn't) I would bash away quite contentedly till I was asked to leave. For being in the music biz gentlemen, that is a very politically incorrect thing to say-good for you guys!

 

I have been known to dent heads in frantic tyrades of ecstacy before. I'm sure my technique was far from pretty but it is an effect to behold when appropriate IMHO.

 

Concave snarehead-I was cracking up.

[Steve LeBlanc]

I agree with Chick in a lot of situations but his words are no Bible...I mean there is a time and place for everything and if you don't break established rules in your musical experimentation how do you continue to grow?

 

I've been playing music outside the mainstream for over 20 years now...if I always used Chick's gameplan I wouldn't have nearly as many CDs full of outrageous music in my closet. I also don't think we'd have "Miles Davis' - Bitches Brew" if Chick always followed that gameplan.

 

As far as breaking/denting heads goes...I know drummers can be plenty powerful without damaging heads.

 

My brother used to dent heads and break cymbals when he played with a Speed Metal band in the early 90s...he was competing with 4 Marshall Stacks and WAY LOUD Bass guitar.

 

He NEVER breaks cymbals or dents heads anymore...I consider him a hard hitter and he's plenty loud when he wants to be. He's used the same drum heads and cymbals for the past 3 years.

 

P.S.

Chick is a great drummer.

 

 

 

 

This message has been edited by Steve LeBlanc on 06-26-2001 at 04:51 PM

[felix stein]

Same drumheads for the past 3 years? YUK! I don't think I believe that either. I change mine every 3 months and the bottom heads every six. If I was rich/endorsed I would change them ...shit, every month or sooner depending on how much I was playing.

[Dwarf]

Denting drumheads? I've been there. I play moderately loud but I rarely dent a head - except for the Evans HD Dry head which dented after one rehearsal. The Pinstripe I had been using (undented after 6 weeks of gigs and rehearsals) went back on my snare. I like the sound of Evans' dry heads but they really have to work on the durability - I can't afford to change the head on my snare every couple of days.

 

As for playing hard in general, I find that for me it's a function of the band I'm playing with. I used to play with a country rock band that really wanted to emphasize the rock factor. When I started rehearsing with them they kept telling me to play louder. One day I felt like I had "broken though" some kind of barrier in my playing and I was able to play very loud - which they loved. The downside being that I changed the Pinstripe on my snare after every second gig. Nowadays I play in three different bands - a 70's/80's/90's rock cover band which requires me to play kinda hard, an original country band which is more moderate and a 50's/60's cover band which is a little quieter. What I really need to do is start playing with a wedding band so I can work on my pianissimo chops.

 

--

Rob

[DrummerCafe]

I personally change out drumheads before every session or, for live playing, when the sound the drums are producing deem it necessary. Having a drumhead endorsement helps because it can get rather expensive changing out heads on a regular basis.

 

I can hear huge changes in my overall drum sound just after a few hours of playing. It's amazing how quickly the mylar changes in a relatively short amount of time. Whether you get dents or not, the drumheads need to be changed out on a regular basis ... if you want your drumkit to sound it's best. Even if your drums sit in your closet for 3 months, the mylar is stretching just from being on the drum (unless you loosen them before storage). Two ply heads do seem to hold out longer, but they stretch just like single ply heads.

 

Three years is an awful long time to keep a set of drumheads. I guess if you like that sound ... go for it. You'll be surprised how big a difference and new set of heads (top AND bottom) will make on your kit.

 

 

 

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Bart Elliott

http://bartelliott.com

[ian1642605905]

Don't you think that a big part of the heavy hitter syndrome is for stage presence?Heavy hitters are fun to watch!Cymbals rocking,arms flailing,just for show!Alot of the time the rest of the band is so lifeless on stage that the drummer "is" the stage presence.

Energy on stage makes for a show people go home and talk about for the next week.

From my experience (not that I'm a super heavy hitter)I can motivate the rest of the band by unleashing my fury.They have to motivate themselves or look like a log.

Performing is different that studio drumming.I think we're obligated to put on a show!!

ian*

[DrummerCafe]

I can play the part too ... the difference is that I don't follow through by forcing the stick into the head like I'm trying to strike something two inches below the surface. When I need to play loud I use stick height and velocity to get the volume I need. I pick the stick up over my head and throw it hard. The difference is that I IMMEDIATELY relax my body so that the stick can freely rebound after it strikes the drum. I don't get dents and yet I look (and sound) like I'm beating the hell out of my drums.

 

Try it sometime! It's just like throwing a baseball except you don't let go of the stick. Tension ... then release!

 

Believe me, I know what it's like to pound the drums and destroy my drumheads; I used to play that way when I was first learning to play. Then I discovered that I could play just as loud and still be relaxed. I use tension in my body just long enough to throw the stick and then I relax. Not only can I play faster with this technique, but I burn fewer calories ... thus being able to play loud for long periods of time.

 

 

 

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Bart Elliott

http://bartelliott.com

[rlhubley]

I play with very studied technique, and i have dented a head recently. This was the first time in years! We were recording and i had put a brand new G2 on my 16"floor tom. I had that sucker tuned pretty low(it sounds incredible!), and due to the low tension and the ball tips of my Vaters, i have put a couple of dents into the head.