Mike Gug Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 Has anyone else ever experienced more of a mushy sound in a semi-hollow compared to a solid body when over-driven/distorted? I'm getting mushiness from my Duncan-Design HB PUP's Samick Royale 2. I have a chance to get a Jay Turser double cut at a good price. I'm considering just getting Seymour Duncan Phat Cats in there.... just a thought. Any thoughts from you? Mikegug www.facebook.com/theresistancemusic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Geoff Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 I suspect this may have more to do with your pickups/amp settings than the nature of the body construction......... G. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the World will know Peace": Jimi Hendrix http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=738517&content=music The Geoff - blame Caevan!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miroslav Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 Semis tend to have more resonance in their tone...where solids have a "harder" tone. Maybe that's what you are hearing...? miroslav - miroslavmusic.com "Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Gug Posted April 25, 2007 Author Share Posted April 25, 2007 Semis tend to have more resonance in their tone...where solids have a "harder" tone. Maybe that's what you are hearing...? That's what I'm thinking. Re: the settings... I haven't played too much with the settings. Of the three guitars I have, it's the one I play the least (and this may be why). I do, in fact, have my settings set for my Strats. Mikegug www.facebook.com/theresistancemusic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 I have a chance to get a Jay Turser double cut at a good price. I'm considering just getting Seymour Duncan Phat Cats in there.... My other guitarist plays a Turser. He uses Duncan Hot Rails, and they do great! A bunch of loud, obnoxious music I USED to make with friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s mel gibson1642606968 Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 The p'ups you have in there may be too hot for a semi hollow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Geoff Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 The p'ups you have in there may be too hot for a semi hollow. Or you have too much gain for 'buckers on the amp. Try turning the gain back a bit - you can't use the same settings for single coil & humbuckers!! (Well, you can, but................).. G. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the World will know Peace": Jimi Hendrix http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=738517&content=music The Geoff - blame Caevan!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GovernorSilver Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 Semis tend to have more resonance in their tone...where solids have a "harder" tone. Maybe that's what you are hearing...? I'm not sure this is true. The other guitarist in our band plays a Rickenbacker semihollow and Vox AC30. He has an ongoing issue with muddy distorted tone - we often make him replay his part clean so we can hear the chords he's playing as we write and refine our own parts to fit with his. My Reverend Club King HB, which is also semihollow, does not have the mud problem - it goes into a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe. I use only the amp overdrive and a delay or two in the effects loop. The problem I think lies somewhere between his guitar and his amp - ie. his pedals. One or both of his fuzz pedals (Rat and I think Fab Tone) is the culprit, I suspect. I suggested a clean boost pedal at the front of his chain. He's looking into getting an EQ pedal. Perhaps your problem is similar - a mismatch between pedal(s), guitar, and amp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caprae Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 I tried a Samick Royale at the local shop. Loved the feel of the guitar, but would have replaced the neck pickup at least. It was very dark and muddy sounding to me. Raise your children and spoil your grandchildren. Spoil your children and raise your grandchildren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Geoff Posted April 26, 2007 Share Posted April 26, 2007 I've swapped out the 'buckers on my TA-40 for 'bucker-shaped P90s. Much more 'edge'. G. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the World will know Peace": Jimi Hendrix http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=738517&content=music The Geoff - blame Caevan!