The Difference Between a Custom Built And Stock Bass

[plangentmusic]

I hear differing opinions of this all the time. Well, time for a reality check.

 

Myth#1: Stocks basses are made by machines and custom are made by hand.

 

100% false.

 

All basses, whether it's a Squier or a Fodera are put together by hand. And ALL parts, be it Squier or Fodera are cut by machines.

 

The differences?

 

#1: Custom built have more attention to detail so they're more consistent. Then again, I'm not looking to buy the entire line. I just need one of them.

 

#2: Customer service. Personally, I think this is a con. How much servicing do you really need? And in my experience, some of those boutique joints charge a pretty penny to do repairs.

 

#3: Better wood.

 

This is deceptive. Exotic woods don't necessarily sound better. As to how well a neck stays straight is uncertain. An Ibanez can stay pin straight for life and a Warwick can warp.

 

#4: Better finishes.

 

This too is a judgment call. ALL finishes are veneers. Personally, I don't care how they've been treated to give them their tint, as long as it looks good.

 

#5: Better electronics.

 

Another myth. Sure, some pu's have a higher output and more tonal range, but again, that isn't necessarily better. A P bass has a very limited tonal range but it sounds great in THAT range. And sometimes basses with a limited range record the best. Not to mention, I've seen $5000 Custom Shop Jazz basses with $90 Seymour Duncans.

 

#5: More output: Hey, you can get a $199 Jaguar that has a wide tonal range and is hot as hell. It ain't all that pretty sounding, but then we get into something subjective. And in a straight up comparison it's unlikely most people can tell the difference between that and a Michael Pope preamp. And I don't mean the audience, I mean the player.

 

 

#6: One of the main reasons a bass from a small company cost more is that they have more overhead and fewer employees making the product. But I don;t want to pay for someone's carpentry hobby.

 

 

 

Also, once a custom bass is built, you're stuck with it. And selling it usually results in a loss, since it's a specific thing.

 

 

Now some basses are unique. For example, nothing sounds like a Rickenbacker and you're not going to get that unless you pay for it. But Ricks at one time were cheap stock basses. I got mine in 1994 when no one wanted them and payed $250 for it. Now they;re coveted so they're expensive. But they don't cost that much to build.

 

Bottom line, if you love what a custom built or boutique bass does, or what it looks like or how it plays, then it's worth every cent. But at the end of the day, a $6000 bass is not that that different than a $1200 bass. And in some cases, they may not work as well as a $500 bass.

 

They ARE NOT like cars, where a BMW is obviously superior to a Hundai. They're more like wrist watches where a $5000 one isn't any better than a $500 one other that it's a more expensive piece of jewelry.

 

But again, if that's the one you want, who's to say you shouldn't have it and enjoy it? But the facts are the facts.

[J. Dan]

The reason to get a custom is just to get it specifically to match what you want - usually it's more about asthetics than anything, IMO.

 

I'll add another twist regarding mass produced. A friend of mine used to work for St. Louis Music, which manufactures Alverez (as well as Crate and some other brands). He said 90% of all the manufacturers got their guitars from the same few Chinese manufacturers. The difference between them and some of the cheaper ones was that when they arrived, they would take time to rework them where needed and set them up properly.

 

My Sax is a cannonball, and from what I understand, they do the same thing. It's manufactured in china, but then they rework it to get good tone and tuning. The result is an $1800 sax that plays and sounds like a $3500 one,

[plangentmusic]

The reason to get a custom is just to get it specifically to match what you want - usually it's more about asthetics than anything, IMO.

 

I'll add another twist regarding mass produced. A friend of mine used to work for St. Louis Music, which manufactures Alverez (as well as Crate and some other brands). He said 90% of all the manufacturers got their guitars from the same few Chinese manufacturers. The difference between them and some of the cheaper ones was that when they arrived, they would take time to rework them where needed and set them up properly.

