Let’s talk about Korg and adjusting to markets.

[zeronyne]

I’m sure you’ve already discussed this, but I want to add another voice to the subject.

I have no insider contacts anymore at Korg, but if YOU do, please buy your Korg insiders a beverage. I think there are two possible triggers for what happened with the Nautilus, but it almost doesn’t matter which:

 

1) Korg’s Nautilus product manager did a competitive/comparative analysis and saw that the use case for the Yamaha MoDx was nearly identical and sought a differentiator to elevate the line.

 

2) Korg anticipates AT being the next feature to be returned to this sweet spot of working musicians who do not need the flagship but want the sounds.

 

Either way, I was a little taken aback (in a good way) when Jordan Rudess appeared in my Facebook feed talking about the addition of aftertouch to the Nautilus line AND as a retrofit!

 

So whether one of the two market triggers above forced their hand or whether they just listened to customers is probably not material, but they should definitely be acknowledged for improving an existing product rather than leaving early adopters in the dust. Well done, Korg,

[Paul Woodward]

Or, my cynical self thinks…introduced a cheaper alternative to the Kronos, but then discontinued that board leaving the Nautilus as the flagship, but lacking flagship features such as aftertouch. Released an updated model to address that and offered existing users an upgrade path (albeit not a cheap one). Meanwhile, value of OG Nautilus plummets making a sell and upgrade difficult leaving an expensive loss or upgrade path…and perhaps a nasty taste in the mouth.

[zeronyne]

51 minutes ago, Paul Woodward said:

Or, my cynical self thinks…introduced a cheaper alternative to the Kronos, but then discontinued that board leaving the Nautilus as the flagship, but lacking flagship features such as aftertouch. Released an updated model to address that and offered existing users an upgrade path (albeit not a cheap one). Meanwhile, value of OG Nautilus plummets making a sell and upgrade difficult leaving an expensive loss or upgrade path…and perhaps a nasty taste in the mouth.

I guess that will depend on the price of the retrofit.

[Paul Woodward]

49 minutes ago, zeronyne said:

I guess that will depend on the price of the retrofit.

https://www.korg.co.uk/products/nautilus-at-upgrade

 

£429 to £599....i would say that is quite expensive when I have seen the board itself selling second hand for around a grand. 

[zeronyne]

Arrgh, I just realized the retrofit also excludes the 73 key...those must not have sold well. Darn...my plan was to get a used 73 and upgrade. 

 

[zephonic]

To me, a 73AT would be just 3 keys shy of being the perfect instrument for both top-tier and single board duties.

 

No idea why they’ve excluded it from the AT upgrade, maybe parts shortage or something?

[Finale]

Korg has been good adjusting to markets with their numerous inexpensive products since a while, but in the case of the Nautilus they are simply trying to catch up and correct one of their quite bad decisions. Another bad aspect of getting an upgrade is that the owner is left without his/her keyboard until it is completed.

[zeronyne]

50 minutes ago, K K said:

Korg has been good adjusting to markets with their numerous inexpensive products since a while, but in the case of the Nautilus they are simply trying to catch up and correct one of their quite bad decisions. Another bad aspect of getting an upgrade is that the owner is left without his/her keyboard until it is completed.

Ah, another hitch...so definitely not user-installable?

 

[ElmerJFudd]

MIDI 2.0 and MPE are the next sales pitch for hardware.  The synth or controller developer that omits after touch will regret the decision at customers choose someone else’s top modern offering.  

[Radagast]

5 hours ago, zeronyne said:

I’m sure you’ve already discussed this, but I want to add another voice to the subject.

I have no insider contacts anymore at Korg, but if YOU do, please buy your Korg insiders a beverage. I think there are two possible triggers for what happened with the Nautilus, but it almost doesn’t matter which:

 

1) Korg’s Nautilus product manager did a competitive/comparative analysis and saw that the use case for the Yamaha MoDx was nearly identical and sought a differentiator to elevate the line.

 

2) Korg anticipates AT being the next feature to be returned to this sweet spot of working musicians who do not need the flagship but want the sounds.

 

Either way, I was a little taken aback (in a good way) when Jordan Rudess appeared in my Facebook feed talking about the addition of aftertouch to the Nautilus line AND as a retrofit!

 

So whether one of the two market triggers above forced their hand or whether they just listened to customers is probably not material, but they should definitely be acknowledged for improving an existing product rather than leaving early adopters in the dust. Well done, Korg,

I’m not going to say “well done Korg”.  I will say WTF is wrong with you Korg?  The Nautilus needed two upgrades.  It got one.  Im not going to give them my money as a result of a (really) half-assed upgrade.

[CHarrell]

6 minutes ago, Radagast said:

I’m not going to say “well done Korg”.  I will say WTF is wrong with you Korg?  The Nautilus needed two upgrades.  It got one.  Im not going to give them my money as a result of a (really) half-assed upgrade.

