Do you touch "deep" topics . . .

[shniggens]

. . . . In your writing . . . such as religion, politics, death, etc? If you do, how do you approach it?

 

I try to, but they all come off a little heavy-hitting and pretentious. I have too much to say, and the end result turns out to be a little too . . . verbose, I guess.

[songrytr]

It's not easy to write something heavy without getting preachy.

 

It helps a lot if you try to "show" instead of "tell" in your lyric. A story will draw someone in a lot faster than a simple rant or list.

 

Think back to some of the songs you like that handled the message right and take a cue from them.

 

[Sean Eldon]

I'm doing a record that's all about death and despair and "deep" things.

 

there's 3 songs on purevolume.com link in my signature. one's about capitalism, one's about drug rehabilitation, one's about the suicide of a friend. those are pretty "deep" i suppose.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

If you are telling me how something touched you, rock on. If you are trying to tell me how it should be according to you... well, maybe I'll pass.

 

The best songs, even maudlin ones like "I'm Already There", say much more and reach more people in a more effective manner than any song that preaches or accuses.

 

Bill

[GreeleyEstates]

a good way to get deep is ask lots of questions in your lyrics. everyone's quick to throw their two cents in. take the band switchfoot for a GREAT example. read their lyrics and you'll see what i mean. ( www.switchfoot.com )

[cherri]

One of our reviews describes me as a "fearless songwriter", so it's kind of expected these days. Two of our newer ones (which will be on the next CD) for example:

 

Mirror Mirror is about aging and losing one's surface beauty, but it has a positive resolution at the end. It never directly says anything about age, because the images are pulled from Grimm's fairy tales. My only concern is that it's a bit contrived in parts. However, the lyrics are interwoven with the musical melodies, so it doesn't come across that way. It's an "A / B" song - the first half is melodic and sung, the second half kicks out an instrumental jam.

 

Empty Pockets is about the economy ... it's got lyrics like "all the good jobs gone overseas". Because it's a Delta blues tune, played on a steel resonator with a slide, it sounds like it's from the Great Depression ... but it's about our current economy.

[Lee Flier]

If something "heavy" is on my mind and it comes out in a song, it's what comes out. I wouldn't consciously sit down and say "I'm going to write a song about death" or whatever, that would come out sounding contrived I think. But I certainly don't shirk from something if it's a very heavy thing... currently I'm writing a song which I guess is about the epidemic of depression... but I don't think you'd know that to listen to it, I just wrote it because I feel bad for all the people who are suffering from things they can't explain, even though they might seem fine on the outside.

 

I agree that I usually prefer to hear (and write) songs that describe how someone is affected personally by a political or religious issue than preaching about it. Although Bob Dylan can do either or both and just nail it. He wrote "Knockin' On Heaven's Door" AND "Masters of War." Damn him.

[BillWelcome Home Studios]

Lee,

 

Both songs date from the 60s/70s, when Bob was still a part of the 'protest movement' in music. Lots of great songs... "My Back Pages", etc, etc. Put in the context of the music of the time and what predated it (Pat Boone...) it was radical stuff. Now, well, I've heard it all before. This is a different time, and for a new songwriter... well, he's better have a lot of drive if he is going to try to tell me how fucked up I am, and expect me to buy their product.

 

Bill

[Tedly Nightshade]

I write about lots of heavy stuff. It's very effective- I write in a roundabout way, asking more questions than making statements, although I make those too, telling stories rather than making manifestos.

 

Part of being an effective artist, IMO, is the ability to put things in an open ended way, so the listener comes to their own conclusions, "I dunno, what do you think?" but supplying tone and context and human angles so they end up looking at it "your way", or really the song's way. I've very often really connected persuasively with people who would have been locked down solid and entrenched about an issue in any kind of verbal discussion, but with art, I've had them opening up to consider a point of view they would have rejected anywhere but art.

 

Riddle me this. Tell somebody's story, let the reader derive the answers.

