Matched Grip vs. Traditional Grip

[djarrett]

Which do you use and why?

[Brenton Trott]

Well I learnt traditional grip for the first two and a half years of playing and then changed to matched. It just never felt right to me when I hit cymbals with that hand (and I do quite a bit of that). The majority of my favorites play traditional so go figure.

 

Brenton

[felix stein]

Matched with the Moeller = Bam, Bam-Bam

[Lee Flier]

To what little extent I can play drums, I use traditional grip. It just feels natural to me for some reason. I think I might have been an old jazz drummer in New Orleans in a previous life. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Plus I grew up seeing Charlie Watts and Stan Lynch and Stewart Copeland playing traditional, and the first drummer I played in a band with played traditional, so I guess I just thought that was what you did. I think subconsciously I started to associate traditional grip with the "craftsman", the drummer who'd bothered to learn rudiments, while I associated drummers who played matched grip with "cavemen." Not that there haven't been a lot of cavemen - like John Bonham - that I totally dig! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif But when I was a teenager I was a real snob about it, I didn't think anybody who played matched would be able to swing at all!

 

--Lee

[rebonn]

Traditional grip was needed back in the early days of drumming such as drum and bugle corps because the drum itself was slanted to the right and a traditional grip would have been awkward.

Nowadays marching bands have the drums mounted straight and are using matched grip.

I originally learned to play traditional grip I guess because it was the way at the time to play, sort of like being circumsized, no real reason, just tradition.

I have since switched to matched grip but wasn't easy for the left hand.

It took a while to surpas the left hand traditional grip I learned, to the matched grip.

That's probably the reason you see the traditional grip today.

I would not recommend the traditional grip to anyone starting out because it's not natural and not needed.

The point being you wouldn't use the traditional grip with the right hand would you.

Try it and you'll see how silly it is.

[Lee Flier]

rebonn,

 

No you wouldn't use traditional grip with your right hand, but since the left hand is the one that keeps the backbeat on the snare, I think it does offer some advantages on the snare. I know at least one drummer who played matched grip for 20 years but switched to traditional because it helped him relax his left wrist, which had developed carpal tunnel. Traditional is also great for intricate rim shots and other subtleties on the snare and hi hats. It's true that it's unnatural for cymbals and would probably only get in the way if you have a bunch of toms. So I guess it would somewhat depend on your style, too, whether it would have advantage or not.

 

--Lee

[rebonn]

Well, I think what ever can be done with traditional grip can be done with matched grip.

However, there was this Russian guy I met who just entered the country and spoke no english, I think he fled the country or something.

Anyway he was one of these guys who was picked out by the Russian government to excell in drumming at the earliest age.

He was about 40 when I met him and he could do a one handed roll.

The way he did this was to use the traditional grip and tap the stick with his index and 2nd finger back and fourth balancing the stick in the process.

Of course I asked him how he did this and he tapped his 2 fingers on the drum head creating a roll with his 2 fingers.

Of course incorporating a finger tap roll into a one handed balancing act with a drum stick takes some practice which appears he had plenty of.

[djarrett]

rebonn wrote:

 

>Nowadays marching bands have the drums mounted straight and are using matched grip.<

 

Truth is rebonn, that the majority of snare lines in DCI (although having the drums mounted flat) still use traditional grip. You *will* see the snare line using both thru-out a show depending on the music style and sticking visuals.

 

The multi tenors (quads, quints, and sextets) all use matched grip.

 

I really feel like versatile drummers will be able to use both grips and guage the use based on musical needs.

 

Thanks

DJ

[felix stein]

Ever see old videos of def leppard where rick allen is whipping the back beat with traditional grip? Sweet.

 

All my teachers, even for the rudiment and jazz stuff made me play matched.

 

versatile=convincing=mediocre? well in my case maybe....

 

Traditional is painful for me.

 

One handed rolls sound wimpy IMHO...I'd rather hear a clean multiple bounce roll or a hard pulled double and fill the roll with the feet anyday-then stick BOTH arms in air and twirl LOL

[ajcamletearthlink.net]

Originally posted by djarrett:

I really feel like versatile drummers will be able to use both grips and guage the use based on musical needs.

[/b]

 

 

I concur. I use both - probably because I've perfected neither one, and each has its strengths & weaknesses for me.

I tend to be able to play very intricate passages with a traditional grip - but this is probably because my finger technique is more refined in this grip. For power - its matched all the way.

 

I theory, i do feel that traditional grip is unecessary these days for the reasons mentioned above (i.e marching snares on an angle went away long ago). Logically & physically matched grip makes more sense. Same muscle groups - same amount of muscles. i really wish i could develop my matched grip, specifically my finger technique, to a point where i didn't switch to traditional anymore. Actaully, i *can* do that, i just haven't yet.... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

ajc

[djarrett]

Good points all!

Any one else?

DJ

[Dwarf]

When I first started playing it was only matched grip. Then, because I was in my high school marching band, I had to learn traditional. Now I use both depending on my needs. Straight ahead rocking sees matched grip. Jazzy stuff or anything requiring intricate snare work sees traditional.

 

--

Rob

[djarrett]

Keep in mind there are many masters today that use traditional grip as their primary grip. They also use matched, but not often.

They include Vinnie Colaiuta, Gregg Bissonette, Dave Weckl, etc.