 

My Sax is a cannonball, and from what I understand, they do the same thing. It's manufactured in china, but then they rework it to get good tone and tuning. The result is an $1800 sax that plays and sounds like a $3500 one,

 

Good point. Take the time to pick out a good one, set it up right, and that's 99% of the end result. Waiting 6 months for a builder to get in some exotic wood isn;t going to make a big difference. And it ain't going to make you play better or get you more gigs.

[jeremy c]

I hear differing opinions of this all the time. Well, time for a reality check.

Myth#1: Stocks basses are made by machines and custom are made by hand.

100% false.

All basses, whether it's a Squier or a Fodera are put together by hand. And ALL parts, be it Squier or Fodera are cut by machines.

I know that my Wendler bass was carved by hand. Dave Wendler made the neck to my exact specifications and the body is his own unique design. He runs a one-person operation and it's pretty doubtful that he has a CNC machine in his garage.

The differences?

#1: Custom built have more attention to detail so they're more consistent. Then again, I'm not looking to buy the entire line. I just need one of them.

And with a custom-made bass you get the details right the first time. If you want a Fender, you have to try out a lot of them to find the one that has the proper sound and feel.

#2: Customer service. Personally, I think this is a con. How much servicing do you really need? And in my experience, some of those boutique joints charge a pretty penny to do repairs.

Well, if I have a problem with my Mike Lull bass, I can walk into his shop with my bass and get it back in two days. I can also call him up and ask a question.

#3: Better wood.

This is deceptive. Exotic woods don't necessarily sound better. As to how well a neck stays straight is uncertain. An Ibanez can stay pin straight for life and a Warwick can warp.

Ahh...but there is the body wood. My Lull is alder and Mike and I went to his storeroom and talked about what I wanted. Then he picked out a piece of wood and tapped on it, saying, "this is the one I will use." The wood in his storeroom had already been carefully picked out, rather than just ordering 20,000 board feet and having it delivered to a giant factory.

#4: Better finishes.

This too is a judgment call. ALL finishes are veneers. Personally, I don't care how they've been treated to give them their tint, as long as it looks good.

There's no veneer on my basses. I'm not sure what instruments are being talked about. Most instruments seem to have a polyester finish or in the case of my vintage Fender and some boutique instruments, nitrocellulose lacquer. In the 70's, the major companies were putting way too much polyester finish on their instruments. hmm..don't Warwick instruments have oil finishes?

#5: Better electronics.

Another myth. Sure, some pu's have a higher output and more tonal range, but again, that isn't necessarily better. A P bass has a very limited tonal range but it sounds great in THAT range. And sometimes basses with a limited range record the best. Not to mention, I've seen $5000 Custom Shop Jazz basses with $90 Seymour Duncans.

My Mike Lull bass has Lindy Fralin pickups which were not ordered off the shelf...there is something unique about them.

It also has a Bartolini preamp, like many other boutique basses on the market and some name brands. I'm not sure about what model the name brands use, but I know exactly which one is in my Lull bass.

#5: More output: Hey, you can get a $199 Jaguar that has a wide tonal range and is hot as hell. It ain't all that pretty sounding, but then we get into something subjective. And in a straight up comparison it's unlikely most people can tell the difference between that and a Michael Pope preamp. And I don't mean the audience, I mean the player.

I have never wanted more output out of a bass or pickup, so this issue doesn't mean anything to me.

#6: One of the main reasons a bass from a small company cost more is that they have more overhead and fewer employees making the product. But I don;t want to pay for someone's carpentry hobby.

It's not a hobby for the builders that I talk to.

Also, once a custom bass is built, you're stuck with it. And selling it usually results in a loss, since it's a specific thing.

That depends on the builder and whether you had your own unusual requirements.

Now some basses are unique. For example, nothing sounds like a Rickenbacker and you're not going to get that unless you pay for it. But Ricks at one time were cheap stock basses. I got mine in 1994 when no one wanted them and payed $250 for it. Now they;re coveted so they're expensive. But they don't cost that much to build.

