Send usb to two MacBooks?

[Piano-Pete]

Hope this is the correct forum for this. I am in the process of moving to all computer generated sounds so I can fly to gigs without having to worry if I can get the backline I use. I am considering purchasing the Radial KL-8 to have a redundant system in case MacBook 'A' goes down I can seamlessly switch to MacBook 'B' with a foot switch. That looks like it will work well for switching outs but how would I switch the usb in from my keyboard controller to MacBook 'B' from MacBook 'A'? Is there there such a thing as a usb splitter? I'd rather not have to use a switcher as it's yet another button to press along with the foot switch, another thing that could go wrong, and would take my hands from the keys. So how can I send midi via usb to two Macs simultaneously from one controller?

[confidence]

I'm pretty sure that's impossible, due to the limitations of USB.

 

Does your controller also have a MIDI DIN output? The only solution I can imagine would be to send that to a MIDI merge/splitter unit or some such with two outputs, and then each of those to a separate MIDI interface attached to each macbook. It adds several steps of gear and cables though.

[ElmerJFudd]

I"d suggest a hardware USB switch, also called a KVM switch.

 

USB is hot swappable, so a switch gives you USB inputs for your devices and the option of throwing a switch to computer A or computer B.

[Reezekeys]

Don't mean to be a noodge but it wasn't that difficult to type "USB switch box" into Google! They exist. Whether they'll work in this context is another story - for example, you probably don't want "hanging" midi information if you have to switch (like with notes held). Here's one on Amazon but it's touted mostly as a way to share a printer or keyboard & mouse with two computers:

 

https://www.amazon.com/Selector-Switcher-Computers-Devices-Keyboard/dp/B08MVXZM9G

 

Nothing to lose here but some time, and maybe the shipping if you have to return it.

[Piano-Pete]

I'm pretty sure that's impossible, due to the limitations of USB.

 

Does your controller also have a MIDI DIN output? The only solution I can imagine would be to send that to a MIDI merge/splitter unit or some such with two outputs, and then each of those to a separate MIDI interface attached to each macbook. It adds several steps of gear and cables though.

 

Yes I was hoping to avoid the extra interface by splitting the midi then converting. Wish I had tons of money and could get a Radial SW8 but $2k is out of the question lol. Thanks for the reply!

 

Don't mean to be a noodge but it wasn't that difficult to type "USB switch box" into Google! They exist. Whether they'll work in this context is another story - for example, you probably don't want "hanging" midi information if you have to switch (like with notes held). Here's one on Amazon but it's touted mostly as a way to share a printer or keyboard & mouse with two computers:

 

https://www.amazon.com/Selector-Switcher-Computers-Devices-Keyboard/dp/B08MVXZM9G

 

Nothing to lose here but some time, and maybe the shipping if you have to return it.

 

Not to be a noodge but did you read the op where I said I was trying to avoid a switcher?

[Reezekeys]

Not to be a noodge but did you read the op where I said I was trying to avoid a switcher?

Sorry Pete, you are correct. I apologize. I missed that. I need more coffee! (I'm not the only one, ahem, Elmer!). Good luck with getting a workable setup.

[Docbop]

Not to be a noodge but did you read the op where I said I was trying to avoid a switcher?

Sorry Pete, you are correct. I apologize. I missed that. I need more coffee! (I'm not the only one, ahem, Elmer!). Good luck with getting a workable setup.

 

 

I'd say he should try a USB Hub very common device and if they work like a network hub there would be no need to switch since everything on the hub is seeing everything connected.

[Piano-Pete]

Not to be a noodge but did you read the op where I said I was trying to avoid a switcher?

Sorry Pete, you are correct. I apologize. I missed that. I need more coffee! (I'm not the only one, ahem, Elmer!). Good luck with getting a workable setup.

 

Thanks we all need more coffee!

[Piano-Pete]

I'd say he should try a USB Hub very common device and if they work like a network hub there would be no need to switch since everything on the hub is seeing everything connected.

 

Thanks but I don't think this will work as a hub only outs to one computer afaik or am I incorrect here?

[Docbop]

I'd say he should try a USB Hub very common device and if they work like a network hub there would be no need to switch since everything on the hub is seeing everything connected.

 

Thanks but I don't think this will work as a hub only outs to one computer afaik or am I incorrect here?