It works o.k. for them. That is not to say it is right or wrong, just that it can work. I think it really comes down to comfort.

DJ

[DrummerCafe]

I use Matched Grip exclusively now for several reasons (which have already been mentioned).

 

1) Matched Grip uses nine small muscles; Traditional grip uses two large muscles (rotating the Radius bone around the Ulna). Having both hands using the same grip has a definitely advantage, especially for beginners.

 

2) I play timpani, mallet instruments, etc., and Matched is more conducive to the techniques used on these other instruments. An exception to this might be French grip on timpani which uses a similar bone rotation as Traditional grip (although the actual grips are very different).

 

3) Traditional grip was only created because the marching snares were slanted. Now that we have carriers that can level the drums to a horizontal playing surface, there is really no need for Traditional grip.

 

4) I found myself only using Traditional grip when playing jazz; all other styles used Matched. So I made a permanent change to always use Matched, making it easier on my muscle memory and overall balance between my hands. It's tough going back and forth between the grips, although many people do it. Billy Cobham is a monster with all his variations of the two grips.

 

I am very aware that there are some nice things you can do with Traditional grip that you can't do with Matched grip. This would really play into the jazz medium.

 

One thing I see a lot of is drummers using Traditional grip but their snare drum is flat; perfectly horizontal. Why? They try to argue their point to me, telling how relaxed they feel. I'm all for it, but why not slant the drum? They say they don't need to ... and yet when I watch them play their left side of the body sags and leans down towards the left. Their own bodies are trying to tell them that the drum should be slanted.

 

If you think I'm nuts, try this experiment.

 

Level your snare drum so it's perfectly horizontal and play a single stroke roll. You'll quickly notice that there is a huge sound difference between the strokes because the tips of the sticks are striking the drum differently. The left stick is hitting the drum using on the very tip of the bead, rather than the full side of the tip. The ONLY way to compensate is to lean over to the left, lowering your self so that your left hand can strike the drum just like the right hand.

 

Now many of my Drum Corps friends might argue that you can compensate in another way ... raise the height of the drum. The are CORRECT!!! That does work and will keep you from slouching to the left ... BUT ... the drum height is now so high that it's extremely ackward to play the rest of the drumkit. If you are in a drumline, where every drummer is a different height, you now have different heights between all the snare drums. This is unacceptable in drum corps, so that blows the potential of using it right out of the water.

 

So, if you are going to play Traditional grip ... please, please, please ... slant the drum down to the right so that your left hand will strike the skin with the same type of attack as the right hand. God will smile on you and you will live a long, healthy life. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

 

If in doubt, look at the front cover of your Ted Reed's "Syncoptation for the Modern Drummer" and/or George Stone's "Stick Control". They too will smile down on you from heaven. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

 

 

 

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Bart Elliott

http://bartelliott.com

[djarrett]

Yes, Bart:

You make good arguements for Matched vs. Traditional.

I tend towards traditional more from habit than anything else.

I do however, slightly angle the snare and not too much, ... and still I get a rim-"gock" with most hits.

Most folks that I play with like than fat "gock" on the backbeat!

Your thoughts?

DJ

[DrummerCafe]

Yeah DJ ... I play the snare "gocks" or snare rimshots when needing strong, driving back beats.

 

Great to hear that the drum is slanted!!! You can still be my friend. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif

FYI, I don't think someone has to slant the drum as much as Gladstone, Reed, or Stone does in those photos; but the angle is directly related to how high the drum is. The higher the drum, the less of an angle. These guys where playing it like it was still strapped to their bodies, although it was on a stand. It makes since because it was a transition time during that part of history. But now, with technology, state-of-the-art snare stands and marching carriers, we have changed our approach.

 

I have absolutely nothing against Traditional grip; none whatsoever. My only beaf would be if someone used that grip and doesn't slant that snare drum. Not doing so would cause you to slouch to the left in order to play those snare "gocks". I'm really into the whole ergonomics of drumming. Every stroke needs to flow and the body needs to be fully relaxed; shoulders down in a relaxed position and a straight back.

 

Hey, let me share what I believe is great way to find the degree of angle for the snare drum.

 

1) Hold the sticks using the grip of your choice; Traditional or Matched.

 

2) Move into position so that you are over the drum, ready to play. Typically you would want your sticks to be hovering over the snare drum about one or two inches. I usually think of being in a hybrid "fetal" position in which my elbows are down at my sides and my forearms relaxed.

 

3) Check to see the relationship between the drum and the sticks. Adjust the angle of the snare drum so that your sticks are parallel to the surface when you hover about two inches above the head.

 

Using this will allow for accurate strokes, using the full tip of the stick, and will prevent accidental rim clicks or rim shots.

 

I use this same technique in finding the angle for my toms and ride cymbal. It's been great and seems to work well for others. I sure wish someone had told me about this when I was younger. The drum set-up can make a HUGE difference in your overall endurance, accuracy and technique.

 

What do you use to find the correct angle for your playing position?

 

 

 

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Bart Elliott

http://bartelliott.com

[Steve LeBlanc]

I play traditional style...for no real reason other than the fact that I was emulating Dave Weckl when I first did a lot of practicing.

 

I like the way it feels and actually feel really awkward when I try to play matched grip now.

[djarrett]

Thought I would revive some of these old threads with all the new drummers participating!

DJ