Android phone apps are like WHACKAMO

[techristian]

Android phone apps are like WHACKAMO. Every time I get used to the system Google moves things around again! I can't find MY photos. They want me to upload everything to THEIR servers and then charge me. 

 

Is it the same with Apple I Phones ?

 

Dan

[RABid]

IPhones are pretty consistent. iCloud comes with 5GB. You pay to expand to more space. I subscribe to Apple+ family plan which includes 2TB of iCloud, AppleTV, Apple Music, Apple Arcade and Apple News. It can be shared among 5 family members. My main complaint with Apple is each OS updates kills off more older programs that have not been updated by developers. I have an old iPad just for running some favorite old games that will not run on anything new.

[Anderton]

iPhone is in theory a better option. Having both, though, I currently use Android. I upgrade the phones successively - first one, then later, the other. It's less expensive than upgrading them both at once. I am disappointed that Samsung took out the SD card option, to me that was a big advantage over paying Apple's outrageous prices for memory. Yes, I know the integrated Apple memory gives better performance. However, I just used the SD card as a place to dump data and run simple programs, where performance made no difference at all.

 

I have run into issues with Apple changing things around. At one point I had to hunt for "do not disturb," only to find it was in something called Focus. 

[analogika]

14 hours ago, RABid said:

IPhones are pretty consistent. iCloud comes with 5GB. You pay to expand to more space. I subscribe to Apple+ family plan which includes 2TB of iCloud, AppleTV, Apple Music, Apple Arcade and Apple News. It can be shared among 5 family members. My main complaint with Apple is each OS updates kills off more older programs that have not been updated by developers. I have an old iPad just for running some favorite old games that will not run on anything new.

 

This. Apple's own hardware and software interface is so consistent that people complain they aren't moving fast enough, and that there is little reason to upgrade. This is a good thing, coming from @techristian's perspective, I think. I appreciate the conservative approach. 

Apple's free 5GB tier is laughable, but if you're prepared to spring for the larger tier, it's seamless and works really well across devices. The only quibble I have is that you can't earmark stuff for local storage to guarantee offline use. 

[Anderton]

One other point is that Apple has traditionally been ahead of Android in terms of ecosystem integration. All Apple stuff works together. Fortunately, for phones Windows mostly caught up with Phonelink, which works extremely well with Samsung phones. You can drag and drop files, transfer files among devices connected to the same network, run phone apps on your computer, etc. It recently added the ability to listen to sound from your phone on your computer. Although the integration isn't at tight as Apple, it's well-implemented. 

 

Analogika is right about the 5GB tier, you definitely need to upgrade the amount of storage. However, the storage cost is competitive with what Microsoft charges for OneDrive. No matter which platform you use, you're going to need more storage.

 

FWIW you don't have to upload your photos to Google's servers. I use OneDrive and local storage. I pretty much avoid Googledocs etc. whenever possible. It's worth the extra bucks for me to subscribe to Office 365 with its Terabyte of storage, even though LibreOffice is pretty formidable. 

[Philbo King]

20 hours ago, techristian said:

Android phone apps are like WHACKAMO. Every time I get used to the system Google moves things around again! I can't find MY photos. They want me to upload everything to THEIR servers and then charge me. 

 

Is it the same with Apple I Phones ?

 

Dan

Another thing that drives me nuts - Every time my phone updates, Samsung installs 4 or 5 stupid gambling and game apps that need to be uninstalled.

[analogika]

6 hours ago, Philbo King said:

Another thing that drives me nuts - Every time my phone updates, Samsung installs 4 or 5 stupid gambling and game apps that need to be uninstalled.

 

This sort of shit Just Doesn't Happen on iPhone. Never has. 

Apple is the only vendor for iOS; they don't need to differentiate their experience from other vendors using the same software, or subsidise their products by taking money from scammy vendors to place apps on users' phones. 

 

In fact, one of the major nobody-has-EVER-managed-to-do-this-before breakthroughs back in 2007 was that Apple flat-out refused any kind of carrier branding — not in software, and not in hardware. Unheard of at the time. 

[KenElevenShadows]

10 hours ago, Philbo King said:

Another thing that drives me nuts - Every time my phone updates, Samsung installs 4 or 5 stupid gambling and game apps that need to be uninstalled.

