drummer trouble

[Nicklab]

And I don't think having a Bonham in my band would be a good idea.

"Hey, Bonham, could you play the next song with brushes? It's get a little loud on stage. And by the way, no drinking at rehearsals or on gigs."

 

+1 to Jeremy. I didn't factor in the "drinky-drinky" thing.

 

But onto other things, being in a small town really is very limiting. When I was in college there was a very small pool of musicians to draw from. I wound up with some decent players but nobody really great. But what my bass teacher at the time was doing was remarkable. There were only a handful of musicians in town that were on his level who wanted to play jazz. His solution? Play with musicians in the nearest city. The trouble there was that he was driving 2+ hours just to get there, but for him it was worth it musically.

[Kramer Ferrington III.]

I have occasionally recommended students for bands.

 

Sometimes bands will have the bright idea of calling up a bass teacher and asking if I have anybody who fits their requirements.

 

If anyone in your town teaches drums, you might want to call them for a recommendation.

 

Interesting. I'd sort of given up on that one. Every time I've rung a teacher, I always get the feeling that I've asked something very indiscreet, embarrassed silences on the other end of the phone. I started to think that you needed to be a freemason or something before you could ask.

 

If you recommend students, that's great!

[mcbn]

In my defense, my current band has only been together about 5-6 months. We started with 1 day per week practices and moved it to 2 days a week after about the 2nd month.

 

We have already started playing paid gigs.

[Ross Brown]

Interesting rehearsal last night. In an attempt to keep the body count to a minimum, we agreed to be much more careful in selecting players/drummers. We agreed we would rather wait for the right person (if it is even possible to figure who that is inan audition or two) than take the first "drum owner" that comes along.

 

The two nights a week thing is not supposed to be a way of life, the plan is/was to push over that final hump to get to the place in which we are a good band that draws a crowd, etc. Then back off and fit practices into the spots were we don't have gigs that week, just to stay tight and add songs. Currently we have a full night of music, just need a drummer that can play it. It is regular old classic rock stuff, not obscure music that is too strange for anyone to care about.

 

In the interim, we have decided to continue with the twice a week practices in order to stay sharp, learn new songs and be ready. Hopefully a drummer will drop from the sky that can just sit in and go at it.

 

We are also going to start playing some open mic nights with the hope of finding a drummer. If there is someone there that wants to sit in, perfect. If not we can select from some of our sets list to play without one. Either way, it will get us out and in front of people. Maybe someone will know a drummer.

 

Some of you guys seem to think two practices a week is too much. I bet it is for you. Every situation is different. I/we are not full time musicians, and while we are competent to play good music and share our fun doing it, I bet we would struggle in many of the situations that some of you are quite comfortable in. What I/we are doing is bringing a work ethic to this situation that has proven very successful in other areas of our lives. While the goal is to play out, it is also to play very well.

[yourlord]

I'd love to have band practice 2 or more times a week. Unfortunately wives, kids, and work don't.

 

We have a hard time even getting the 1 time a week in. An example is this past weekend we skipped practice because we hold it at my house and my son had chicken pox.. Not a good thing to give to band mates who have kids and pregnant wives, etc.

[Ross Brown]

Did your son have the vaccination? Just curious.

[Eric VB]

Ross, the 2-a-weeks aren't a bad idea. I think it was a good decision for your band. It seems to be working for you.

 

I think it's a good idea for your band to continue with twice weekly rehearsals since nobody is objecting. Get that song list down as quickly as possible. Just that much moves you up a notch from "startup" to "gig ready".

 

Playing out at open mikes is another good idea for all the reasons you've given.

 

Once you've got all that going, another idea is to try playing unplugged. This may be a way to land gigs sans drums and moves you up to "gigging band" status.

 

Remember to put yourself in the drummers shoes. As he or she is reading the ads, which will be more eye-catching: "forming new band", "gig ready", or "gigging"?

 

Of course by the time you get to the last stage you may not need an ad anymore. All of your networking at open mikes and gigs may land you a drummer first. Someone else said it first; this is just the long-winded, drawn-out version.

[Ross Brown]

 

Yes. This is the plan if a drummer takes a while to find us. Sure does put the heat on me not to stink up the place. Last night we picked out 21 songs from our list that we can either do unplugged now or feel we can, with a little tweaking. For me, I will have to consider these songs with a new mindset. It will be different without the drums. A real challenge. I really like the energy of the whole plugged in (with drums) deal.

 

[Phil W]

While the goal is to play out, it is also to play very well.

 

Well it's cool for you guys if you are learning to play better together. Provided you guys all have the time and it doesn't interfere with any band members' family or other commitments. And provided you all have the same outlook.