Old Fenders were like that too. They were cheap off the shelf and then they went down in value. Then there was the cult of pre-CBS and later for anything made in the US and used prices got out of hand.

Bottom line, if you love what a custom built or boutique bass does, or what it looks like or how it plays, then it's worth every cent. But at the end of the day, a $6000 bass is not that that different than a $1200 bass. And in some cases, they may not work as well as a $500 bass.

The $6000 bass usually looks like a fine piece of furniture and maybe has really nice inlay. I agree completely, that doesn't affect the sound. I will never own an instrument with a AAAAA flame maple top. My PRS bass is navy blue.

They ARE NOT like cars, where a BMW is obviously superior to a Hundai. They're more like wrist watches where a $5000 one isn't any better than a $500 one other that it's a more expensive piece of jewelry.

Any Sadowsky bass is a better instrument than pretty much any $500 bass, unless you get really lucky with the one you find.

But again, if that's the one you want, who's to say you shouldn't have it and enjoy it? But the facts are the facts.

Of course.

[hippie wood]

Player hating isn't very becoming.

[Cthulhu Fhtagn]

That was weird.

[Cthulhu Fhtagn]

There were TWO "#5"s?

[_Sweet Willie_]

plangentmusic:

 

Maybe you should define your terms. By custom built do you mean made to specs worked out with an individual customer or do you mean expensive? By stock bass do you mean mass produced?

 

For example, while Warwick has a custom shop (like Fender), I don't think of Warwick as "custom." Then Warwick has their lower priced "Rockbass" line, similar to Fender having Mexican built lines and Squier, etc.

 

However, I'm not really trying to head down a path upon which I will be accused of just messing around with semantics. What's your point, really? That there are good quality mass produced instruments out there that can do the job we need them to do as musicians? That folks who spend money on custom instruments are wasting their money on myth-fueled "mystique"? Are you providing a public service announcement, trying to warn a set of players that are considering custom instruments that they're likely heading down a useful, money-wasting path?

 

Aren't you ignoring some of the unique features of some of the most expensive customs -- for example, the proprietary on-board preamps of Wal, Alembic, and Fodera which seem to offer a mix of sonic flexibility as well as some signature tones, or the proprietary pickups of Wal and Alembic?

 

Mike Tobias isn't the only one to use asymmetrical necks, but damn his necks play frighteningly well. Mike Lull isn't the only one to "plek" his necks/frets. Sheldon Dingwall isn't the only one who does fanned frets...etc. However, these things are examples of ways in which custom basses do seek to improve upon mass built instruments, and seem to succeed.

 

And, let's call a spade a spade here. You wrote:

 

But again, if that's the one you want, who's to say you shouldn't have it and enjoy it? But the facts are the facts.

 

Isn't that just condescension? It certainly doesn't read as sincere. "But the facts are the facts" destroys any suggestion from "who's to say you shouldn't have it and enjoy it?" that you actually aren't passing judgment.

 

I play mass produced and custom instruments. I enjoy them all.

 

Peace.

--SW

 

[alexclaber]

I got a custom bass because no-one made the bass I wanted! Even now does anyone make a wenge/ash thru-neck chambered body 36" scale 5-string bass with passive electronics, Q-tuner pickups, stainless steel frets?

 

#3: Better wood.

 

This is deceptive. Exotic woods don't necessarily sound better. As to how well a neck stays straight is uncertain. An Ibanez can stay pin straight for life and a Warwick can warp.

 

Better wood doesn't have to be a fancy species - in the case of Sadowsky it's the same trees but they're very good at picking the right pieces of timber for the right function, be it neck, fingerboard, body or furnace. Or you could play lots and lots of cheaper basses until you get lucky.

 

#6: One of the main reasons a bass from a small company cost more is that they have more overhead and fewer employees making the product. But I don;t want to pay for someone's carpentry hobby.

