So, I had my wife arrested last night....

[not coaster MODERATOR]

serves you right for taking a female co-worker to lunch. what did you think was gonna happen? duh.....

[Gator Wing]

Best wishes for a happy ending.

[skipclone 1]

If I`m reading what you said before correctly, it sounded like the manure hits the turbines every time you have ANYTHING to do with ANY female co-worker, so this is hardly a case of a little more TLC, some candy and flowers and then it`s all better. It`s more than an ordinary case of, don`t do this again and then there`s no problem, right? But while accepting your thanks I was kind of saying, as have several others, that you are not blameless here. You either should have done something a lot sooner or avoided situations, however innocent, that you know would set her off.

[Matt.Hepworth]

Wow Dean, that's bad news. My brother-in-law (my wife's bother) had the exact same thing just happen. Different trigger, but indentical situation - including the mother-in-law screaming at him for causing the problem. Needless to say, your story strikes very close to home and I feel for you very much. It is normal to be a bit suspicious/jealous of another person with our spouse, however, the fury and suddeness of the attack instantly gave me the impression that she may be reacting so heavily toward you because she is defending something she's done, if you take my meaning. Your retelling of your reaction definitely implies that you were having a pretty turbulent relationship already, and it would have been wise to not have stirred the pot a bit by bringing another woman home. I was always taught to never even lay a finger on a woman - for any reason, and because I would usually react in the way same as you did, I got beat up by my college girlfriend countless times in the one year relationship. That kind of situation and reaction is a situation that unintentionally prompts women to react. I also have to agree with much of what Ani said, as far as being premptive with bringing a female co-worker by the house. Also, her advice on handling an abusive situation is also dead-on, IMO. I also strongly disagree with her role-reversal points. No one should have to be in a situation like that, period. You should not do things to trigger, but you can't live your life walking on eggshells either. If eggshells is the only solution, then walk away. It already sounds as though you're ready to throw in the towell, and it sounds like it would be for the best in this situation. I kind of get the impression the relationship was near death anyway. Please take care, and ponder your decisions very carefully. I'm sorry you have to go through it.

 

Matt

[revolead]

Well, I don't know anything about wives or husbands, since I'm only 19, but I know a lot about calling the police on a family member.

 

Last year my dad and I weren't getting along very well. My mom signed us both up for counseling, so I was going once a week. I liked my shrink a lot, and I'm kinda sad now, cause he was a good friend and he just passed away. But anyway, sometimes the counseling helped, sometimes not.

 

But I got really mad at my dad one night and he and I got into a physical fight. I didn't want to put up with it anymore, so I left home for a friends house. I came back the next day, hoping my family would have missed me or something, but they didn't even seem to care. Out of anger and hurt, I punched the wall several times, and my sisters got scared and called the police on me. I never really forgave my sister for that, because I felt like I was abandoned. I never went to jail or anything, but I was angered by what the cop told me. We live in a nice house in the better off part of town, and the cop told me something along the lines of I shouldn't get pissed and punch holes in my wall because we have more money. And this type of behavior is typical of people in the poor part of town blah blah blah. What a jerk. Upper middle class or poor, everyone has feelings.

 

Well a few weeks later, my dad got pissed at me over nothing. I started yelling back at him and then he hit me. This wasn't the first time, but it certainly was the last. My friend was right in the house with me, and my dad still hurt me. I called the police on him that night because I was sick of all of this. They came and basically talked to both of us indivdually and helped keep things under control. Problem is, I was eighteen, so I couldn't really do much. I had no money, or I would've left home.

 

To this day, I've never really forgiven my dad, and I don't really like being at home. I'm grateful he still pays my college tuition, but he doesn't seem like he even cares about me anymore. He doesn't show it at least. I know I haven't treated him the best, but to be fair, we have equally physically abused each other. But he always seemed to start it. I tried so hard to please him and it didn't seem to work. If you met him as your father you'd understand.

 

Anyway, point of all of this, is you can sometimes work things out after these incidents. My dad said the next day he was going to kick me out of the house but still pay for my tuition. He never did, thanks to my mom, but our realtionship really hasn't been the same. I wish you the best of luck, and please, for the sake of those like me who have also had to call the police, please work it out. I hate stories like this. They remind me of the father I wish I never had.

[Bejeeber]

All I can say is I agree that Dean gets HUGE points for having the self control not to physically retaliate.

[Rog]

Dean, I don't know what to say apart from that it seems you're doing all the right things. Hang in there.

 

Ani, that was WAY out of line.

 

I think you should apologise.