 

Just THIS ALONE would stop me from using Samsung phones. Wow. 

 

Their ecosystem is not real tight, and there seem to be a lot more security issues than iPhones.

 

I have used iPhone for something like nine or ten years, and that sort of thing has never happened. It's a nice, tight ecosystem, and there tends to be far less apps that are scams. While I use Apple products (computer, phone), I'm not a fanboy. But their stuff just works (well, most of the time), and their computer hardware just keeps going and going and going and going. Hardly perfect in their business model or their products, but I've had ridiculously good luck with them overall.

 

I do have a PC laptop, and that thankfully works very well for routine stuff like browsing, email, and Microsoft Office.

[techristian]

My wife had a Samsung phone. Never again because Samsung has a software layer ON TOP of Android which can further complicate things.

 

On top of that Samsung has redundant apps which Google also has. You can't remove or disable the Samsung apps, this using up extra resources.

 

Dan

[Anderton]

16 hours ago, Philbo King said:

Another thing that drives me nuts - Every time my phone updates, Samsung installs 4 or 5 stupid gambling and game apps that need to be uninstalled.

 

Strange. I always keep my S23 updated, and there are zero gambling or game apps installed. There is a Games icon for organizing games, and a Game Hub icon, but since I don't have any games installed or buy games, they don't do anything. Who's your carrier?

 

It did install Samsung TV+ without asking, so I ignored it. But one day in a waiting room I checked it out, and I've actually found movies on there I like. I looked at Knives Out the other night. I kept expecting it to play for a few minutes and ask for money or something, but that didn't happen. School of Rock is also on there, as well as news stations, music playlists (like "00s Pop"), that type of thing. It won't replace Netflix or Hulu, but it was much better than I expected given that everything is free.

 

Samsung Internet also has a news feed I like. It features a lot of international news. I prefer it to Microsoft Start (admittedly, a very low bar) but also Google news. It's the first news feed I go to for a quick hit of Reuters (probably the bulk of the stories), AP, CNN, NBC, Bloomberg, the Guardian, etc. It complements WION well. I'll probably pay for Apple News someday but it's not a priority. I also like the look of the Musicplayer forums on Samsung internet.

 

Frankly, if only iPhone or Android existed, I'd use it and be happy.

 

 

[Bill H.]

On 7/17/2024 at 10:27 AM, techristian said:

Android phone apps are like WHACKAMO. Every time I get used to the system Google moves things around again! I can't find MY photos. They want me to upload everything to THEIR servers and then charge me. 

 

Is it the same with Apple I Phones ?

 

Dan

 

I don't experience this with my Google Pixel 7 Pro. After every update everything is exactly where it was, and with no unwanted surprises - but it's straight-up Android without the Samsung skin.

 

Google gives you 15g of free cloud storage, which fills up pretty fast if you take videos with your phone. My kids resign themselves to it, but I'm the old stubborn type, disabled it, and transfer files like it's last century with a USB cable. 

 

I usually replace my phone after a couple of years or so, but I'll keep this one awhile longer. It's my first Pixel, and I'm in. 

[Philbo King]

Craig - we use US Cellular, however this was a Samsung update.  The phone is a model A53.

[analogika]

29 minutes ago, Philbo King said:

Craig - we use US Cellular, however this was a Samsung update.  The phone is a model A53.

 

IIRC, the A-series is a budget phone line that doesn't actually make them mentionable profits off hardware sales. 

I suppose it makes sense that they treat it differently from their flagship S-series. 

 

Well, in a non-Apple world. 

 

Can you imagine Apple putting out an iPhone SE and plastering spamware all over the home screen? 

[Anderton]

A Galaxy A53 isn't exactly cheap, I think it's in the same general range as an iPhone SE. I'm not sure cost has much to do with it, as I had a Samsung A12 - the cheapest of the cheap - before the S23, and no update added games or gambling apps with that phone, either.

 

However, here's what ChatGPT says about customization of Samsung updates.

 

"Carrier Customizations: Sometimes, carriers like US Cellular might include specific apps, including games, as part of their customization."

 

Hmmm..."carriers like US Cellular"...

[Anderton]

3 hours ago, Philbo King said:

Craig - we use US Cellular, however this was a Samsung update.  The phone is a model A53.