 

What's the second? 

 

(To be honest, I think Nautilus was a flawed product from concept).

[Finale]

3 hours ago, zeronyne said:

Ah, another hitch...so definitely not user-installable?

 

I'm sure people with decent experience with mods and electronics stuff could easily do it, but usually the "official" manufacturer way is that the repairs or upgrade must be done by authorized music shops/techs. Just like you can't replace rubber contacts yourself unless you don't mind voiding your warranty. Here, maybe Korg sends to the authorized tech a complete replacement action with AT already under the keys, instead of instructions and the separated components to add.

[Julius D Majestic Studios]

4 hours ago, zephonic said:

To me, a 73AT would be just 3 keys shy of being the perfect instrument for both top-tier and single board duties.

 

No idea why they’ve excluded it from the AT upgrade, maybe parts shortage or something?

3 keys change that much for you as it relates to a keyboard being able to be used for aux AND mains? 

[David Emm]

I once had a budgetary choice to make between a serious flagship or a lesser model + some meaningful software. I went with the 2nd choice and was far better off for it. I can understand pulling at your hair over some changes that miss your boat; been there. We all wrestle with working towards an ideal setup. 

 

The Nautilus seems to get slagged because its not a Kronos, but its also several leaps ahead of the next synth down. If you're playing live and really need AT as a performance tool, so be it. Same with 76 keys. Just give credit where some is due. The means for the upgrade may turn that tide for players who love the base voice. Hell, if I was in this zone, I'd look hard at Korg's new AT-equipped controllers. I couldn't discover whether or not a Nautilus will RESPOND to aftertouch from an external source, but if so, its a possible fix for some folks.

 

Side note: if the magical Kronos 3 appears and knocks our socks off, think of the happy people who will get a Nautilus at an even cheaper price. I can easily see someone being as pleased with that as I was when I bought an 01Wfd and took 3 steps ahead, all at once.     

[Radagast]

6 hours ago, CHarrell said:

 

What's the second? 

 

(To be honest, I think Nautilus was a flawed product from concept).

Nine sliders to control the drawbar organ.

[zephonic]

8 hours ago, Julius D Majestic Studios said:

3 keys change that much for you as it relates to a keyboard being able to be used for aux AND mains? 

Weirdly, yes. A 76 key layout seems so much more useful than a 73.

 

I think this has to with C-C layout of current Korg 73’s. It feels weird. The E-E layout on the Kronos or Nords seem more logical to me somehow.

[AnotherScott]

7 hours ago, zephonic said:

I think this has to with C-C layout of current Korg 73’s. It feels weird. The E-E layout on the Kronos or Nords seem more logical to me somehow.

 

Korg seems to have been using C-C on non-hammer 73s (M50, M3, Nautilus, Krome) , and E-E on hammer action 73s (SV1, SV2, Kronos, Grandstage). Which has made sense for me, since I always want the highest note to be a C if I'm playing organ. Which makes it ironic that an exception to this rule is the Vox Continental 73. (Though it kind of works out because as discussed before, almost paradoxically, I think that board makes for a better piano/EP board than organ board! The action on those other non-hammer 73s are not as good for piano as the Vox action was.)

[stoken6]

2 hours ago, AnotherScott said:

an exception to this rule is the Vox Continental 73[...]that board makes for a better piano/EP board than organ board!

They obviously intended to sell the entire production run to you Scott!

 

Cheers, Mike.

[AnotherScott]

43 minutes ago, stoken6 said:

They obviously intended to sell the entire production run to you Scott!

 

Nah, I only had one. Niacin has (or had) 2 and Fleer 3, at last count. 😉

[ElmerJFudd]

If I were Korg I’d refresh the Vox and start with physical draw bars. 

[stoken6]

3 hours ago, ElmerJFudd said:

If I were Korg I’d refresh the Vox and start with physical draw bars. 

And a full set of percussion and C/V controls. Even Nord have got the drawbar memo by now.

 

Cheers, Mike.

 

 

[ElmerJFudd]

24 minutes ago, stoken6 said:

And a full set of percussion and C/V controls. Even Nord have got the drawbar memo by now.

 

Cheers, Mike.

 

 

Yep. Korg historically has paid attention to what the end users are saying but who knows these days. 

[CEB]

Nautilus looks fine to me.   My main complaints would be the same complaints I have with the Kronos.  These are complaints that apparently none of seem to have.  The pedal I/O is lacking for a truly good performance board and for SetList.

 

A lower const keyboard with the nine engine and setlist.  Large onboard sound set, Korg effects with a great SSD.   AT would be nice but it is $1699 for a 61 .  I would take it over what the what the competition has for that price.  If I need to play an organ gig I'm bringing an organ.  If I bought a Nautilus I would buy an 88 also.  Its the way I like to work.    

 

But thing look okay to me.