[Rog]

Originally posted by Ani:

Originally posted by Rog:

Dean, I don't know what to say apart from that it seems you're doing all the right things. Hang in there.

 

Ani, that was WAY out of line.

 

I think you should apologise.

Rog,

 

I don't think so... Dean deliberately instigated what he KNEW would end in the final result. Especially as he has said the wife had previous reactions of jealousy. Why throw something out there when you know there will be incident? Why deliberately expose your child to what you KNOW will erupt into at least a vicious argument. If this couple has been to counseling for the purposes of jealousy, you can't say that Dean didn't have any idea that his wife would react as she did.

I'm not getting into another war with you but here are a couple points for consideration:

 

1. Dean has posted here when he's going through a really bad time. He needs support, not condemnation.

 

2. There are only a few people out there who know the facts. You're not one of them.

 

Neither am I.

 

Why launch into him?

[seclusion]

Dean, there comes a time when you just have to live. I've dealt with a similar, yet somewhat lesser degree of this. My current wife goes through periods of time where I can't do anything right. She even gets jealous when my buddy comes up to jam. He's a guy(no I'm not gay), she just hates the fact that I have fun with other people. When I pointed out that she doesn't have anyone she can hang with... I've suggested councelling etc. As we're out to dinner etc. I'm sometimes getting hit on. I find that acceptable, as that makes everyone of us feel good. It happens to her as well and I act out her reaction to show how absurd it is. But she just gets phyco and pissed. We have a solid relationship otherwise... She's realized that there are days that I can't do anything to make her feel "loved". Even though it is said and showed everyday. I've said that it's not my job to constantly reassure her that we're together. In fact I've mentioned that it gets tiresome... It's called self-esteem(sp). That comes from inside oneself... If you tell yourself your a looser every minute of your life, your spouse cannot ever fix that for you... I susspect you've been dealing with this for a while, maybe having the co-worker around is your way of making your wife deal with a problem... I totally understand why you did... Hope it can go forward..

Ani, much of the literature states that an abused person will put themselves back into an abusive situation time and time again. In extreme situations that they will MAKE an abusive situation!!! I assume you've done some research on this and refuse to put yourself as part of a problem... Be it that nobody deserves to be hit or verbally abused... Dean had the right response. Call the police and stand down!!! Anger, frustration, helplessness, jealousy. Are all parts of relationships of both spouses... It's how we deal with them that makes them more then that!!!

Later

Brian

[videoeditor1]

I don't agree with MYSELF 100% of the time... , so I don't expect to always be in concord with anyone else here all the time.

 

I don't have any sympathy for Dean, not because I'm callous, but because what he's going thru is a facet of life, determined (or predetermined) by words and actions over the years with his spouse.

 

It IS an unfortunate situation, but because we are all grownups here, we know there are no "innocents" of the two people involved in any type of long term dispute.

 

One of the very best practices I've picked up over the years is to place myself squarely in the shoes of my "counterpart" (wife, business associate, family member) during (or after) not so pleasant discussions. Things seem a lot LESS irrational when issues are viewed from the other side of the table.

 

Yes Rog, we dont know the facts, so we shouldn't project them, and yes, Ani's experiences makes her in general somewhat bitter about men and fathers. I remember one of her 1st posts (I read) about issues with her ex, men and family responsibilities. She definately came across as " all men are pigs" - even if that was not her intent.

 

I also think that, based on the information that Dean has provided (however biased or unbiased), Ani's response is unwarranted, biased, and somewhat counter to what one would expect of a previously abused spouse.

 

...don't know you or your circumstances, and your wife might truly be abusive, but if this is an isolated incident; your wife made a mistake in attacking you. "SHE" should have refrained her anger and jealousy while waiting for you to leave with your little philly... If she had done what she should have in the given circumstances, after the character assassination on top of the entry of another woman on the scene, YOU should have came home to changed locks on the door and all of your belongings setting out on the curb...She should have contacted an attorney immediately and filed, at minimum, a legal separation until differences could be worked out.

...is total bullshit. I don't expect my spouse to do any of those things if I tell her her cooking sucks, the neighbor doesn't trust her with a 15mth old, if I bring home an female co-worker...

 

Nor do I anticipate changing locks, or doing any of those things (lawyer etc) if she tells me I can't do housework/cook/babysit; and bring a male co-worker into our house.

 

Yeah Ani, you should check yourself, and take a 2nd look at your initial response to a guy that probably did the best possible thing once the situation escalated.

 

NYC Drew

[deanmass]

Ani, I am sorry for the reaction response. I am fried this weekend. I disagree with nearly all your points, but you are entitled to your opinion.