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by bpark@prorec.com:

Both songs date from the 60s/70s, when Bob was still a part of the 'protest movement' in music. Lots of great songs... "My Back Pages", etc, etc. Put in the context of the music of the time and what predated it (Pat Boone...) it was radical stuff. Now, well, I've heard it all before. This is a different time, and for a new songwriter... well, he's better have a lot of drive if he is going to try to tell me how fucked up I am, and expect me to buy their product.

I agree that times are different now, but "Masters of War" could have been written today and still be just as relevant and hard-hitting. Nothing's changed since then as regards that subject. It didn't have to be Vietnam or any specific war. I agree that most people can't pull that off, though - nor could they in the 60's, really. Most of those "protest" songs of that era are long forgotten. My point was that it can be done, but like you said, you'd better really have a lot of drive behind it.

[skipclone 1]

I have some heavy topics for sure but I prefer allusion and metaphor to blatant attempts at persuasion or accusation. I like a lot of Lauryn Hill`s music for example, I don`t have an issue about someone writing about their own religious faith and what it`s done for them, but to me some of it comes off as preachy and didactic. Living Colour also, love their music and their songs but some of the lyrics are a bit heavy-handed in the way they deliver the message. As far as politics, I would never name names or refer to political parties in a song, unless I was commissioned to do so.

A friend of mine who was a producer in L.A. made a comment about getting hit over the head with messages, `If you haven`t been through the kind of shit I`ve been through, and especially if you haven`t had to deal with a lot of shit, don`t go telling me about what I should be thinking or how I should be living.` Now I don`t agree 100% with that, I`ll listen to anyone who may have an insight, I just keep the difference between advice and orders in mind-I`m free not to take advice. But as someone said before, showing is much better than telling.

[shikawkee]

Heavy topics are okay if you're really, truly into the subject matter. But like Dylan, I think it sort of needs a 'wink' or at least a 'crooked jaw' with a bit or scarcasm or distance. For the most part though I think it's best to stay away from the heavier topics unless there's a way to do it without making people cringe or possibly turning off certain more sensitive listeners straight off.

 

I was very hesitant to publish my song 'Baghdad' because I was afraid of how it might be taken yet so far, so good.

 

Here's a link if you care:

 

http://www.edpettersen.com/edpettersen/Audio.html

 

I tried to take a less direct path with it (I think ! )

[D_dup3]

Two elements help: pithiness (even to the point of near sloganeering---consider how George Clinton's or John Lennon's lyrics work)

& a touch of humor.

[Archer]

Songs are great for conveying emotion and sometimes there's no better way to bring up heavy topics.

 

Many songs go the direct rout, the very few things I've heard from Eminem are pretty direct but he seems to connect with his audience.

 

Bruce Cockburn's "If I had a rocket launcher" deals with pretty heavy subject matter. There are a lot of word pictures in the verses and the choruses are more direct.

 

I think it's okay to tell it like it is, you just have to be aware that it will come across as "preachy" to the listener. Sometimes that is what is called for. I do prefer the "show, don't tell" approach, without resorting to cliches, if possible.

[Robman2]

Deep?

 

Write from the heart,

 

Whether it's a love song based on a broken one,

 

A message to someone you never met but that is something you have to say to them,

 

A conscious reverberating anthem,

 

Stay still and let the muse, spirit, interplay with your intellect and soul

 

I asked Jim Collins about his take once and he said "Take the biggest subject you can, and tell get it into three minutes"

 

Rob

[RobT]

Originally posted by shikawkee:

I was very hesitant to publish my song 'Baghdad' because I was afraid of how it might be taken yet so far, so good.

 

Here's a link if you care:

 

http://www.edpettersen.com/edpettersen/Audio.html

I tried to take a less direct path with it (I think ! )

I like the music and the lyrics. I think you pulled off (the good stuff) what's been discussed

[shikawkee]

[/qb]

I like the music and the lyrics. I think you pulled off (the good stuff) what's been discussed[/QB]

 

Thank you very kindly !