 

Most of us just practise to get better on our own and then get together to rehearse when we have to. I hardly ever go to a rehearsal but I practse bass every day. That's a lot easier to fit in with my work and family commitments.

[Nicklab]

There are definitely some working alternatives that you can try in order to keep the band ball rolling. Because the fact is that you don't need a drummer to get work.

 

Case in point: when I was still studying with my teacher, he had a regular gig with an acoustic guitar player/singer. There was hardly ever a drummer, but they were able to play gigs on the strength of their playing and singing. On the occassions when they had a drummer they were very good, but they were just as good without him.

 

Obviously a situation like this depends greatly on the material, but it is possible for a band to play without a drummer. And you can continue to do that while you search for a drummer. You should try to keep making progress as a band despite the current situation.

[_Sweet Willie_]

Re: drummers.

Good drummers can be hard to find, but they're out there. Drummers must be able to keep time. After that, being able to control dynamics and alter feels are important in my book.

 

Re: not having a drummer.

As Nicklab points out, progress can be made sans drummer. It is also possible to gig without a drummer, depending a little bit on what kind of music you're playing (but not necessarily the genre) and/or your willingness to do things like incorporate a drum machine into your sound.

 

Re: rehearsal.

I view rehearsal and practice as two different things. Practice is what band members do on their own time to learn the music and improve their individual skills. Rehearsal is when the band puts the pieces together and makes sure they fit -- the arrangements work and the interaction of the players works. More rehearsals can sometimes be counterproductive if the band members still need more time to practice. I'd rather my bandmates show up prepared for one rehearsal than they show up ill-prepared for three.

 

Re: gigging.

The time spent rehearsing before starting to gig or between gigs should vary, in my opinion, based on the band goals and personal constraints (e.g., spouse, kids, job). I play because I enjoy it. I can enjoy it on my own, in a rehearsal, or playing a gig. For some folks, gigging is not necessary. I like to play for people, so gigging has to fit in somewhere. I do think, however, that some folks whose goal is to gig take too much time trying to get perfect.

 

Re: current project.

We just found a drummer and have rehearsed with him twice. (The first time was a pseudo-audition.) He is picking up the tunes pretty well and he now has some rough rehearsal recordings of us without drums to help him learn them faster on his own. We rehearse once every two weeks if we're lucky. However, I feel like we will be ready for gigs after two more rehearsals with this drummer. We are not pros, but we love to play and are as serious and time-committed to this project as we can be given pressures on our time from family and work.

 

Peace.

--Dub $$

 

 

[Gruuve]

Good posts. I'm definitely of the mindset that rehearsal and practice are two different things....practice is what you do by yourself to improve, learn songs, whatever. Rehearsal is when you put it all together just to make sure it works.

 

Like Phil, I practice just about every single day. When I'm playing in church, we rehearse once prior to playing, then after that one rehearsal we play twice on Sunday. Sometimes we do songs that we've just learned. I've had to learn 5-6 new songs in one week before (which can be a bit tough...just getting the song stuffed into my memory so I can recall what it sounds like can take a couple or so days in some cases). Luckily, we pull from a library of songs, so on a typical week I may have one new song to learn, one existing song to learn, and then 3-4 that I already know or have played before.

 

We aren't always the tightest group...BUT, overall I think the musicianship in the worship band is surprisingly good, so we generally deliver a reasonably polished worship set.

 

Dave

 

[BenLoy]

Are there that many groups of people out there practicing one or two nights a week "until we are ready to do a gig"? Seems like I hear about lots of them here on the forum.

 

How long does it take to learn 10 songs per set? My estimate is ten weeks maximum per set. I taught classes for years and years with that kind of schedule. The performances were not always up to "Live at Leeds" standards, but they were fine.

 

If you aren't ready for a four hour gig within a year, you will never be.

 

Jeremy speaks the truth (as usual). I don't get why there are so many complaints on this forum about "finding gigs, finding band members, finding committed people, etc." When I was a kid in high school, sure I had that problem. There was a drummer I played with back then who inspired many fantasies about attaching a hammer to the end of a metronome arm and strapping the whole thing to his skull.

 

But I kept practicing, and the better I got, the better musicians I found to play with. I also had less tolerance for people who couldn't play. Now I'm at the point where if they can't play, I don't want to play with them, period.

 

Sure, I'll jam with someone who's a beginner or an amateur. I'm not a jerk, but I see no point in making awful noises when I know how to make music.

 

I'm not saying this as some kind of virtuoso or anything or trying to talk myself up. But have some standards for god's sake.

[Ross Brown]

Practice is different than rehearsal. The guys that are left practice everyday, at home. The drummer did not, at all!