 

I am sure I am not without fault or guilt in some ways. The main reason I feel at fault is for letting the situation get so tense it exploded this way, but in that snippet of time, I was chilling, making dinner and tryint to let her vent so we could have a peacful weekend.

 

My faults with my wife are, I can be very sarcastic, as my email reply to you indicates, when pissed off. I also admit to systematically unplugging myself from her in the past 3-5 years, but that was a defense mechanism caused by getting hurt emotionally. I have three optios when it comes to responding to her Agree, disagree and say why, or say nothing. I used to do the first 2, in the past 3 years, I usually just nod if the kids are around. If she pushed, I'd ask if we can talk it over later.

 

One of my other faults may be that I am physically intimidating, and do look rather mean when pissed, but I cannot help that.

 

I have a lot of friends. I work for a school, and I am guessing we have an 80% female staff. I cannot avoid females just because my wife has a hang up about it. Her hang up is her hang up. This particular gal is 47 years old, and certainly not unattractive, but she is not some 20 year old hottie in a mini skirt either. I am 38, btw. Up until the lunch drop off, we had had a great, productive day. Travis kicked ass on his projects, my co-worker helped him and got everything done that needed to be, and I got 2 major projects knocked off that morning. We ate a great lunch of coney dogs and took Travis to grab his computer case then home. Simple as that.

 

If I had to give you an example of my circle of friends, I'd say my male hard core engineer dirt bike friend, my male therapist west coast bi-sexual friend, this co-worker, who is just a geek like me, my wifes' friend who is a 35 year old living with us as she navigates out of her divorce, my female accounting friend at work and my male chem teacher friend.

 

Note I said that my wife has a female friend living here with us. Free. Did I want her here? No, but she had no where to go, no one to help her and no way to get her back on her feet. Why does my wife not attack me for talking to her?

 

It is all complicated. .I appreciate the support on here. Ani, I am sorry you feel the way you do, but I think your preconceptions are not the reality, but you have no way of knowing that.

 

Drew, I REALLY like the fact that you you DO NOT feel sorry for me, because it is a part of life. That is some astute shit my friend. You never know what you are gonna get dealt. You guys are all helping me roll with it ( you 2 Ani, for forcing me to think a little deeper)

[JES]

Wow. That sounds messed up, good luck.

 

Just to point out something nobody else in this thread has mentioned. You said you took insulin to her in jail. Is she diabetic?

 

Mental illness rates, especially rapid cycling and manic depression are higher with diabetics, and bad blood sugar balance can mess it up further. I have a good diabetic friend and low blood sugar has sometimes led to panic attacks, etc. Sounds to me like she need treatment either way.

 

Best,

--JES

[skipclone 1]

Let me remind you of something, you may be bigger and mean looking and intimidating. Sooner or later you have to sleep. You wanna wake up again?

Don`t take anything for granted.

[skipclone 1]

I don`t want to come off like I`m not feeling for ya here mon, but you said you got hurt. So instead of telling her that and talking about it-like people who love each other do-you slammed the door on the matter, for how long? Jeez, I`m starting to feel like-hopefully not sound like-Dr. Laura, that woman annoys the crap out of me. But now I see why you walked right into s situation you could have easily avoided if you had considered her feelings, or at least had some freakin discretion about it. But you stopped doing that right? you got hurt so you stopped giving a crap. Sorry but that`s just a bad decision, I believe there has been some over-the top condemnation of your position but come on, you should have known better and at least covered your hindquarters.

[Geoff Grace]

Q. How many forum members does it take to change a light bulb?

 