 

My custom bass cost less than any production bass I could find with even vaguely similar specs... But some cost more, like Sadowsky's because they have to pay for SW's annual birthday present bass.

[butcherNburn]

It also is helpful to define what you mean by custom. I would think a truly custom bass involves you having several in person meetings with the builder initially, then a couple at the end for fine adjustments and almost nothing off the shelf. Were the pickups hand wound just for you, perhaps not going that far but people have that done and put them stock instruments. To some, custom may mean no more than a paint job or even a sticker and don't tell a guy that spent hour upon hour assembling his Frankenbass that it isn't custom. I picked a whole lot of options on my Carvin and it took some time to be made for me but I don't know if I'd call it custom.

[plangentmusic]

Player hating isn't very becoming.

 

No one mentioned hating anything until you did.

[plangentmusic]

plangentmusic:

 

Maybe you should define your terms. By custom built do you mean made to specs worked out with an individual customer or do you mean expensive? By stock bass do you mean mass produced?

 

For example, while Warwick has a custom shop (like Fender), I don't think of Warwick as "custom." Then Warwick has their lower priced "Rockbass" line, similar to Fender having Mexican built lines and Squier, etc.

 

.......................................

 

Yeah, I see what you mean, there's a difference, but my analogy is the same. Boutique/custom made, in either case, it's a lot more money for something suppossedly hand crafted when in reality they are made pretty much the same way as mass produced instruments. Materials differ, but again, sometimes not that much, and sometimes the difference doesn't add up to a big improvement.

 

 

.......................................

 

However, I'm not really trying to head down a path upon which I will be accused of just messing around with semantics. What's your point, really? That there are good quality mass produced instruments out there that can do the job we need them to do as musicians? That folks who spend money on custom instruments are wasting their money on myth-fueled "mystique"? Are you providing a public service announcement, trying to warn a set of players that are considering custom instruments that they're likely heading down a useful, money-wasting path?

 

.............................

 

Just making a point bro. You can disagree. I never said that anyone was wasting their money. Maybe to others the info will provide a little insight.

 

 

..............................

Aren't you ignoring some of the unique features of some of the most expensive customs -- for example, the proprietary on-board preamps of Wal, Alembic, and Fodera which seem to offer a mix of sonic flexibility as well as some signature tones, or the proprietary pickups of Wal and Alembic?

 

...................................

 

I'm fully aware of the differences. I've played all of those basses. I owned a Fodera. I'm just not that impressed. The Fodera never really cut through the band . The Alembic had a unique sound but it was the same sound all the time and wasn't very adaptable to studio recording. That's not to say they were bad, they just weren't necessarily "better" than a stock bass for those purposes.

 

................................

 

Mike Tobias isn't the only one to use asymmetrical necks, but damn his necks play frighteningly well. Mike Lull isn't the only one to "plek" his necks/frets. Sheldon Dingwall isn't the only one who does fanned frets...etc. However, these things are examples of ways in which custom basses do seek to improve upon mass built instruments, and seem to succeed.

 

............................

If it works for you, go for it!

 

 

..........................................

And, let's call a spade a spade here. You wrote:

 

But again, if that's the one you want, who's to say you shouldn't have it and enjoy it? But the facts are the facts.

 

Isn't that just condescension? It certainly doesn't read as sincere.

 

................................

 

Sorry you feel that way. But I think you're reading into it wrong. I meant what I said.

 

 

.................................

"But the facts are the facts" destroys any suggestion from "who's to say you shouldn't have it and enjoy it?" that you actually aren't passing judgment.

 

.............................

 

The FACT is that all guitars are hand made to a degree all that in all cases, some parts are machine made. That's not a judgement.

 

 

.....................................

 

...............................

I play mass produced and custom instruments. I enjoy them all.

 

............................

 

Cool. That's the idea.

 

Peace.

--SW

 

 

Scroll down above to read responses.

...........................

 

 

[Michele C.]

Myth#1: Stocks basses are made by machines and custom are made by hand.

