Semi-weighted 88 key MIDI controller

[bill5]

But "has a USB connection" does not equate to "has a built-in audio interface." An audio interface is a separate unit entirely with mic pre-amps, etc. 

 

[stoken6]

23 minutes ago, bill5 said:

But "has a USB connection" does not equate to "has a built-in audio interface." An audio interface is a separate unit entirely with mic pre-amps, etc. 

 

Correct. A lot of boards have a USB connection and don't have an audio interface.

 

The Numa has a USB connection and an audio interface. Admittedly, it doesn't have mic preamps, but it does convert digital audio (transmitted via USB) to analog(ue) audio, and plays it back through its speakers and audio out connections.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[AnotherScott]

1 hour ago, bill5 said:

But "has a USB connection" does not equate to "has a built-in audio interface." An audio interface is a separate unit entirely with mic pre-amps, etc. 

Picking up from what Mike said, audio interface does not have to mean mic input. For example Roland, Behringer, and M-Audio make USB interfaces with no mic input. But unlike most keyboards with USB, the Numa can send its audio to a computer over the USB connection, and can also receive audio from the computer over that same connection (and as Mike said, convert it to analog, for playback through its speakers, headphone out, or playback system connected to its main audio outputs). This is similar to how other keyboards that have built-in USB audio interface functionality work (e.g. numerous Yamahas and Dexibells, Kurzweil K2700, Korg Kronos/Nautilus, Roland Fantom), but this feature is still the exception rather than the rule.

[bill5]

On 8/22/2022 at 4:15 PM, AnotherScott said:

Picking up from what Mike said, audio interface does not have to mean mic input. For example Roland, Behringer, and M-Audio make USB interfaces with no mic input.

I'll bite: point me to one...I've yet to see an audio interface with no mic pre's.

 

Quote

But unlike most keyboards with USB, the Numa can send its audio to a computer over the USB connection, and can also receive audio from the computer over that same connection (and as Mike said, convert it to analog, for playback through its speakers, headphone out, or playback system connected to its main audio outputs). This is similar to how other keyboards that have built-in USB audio interface functionality work (e.g. numerous Yamahas and Dexibells, Kurzweil K2700, Korg Kronos/Nautilus, Roland Fantom), but this feature is still the exception rather than the rule.

? Numa has no "audio".... it's all digital/MIDI. More telling is that even the company and its advertisements/listings make no mention of audio interface capability. Sorry not following or seeing this. 

 

[AnotherScott]

11 hours ago, bill5 said:

I'll bite: point me to one...I've yet to see an audio interface with no mic pre's.

I did point you to some... Like I said, Roland, Behringer, and M-Audio. (Mobile UA, UCA222, and Air Hub, respectively.)

 

11 hours ago, bill5 said:

? Numa has no "audio".... it's all digital/MIDI.

The Numa can convert the digital audio out from the computer (via USB) to analog, to play it through its speakers or send it out its line outputs, that's an audio interface function. The Numa also sends its own audio out over USB to the computer (obviating the need to buy an external audio interface to record audio from the keyboard into your DAW, so performing another audio interface function). Korg Kross has the same functions, and you can see how they describe it at  https://www.korg.com/us/products/synthesizers/kross2/, scroll down to the section headlined, "Also operates as a USB audio interface." Assorted other boards have it as well. Though still more exception than rule. Kurzweil only has it in the K2700, none of the Nords have it. But Dexibell has it in most (all?) of their line, while Yamaha, Korg, and Roland have it in some.

[Adam Burgess]

4 hours ago, bill5 said:

I'll bite: point me to one...I've yet to see an audio interface with no mic pre's.

 

https://www.avid.com/products/pro-tools-hd-io

Line ins only - and hardly entry level. First one I thought of.

There are many more without mic-pres. Top of the line Yamaha/Korg/Roland keyboards do have them, sure. I think in these cases, a USB interface-equipped keyboard means that everything going to and from the unit stays digital, without the need to take analog jack cables into line-ins to USB…

[bill5]

Huh. OK thanks. This is a broader definition of "audio interface" than I'm normally used to dealing with - and I don't think this is what is normally thought of when one says "audio interface," but at this point I'm not putting any money down on it  Or maybe I'm being pedantic!

[AnotherScott]

12 hours ago, bill5 said:

Huh. OK thanks. This is a broader definition of "audio interface" than I'm normally used to dealing with - and I don't think this is what is normally thought of when one says "audio interface," but at this point I'm not putting any money down on it  Or maybe I'm being pedantic!

I think it comes down to different things falling into the "audio interface" category. so while standalone interfaces are more likely to include mic inputs because users of standalone devices are more likely to want them, the ones built into keyboards include those functions the player of that keyboard are likely to be after.

 

I believe the first keyboards to have this feature were the Yamaha MO-X and original Korg Kronos, both in 2011. Yamaha describes it thoroughly in the first 1:15 of the first video below, and while the Kronos video below is not in English, it is also notable because, at 1:15, you can literally see that "Kronos" comes up in Cubase as an available attached audio interface. Cubase can directly send audio to and receive audio from the Kronos, and the Kronos identifies itself accordingly. (Most audio interfaces have both "to" and "from" functions, but even if a device can do only one of those things, it still identifies itself as an available audio interface, and will come up in a DAW as a device that you can get audio into and/or out of, afaik.)

 

Another advantage of these internal interfaces (compared to many of the external audio interfaces you might otherwise use to get audio from your keyboard to your DAW) is that they may be multi-channel. Many stand-alone audio interfaces have only 2 analog audio input channels. But the direct audio interface connection in, for example, the Montage, means that you can simultaneously send 6 channels of audio from your keyboard to your DAW (4 channels in the MODX). So that can be another advantage of a built in interface (in addition to running fewer cables and avoiding extra D-to-A and A-to-D conversions).

 

BTW, another variable is whether the keyboard's audio interface function is class compliant. Rolands are not, so the Rolands that have this feature require that you load a custom driver on your computer... meaning the function is not available on iOS devices. Current Yamahas are class compliant for audio over USB, as is the Numa we've been talking about. I'm not sure about the Korgs.

 

This doesn't mean that a keyboard's USB audio interface necessarily can't also have the other functions that you typically associate with audio interfaces, check out this description from the Kurzweil K2700, it routes from the keyboard's analog inputs as well. But as you've seen, that function is not required for it to be called (and seen by your computer as) an audio interface.