A. 101. One to change the light bulb and 100 more to debate about it.

 

````

If only perfect people deserve compassion and sympathy, then no one deserves compassion and sympathy because nobody's perfect. IMHO, if compassion and sympathy were given generously, the world would be a much better place.

 

Sure, judgment is needed when sorting out conflicts; but in this incident, there will be plenty of judgment handed out through the court system.

 

It is amazing how isolated I feel right now in a house with 2 sleeping kids and a couple pets.

Dean, I'm sad to read about what you're going through. You are not isolated from people who care about you. I'll go out on a limb and guess that even the forum members who criticized your choices still care about you.

 

You have my compassion and sympathy.

 

You are in my thoughts and prayers.

 

Take care,

 

Geoff

[eh steve]

the drama queen strikes again.

 

it's all about you, ani.

[Dan South]

Originally posted by Cereal:

serves you right for taking a female co-worker to lunch. what did you think was gonna happen? duh.....

I disagree with this COMPLETELY. The wife is the one who is out of control, here. What's the guy going to do? Quit his job and join a company that only hires MEN? Then she'll find some reason to distrust the GUYS. I've had girlfriends that didn't like/trust some of my male friends, and I'm sure that the rest of you have, too.

 

If someone is jealous, IT IS THEIR OWN PROBLEM. Period. I know, because I used to be a VERY jealous person. I'm ashamed to recount in public some of the things that I did because of jealousy. I had to pull myself out of a pit of self-doubt in order to conquer the problem. It took years, but I couldn't have done it AT ALL without ACCEPTING RESPONSIBILITY for the problem first.

 

Jealousy is the most illogical of all emotions. If someone is trustworthy, there's no reason to be jealous. Being jealous just drives the person away. If someone is NOT trustworthy, you gain nothing by keeping them around. Jealousy doesn't HELP you in either case. It's the most cruel of all emotions, because it destroys us from the inside out. The more you fear losing someone, the more miserable your life will be, and the more miserable THEIRS will be. It's totaly unhealthy for everyone involved.

 

Blaming Dean for his wife's irrational behavior is like blaming your dog for a snowstorm.

[mwestenberg]

by JES

Mental illness rates, especially rapid cycling and manic depression are higher with diabetics, and bad blood sugar balance can mess it up further. I have a good diabetic friend and low blood sugar has sometimes led to panic attacks, etc. Sounds to me like she need treatment either way.

This also threw up a red flag for me. I am also a diabetic and have experienced a number of situations like this although not as dire thank God. This is worth examining though I will advise you, it is not a quick solution. My best to you in your struggle.

Mark

[dohhhhh6]

Yeah, Ani, I don't see why you must be so aggressive and to a degree attack Deanmass.

 

Someone who just might've had their marriage I think deserves some sympathy. Even if that means being pathetic.

 

Deanmass, I pray that things work out for you and your family.

[deanmass]

Thanks again people...

 

I told the police when they were here that my spouse was an insulin dependant diabetic and has other meds she takes, and that can contribute. I was telling them this because I wanted them to know it may have been a factor.

 

My wife is home now, upstairs sleeping. We talked a lot tonight. I held her alot and both of us wept. None of this is light or easy, and she is stil lmy most loved person other than my kids. The entire scenario rattled her. I hav ehad about 6 hours sleep in 2 days, and the only thing that I can say is I wish it had never happened, but in some ways, maybe it needed to.

 

Tomorrow AM is our 5 year olds first day of K-garten, and our 14 year olds 1st day of eighth grade. Aftera ll that happened this weekend, what I told her her is that I do not or will not hurt her, but if she chooses to hurt me or the children, I will do what I can to defend against it. I told her I loved her, and that I do tno think she realizes how much, and without saying it, that means 'I woudl not be here' if I did not love her. I told her I want NOTHING bad to happen to her ever, but when all this blew I did nto know what to do, and since she told me 3 weeks agao she was thinking of slitting her wrists, THAT was the thought that made me dial the phone. I todl her that no matter what happened, I would take care of her as much as I could. If we chose to break up, I woudl consider legal separation over divorce so she can stay on my medical policy and get whatever medical help and attnetion she needs.

 

This is all so complicated, tense, heart breaking. I love my wife, but I do not think I can go on living with her. But, we promised each other tonight to NOT make any decisions and to continue to talk as much as we could.

 

Thank you again for your input, all of you.

 

Ani, I am sorry I was critical of your handling of your children.

[blackfish]

Dean-

Good luck man, truly sad that this happended to your family.

 

Ani-

your reply sucks. of all the replies to cherri in her problems, does dean not deserve the same respect? cuz he's a man? f*#@ed up.

[where02190]

dean, hang in there and do what you have to do for you and the kids.

 

Don't even bother to waste your time reading what Ani writes to you, they'll inevitiblay always stick together.

 

I learned after my ordeal that I'm better off without them. You may find that to be true for you as well.

[Duddits]

Originally posted by revolead:

I know I haven't treated him the best, but to be fair, we have equally physically abused each other.

For what it's worth:

 

it's his fault, not yours.

[Lee Flier]

Wow. So much bitterness and generalization and jumping to conclusions on so many people's part.

 