 

You may be able to bypass over-the-air updates from your carrier by using Samsung's Smart Switch program on your desktop. This is kind of like the way iTunes handled iPhones, because it can do backup, restore, and transfer. It also downloads updates directly from Samsung, so in some cases, you can get an update before your carrier rolls it out.

 

I don't know how US Cellular reacts if it pings your phone and finds the OS has already been updated. Perhaps that would prevent it from installing customizations. Or maybe not...I don't know, but it might be worth a try. 

 

For the record I use AT&T. Not the greatest service on earth, but they don't customize the Samsung updates. 

[RABid]

21 hours ago, techristian said:

My wife had a Samsung phone. Never again because Samsung has a software layer ON TOP of Android which can further complicate things.

Same here. I tried a Samsung phone once. After a week of it tracking my movements and sending me marketing text related to what store or restaurant I was in I went back to the store and changed back to iPhone. Oh, I did search the internet first. At the time there was no way to turn off the marketing messaging.

[Anderton]

10 minutes ago, RABid said:

Same here. I tried a Samsung phone once. After a week of it tracking my movements and sending me marketing text related to what store or restaurant I was in I went back to the store and changed back to iPhone. Oh, I did search the internet first. At the time there was no way to turn off the marketing messaging.

 

I think the various European regulations have made it so you can turn that stuff off now, as well as give you choices for cookies (I just click on "reject all" most of the time). I don't get any marketing, except for what shows up from Google/AdSense when visiting web sites. I did get a pitch in the new update to be alerted on deals for Samsung products in my area, but I simply declined.

 

In way it's a problem to always decline, because when I want to check the weather, it might give me Los Angeles or Duluth or Boston or whatever, because it doesn't know where I am. The "Once Only" button is your friend when using apps, although I sure that data gets mined. But it would anyway, it's Google-based.

 

To be clear, the concept of Apple being more secure is not a myth, despite iCloud breaches in the past. No company is perfect in that regard, look at what just happened with AT&T, which is terrible at safeguarding data. Apple is better than others but ultimately, it's up to the user to practice Safe Phone. If you have an iPhone, no matter how good Apple is, it won't really matter if the breach happens in a non-Apple service to which your iPhone connects. 

[Anderton]

And speaking of updates...look at the IT catastrophe that happened with the CrowdStrike forced update that messed with Windows (but didn't affect macOS or Linux machines). That's a perfect example of how a third-party update can screw up an operating system. You could say Microsoft is equally at fault because its core architecture allowed it to be messed with, but that's like blaming Apple because AT&T is your iPhone carrier and AT&T got breached.

 

So back to the topic at hand...Google and phone manufacturers could lock down their updates and not allow customization, but one of the advantages/disadvantages of Android is there are differences among different brands that run on the Android operating system.

 

Oh, one more Samsung comment: NEVER buy a Samsung refrigerator. Samsung does some things extremely well, and some things extremely poorly. Refrigerators are in the latter category. You've been warned. 

[Philbo King]

Yep.  We bought a nonsmart Whirlpool fridge, because my toaster oven has absolutely no need to know when we run low on milk...

[Anderton]

I bought a Whirlpool fridge when the Samsung that came with the house died. I've had really good luck with Whirlpool appliances in general. 

[David Emm]

There's a lot of hype and anxiety over the development of A.I.
Much of the hype is fueled by a childish want for new toys
 without a maturity of developing skills of tools one already has.
In the terms of Steve Jobs, it's the creation of B and C players.
         ~ Off the Matrix

 

"Multitasking" is for rubes, past a minimal point. We like to think of ourselves as great mental jugglers, but all it does is diminish the mental CPU cycles available per task, undermining the whole playing field. I'm lucky to even be a mono-tasker! My sister gapes at my Logic projects in sci-fi wonderment, but I tell her "Don't be unduly impressed. Its still partly the 21st century version of a juggling bear."

 

Flip phones are making a defiant comeback and I'm doing my part. I already have a computer at home to drive me batty. I don't need a smaller one in my pocket to nag me on the go. I can easily see the camera and recording means as useful, but leave the Internet at home, where you can yell at it from the comfort of your own shorts. There, you can walk away, but on a cell phone, it becomes parasitical. I have more money for my music doings through a few command decisions like that. Said Grandpa Simpson, in a lucid moment. 