 

Check this out..... USB Splitter vs USB hub

 

 

USB Splitter vs HUB

[Piano-Pete]

 

Check this out..... USB Splitter vs USB hub

 

 

USB Splitter vs HUB

 

Thanks! I'm pretty sure neither one can send midi to two computers simultaneously. The article linked seems to contradict itself. 'USB splitter is a device to connect peripheral devices to a computer. It increases the number of available USB slots built into a computer and increases options (adds functioning printers, scanners, cameras and other devices) for users.'

 

then later it states 'When you need to connect a device to two computers at the same time, the answer goes to USB splitter'. Are they implying that the splitter can work in both directions? Plus midi is a different animal than a printer. From what I've learned recently midi via usb cannot be split.

 

EDIT: This looks like it's translated from another language which probably adds to the confusion.

 

Edit 2: The splitter is mis-named. Should be called a USB merge.

[Mike Warren]

I think what you want is so specialized I doubt anyone would make one.

 

There. Now someone will post a link the the perfect device just to prove me wrong.

 

More seriously, USB is a bi-directional communications protocol. Both devices need to be intelligent, and having two hosts would cause all sorts of complications. It could be made to work for simple protocols like USB MIDI, but would be extremely hard for other devices like audio interfaces.

 

Have you thought about coming out of your controller with normal MIDI and the using separate interfaces on each computer?

[Groove On]

iConnectivity has some pricey devices for connecting 2x or more computers.

 

1. The PlayAUDIO12 allows you to connect 2x computers via USB for redundancy. It acts as both an audio and MIDI interface.

https://www.iconnectivity.com/playaudio12

 

2. The MioXM is a MIDI interface that allows you to connect 2x or more computer via Ethernet (aka RTP-MIDI or Bonjour on the Mac). You will need an ethernet hub for 2 or more computers.

https://www.iconnectivity.com/mioxm

[analogika]

We use the iConnectivity stuff for redundant machines onstage. It's wired so that a single USB controller will start playback on both machines.

[EscapeRocks]

Just to throw my hat into the discussion:

 

While it's a bit older, search for David Rosenthal's rig rundown on YouTube He's the keyboardists for Billy Joel. He discusses how he has redundant Mainstage set up.

I know you said no switches but take a look anyway. It's quite a robust and stable setup.

 

I will also concur with those who mention the iConnectivty boxes. Good stuff there as well

[Piano-Pete]

iConnectivity has some pricey devices for connecting 2x or more computers.

 

1. The PlayAUDIO12 allows you to connect 2x computers via USB for redundancy. It acts as both an audio and MIDI interface.

https://www.iconnectivity.com/playaudio12

 

2. The MioXM is a MIDI interface that allows you to connect 2x or more computer via Ethernet (aka RTP-MIDI or Bonjour on the Mac). You will need an ethernet hub for 2 or more computers.

https://www.iconnectivity.com/mioxm

We use the iConnectivity stuff for redundant machines onstage. It's wired so that a single USB controller will start playback on both machines.

 

I've seen the iConnectivity stuff and lots of bad reviews of them not working properly. What has your experience with them been like?

 

 

 

Just to throw my hat into the discussion:

 

While it's a bit older, search for David Rosenthal's rig rundown on YouTube He's the keyboardists for Billy Joel. He discusses how he has redundant Mainstage set up.

I know you said no switches but take a look anyway. It's quite a robust and stale setup.

 

I will also concur with those who mention the iConnectivty boxes. Good stuff there as well

 

David Rosenthal uses two Radial SW8 switchers at $2000 each. Way out of my league.

[EscapeRocks]

 

I've seen the iConnectivity stuff and lots of bad reviews of them not working properly. What has your experience with them been like?

 

 

If I may jump in here. I used an iConnectivity Audio 4+ for a couple years in one of my rigs. While it takes a minute to wrap your head around their conventions, once setup it was rock solid. I never had any issues with it.

[analogika]

 

I've seen the iConnectivity stuff and lots of bad reviews of them not working properly. What has your experience with them been like?

 

 

If I may jump in here. I used an iConnectivity Audio 4+ for a couple years in one of my rigs. While it takes a minute to wrap your head around their conventions, once setup it was rock solid. I never had any issues with it.

I inherited the playback setup when I took over a current gig. Apart from one gig where electrical issues were plaguing gear in weird ways everywhere on stage, it"s been pretty much rock-solid.

 

Especially the automatic failover has been solid. Our tech actually built a little box with a red LED that lights up when failover is activated, and a little pushbutton to switch back to primary hardware.

[confidence]

iConnectivity has some pricey devices for connecting 2x or more computers.