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Gug Posted April 26, 2007 Author Share Posted April 26, 2007 I tried a Samick Royale at the local shop. Loved the feel of the guitar, but would have replaced the neck pickup at least. It was very dark and muddy sounding to me. For certain, the neck PUP is the first to go, if any. Phat Cats?... anyone?... Great playing axe, huh? BTW, I passed on the Jay Turser. Needed new PUP's and the neck was a tad thick. Beautiful guitar and played well. JT's seem to be a good lot. It seemed like I wouldn't be solving any issues if I was to buy it. I practice tonight and play tomorrow. I'm gonna mess with settings more. Mikegug www.facebook.com/theresistancemusic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Gug Posted April 26, 2007 Author Share Posted April 26, 2007 I've swapped out the 'buckers on my TA-40 for 'bucker-shaped P90s. Much more 'edge'. G. Made by whom? More edge. I like that. Mikegug www.facebook.com/theresistancemusic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miroslav Posted April 26, 2007 Share Posted April 26, 2007 Semis tend to have more resonance in their tone...where solids have a "harder" tone. Maybe that's what you are hearing...? I'm not sure this is true. What...that semi-hollow guitars have a more resonant tone than a solid body...? Well...they sure do, at least the ones I have. Why does an acoustic sound so different than a solid body...because you have all that open area inside that allows the sound waves to really move and make the body resonate a LOT more than you get with a solid body. He has an ongoing issue with muddy distorted tone Perhaps your problem is similar - a mismatch between pedal(s), guitar, and amp. That could be...but I would not ever suggest that semi-hollow guitars by themselves are naturally "muddier/more distorted". Of the 4 that I have...none exhibit those symptoms. They can be as clean as any of my solid body guitarsits a question of dialing in everything the right way. miroslav - miroslavmusic.com "Just because it happened to you, it doesn't mean it's important." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GovernorSilver Posted April 26, 2007 Share Posted April 26, 2007 Semis tend to have more resonance in their tone...where solids have a "harder" tone. Maybe that's what you are hearing...? I'm not sure this is true. What...that semi-hollow guitars have a more resonant tone than a solid body...? That could be...but I would not ever suggest that semi-hollow guitars by themselves are naturally "muddier/more distorted". Of the 4 that I have...none exhibit those symptoms. They can be as clean as any of my solid body guitarsits a question of dialing in everything the right way. No to the first question quoted above. I simply thought you were stating that semi-hollows are muddier and I obviously misunderstood. My bandmate's distortion problems are the main reason I've held off on buying a distortion or fuzz pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Geoff Posted April 27, 2007 Share Posted April 27, 2007 I've swapped out the 'buckers on my TA-40 for 'bucker-shaped P90s. Much more 'edge'. G. Made by whom? More edge. I like that. Well, P90s are single coil, so you'd expect more bite & edge than a 'bucker (usually, but try the DiMarzio 'Humbucker From Hell'). Mine are inexpensive GFS pups (which I think are really rebranded Artec), but they are not far off the mark. If you have the $$$ you could look at Phat Cats (Seymour Duncan, I think). By the way, working on a semi - taking out the pots through either the pickup hole or the F-hole is a real b*gg*r. Good luck. G. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power the World will know Peace": Jimi Hendrix http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=738517&content=music The Geoff - blame Caevan!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GovernorSilver Posted April 30, 2007 Share Posted April 30, 2007 Semis tend to have more resonance in their tone...where solids have a "harder" tone. Maybe that's what you are hearing...? I'm not sure this is true. What...that semi-hollow guitars have a more resonant tone than a solid body...? That could be...but I would not ever suggest that semi-hollow guitars by themselves are naturally "muddier/more distorted". Of the 4 that I have...none exhibit those symptoms. They can be as clean as any of my solid body guitarsits a question of dialing in everything the right way. No to the first question quoted above. I simply thought you were stating that semi-hollows are muddier and I obviously misunderstood. My bandmate's distortion problems are the main reason I've held off on buying a distortion or fuzz pedal. As it turns out, the problem was not with the guitar or the pedals, but with the amp. It WAS a Chinese-made Vox AC-30 Reissue. Lesson learned: Chinese-made Vox AC-30 Reissues just plain suck. This amp broke down at least 3 times. This bandmate managed to sell the "Vox" and replaced it with an 80s Fender Twin. What a dramatic improvement! If I weren't so influenced in my amp thinking by Allan Holdsworth, I'd be scoping out a Twin too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Ellwood Posted April 30, 2007 Share Posted April 30, 2007 I don't know about Holdsworth, but I can sure tell you, you would never be sorry you bought a Twin!! http://www.thestringnetwork.