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who still believes in the BIG rig?


rumpelstiltskin.

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when i was in an early band that played out about twice a year, my dream rig was something with an 8x10 cabinet. that was the only way to get the sound.

 

i still read quite a few people who have a 4x10 and 1x15, or even just a 4x10, and i think about what a huge pain that would be.

 

there seems to be a trend out there for smaller lighter rigs. i have been using a fairly compact carvin 1x15 w/ tweeter as my cabinet, but since i've played through a bergantino HT112, i am a believer in the small, powerful, tight rig. especially after being in a band that plays about 150 shows per year, i dream of the day i can carry my rack in one hand, my cab in the other, and my bass on my back -- one trip load-in.

 

you light-rig owners, what do you have? those who dream, what do you want?

 

does anyone still believe the big rig is better than the small?

 

robb.

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I love my rig -- SWR SM-500 and two mesa cabs (2x10 and 1x15). It's big. It's pretty durn loud, too. It's kind of a pain in the ass to lug around, but it sounds awesome.

 

However, one of my bands (I've mentioned my "brit-poppy" band here before) doesn't really require the big booty bass sound all the time, and since it's easier for us to travel in one car for weekday gigs because nobody in that band owns a van, I usually find some way to borrow a bass rig from one of the other bands on the bill. This almost always results in some kind of sonic adventure like the one I mentioned in my last night thread.

 

Until our "one car" is something sizable, like a minivan, I'm gonna keep on borrowing bass amps for weekday gigs and leave my big rig at home. Even if I DID have a smaller rig, we still couldn't fit it in the car with us. We're cramped up as it is.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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I wrestle with this constantly. I had a post up a couple weeks ago asking if I should get new stuff or keep what I have. I am keeping what I have (for now anyway) because it seems to work for the gigs and rooms I play.

 

I am a believer in the small, tight, versitile rig. I use an SWR WM10 combo (rehearsals and small rooms) and 2X10 cab (bigger rooms) that basically becomes a 100 watt 3X10. It's very portable, has nice sound, and keeps up very well. For the really big gigs and rooms, I DI into a PA anyway so I don' t worry about the "big rig" right now.

 

I do struggle with th equality of sound. That's what I am kicking back and forth right now. The current set up is fine, but I know my "Modului" would sound better through a really nice preamp and a power amp into the 2X10 or maybe a 1x12 cab. The Stewart World 1.2 is a nice single space power amp that when teamed with a preamp would make a very nice, light and powerful 2 space rig.

 

So, to make a long post short (too late, I know) I guess my dream is a sweet preamp (Kern, Demeter, SWR, etc.) a light, powerful single space power amp (Stweart World, Walter Woods) and a tight, full sounding cab.

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I just like the look of those huge 8x10 monsters! I hear the 'Space Odyssey' theme every time I look at one...

But I currently only have a single 400W 1x18 cab which does the job just fine for me. I may add a 2x10 later, but right now I just don't need any more. Getting a new amp to replace the tired Acoustic head I have right now is the big issue.

DX

Aerodyne Jazz Deluxe

Pod X3 Live

Roland Bolt-60 (modified)

Genz Benz GBE250-C 2x10

Acoustic 2x12 cab

 

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Well, as I posted on the earlier thread, I love my WM10.

 

But there's no way I'd say it replaces or equals my "big rig."

 

A single 10 can't hold a candle to the sound of a stack of drivers behind you.

 

And even a small rig with PA help ... is not the same, mostly because you don't have full control over your stage sound. And if you (as I do) adjust your sound at least in part by varying your playing technique, an approximation of the "real" sound, coming back at you through monitor side fills and a small combo can really make alter your playing style in ways that aren't great. (i.e. shifting up higher on the neck, using a lighter touch and increasing volume to adjust for lack of bottom end)

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I've mentioned before on a past thread that I'm to old, fat and lazy to hump around a big rig anymore. In the past when I did do that I about destroyed my old hatchback (even broke out the glass one time when I closed the hatch and didn't have the cabinet in right, that was funny). Now that I finally own a decent car I'm loath to do that.

 

The drummer I play with right now has a pretty light touch, so volume isn't an issue anymore.

 

But I gotta tell you on the occasion I do play through a 4x10 I really do think about it.

"I never would have seen it, if I didn't already believe it" Unknown

http://www.SongCritic.com

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Yeah, portability and convenience are nice...but that's no tradeoff for the feel of pure volume blasting behind you and seeing your leg hairs literally blowing in the moving air from the cab. (Whoa! I'm gettin a little excited here.)