 

My own bass, is made by an artisan in a one man shop. As Jeremy said, I am not sure he has CNC equipment.

 

#1: Custom built have more attention to detail so they're more consistent. Then again, I'm not looking to buy the entire line. I just need one of them.

 

My bass always catches attention. It is finished with resin and alcohol, and anybody perceives the value of a well finished piece of artisan work.

 

#2: Customer service. Personally, I think this is a con. How much servicing do you really need?

 

Well, I have the mobile phone number of my maker and I called it when I had to and also to say hello from time to time.

 

#3: Better wood.

 

Solid mahogany neck (without a fretboard in some other wood) and solid mahogany body, in two pieces. Weight in the Les Paul range, but good Jazz Basses are not any lighter.

 

#4: Better finishes.

Already talked about this one.

 

#5: Better electronics.

 

Well, in this case we have only pots, a resistor and a capacitor. Pretty good capacitor, anyway. Pickups are assembled and wound by the man. He told me he dedicated eight months to find the right number of turns. He also said he was inspired by Lindy Fralin pickups. Don't know how they compare, but I do like how my bass sounds and how much variation I have in the tonal palette. Good passive sound with two pickups and basically three sounds.

I do not know what would change with different pickups, but I like the fact that anything that goes in them was carefully evaluated.

 

http://www.didatticadelbassoelettrico.it/bass_report/img/Linley_Marthe.jpg

 

I was not planning to buy that instrument. I saw it on display at a concert, I tried it, I heard it played by Linley Marthe and loved it immediately. It has a very narrow neck, but the thickness is the same from the joint with the body to the headstock and its shape goes pretty much V in the low frets, which makes it comfortable.

At the end of the day I had an offer I could afford (800 euros). He said he did not want to go home with the bass and I bought it. I know my bridge has been machined by the same man who wound the pickups, cut and sanded the body and finished the whole thing, and this gives me the feeling that every detail has been evaluated by expert ears, its not only my judgement. And in the end, I like the sound and the way if wears on.

[Paul K]

I got a custom bass because no-one made the bass I wanted! Even now does anyone make a wenge/ash thru-neck chambered body 36" scale 5-string bass with passive electronics, Q-tuner pickups, stainless steel frets?

 

 

I know!!! You're such a freak!

 

Even still, good to hear from you again, Alex!

[Russkull]

At BPL, Igor Saavedra was talking about his ERB (8-string). Someone asked him if it was a custom order. He said yes - the guy only made one, and if he ever made another Igor would have to kill him.

 

http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/6211_114409432757_70509452757_2266597_6806974_n.jpg

 

Plagentmusic seems concerned about buyers being mislead by certain companies already mentioned who have custom shops, vs. a true one-of-a-kind instrument. (?)

 

The adjective "custom" does cast a wide net. My personal opinion is that it's all in the eye of the buyer/owner. If I put $99 pickups in my bass because I love the way they sound, have I not changed it to my exact specifications? Isn't that same in a way as if I commission a builder to create a bass that I designed - the same idea of making my bass unique to me but on a (much) grander scale?

[jeremy c]

 

Someone likes to make blanket statements and then is surprised when questions come up.

 

I'm still wondering about the veneer finishes.

[jeremy c]

The custom built instruments that I wonder about are the ones made by Fender, Gibson, etc. Sometimes there is even a builder's name in the ads, someone I've never heard of.

 

They call them masterbuilt or Fender Custom Shop or Gibson Custom Shop.

 

What's that all about? You're getting a more expensive version of a factory model because more time was spent on it? What exactly is the difference?

 

I know what the difference is between a Fender Jazz bass and a similar model made by Roger Sadowsky, Mike Lull, Carey Nordstrand (just to mention a few), but can't figure out what the Fender Custom Shop is trying to do.

[butcherNburn]

A real good setup with the strings of my choice would be a good option. Of course this would have to be a store pickup and not shipped.

