Sam CA Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 A friend asked me about this. I'm a little confused as what exactly the difference between Kawai CA99 and MP11 is. They both seem to have the Grand Feel Wooden action. Do they have the exact same action? Quote www.youtube.com/c/InTheMixReviews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElmerJFudd Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Ooo thanks. I hadn"t noticed the jump to CA99... or the new DG30. Anyway, no, it"s not identical. The CA99 has a new GFIII. They need to update what was altered, but I suspect they are very similar. Maybe KawaiJames can clarify. Here are Kawai"s actions and what they are used in. https://kawaius.com/technology/wooden-key-actions/ The page needs an update for new models, but you get the idea. Quote Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam CA Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 Ooo thanks. I hadn"t noticed the jump to CA99... or the new DG30. Anyway, no, it"s not identical. The CA99 has a new GFIII. ... Thanks a lot. I thought that III meant triple sensor, so I assumed both GF with triple sensor and GF III mean the same thing. Ok, so GF III suppose to be the latest greatest action from Kawai then? Quote www.youtube.com/c/InTheMixReviews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElmerJFudd Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 It"s the best action they make in that price range. The CA99 and MP11 would feel similar, however there is also something to be said about the feel in a console like the CA99 vs a more portable design like the MP11 which would need a good quality 4 legged table stand to dig into the instrument in the same fashion. The GFII always has a triple sensor - I"m not sure what changes have been made to the III. The best digital action they make is called the Millennial - and it"s in the Novus NV5 and NV10 Instruments. They are significantly more expensive because it"s actually an acoustic piano action design. You can compare these to Yamaha's N3X, N1X, NU1X, N2. Quote Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kawai James Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 A friend asked me about this. I'm a little confused as what exactly the difference between Kawai CA99 and MP11 is. They both seem to have the Grand Feel Wooden action. Do they have the exact same action? The MP11 uses the Grand Feel (I) action, while the CA99 (and CA79) use the Grand Feel III action. There are many similarities between the two keyboard actions, however here are the core features of Grand Feel (I): - Long, fully wooden key sticks used for both black and white keys - Acoustic piano-like "see-saw" movement - Action mechanism behind and above the keys - Staggered balance pins for black and white keys - Ivory Touch white key surfaces - Triple sensor hammer detection - Let-off simulation - Counterweights beneath the keys Grand Feel II (CA97/CA67, CA98/CA78) added some changes/improvements: - Ebony Touch black key surfaces - Graded counterweights across the length of the keyboard - Improved hammer weighting Grand Feel III (CA99/CA79) added some further changes/improvements - Capstan screw+sliptape system replaced by actuator cap - Revised hammer cushion for improved key-stop feel (less "spongy") - Improved let-off consistency So yes, GFIII is Kawai's current flagship digital piano keyboard action. However, as Elmer notes, the next step up are the Millennium III Hybrid upright and grand actions, as found in the NV5 and NV10 respectively. I hope this helps. Kind regards, James x Quote Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own. Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kawai James Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 Here are reference images for the Grand Feel I, II, and III actions. Cheers, James x Quote Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own. Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElmerJFudd Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 Thanks, James. Always so impressed with Kawai"s commitment to getting digital instruments to play as close to what piano players expect as possible. I"ve yet to sit down at a Novus, but it just looks so incredible I can"t wait to try one out in the shop. As usual, if you hear anything about an effort at Kawai to get a GF-like action into a slab we can carry like a CP88, let us know first!!!! Also an SV-2 with GF action. Quote Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kawai James Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 Hello Elmer, I"ve yet to sit down at a Novus, but it just looks so incredible I can"t wait to try one out in the shop. The Novus models (Novi?) are proving very popular with our customers. The NV5 is also receiving glowing reviews - check out the excellent video from Merriam Music on YouTube, for example. As usual, if you hear anything about an effort at Kawai to get a GF-like action into a slab we can carry like a CP88, let us know first!!!! Also an SV-2 with GF action. The laws of physics may preclude a GF action from being used in a sub-30kg slab, and the chances of this action being used in a Korg instrument are probably even more remote. However, I'll obviously keep you informed if I hear anything. Cheers, James x Quote Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own. Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElmerJFudd Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 Oh, my bad. I meant a VPC-2 not the SV-2. Quote Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kawai James Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 Ah, well that's a different proposition entirely. Cheers, James x Quote Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own. Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marzzz Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Ah, well that's a different proposition entirely. Cheers, James x Slight thread revival here. Last actual NAMM (2020) I had a chance to directly compare the VPC-1 to the MP11SE, and could really tell the difference. Let me join Elmer Fudd to humbly request a VPC-2 with a Grand Feel keyboard action (II, III...), please! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurt W Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Grand Feel III (CA99/CA79) added some further changes/improvements - Capstan screw+sliptape system replaced by actuator cap The sliptape system could case great problems since the top teflon layer of the tape started to slip (sic!) exposing glue to the capstan. The result was hanging keys which made the key almost stucked. I bought my MP11 in 2014 and started to experience this problems only a month ago. Solution is to remove the old sliptape, clean the capstan from glue and add a new sliptape. That said I love the sound and keyboard action of my MP11. Actually consider to buy the more portable MP7-SE in addition for rehearsels etc. The controller functions, keyboard action, piano sounds are top notch. Prices are also really competitive. Much prefer the MP to both the Yamaha CP5 and CP4 which have been in my stable at some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skipeb3 Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 I haven't played an MP11, but I do have an MP7SE, and I agree with Kurt...the action and pianos are top notch. And while we're at it, I also agree with Marzzz... Kawai could do with some new stuff...Let's see a new VPC with new action/pitch bend & mod wheels & a volume pedal input. And since we're at it... software? A virtual piano app? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruust Posted November 16, 2021 Share Posted November 16, 2021 Does the MP11SE still have the sliptape issue? I'm not too happy with the bulkiness of a CA-79, so I wonder if GF1 is a noticeable downgrade to GF3? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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