 

Of course, I'm only 27. Check back with me in 15 years.

 

Scooty

Ah, nice marmot.
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I'd say there's many advantages to the smaller rigs but I don't think anything beats the big rigs, in my opinion. Yeah, I'd probably save a lot of wear and tear on my back with one of those little rigs and one day I might trade my stack in for one. Right now though, I'm 24, in great shape(lifting weights every morning), and believe more is better. I'll keep my 2 4x10 cabs and my 1000watt Carvin R-1000 head for now. I love making the ground shake.
Don't ask me, I'm just the bass player.
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Honestly, having 2 8x10 Ampeg cabs pushing air right behind you is a great feeling. I've played a few shows with that kind of setup. I love feeling the air blowing my pants legs. But, I hate the loading and unloading of those big bastards. I know I'm young and strong as an ox, but, I don't like playing a show half dead from lugging around all that gear all the while knowing I have to load it back up at the end of the set. I really like my Super Redhead. It's light enough for me to carry it and my bass strapped to my back in one load. Of course, when I add the Acme to it, it will no longer be a one tripper, but it will still be lighter than the 2 refrigerator cabs and a rack full of gear.
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My SWR Bass 350 and Triad cabinet will fit on a handtruck and roll right in in one trip, with my gig bag on my back. I'll think of bringing more gear to the gig when I have someone to tote it for me.

"I had to have something, and it wasn't there. I couldn't go down the street and buy it, so I built it."

 

Les Paul

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I have been using 2 Bag End single 15" cabs with either an Eden WT 400 or an SM 500.

Its a great sounding set up with good volume but does not compare to an 8 x 10 stack.

The cabs are very portable and weigh in at about 40lbs each.

I dont have the space for an 8 x 10 stack - If I did and did not have to move it too often its a no brainer.

www.danielprine.com

 

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I agree with pretty much everything said above. However, I sure do love my Ampeg 410 & 15. It just feels, sounds and looks right. I'm sure I'll change my tune down the road, when my back won't support using them, but imagine the types of portable cabs they'll have available by then!

-Mike

...simply stating.
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My 1x15 and 2x10 are perfect for me. Not too heavy and I can fit them both easily on my dolly. I would like to get a 4x10, but they are just way too heavy. I live on the second floor, no elevator. So, lugging a 4x10 up and down a flight of stairs every gig is not exactly ideal for me. Someday...
I have no homepage.
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Originally posted by cornbread:

Honestly, having 2 8x10 Ampeg cabs pushing air right behind you is a great feeling. I've played a few shows with that kind of setup. I love feeling the air blowing my pants legs. But, I hate the loading and unloading of those big bastards. I know I'm young and strong as an ox, but, I don't like playing a show half dead from lugging around all that gear all the while knowing I have to load it back up at the end of the set. I really like my Super Redhead. It's light enough for me to carry it and my bass strapped to my back in one load. Of course, when I add the Acme to it, it will no longer be a one tripper, but it will still be lighter than the 2 refrigerator cabs and a rack full of gear.

Holy christ. Where in the hell did you play where you used 2 8x10 cabs?? I've played some really large outdoor events (and a huge indoor one, the Superdome in New Orleans) and a single 2x15 or 8x10 has always been more than enough. I suppose it looks cool to have 2 8x10 cabs anyways... but that would be enough volume to overpower any club PA system in existence.
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Originally posted by Bumpcity:

Holy christ. Where in the hell did you play where you used 2 8x10 cabs?? I've played some really large outdoor events (and a huge indoor one, the Superdome in New Orleans) and a single 2x15 or 8x10 has always been more than enough. I suppose it looks cool to have 2 8x10 cabs anyways... but that would be enough volume to overpower any club PA system in existence.

It was at a local club and the regular p.a. company couldn't make it and the replacement guy only had enough for the vocals and drums, so, we bass players combined our rigs for one massive rig, since we had to play a rather large club with no p.a. backing us. We used my Mesa 400+ driving the other guys' Ampeg cabs. It was overkill by all accounts, but, it was a doomed gig, so we had fun. Tool was playing just down the road, so there went the crowd and cash and sound company. We booked the gig well before Tool booked their show, otherwise we wouldn't have considered it. Massive sound. I was smiling for days.
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All you young whippersnappers and your monster rigs slay me. Doesnt anyone haul around your twin Cerwin Vega double folds anymore? No triple stacks of JBL 18s pushed by a couple of 1200 watt 120 pound power heads, bi amped? At the minimum a 1968 VW minibus to haul it all around in? No? Uh. Wha hoppn, Lucy?