 

It seems like us lowdowners quest for the custom built axes more than the skinny stringers and they rarely change more than the pickups. I wish Les Paul was a bass player, but at least Leo had everyone's backs.

[The Bear Jew]

A real good setup with the strings of my choice would be a good option. Of course this would have to be a store pickup and not shipped.

 

It seems like us lowdowners quest for the custom built axes more than the skinny stringers and they rarely change more than the pickups. I wish Les Paul was a bass player, but at least Leo had everyone's backs.

 

Now you're being, like, totally racist against guitarists.

[jeremy c]

I heard about a Yamaha band contest in which the finals were held with a whole stage full of Yamaha gear.

 

The bassists said, "cool, I don't have to bring anything."

The drummers said, "cool, can I bring my own cymbals?"

The keyboardists said, "cool, can I bring a card with my patches on it?"

The guitarists said, "uh,uh, I have to use my own guitar and amp."

[butcherNburn]

A real good setup with the strings of my choice would be a good option. Of course this would have to be a store pickup and not shipped.

 

It seems like us lowdowners quest for the custom built axes more than the skinny stringers and they rarely change more than the pickups. I wish Les Paul was a bass player, but at least Leo had everyone's backs.

 

 

Now you're being, like, totally racist against guitarists.

 

 

I think it was like, you know, the other way around.

[The Bear Jew]

Like, you know, whatever.

[butcherNburn]

What-EV-errr...

[Davo-London]

I just disagree with everything in the OP thread. My custom and I mean totally custom bass is cheaper than a lot of medium priced stock basses - and in my view is lightyears better to play. I don't understand where some folk get their prejudices from. And why do they want to share it? Keep it to yourself old chap.

 

Strewth

Davo

[plangentmusic]

I just disagree with everything in the OP thread. My custom and I mean totally custom bass is cheaper than a lot of medium priced stock basses - and in my view is lightyears better to play. I don't understand where some folk get their prejudices from. And why do they want to share it? Keep it to yourself old chap.

 

Strewth

Davo

 

You're confused bro. No prejudice. (I don't understand how you're saying a custom built bass is cheaper though). Anyway, my point is that all basses are made by hand and all companies use machines or parts cut from machines. That's all.

[kenfxj]

Well, you know, most hand-built basses use machines too. They're just machines that are held by hand. Except Amish basses. And even they use simple machines. So true hand-made basses don't really exist.

 

I've tried shaping a tree into a bass with my bare hands. It always turned out like crap. :idk

 

I hope this was helpful.

[Cthulhu Fhtagn]

Ok, enough of this thread. We need to join together and

 

OCCUPY MIKE LULL!!!!!

 

Enough of those greedy boutique bass shops. Why, I bet they are even using endangered rain-forest wood for their bodies!!!!

 

(Just for the record, I've been to Mike's shop, have friends who have bought his gear and had it serviced and it is a wonderful place and Mike's a great guy. I AM ONLY KIDDING!)

[Paul K]

OCCUPY MIKE LULL!!!!!

 

E

 

Yes. Damn 1%'ers.

[Cthulhu Fhtagn]

I just disagree with everything in the OP thread. My custom and I mean totally custom bass is cheaper than a lot of medium priced stock basses - and in my view is lightyears better to play. I don't understand where some folk get their prejudices from. And why do they want to share it? Keep it to yourself old chap.

 

Strewth

Davo

 

1 - Two words - Wish Bass

2 - Strewth - Awesome

[plangentmusic]

I just disagree with everything in the OP thread. My custom and I mean totally custom bass is cheaper than a lot of medium priced stock basses - and in my view is lightyears better to play. I don't understand where some folk get their prejudices from. And why do they want to share it? Keep it to yourself old chap.

 

Strewth

Davo

 

1 - Two words - Wish Bass

2 - Strewth - Awesome

 

I just saw those Wish basses for the first time. I'll refrain from an opinion on their looks. Are they any good?