Dean, I'm truly sorry you and your family are going through this. You've always seemed to me like a really good guy who really wants his marriage to work, and it sounds like you're doing the best things you can under the circumstances. And yeah, I'm sure your wife's diabetes and other meds are a big part of what prompted her violent mood swings, I've seen it happen with quite a few people.

 

There are a lot of ways to deal with jealousy, some people just avoid the sources of their partner's jealousy, but if the jealousy seems unreasonable and unwarranted, sometimes what works (over time) is just complete openness, saying "I had lunch with so-and-so today" and then getting back to your normal activities. Eventually the partner begins to realize that their partner will always have a certain amount of contact with the opposite sex but it does NOT result in their leaving, or neglecting their family. And it's better to be open about your activities than keep them secret, arousing further suspicion and lack of communication. It sounds like that's what you've been trying to do (be open and try to live life as normally as possible while still being loyal to your wife), and that's cool. It's hard to know how else to handle it, I'm sure.

 

Hang in there... you've definitely got my support whatever that's worth.

[where02190]

So Ani, according to your theory then, we should jsut let them get away with the mild attacks, in hopes that when they brutally attack, no one gets seriously injured? and lets jsut not bother to worry about the emotional and psycological damage that occurs because w woman is a bit unstable, right?

 

You women make me sick, you ahve the law 1005 on your side, we men suffer the consequences time and time again. Bitter, damn right I am, because I am one of the victims like Dean.

 

Peddle your crap elsewhere I say. the guy IS looking out for the best interests of his children, as well as himself. IF you can't be supportive be gone.

[Dan South]

Ani,

 

We go back a long way, and you know that we're cool, right? But I have to suggest that maybe you should restrict replies on THIS thread to the subject of Dean's situation. If you want to post long posts about your personal history, maybe it would be more appropriate to do so in your own thread.

 

Dean's experience is not yours, and yours isn't his. I don't think that it helps to draw parallels between them even if some may appear to exist. Dean came to us to express his anguish. Printing pages of detail about our own ups and downs isn't likely to help him.

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by where02190:

You women make me sick, you ahve the law 1005 on your side, we men suffer the consequences time and time again. Bitter, damn right I am, because I am one of the victims like Dean.

I am a woman but I have a problem with this also. I've had male friends who had wives lie and call the police claiming abuse when they had a verbal argument, just out of spite. And of course a guy can't always physically restrain a woman from harming him without her getting hurt, in which case the guy is always going to be blamed.

 

On the other hand, the number of women who were abused without any options, before domestic violence laws existed, was astronomical. And there are still PLENTY of men who beat women and children. It sucks that a lot of innocent men now often have to pay the price for the guilty ones, just like it sucks how many innocent women have to suffer abuse. And it's really, really difficult (as it can be with rape cases) for a court to determine who is really at fault. This is one of those awful issues where it's a really bad thing if the law gets involved and it's even worse if they don't get involved. Cuz certainly neither sex has a monopoly on being a jerk - both men and women are capable of making each other's lives hell, especially in relationships.

 

I do agree with your sentiment that Dean seems to be trying to do the best thing possible for his family, whether or not it's the same thing you or I would do (which we don't know cuz we aren't there), and he deserves our compassion.

[felix.]

Sometimes you just have to draw the line. People have to take responsibility for their actions. If my wife did this, I'd do the same thing. As for whether the kids see it? I'd rather that than teaching them that people can do whatever they want with no consequences.

 

There just comes a time when your well-being and the well-being of your family is more important than allowing unacceptable, abusive behavior to continue.

 

Dean, I hope that you and your family emerge from this better and stronger - whether your marriage can be saved or not. Thanks for sharing.

[blackfish]

Originally posted by Ani:

 

During this time period, while I was being such an insensitive bitch (according to most of you), Dean had some very serious decisions to be making in regard to whether or not he would prosecute and press for conviction against the wife. Having an arrest made is merely the beginning of a courts' process against abusers. This is certainly a time where Dean needed a hard slap in the face and NOT someone to put a bandaid on a boo boo.

 

Isn't this what started the conversation, dean being abused? So then he needs more from you....hmmmm. Great Idea ANI!

[videoeditor1]

Guys,

 

If we can give Dean the benefit of the doubt, surely we can do the same for Ani. I suspect that she'll look back at her postings after a few hours/days, and say... "I went overboard with my criticisms of Dean" and/or..."I was guilty of injecting too much of my personal shit in the thread"...

 

I too was tempted to tell how my momz (5'1", 115lbs)) taking a broken bottle and doing a royal number to my dad (6' 2", 250+ lbs) made me RESOLUTE that

 

a) I would never abuse my woman

b) I would never take no abuse

 

but I didn't, cuz I didn't wanna crowd the thread.

 

Dean, this experience will make you a bigger and better man; it will make your elder son aware of what to do & not to do. Hopefully, all of the lows will stay fresh in your memories. These types of events helped me to steer my life thru calmer waters - without compromising who I am. The same will probably happen to you.

 

Peace.