 

1. The PlayAUDIO12 allows you to connect 2x computers via USB for redundancy. It acts as both an audio and MIDI interface.

https://www.iconnectivity.com/playaudio12

 

I just read that entire page and I still don't understand what the box actually is, what it does, where it sits in the setup chain or how it interacts with everything else.

 

Is that bad advertising or am I just dim? You don't have to answer that question.

[EscapeRocks]

iConnectivity has some pricey devices for connecting 2x or more computers.

 

1. The PlayAUDIO12 allows you to connect 2x computers via USB for redundancy. It acts as both an audio and MIDI interface.

https://www.iconnectivity.com/playaudio12

 

I just read that entire page and I still don't understand what the box actually is, what it does, where it sits in the setup chain or how it interacts with everything else.

 

Is that bad advertising or am I just dim? You don't have to answer that question.

 

It's not bad advertising, nor are you dim. The iConnectivity stuff is pretty much aimed at those of us who have a long history with MIDI, DAW/Live (Mainstage, etc) and other related stuff.

If I read that page 10 years ago before I jumped into all this stuff I'd be very lost as well.

 

Think of the stuff like this: A USB/MIDI Hub on steroids. A bit like a router you use for your internet and devices. I.e., your computers, printers, smart phones, etc. all connect to it so they can all talk to each other.

 

Knowing what you need to have talking to each other and your specific needs then determines which of their product lines you enter.

 

When I start re-configuring my rig, I tend to draw a flow chart of all my interconnected gear so I can visualize what I want to do.

 

Even then, I still have to read, read, and read some more the various product specs to make sure it's what I need....

[Piano-Pete]

iConnectivity has some pricey devices for connecting 2x or more computers.

 

1. The PlayAUDIO12 allows you to connect 2x computers via USB for redundancy. It acts as both an audio and MIDI interface.

https://www.iconnectivity.com/playaudio12

 

I just read that entire page and I still don't understand what the box actually is, what it does, where it sits in the setup chain or how it interacts with everything else.

 

Is that bad advertising or am I just dim? You don't have to answer that question.

 

No it's not you. I had to research it a bit too. It's like a super usb and midi hub with ethernet too!. As I understand it anything plugged in can be routed to anything else plugged in, in any/all directions (except the power supply lol). Looks like a pretty powerful routing solution.

[Piano-Pete]

 

If I may jump in here. I used an iConnectivity Audio 4+ for a couple years in one of my rigs. While it takes a minute to wrap your head around their conventions, once setup it was rock solid. I never had any issues with it.

Good to know thanks!

 

I inherited the playback setup when I took over a current gig. Apart from one gig where electrical issues were plaguing gear in weird ways everywhere on stage, it"s been pretty much rock-solid.

 

Especially the automatic failover has been solid. Our tech actually built a little box with a red LED that lights up when failover is activated, and a little pushbutton to switch back to primary hardware.

 

Thanks! I've played gigs with funky power. They're not fun!

 

Maybe the negative reviews are from people who can't rtfm and route/set up properly?

[Piano-Pete]

Thanks again to all of you. Great forum.

[Dr Mike Metlay]

Thanks again to all of you. Great forum.

Welcome to the circus! Let us know what you end up doing.

 

The iConnectivity stuff has a pretty steep learning curve, but once you get it set up the way you want it, it's amazing. I would have suggested it if nobody else did.

 

The key to it all is that each computer is fooled into thinking the other computer is a USB peripheral. Clever, scary stuff, but it works.

[Groove On]

So the techie part of my brain started thinking, maybe you could build a budget version of an iConnectivity device, with a Raspberry Pi setup as a MIDI Host. It won't be as clean/neat a setup as the iConnectivity devices, but you can buy 10+ Raspberry Pis for the cost of 1 iConnectivity device.

 

SETUP:

- all USB controllers/keyboards plug into the Raspberry Pi MIDI Host

- computers connect via ethernet, plus an ethernet hub for more than 1 computer

* for MIDI DIN keyboards there are 3rd party add-ons or you could build your own DIN ports

* you might have to run the audio from the computers into a mixer as a failover/backup

- not sure if a single audio interface connected to the Raspberry Pi could be used by both computers ... or perhaps a 2nd Raspberry Pi could handling the audio interface for both computers?

 

CONFIG:

- to make the Pi into a MIDI host, use the built-in 'amidi' and 'aconnect' commands to list MIDI devices and route MIDI signals

- to enable MIDI over ethernet (RTP-MIDI / Bonjour), use the ravelox software (config instructions for MacOS) | (github)