 

I appreciate everyone's posts. Hopefully this wacky road will end up good!

[Brocko777]

It looks like all of us have or ARE going through the same thing with members of our groups. I was even "that guy" once. Had too much on my plate and just didn't put the time in. This happened many moons ago and I learn personally from that. I will NEVER do that again to myself or to a group of people putting in the time to do their best.

You always want to play with people that are at your same level or higher to push you. (at least I do, if you ain't learning, your dead) If you had the chance to play with a group way above your level you better be ready to stick yourself in the woodshed and hang with the big dogs! woof

But also, some things you just cannot learn. You have to feel.

 

Brocko

[Rocky McDougall]

Here is a drummer that may be available. Check him out !

 

 

Rocky

 

[Ross Brown]

I have played with Animal before. Think he is still available?

 

Buddy Rich is just OK....

[Cthulhu Fhtagn]

Man, you guys are killin' me! I'm reading this post, taking in all the beeching about sucky drummers and the reassuring each other about good drummers being out there. Here's something to consider ... location, location, LOCATION!

 

All you guys posting from NYC, Seattle, Bay Area, large college towns like Raleigh. Try finding ANY drummer someplace like Kennewick or Richland, WA. I live in the radioactive waste dump of the state. The nearest towns of any size are an hour away and those towns aren't even really big. I see three ads in the local ad rag looking for drummers and I found one guy at work who used to drum, but doesn't own a kit, or a driver's licence or a car. The guy I'm using for a drummer now is a guitar player in a band based out of Seattle (three hour's drive from here). Hell, by definition I am a drum owner.

 

Drummers are hard to find. Good drummers are already gigging. Really GOOD drummers move the hell out of town and go to Seattle or Spokane.

[jeremy c]

I did mention in one of my posts that I moved to the SF Bay Area specifically because of my musical aspirations. I was 21 at the time.

 

btw, a great drummer who is a friend of mine is originally from Spokane. He moved here too.

[alexclaber]

Good posts. I'm definitely of the mindset that rehearsal and practice are two different things....practice is what you do by yourself to improve, learn songs, whatever. Rehearsal is when you put it all together just to make sure it works.

 

Exactly. Learning how to play a song (or worse yet, an instrument) during a band rehearsal is a waste of everyone else's time. Two rehearsals a week would do my head in - I need enough time in between to get everything else done!

 

I found my last drummer by contacting a pro bassist in the area who suggested contacting a few drummers he knew and one of them directed me to one of their students. He was great, though very raw. All three of my current (and hopefully longterm!) bandmates were found via various musician finding websites.

 

Alex

[Mr. Knowitall]

PS:Bands I've been in ALWAYS auditioned drummers. During those trying times, it was found quite useful to play a handful of tunes with varying tempo's AND...without telling anyone when or where...the bass player( :grin:) would toss in a completely off-beat but time-correct bassline or two(the others expected it and kept going as if nothing happened). GOOD drummers would not miss a thing, some would look at you grinning, great ones would answer your line beat for beat, and the ones you didn't want would either trainwreck the song, derail and loose time, or stop playing and say "Why'd you do that?". Made it easier to pick good ones .

 

I'll definitely try this when I audition a new drummer next weekend!

[Cthulhu Fhtagn]

I remember the post. I spent my high school years and a brief stint in college in San Jose ('76-'79). I wish I were confident enough in my ability as a bassist to hang it up and move someplace like the Bay Area, but 1) my wife would kill me 2) I'm better off sticking with what I know and doing music part time. More power to your friend from Spokane ... If I could make a living there I'd move in a minute.

[mcbn]

The gig on Saturday went much better. We had focused on getting everyone to communicate a little better during our rehearsals and as a result when the drummer would start to rush I could slow him down. Nerves were also a lot calmer this time around and our drummer didn't seem to push as much.

 

I've convinced the band to break practices down into 2 different categories.

 

Once a week we are going to break into sections. I'll play with the drummer for a couple of hours and focus on rythm and timing. The g****r players will get together at the same time in a different location and work on song structure and solos.

 

Our second practice during the week is going to be more of a true rehearsal. I've set a basic schedule that includes time for setup/tune-up, working on new material and working through some bugs on our current material.

 

Everyone has agreed that this is a better way to spend our time so hopefully we'll see results.

[Tom Capasso]

Nutt - sectional rehearsals can be quite helpful. Due to geography, we've done very few of them. One time, the three of us that sing got together to work on some parts for songs, and it was a big help. The drummer and percussionist worked out an intro to Oye Como Va (it's a very cool "pre-song" drum duet), and our guitarists meet at times to review harmonies (Allman Brothers songs, usually).

 

I think you'll see the improvement quickly.

 

Tom