 

I'm amused to have reached the point of the technology slowly overwhelming me. A lot of it has the whiff of the old saw about lasers being a solution looking for a problem. I have music in four formats, with the cloud nipping at my mind's heels. I've enjoyed Progress, but it should take a breather.

[Anderton]

A long time ago I made the decision that phone calls were a privilege, not a right. I didn't need to answer the phone. I don't have to be notified when an email comes in, I can batch up several hours' worth and do them all at once. I don't need to know what's hot on Spotify or Netflix, if it's really cool someone will make me aware of it. 

 

Multitasking is for making use of dead time, not creating more active time. I recently ripped my CD collection, but it happened only while I was waiting for something else to happen, like a video rendering or whatever, where normally I'd have to stare at the screen because 40 seconds isn't enough time to do anything else except...rip a CD. 

 

Ultimately we get to choose what we accept and reject. As a result, I'm very happy the options of things I can accept continues to grow, because I'll use them when I want and ignore them when I don't. Conversely, the options of things I can reject continues to grow, so that's a lot of stuff with which I don't need to be concerned. Would a flip phone be nice? I don't know, and I don't care. I have a camera that can make phone calls, play music, and access the internet. I don't need to watch movies on it, assuming there are even any movies I want to watch.

 

The Fear of Missing Out implies you're missing out on something better. If what you're doing works for you, you're not missing out on anything.

[analogika]

On 7/20/2024 at 12:10 AM, Anderton said:

A Galaxy A53 isn't exactly cheap, I think it's in the same general range as an iPhone SE.

 

I literally mentioned the iPhone SE as a point of comparison, and how unimaginable such behaviour would be in the iOS universe… 

 

It would indeed appear to be carrier bullshit, though. 

[Anderton]

14 hours ago, analogika said:

I literally mentioned the iPhone SE as a point of comparison, and how unimaginable such behaviour would be in the iOS universe… 

 

Sorry, it wasn't clear to me you were drawing a direct comparison because you mentioned the Android as a budget model but didn't mention the cost. I thought you were suggesting that it was because of a lower cost/lower margins they included unwanted commercial downloads. I wanted to point out that it was about the same price as the SE, so price wasn't a valid excuse for including unwanted commercial downloads. 

 

But as you said, it appears to be carrier-specific anyway. So then the question is if US Cellular is your carrier and you have an iPhone, are there customizations? I would bet there aren't, because Apple would not approve.

[analogika]

9 hours ago, Anderton said:

So then the question is if US Cellular is your carrier and you have an iPhone, are there customizations? I would bet there aren't, because Apple would not approve.

 

Of course not! One of the biggest innovations of the iPhone at the time was the complete absence of branding of ANY sort. Apple retained complete control over the platform, turning the prior business model 180° on its head. 

[Anderton]

2 hours ago, analogika said:

Apple retained complete control over the platform...

 

Which I believe the people who say p*rn will kick off Vision Pro sales like it did for other forms of visual media are wrong. Apple wouldn't allow that. 

 

Speaking of Vision Pro, a significant amount of advertising has started up here in the US for Meta Quest. This relates back to that previous Beta-vs-VHS thread about Vision Pro and the competition. It will be interesting to see if it causes Meta Quest 3 to get any traction beyond the Meta Quest 2, which has been quite successful with gamers and such. However, based on this review, it's not something that interests me. A lower-cost Vision Pro would.

[analogika]

17 hours ago, Anderton said:

 

Which I believe the people who say p*rn will kick off Vision Pro sales like it did for other forms of visual media are wrong. Apple wouldn't allow that. 

 

Apple has no control over online content. The iPhone's lack of Flash support had the entire porn industry convert their catalogue from Flash to h.264 within a few months. 

 

I do agree that porn won't kickstart Vision Pro sales — it hasn't for any of the available virtual reality headsets. Of course, there's probably very little immersive content available at this point. 

[Anderton]

6 hours ago, analogika said:

Apple has no control over online content.

 

Hmmm...I was assuming an app would be needed, and it could be controlled the same way apps are controlled in the app store. I guess not.