 

Yeah, me too. I am past that. All I do now is wheel my little monitor around with me.

 

90% of my gigs, from orchestra pits, to outdoor gigs with big bands, to jazz clubs, into the studio, down to the nightclub, and giving and taking lessons, I use a SWR WM12 which is bungee-strapped to a collapsible airline cart. I line out the the DI to the main board, tilt it back facing me, and Whammo, theres me monitor! Let the PA guy deal with the house sound. Thats what he is paid for. Lets me concentrate on the task at hand, saves floor space, and is so easy. Both electric and upright get the same treatment. Light, tight and out of sight.

 

The other 10% of the gigs.... ... I use what is provided or go acoustic. Yeah, I still have a couple of oversize dust-collectors in the garage, and dread anytime I start to think of hauling them out.

 

If blowing air is your bag, I got a slightly used Binford 9000 variable speed blow dryer that does my bald head no good.

"Arf", she said.
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i guess before anyone gets the wrong idea of me...

 

i'm 24. i don't want a small rig because i'm lazy, out of shape, or because i don't like the sound and feel of an 8x10.

 

i wear ear plugs when i play, and i don't run out of volume with one carvin 300W 1x15. i can hear everything when i play.

 

i guess i don't have to defend it, i'm just surprised by the attitude that the only way you can get a good, big sound is by playing a huge rig, and that by going small, you're comprimising your tone for more practical matters. i feel like i'm maximizing my tone and volume by going for a small, high-power speaker cabinet and powerful amplifier.

 

weird. i really thought attitudes had changed.

 

robb.

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Well, I miss standing in front of my old SVT set-up, but it's not neccesary anymore.

 

I've got 2 Bag End 1x15's and a 2x10. I use a Carvin ProBass 200 (that's got the X-over built in) and my very old (tried but true, PAS 400) if I want to run a 15". I usually play smaller parties, or outside festivals (with big PA's), and for the smaller stuff the Carvin/2x10 and my MM fit the bill. Bigger stuff...I add the PAS and a 15" (for stage presence).

 

Gettin' my butt kicked by 8x10's is cool, but findin' someone to help load in/load out is not! hehe

JBFLA

Jim

Confirmed RoscoeHead

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When I go to see my favorite bassplayers, Victor, Marcus, Jimmy Haslip, Kai Eckhardt, or many others they always seem to have 2 4x10's on stage. And they are in the PA. These guys are not playing concerts, they are playing in large clubs.

 

Jaco used to have 2 Acoustic 360's.

 

I can play most of my gigs through 1 2x10, sometimes I bring two of them. But one of these days I will be playing a big club.

 

I hate being at the mercy of the soundman.

 

Once I played Shoreline Ampitheatre. Nobody brought amps. It sounded awesome out in the audience. But the monitor guys screwed up something and we had major problems hearing each other.

 

In the 70's I used a 2x15 cab and a Cerwin Vega with an 18 and a 10. I had a full size Dodge van then too.

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I fall into two correlated groupings. 1) I like the sound of well done, small things - convenient. 2) I'm old.

 

I never had the pleasure of using massive rigs in my youth. It's something I'd like to have tried at least once.

 

Jeremy mentioned that he doesn't like being at the mercy of a soundperson, and I can understand that. But his comment reminded me that while we can walk in with more reasonably sized rigs, soundfolks are still carrying a ton of stuff. For the big jobs, we've just off-loaded the work to them !!

 

I was "out of" the equipment side of bass for many years, and I am impressed by how much better things are now. I think that's the key to why we can use smaller stuff if we want to.

 

Tom

www.stoneflyrocks.com

Acoustic Color

 

Be practical as well as generous in your ideals. Keep your eyes on the stars and keep your feet on the ground. - Theodore Roosevelt

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I confess, I never seem to use my sky-scraper stack at all anymore, and although it's not really a light-weight rig, I find my SWR 4x10 with my GK-1001RB is more than enough for any stage situation I have ever played, including some very large rooms.

 

I still love the look of my stack, however...

 

http://herne.tripod.com/bassrig.html

 

...and trust me...it's thick and LOUD!