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revolead Posted April 30, 2007 Share Posted April 30, 2007 FWIW - I'm not a big fan of the Duncan Designed stuff. My Jackson came with those in them and I hated them right away. It's an alder solid body and had the same clarity issues that you're describing, especially in the bass range. I replaced them with real SDs and could not be happier. That seems to be the big fall back with less expensive guitars. Often, they play great and are well constructed, but the pickups are usually crap. Shut up and play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggs Posted May 1, 2007 Share Posted May 1, 2007 On the semi-hollow, try adjusting the pickups a bit further away from the strings. Check out my Rock Beach Guitars page showing guitars I have built and repaired... http://www.rockbeachguitars.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GovernorSilver Posted May 1, 2007 Share Posted May 1, 2007 I don't know about Holdsworth, but I can sure tell you, you would never be sorry you bought a Twin!! My bandmate gets 100% of his distortion from his solid-state pedals - it works for him. Allan Holdsworth is a longtime proponent of power tube saturation for leads, solid state for cleans - separate signal paths for lead and clean tones. He invented the Harness device that Rocktron used to market, which takes the output of a tube amp (preferably one with saturated power tubes) and converts it to line-level signal for processing. He was dissatisfied with their changes to his design (mostly resistor values), so he made and sold his own version of the Harness for a while. There is no doubt this is the way to get a Holdsworth or Scott Henderson type of lead guitar sound. Tube amps like my HRD seem to be backassward-designed - there is no way to patch time-based effects like delay BEHIND the power tube section where they belong, not in front of the power tube section. So you basically need a Harness or similar device if you want to post-process the power tube overdrive with EQ, delay, etc. I plan to start experimenting with running a boost pedal and compressor pedal into my HRD's power amp in to get that power tube saturation sound. I'll leave my guitar plugged into the normal amp input and just leave the HRD on clean channel. I already use my Voodoo Lab Amp Switcher to split the signal coming out of the HRD's preamp out, so one path goes back into the Power Amp In of the HRD, and the other goes into delays and such. My "clean amp" is a mixer and an ElectroVoice powered speaker. My bass amp head broke, so I plan to replace it with a solid state power amp and make use of it along with my Epifani bass cab for the other side of the stereo image - we'll just DI the bass into the mixer. And to be somewhat back on topic, Holdsworth is also a proponent of hollow body guitars, but with no holes on the top like typical hollow/semihollow axes, other than for the pickup(s) and controls. One of his Carvin signature models is chambered/semi-hollow and the other is fully hollow (no block of wood in the middle - so you can't put a Strat-style or Floyd Rose trem on it though a Stetsbar or Les Trem should be possible). His custom Delap guitars are also fully hollow - but the trem (Steinberger of course) goes in the very rear of the guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Gug Posted May 1, 2007 Author Share Posted May 1, 2007 FWIW - I'm not a big fan of the Duncan Designed stuff. My Jackson came with those in them and I hated them right away. It's an alder solid body and had the same clarity issues that you're describing, especially in the bass range. I replaced them with real SDs and could not be happier. That seems to be the big fall back with less expensive guitars. Often, they play great and are well constructed, but the pickups are usually crap. What SD's did you put in there? Mikegug www.facebook.com/theresistancemusic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Gug Posted May 1, 2007 Author Share Posted May 1, 2007 On the semi-hollow, try adjusting the pickups a bit further away from the strings. I haven't come across that remedy before. That would possibly have an effect on the mudiness? What are your thoughts on P-90's in there. One player here in Sacto advised that since there is the solid block running through the body, the open cavities of the guitar would have no influence on the sound created by the PUP. I don't have any science behind my answer, but my answer is, I disagree. Mikegug www.facebook.com/theresistancemusic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Gug Posted May 1, 2007 Author Share Posted May 1, 2007 FWIW - I'm not a big fan of the Duncan Designed stuff. My Jackson came with those in them and I hated them right away. It's an alder solid body and had the same clarity issues that you're describing, especially in the bass range. I replaced them with real SDs and could not be happier. That seems to be the big fall back with less expensive guitars. Often, they play great and are well constructed, but the pickups are usually crap. Also, I called back east to Samick to ask what model of DD PUP's were/are in there Royale guitars. He said that they didn't have a model name ever given to them. They were just Duncan Design. Info like that starts the GAS, doesn't it? :grin: Mikegug www.facebook.com/theresistancemusic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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