 

What I wish I had was a roadie to lug it in and set it up at every gig.

 

:D

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I'm definitely a big sound addict - however I manage to achieve it with two Low-B2's stacked vertically. I would prefer to have four B2's but only if someone else is carrying them to the gig for me. I'm definitely unwilling to let my stage sound rely on just a small combo supported by a bit in the monitors - I need to hear myself well to play my best, and more importantly, the band needs to hear me well to get deep in the groove. I mean, if the other guys (and gals) can't hear you, how are they going to interact with you?

 

Alex

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So I mentioned my "brit-pop" band bass amp situation (I like to borrow amps when I play out with this band.) That's because the band doesn't own a van. If we DID own a van, I'd always bring the big rig. As it stands, the nature of the music usually finds us playing fairly nice rooms with apt soundpeople and nice PAs.

With my metal/hardcore band, I play guitar, and our bassist uses my rig. We NEED to have serious volume and density in this band -- it's part of the genre. Lucky for us, this band owns a van. Also... we tend to play at places that don't have reliable PA systems or overly adept soundpeople. This means we can't depend on hearing anything but vocals through the PA (sometimes we don't even get that.) If we don't have good projection and volume onstage, we're sunk. Hence... the big rig.

And I would be remiss if I didn't mention that those big rigs LOOK fucking cool, too. You can't lie... you know they do.

\m/

Erik

"To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

--Sun Tzu

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I'm still waiting for Bose to come out with some cabinet with one insane little 5" speaker in it that handles 400 watts, has a frequency range from about 35hZ-15khZ, and will fit in the front pocket of my gig bag. THERE'S my dream 'big rig.' It could happen - after all, we live in an age of innovation.

"I had to have something, and it wasn't there. I couldn't go down the street and buy it, so I built it."

 

Les Paul

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Originally posted by surfmonkey:

My 1x15 and 2x10 are perfect for me. Not too heavy and I can fit them both easily on my dolly.

I have half of that right now, just need the 2x10, with the horn, then I'm set. I've got no problems with being mic'd. And with the amp modeling capability of the BP200, I can have just about any amp sound I want.

 

The only thing I'm slightly peeved at is that Marshall now has a hybrid (tube pre/ss power amp) 350 watter known as the Mode Four! Hopefully I won't ever have to compete with those mofo stacks!

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Originally posted by Scootdog:

Of course, I'm only 27. Check back with me in 15 years.

 

Scooty

15 years , 1 wife and two kids later:

 

SWR SM-400 in a padded rack bag.

Acme Low B Series 1 cabinet.

 

All in one trip on a hand truck or hand cart.

Anything larger than the average church sanctuary and I go DI to the house mix and my rig becomes my monitor. No fuss, no muss and a big bootyquake sound. :D

RobT

 

Famous Musical Quotes: "I would rather play Chiquita Banana and have my swimming pool than play Bach and starve" - Xavier Cugat

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I saw my favorite big rig at BassDay NY in 2001. It was an Ampeg box with a handle. Inside was a refrigerator.

 

I've done fine with my Berg 1x12, and I plug in my old Kustom 2x12 to point at the band. I don't know if I'll make it to clubs where I need bigger....

 

Yes, the big rigs look cool. So do the big rack systems you see in BP. I'm starting to wonder if much of that preamp/switching/etc. is unnecessary (not that I'm going to tell Darryl Jones how to spend his money).

 

Tom

www.stoneflyrocks.com

Acoustic Color

 

Be practical as well as generous in your ideals. Keep your eyes on the stars and keep your feet on the ground. - Theodore Roosevelt

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I tried something different on my gig earlier tonight. I took my Accugroove 112 out without combining it with my Eden Metro. Mark (Whappo) from Accugroove let me try a Merlin amp of his. Not only was I blown away but got compliments from the whole band. It was particularly great to hear from the drummer at the end of the night how great my tone was. The gig was with a six piece variety band. I don't know a whole lot about the Merlin amp except that it is, I believe, 500 watts at 4 ohms. I believe that even in situations such as outdoor gigs and larger venues, especially if going through the PA that one would most likely never need more than two of the Accugroove 112's. The 112 is actually lighter than the Eden 210XLT that I sold. One thing that tonight proved to me is that I made the right decision selling my Eden 410XLT and Eden 210XLT to get my Accugroove 112 cabinet. :thu:

 

Wally

I have basses to play, places to be and good music to make!
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